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	<title>Comments on: Parliament sidelined and kept in the dark about Northern Rock</title>
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	<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/</link>
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		<title>By: APL</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1602</link>
		<dc:creator>APL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 12:46:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1602</guid>
		<description>JR: &quot;They also tell us the mortgages not in Granite are good as well.&quot; 
 
The situation with Northern Rock is this, the government is rushing the nationalization through in a matter of days, after dithering for months. 
 
They have deliberately attempted to restrict information about the true financial situation of Northern rock, and one result, in my opinion, is they have created a false market in shares of Northern Rock. 
 
Northern Rock is known to have been a lender that was prepared to offer over 100% of the value of the property (someone I know has just such a mortguage), in a situation where property prices were continiously going upward that was not a problem. But now the housing market is looking decidedly &#039;iffy&#039;, there is a very good chance that much of Northern Rocks mortguage book is already below the surface. 
 
To support that, Northern Rock is one of the lenders that stars prominently in the repossessions statistics. 
 
I have no problem with Granite, if it is what it purports to be, however in a situation where Northern Rock is about to be thrown up to &#194;&#163;100 billion of public funds, we ought to know a little more about what we are buying. 
 
The suspicion is that most of the so called &#039;high quality&#039; loans, that the Chancellor tells us belong to Northern Rock are actually in Granite, and outside the reach of the Nationalization of Northern Rock. That means the investors in Granite will be serviced from the &#039;high quality&#039; loan portfolio in Granite before the public funds are repaid. 
 
If the Chancellor knows that but is withholding that information, then that is something Parliament should find out. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JR: &quot;They also tell us the mortgages not in Granite are good as well.&quot; </p>
<p>The situation with Northern Rock is this, the government is rushing the nationalization through in a matter of days, after dithering for months. </p>
<p>They have deliberately attempted to restrict information about the true financial situation of Northern rock, and one result, in my opinion, is they have created a false market in shares of Northern Rock. </p>
<p>Northern Rock is known to have been a lender that was prepared to offer over 100% of the value of the property (someone I know has just such a mortguage), in a situation where property prices were continiously going upward that was not a problem. But now the housing market is looking decidedly &#039;iffy&#039;, there is a very good chance that much of Northern Rocks mortguage book is already below the surface. </p>
<p>To support that, Northern Rock is one of the lenders that stars prominently in the repossessions statistics. </p>
<p>I have no problem with Granite, if it is what it purports to be, however in a situation where Northern Rock is about to be thrown up to &Acirc;&pound;100 billion of public funds, we ought to know a little more about what we are buying. </p>
<p>The suspicion is that most of the so called &#039;high quality&#039; loans, that the Chancellor tells us belong to Northern Rock are actually in Granite, and outside the reach of the Nationalization of Northern Rock. That means the investors in Granite will be serviced from the &#039;high quality&#039; loan portfolio in Granite before the public funds are repaid. </p>
<p>If the Chancellor knows that but is withholding that information, then that is something Parliament should find out. </p>
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		<title>By: emmie</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1601</link>
		<dc:creator>emmie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 01:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1601</guid>
		<description>John, 
 
I don&#039;t understand. 
 
From you article I gather you, with your business acumen and assuming you had the money, wouldn&#039;t enter into this agreement given the paucity of  information. 
 
I certainly wouldn&#039;t (even if I had the money). 
 
Why then, would MP&#039;s vote to enter such a disadvantageous agreement without insisting on disclosure? 
 
Do we still have an elected house of representatives? 
 
If not, why are they still there? </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John, </p>
<p>I don&#039;t understand. </p>
<p>From you article I gather you, with your business acumen and assuming you had the money, wouldn&#039;t enter into this agreement given the paucity of  information. </p>
<p>I certainly wouldn&#039;t (even if I had the money). </p>
<p>Why then, would MP&#039;s vote to enter such a disadvantageous agreement without insisting on disclosure? </p>
<p>Do we still have an elected house of representatives? </p>
<p>If not, why are they still there? </p>
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		<title>By: APL</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1600</link>
		<dc:creator>APL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Feb 2008 18:36:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1600</guid>
		<description> &lt;a href=&quot;http://haloscan.com/tb/mikedenham/4585285397206897049&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://haloscan.com/tb/mikedenham/458528539720689...&lt;/a&gt; 
 
This makes salutory reading about Northern Rock. 
 
When Alastair Darling says there are high quality assets in Northern Rocks portfolio, does he tell us that in fact the high quality assets are off balance sheets and off shore in the Granite vehicle? 
 
(I have cut out a couple of sentences with accusations about the Chancellor) 
The government admits that Granite exists and has good mortgages in it. They also tell us the mortgages not in Granite are good as well. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> <a href="http://haloscan.com/tb/mikedenham/4585285397206897049" rel="nofollow"></a><a href="http://haloscan.com/tb/mikedenham/458528539720689" rel="nofollow">http://haloscan.com/tb/mikedenham/458528539720689</a>&#8230; </p>
<p>This makes salutory reading about Northern Rock. </p>
<p>When Alastair Darling says there are high quality assets in Northern Rocks portfolio, does he tell us that in fact the high quality assets are off balance sheets and off shore in the Granite vehicle? </p>
<p>(I have cut out a couple of sentences with accusations about the Chancellor)<br />
The government admits that Granite exists and has good mortgages in it. They also tell us the mortgages not in Granite are good as well. </p>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1599</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Feb 2008 10:31:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1599</guid>
		<description>Para left out 
From my perspective, it seems a paradox that we have a Government sitting mired in sleaze and incompetence, and now humiliated into a forced nationalisation of a lending bank (as opposed to the very intentional nationalisation of Railtrack), and an opposition unable offer anything more than some muted slanging.  For heavens&#039; sake, after a decade of increasing taxes, most of which have been poured down the drain, we are now expected to bear the risk for a commercial bank operating in a (we are told) depressed housing market! 
 
Cameron&#039;s position in the polls (presently at about 9 points ahead) is extraordinary, because this means that around 30 percent of those polled are still telling the pollsters they support the discredited Labour Government.  How can they?  Presumably they are die-hards who out of principle will always favour the party, even when they are clearly damaged below the waterline. 
 
But on the other hand, my view is that the reason Cameron is not moving to the 15 - 20 percent lead in the polls which he needs if he is to present a clear future Government, is because nobody knows what he and his party really stand for. 
 
There are two views - one is that oppositions don&#039;t win elections, but Governments lose them.  In the present circumstances that view is clearly deficient.  Labour has a rock-solid minimum level of support below which we can assume it will not fall (the high 20&#039;s percent).  But without a commanding lead, we are looking at a hung Parliament.  In order to win, I believe that the Conservatives have everything to play for, but (and this is the point) they MUST tell the public CLEARLY what they would DO, and they are not doing this in any area at present.  All we are seeing is style over content. 
 
In the dark, &#039;lost&#039; days of the Tory party, orators and intellectuals such as Hague and Redwood were painted as somehow undesirable and &#039;wierd&#039; by Blair&#039;s propoganda machine.  This method of warfare unfortunately seems to have shaped the Cameron response, which is to be the opposite.  That was the only response the cornered Tory Party could make to Blair, but he went six months ago.  We are in different times.  A combination of Cameron&#039;s public - friendly approach and some genuine intellectual power is badly needed if the Tories are to be an effective opposition, let alone a Party seen as a credible alternative Government. 
 
Thank you Mr Redwood for giving us some basis for optimism. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Para left out<br />
From my perspective, it seems a paradox that we have a Government sitting mired in sleaze and incompetence, and now humiliated into a forced nationalisation of a lending bank (as opposed to the very intentional nationalisation of Railtrack), and an opposition unable offer anything more than some muted slanging.  For heavens&#039; sake, after a decade of increasing taxes, most of which have been poured down the drain, we are now expected to bear the risk for a commercial bank operating in a (we are told) depressed housing market! </p>
<p>Cameron&#039;s position in the polls (presently at about 9 points ahead) is extraordinary, because this means that around 30 percent of those polled are still telling the pollsters they support the discredited Labour Government.  How can they?  Presumably they are die-hards who out of principle will always favour the party, even when they are clearly damaged below the waterline. </p>
<p>But on the other hand, my view is that the reason Cameron is not moving to the 15 &#8211; 20 percent lead in the polls which he needs if he is to present a clear future Government, is because nobody knows what he and his party really stand for. </p>
<p>There are two views &#8211; one is that oppositions don&#039;t win elections, but Governments lose them.  In the present circumstances that view is clearly deficient.  Labour has a rock-solid minimum level of support below which we can assume it will not fall (the high 20&#039;s percent).  But without a commanding lead, we are looking at a hung Parliament.  In order to win, I believe that the Conservatives have everything to play for, but (and this is the point) they MUST tell the public CLEARLY what they would DO, and they are not doing this in any area at present.  All we are seeing is style over content. </p>
<p>In the dark, &#039;lost&#039; days of the Tory party, orators and intellectuals such as Hague and Redwood were painted as somehow undesirable and &#039;wierd&#039; by Blair&#039;s propoganda machine.  This method of warfare unfortunately seems to have shaped the Cameron response, which is to be the opposite.  That was the only response the cornered Tory Party could make to Blair, but he went six months ago.  We are in different times.  A combination of Cameron&#039;s public &#8211; friendly approach and some genuine intellectual power is badly needed if the Tories are to be an effective opposition, let alone a Party seen as a credible alternative Government. </p>
<p>Thank you Mr Redwood for giving us some basis for optimism. </p>
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		<title>By: Abdul-Rahim</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1598</link>
		<dc:creator>Abdul-Rahim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Feb 2008 03:49:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1598</guid>
		<description>Good to see some actual analysis and critique as opposed to the whining coming from the Tory leadership about hearkening back to the 1970&#039;s, etc. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good to see some actual analysis and critique as opposed to the whining coming from the Tory leadership about hearkening back to the 1970&#039;s, etc. </p>
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		<title>By: Chuck Unsworth</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1597</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck Unsworth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Feb 2008 21:26:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1597</guid>
		<description>This is not a &#039;purchase&#039; as we know it.  The whole ghastly spectacle is one of financial fois gras - the goose being Northern Rock and the corn being taxpayers cash being regularly shovelled down the neck of the bank by HMG.  Unfortunately it&#039;s the taxpayer who is now cooked. 
 
Let&#039;s understand that right at the outset the Government was faced with a simple choice of allowing market forces to prevail or of full State involvement.  Never mind all of this persiflage about seeking a &#039;commercial solution&#039; - that was never a runner, given the suitors and given the immediate response by the Government to the original offer from a proper bank.  The single driver in all of this has been the political implication - tomorrow&#039;s headlines.  And now the Government has even managed to mishandle that.  Utter incompetence. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is not a &#039;purchase&#039; as we know it.  The whole ghastly spectacle is one of financial fois gras &#8211; the goose being Northern Rock and the corn being taxpayers cash being regularly shovelled down the neck of the bank by HMG.  Unfortunately it&#039;s the taxpayer who is now cooked. </p>
<p>Let&#039;s understand that right at the outset the Government was faced with a simple choice of allowing market forces to prevail or of full State involvement.  Never mind all of this persiflage about seeking a &#039;commercial solution&#039; &#8211; that was never a runner, given the suitors and given the immediate response by the Government to the original offer from a proper bank.  The single driver in all of this has been the political implication &#8211; tomorrow&#039;s headlines.  And now the Government has even managed to mishandle that.  Utter incompetence. </p>
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		<title>By: Matthew Reynolds</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1596</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew Reynolds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Feb 2008 17:27:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1596</guid>
		<description>Having read your blogs on the subject of Northern Rock I have to conclude that your absence from the Shadow Cabinet is an error on the part of successive Conservative Leaders . The Tories did look a bit clueless yesterday as Labour &amp; the Lib Dems cuddled up to each other . Labour are  being pretty hopeless  while the Tories struggle to get to the level of support needed to regain office at the next general election . Beating Labour on the economy is crucial so what the Conservatives need to do is offer an alternative to Labour&#039;s flawed tripartite banking system and flawed fiscal policy . Just shouting about Northern Rock &amp; calling for the Chancellor&#039;s resignation is not enough . The PM will never sack Alistair Darling as he knows all about the rows between Blair &amp; Brown and inherited a mares nest from Brown . Mr Darling is a useful fall guy to take the flak while Brown continues to run the Treasury from Number 10 . The U- Turns on non doms , CGT &amp;  tax powers for the Holyrood Parliament  were done at the PM&#039;s order . The Tories should ignore the Chancellor and just attack Gordon Brown over the economy while offering some helpful ideas on monetary &amp; fiscal policy .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having read your blogs on the subject of Northern Rock I have to conclude that your absence from the Shadow Cabinet is an error on the part of successive Conservative Leaders . The Tories did look a bit clueless yesterday as Labour &amp; the Lib Dems cuddled up to each other . Labour are  being pretty hopeless  while the Tories struggle to get to the level of support needed to regain office at the next general election . Beating Labour on the economy is crucial so what the Conservatives need to do is offer an alternative to Labour&#8217;s flawed tripartite banking system and flawed fiscal policy . Just shouting about Northern Rock &amp; calling for the Chancellor&#8217;s resignation is not enough . The PM will never sack Alistair Darling as he knows all about the rows between Blair &amp; Brown and inherited a mares nest from Brown . Mr Darling is a useful fall guy to take the flak while Brown continues to run the Treasury from Number 10 . The U- Turns on non doms , CGT &amp;  tax powers for the Holyrood Parliament  were done at the PM&#8217;s order . The Tories should ignore the Chancellor and just attack Gordon Brown over the economy while offering some helpful ideas on monetary &amp; fiscal policy .</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew Reynolds</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1603</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew Reynolds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Feb 2008 17:27:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1603</guid>
		<description>Having read your blogs on the subject of Northern Rock I have to conclude that your absence from the Shadow Cabinet is an error on the part of successive Conservative Leaders . The Tories did look a bit clueless yesterday as Labour &amp; the Lib Dems cuddled up to each other . Labour are  being pretty hopeless  while the Tories struggle to get to the level of support needed to regain office at the next general election . Beating Labour on the economy is crucial so what the Conservatives need to do is offer an alternative to Labour&#039;s flawed tripartite banking system and flawed fiscal policy . Just shouting about Northern Rock &amp; calling for the Chancellor&#039;s resignation is not enough . The PM will never sack Alistair Darling as he knows all about the rows between Blair &amp; Brown and inherited a mares nest from Brown . Mr Darling is a useful fall guy to take the flak while Brown continues to run the Treasury from Number 10 . The U- Turns on non doms , CGT &amp;  tax powers for the Holyrood Parliament  were done at the PM&#039;s order . The Tories should ignore the Chancellor and just attack Gordon Brown over the economy while offering some helpful ideas on monetary &amp; fiscal policy . </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having read your blogs on the subject of Northern Rock I have to conclude that your absence from the Shadow Cabinet is an error on the part of successive Conservative Leaders . The Tories did look a bit clueless yesterday as Labour &amp; the Lib Dems cuddled up to each other . Labour are  being pretty hopeless  while the Tories struggle to get to the level of support needed to regain office at the next general election . Beating Labour on the economy is crucial so what the Conservatives need to do is offer an alternative to Labour&#039;s flawed tripartite banking system and flawed fiscal policy . Just shouting about Northern Rock &amp; calling for the Chancellor&#039;s resignation is not enough . The PM will never sack Alistair Darling as he knows all about the rows between Blair &amp; Brown and inherited a mares nest from Brown . Mr Darling is a useful fall guy to take the flak while Brown continues to run the Treasury from Number 10 . The U- Turns on non doms , CGT &amp;  tax powers for the Holyrood Parliament  were done at the PM&#039;s order . The Tories should ignore the Chancellor and just attack Gordon Brown over the economy while offering some helpful ideas on monetary &amp; fiscal policy . </p>
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		<title>By: mikestallard</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1595</link>
		<dc:creator>mikestallard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Feb 2008 17:13:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1595</guid>
		<description>I am impressed by the sheer expertise of all the rest of you! 
 
However, did you notice that the Conservative leader and shadow chancellor did their announcement to a news conference, not to parliament last evening? So much for &quot;In sum, Parliament will have none of the usual information directors would require as matter of course from acquiring management and their advisers before consenting to an acquisition.&quot; 
Kossovo seems to me to be very like the start of the First World War with the West and Russia at loggerheads. The Russians, however, have an army.... And was this debated at all in Parliament? 
It seems that our national legislature is getting more and more irrelevant. 
I am thinking of doing a bumper sticker with 
&quot;ENGLAND - micromanaged by lawyers.&quot; 
Do you know what? I still give this lot until Ester. 
 
Reply: This is very unlike the conditions in 1945. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am impressed by the sheer expertise of all the rest of you! </p>
<p>However, did you notice that the Conservative leader and shadow chancellor did their announcement to a news conference, not to parliament last evening? So much for &quot;In sum, Parliament will have none of the usual information directors would require as matter of course from acquiring management and their advisers before consenting to an acquisition.&quot;<br />
Kossovo seems to me to be very like the start of the First World War with the West and Russia at loggerheads. The Russians, however, have an army&#8230;. And was this debated at all in Parliament?<br />
It seems that our national legislature is getting more and more irrelevant.<br />
I am thinking of doing a bumper sticker with<br />
&quot;ENGLAND &#8211; micromanaged by lawyers.&quot;<br />
Do you know what? I still give this lot until Ester. </p>
<p>Reply: This is very unlike the conditions in 1945. </p>
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		<title>By: Rose</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1594</link>
		<dc:creator>Rose</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Feb 2008 15:56:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/2008/02/19/parliament-sidelined-and-kept-in-the-dark-about-northern-rock/#comment-1594</guid>
		<description>I expect other people have seen the film clips of GB falling asleep on the job.  He was never going to be up to it, and now at last the broadcasters have admitted it - but in their usual poisonous way they are are suggesting Mrs T also got tired and made erratic decisions, which &quot;balanced criticism&quot; will now pass into the historical record. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I expect other people have seen the film clips of GB falling asleep on the job.  He was never going to be up to it, and now at last the broadcasters have admitted it &#8211; but in their usual poisonous way they are are suggesting Mrs T also got tired and made erratic decisions, which &quot;balanced criticism&quot; will now pass into the historical record. </p>
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