Comments on: ID cards and the database http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/ Incisive and topical campaigns and commentary on today's issues and tomorrow's problems Thu, 09 Feb 2012 11:18:17 +0000 hourly 1 By: Guy Herbert http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18967 Guy Herbert Fri, 10 Jul 2009 06:42:18 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18967 It isn't. Simple as that. The global travel surveillance system that is being gold-plated as e-Borders, has been driven by the US and the UK, who together lobbied for the new ICAO passport standard, ably assisted by securocrats everywhere who are keen to demand PNR data of carriers. The EU's bureaucracy is not interested in surveillance per se, but is desperate to copy anything the US does, to prove to itself that "the country called Europe" is big and important, too. @adam, You are wrong, and you don't understand how the EU works. Directives do not discuss things, they set out a legal framework of obligations. There is none in relation to ID cards, and unless the Lisbon treaty comes into effect, the EU is expressly forbidden by its constituting treaties from exercising any control over national ID cards and the like. STORK is extremely pernicious and prevents a threat to privacy but it is an indirect project aimed at making member-countries' various e-ID systems (most of which are themselves nascent projects not real systems) interoperable, NOT introducing ID cards. It isn’t. Simple as that.

The global travel surveillance system that is being gold-plated as e-Borders, has been driven by the US and the UK, who together lobbied for the new ICAO passport standard, ably assisted by securocrats everywhere who are keen to demand PNR data of carriers. The EU’s bureaucracy is not interested in surveillance per se, but is desperate to copy anything the US does, to prove to itself that “the country called Europe” is big and important, too.

@adam,

You are wrong, and you don’t understand how the EU works. Directives do not discuss things, they set out a legal framework of obligations. There is none in relation to ID cards, and unless the Lisbon treaty comes into effect, the EU is expressly forbidden by its constituting treaties from exercising any control over national ID cards and the like. STORK is extremely pernicious and prevents a threat to privacy but it is an indirect project aimed at making member-countries’ various e-ID systems (most of which are themselves nascent projects not real systems) interoperable, NOT introducing ID cards.

]]> By: Number 6 http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18966 Number 6 Thu, 09 Jul 2009 10:21:42 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18966 Agreed, the ID cards and indeed all of the liberty crushing laws that we shout about here emenate from the EU and are rubber stamped by its sock puppet Nu Labor. Sadly, as Dave is still wedded to the EU 'project' I see no chance of the laws ulimately being stopped. As long as we remain in the EU we will do what the EU demands. Agreed, the ID cards and indeed all of the liberty crushing laws that we shout about here emenate from the EU and are rubber stamped by its sock puppet Nu Labor.

Sadly, as Dave is still wedded to the EU ‘project’ I see no chance of the laws ulimately being stopped. As long as we remain in the EU we will do what the EU demands.

]]> By: ex-Civil Servant http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18965 ex-Civil Servant Wed, 08 Jul 2009 22:44:59 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18965 Yes the Government can cancel a contract. It is is parliamentary principle that the current Administration cannot irrevocably bind its successors, even treaties can be rescinded should a future Government so wish. The Conservatives are quite entitled to make it clear that they would not wish to continue with thes contraqcts should they be elected - the current Administration should not be entering into these controversial long-term commitments when it is clear that they will not be in powere to see them through. Unfortunately the arrogance of the current Administration prevents them from acting in the national best interest (in consultation with the Opposition parties) rather than simply pushing them through using their whipped majority. Yes the Government can cancel a contract. It is is parliamentary principle that the current Administration cannot irrevocably bind its successors, even treaties can be rescinded should a future Government so wish. The Conservatives are quite entitled to make it clear that they would not wish to continue with thes contraqcts should they be elected – the current Administration should not be entering into these controversial long-term commitments when it is clear that they will not be in powere to see them through. Unfortunately the arrogance of the current Administration prevents them from acting in the national best interest (in consultation with the Opposition parties) rather than simply pushing them through using their whipped majority.

]]> By: adam http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18964 adam Wed, 08 Jul 2009 13:08:38 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18964 you get called to an interview with the security services where they interrogate you and run various 'footprint' checks on you you get called to an interview with the security services where they interrogate you and run various ‘footprint’ checks on you

]]> By: Adam Collyer http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18963 Adam Collyer Wed, 08 Jul 2009 00:55:26 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18963 One interesting question with the whole identity cards thing is how the government will identify you to get you on the database to start with. For example, a criminal who registered for the database using someone else's personal details, would then have a card, complete with his own biometric details, proving his identity to be that of that other person. Having had some personal involvement with Ukraine, it has been disturbing for me to discover that the power of the State in that ex-Soviet country is actually much less than it is here. One interesting question with the whole identity cards thing is how the government will identify you to get you on the database to start with.

For example, a criminal who registered for the database using someone else’s personal details, would then have a card, complete with his own biometric details, proving his identity to be that of that other person.

Having had some personal involvement with Ukraine, it has been disturbing for me to discover that the power of the State in that ex-Soviet country is actually much less than it is here.

]]> By: adam http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18962 adam Tue, 07 Jul 2009 20:40:24 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18962 Not a damned chance the liar party are backing down on this. They are just in re-election mode. They will just rename them 'e cards' or something equally childish and claim its an entirely different system. If they even bother with that. The ID card system was designed to fail anyway. The biometric technology is not ready. fake politicians. fake party Not a damned chance the liar party are backing down on this. They are just in re-election mode.
They will just rename them ‘e cards’ or something equally childish and claim its an entirely different system. If they even bother with that.

The ID card system was designed to fail anyway. The biometric technology is not ready.

fake politicians. fake party

]]> By: adam http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18961 adam Tue, 07 Jul 2009 20:36:16 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18961 It is. Its multifaceted though. It is actually a global id card system that is be designed alongside the global 'e borders' system. There are EU directives discussing introducing ID cards (cant find the links) and EU funded projects to coordinate them (http://www.eid-stork.eu/ It is. Its multifaceted though. It is actually a global id card system that is be designed alongside the global ‘e borders’ system.
There are EU directives discussing introducing ID cards (cant find the links) and EU funded projects to coordinate them (http://www.eid-stork.eu/

]]> By: Paul http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18960 Paul Tue, 07 Jul 2009 15:49:18 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18960 Actually the current government isn't elected, but apart from that semantic point I agree with your argument for the most part Actually the current government isn’t elected, but apart from that semantic point I agree with your argument for the most part

]]> By: Adrian Peirson http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18959 Adrian Peirson Tue, 07 Jul 2009 15:44:38 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18959 If they are scrapping ID cards it's probably only because they are going to introduce something else, like having us all chipped. This thing can't go away because it's all part of their New World Order Agenda. We know whats going on, can't we just have them all arrested so we can all get on with our lives raising and providing for our families and generally enjoying life without having to spend it worrying about 'them' and what they are up to. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nD7dbkkBIA If they are scrapping ID cards it’s probably only because they are going to introduce something else, like having us all chipped.

This thing can’t go away because it’s all part of their New World Order Agenda.

We know whats going on, can’t we just have them all arrested so we can all get on with our lives raising and providing for our families and generally enjoying life without having to spend it worrying about ‘them’ and what they are up to.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nD7dbkkBIA

]]> By: Adrian Peirson http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/07/07/id-cards-and-the-database/#comment-18958 Adrian Peirson Tue, 07 Jul 2009 15:38:01 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4001#comment-18958 Oi ! get to the back of the Queue Oi ! get to the back of the Queue

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