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	<title>Comments on: Government cannot be trusted to run our roads</title>
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	<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/</link>
	<description>Incisive and topical campaigns and commentary on today&#039;s issues and tomorrow&#039;s problems</description>
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		<title>By: Mike Slattery</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21520</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Slattery</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 19:13:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21520</guid>
		<description>Has nobody learned from the referendums in both Edinburgh and Manchester, how unpopular any form of road toll is to the motorist. They are another tax, a way of tracking our every movement and we will not accept this form of highway robbery, the fight continues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Has nobody learned from the referendums in both Edinburgh and Manchester, how unpopular any form of road toll is to the motorist. They are another tax, a way of tracking our every movement and we will not accept this form of highway robbery, the fight continues.</p>
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		<title>By: Frank</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21519</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 16:38:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21519</guid>
		<description>I do not believe tolls are the answer. Surely it would be much easier to remove VED and add the tax to fuel. The more you drive on the roads, the more you pay. The less efficient cars would pay more tax per mile. Two birds with one stone and no big brother tracking systems to pay for or maintain,but most importantly to track us. Simples</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do not believe tolls are the answer. Surely it would be much easier to remove VED and add the tax to fuel. The more you drive on the roads, the more you pay. The less efficient cars would pay more tax per mile. Two birds with one stone and no big brother tracking systems to pay for or maintain,but most importantly to track us. Simples</p>
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		<title>By: IEA Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Economics on the web</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21518</link>
		<dc:creator>IEA Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Economics on the web</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Aug 2009 10:15:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21518</guid>
		<description>[...] ●  John Redwood explains why the government cannot be trusted to run our roads [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] ●  John Redwood explains why the government cannot be trusted to run our roads [...]</p>
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		<title>By: ManicBeancounter</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21517</link>
		<dc:creator>ManicBeancounter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 23:21:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21517</guid>
		<description>Another thought.
This proposal will not fly because of the &quot;green&quot; lobby.
The VED is weighted according to emissions. Unless a similar structure is introduced in the tolls (making it unfeasibly complicated) it will get severe opposition. The government would be accused of favouring the rich at the expense of the planet. Maybe an absurd suggestion, but less so than many pronouncements in the world of &quot;climate change&quot; politics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another thought.<br />
This proposal will not fly because of the &#8220;green&#8221; lobby.<br />
The VED is weighted according to emissions. Unless a similar structure is introduced in the tolls (making it unfeasibly complicated) it will get severe opposition. The government would be accused of favouring the rich at the expense of the planet. Maybe an absurd suggestion, but less so than many pronouncements in the world of &#8220;climate change&#8221; politics.</p>
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		<title>By: ManicBeancounter</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21516</link>
		<dc:creator>ManicBeancounter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 23:10:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21516</guid>
		<description>The real competition is as follows.
1. Take the train, or coach v. the car.
2. Travel off peak

You may have a point. Like I believe happens with conjestion charging in cities, the initial impact of the localised cost is to cause a decrease in volumes. However, over time, people adjust their budgets, so volumes adjust back to where they were prior to the charge being introduced.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The real competition is as follows.<br />
1. Take the train, or coach v. the car.<br />
2. Travel off peak</p>
<p>You may have a point. Like I believe happens with conjestion charging in cities, the initial impact of the localised cost is to cause a decrease in volumes. However, over time, people adjust their budgets, so volumes adjust back to where they were prior to the charge being introduced.</p>
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		<title>By: ManicBeancounter</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21515</link>
		<dc:creator>ManicBeancounter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 22:51:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21515</guid>
		<description>This sounds as good scheme - and one where most of the bases are cover. In particular
1. It would tackle a significant chunk of national debt, with (possibly) a net revenue increase (revenue neutral in terms of VED minus interest on debt, but than tax on profits providing the net increase).
2. Would incentivize the road operators to invest.

 However, there are three major problems.
1. The incentives have their limits Building a competing road might make good sense but the existing road operator would have an entrenched interest in blocking such a scheme. What is more, new competition would cause an existing operator to lower prices. So a road like the M6 Toll might never have been built in a competitive environment, as it relied on being able to raise tolls over time. One might get less new roads as a result, not more.
2. Politics get in the way - most schemes get evolved, there are compromises made. As private companies would need to be incentivised, it could either mean huge profits for the operators (with a net welfare loss to society), or such onerous conditions that there would be insufficient bids for the franchises to mop up much of the national debt. A big bang approach (that is implied here) would probably lead to too much profit.
3. The alternative - the piecemeal appraoch over time, would lead to a slow impact on the national debt. Also a phases approach would have the VED and the tolls running concurrently. As the onus will be on maximising revenue over the next few years, you could end up with both road tolls and car tax.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This sounds as good scheme &#8211; and one where most of the bases are cover. In particular<br />
1. It would tackle a significant chunk of national debt, with (possibly) a net revenue increase (revenue neutral in terms of VED minus interest on debt, but than tax on profits providing the net increase).<br />
2. Would incentivize the road operators to invest.</p>
<p> However, there are three major problems.<br />
1. The incentives have their limits Building a competing road might make good sense but the existing road operator would have an entrenched interest in blocking such a scheme. What is more, new competition would cause an existing operator to lower prices. So a road like the M6 Toll might never have been built in a competitive environment, as it relied on being able to raise tolls over time. One might get less new roads as a result, not more.<br />
2. Politics get in the way &#8211; most schemes get evolved, there are compromises made. As private companies would need to be incentivised, it could either mean huge profits for the operators (with a net welfare loss to society), or such onerous conditions that there would be insufficient bids for the franchises to mop up much of the national debt. A big bang approach (that is implied here) would probably lead to too much profit.<br />
3. The alternative &#8211; the piecemeal appraoch over time, would lead to a slow impact on the national debt. Also a phases approach would have the VED and the tolls running concurrently. As the onus will be on maximising revenue over the next few years, you could end up with both road tolls and car tax.</p>
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		<title>By: Julian Melford</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21514</link>
		<dc:creator>Julian Melford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 15:22:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21514</guid>
		<description>Mr Redwood. Road pricing would inevitably involve vehicle tracking, and probably a personal smart/ID card that would be automatically debited. Surveys show that the public doesn&#039;t trust either the government or the commercial sector with our private travel data, and I can see lots of scope for fraud.

I can&#039;t imagine any sane companies paying £110 billion for rights to maintain our roads, even if they were guaranteed a profit. Any company daft enough to take on overall responsibility for our main roads would probably be sued for accidents, closures and failure to repair potholes promptly.

The next Conservative government will need all the friends it can get, without making enemies of 33 million drivers, most of whom have votes. Although they have soaked up being treated as a cash cow for years, they are becoming increasingly militant and well-organised.

If a future government needs to trim spending, it should look first at reducing the vast state advertising bill and the money wasted in trying to stop naturally-occurring climate change?

Reply: I have gone hoarse talking about reducing waste and needless public spending. We need to do that as well.I am dead against government tolling and surveillance of our highways. I have in mind the kind of smart pre payment card and drive through toll system they have on US roads. They only need log the ones without the prepayment card. Why don&#039;t you want to get the government out of our pockets as motorists, by abolishing the poll tax on cars and giving us better roads?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr Redwood. Road pricing would inevitably involve vehicle tracking, and probably a personal smart/ID card that would be automatically debited. Surveys show that the public doesn&#8217;t trust either the government or the commercial sector with our private travel data, and I can see lots of scope for fraud.</p>
<p>I can&#8217;t imagine any sane companies paying £110 billion for rights to maintain our roads, even if they were guaranteed a profit. Any company daft enough to take on overall responsibility for our main roads would probably be sued for accidents, closures and failure to repair potholes promptly.</p>
<p>The next Conservative government will need all the friends it can get, without making enemies of 33 million drivers, most of whom have votes. Although they have soaked up being treated as a cash cow for years, they are becoming increasingly militant and well-organised.</p>
<p>If a future government needs to trim spending, it should look first at reducing the vast state advertising bill and the money wasted in trying to stop naturally-occurring climate change?</p>
<p>Reply: I have gone hoarse talking about reducing waste and needless public spending. We need to do that as well.I am dead against government tolling and surveillance of our highways. I have in mind the kind of smart pre payment card and drive through toll system they have on US roads. They only need log the ones without the prepayment card. Why don&#8217;t you want to get the government out of our pockets as motorists, by abolishing the poll tax on cars and giving us better roads?</p>
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		<title>By: Robert K, Oxford</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21513</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert K, Oxford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 11:09:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21513</guid>
		<description>Your ideas appear sound, but  I am not a road expert, nor do I run a transportation company. The thing I would encourage you to beware of is planning (I mean this in the Hayekian sense rather than the town &amp; country planning sense). The point about free market competition is that the optimal solution will come about through trial and error as different suppliers try different initiatives to best satisfy their customers. In this case, the supplier - the road owner - may well experiment with differential pricing for different vehicles at different times of the day to  maximise the best use of his infrastructure asset. After all, congestion would be anathema to a private road owner as it would tend to push his customers towards competitors, whether they be other road owners or trains/planes/boats. The private owner would seek to optimise the balance between usage, speed, safety and congestion in a far more efficient way that a government planner could achive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your ideas appear sound, but  I am not a road expert, nor do I run a transportation company. The thing I would encourage you to beware of is planning (I mean this in the Hayekian sense rather than the town &amp; country planning sense). The point about free market competition is that the optimal solution will come about through trial and error as different suppliers try different initiatives to best satisfy their customers. In this case, the supplier &#8211; the road owner &#8211; may well experiment with differential pricing for different vehicles at different times of the day to  maximise the best use of his infrastructure asset. After all, congestion would be anathema to a private road owner as it would tend to push his customers towards competitors, whether they be other road owners or trains/planes/boats. The private owner would seek to optimise the balance between usage, speed, safety and congestion in a far more efficient way that a government planner could achive.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21512</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 09:08:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21512</guid>
		<description>But the whole point of going to the enormous expense of building a tunnel was to protect the environment. If we hadn&#039;t been interested in that we could just have widened and straightened the existing A3 through Hindhead and the Devil&#039;s Punchbowl. Having spent all that money, after years of consideration, it makes little sense to keep the original road anyway.

I have my own doubts about whether the planning process did come to the best final decision, but having come to a decision let&#039;s carry it out. It takes us so long to make a decision we shouldn&#039;t then spend time undoing it later. That way we would get even less done, and spend even more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But the whole point of going to the enormous expense of building a tunnel was to protect the environment. If we hadn&#8217;t been interested in that we could just have widened and straightened the existing A3 through Hindhead and the Devil&#8217;s Punchbowl. Having spent all that money, after years of consideration, it makes little sense to keep the original road anyway.</p>
<p>I have my own doubts about whether the planning process did come to the best final decision, but having come to a decision let&#8217;s carry it out. It takes us so long to make a decision we shouldn&#8217;t then spend time undoing it later. That way we would get even less done, and spend even more.</p>
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		<title>By: True Belle</title>
		<link>http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2009/08/26/government-cannot-be-trusted-to-run-our-roads/#comment-21511</link>
		<dc:creator>True Belle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 08:53:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=4354#comment-21511</guid>
		<description>I do agree with you, but some councils may throw the idea of a visitor/bed tax in to the arena.

Day trippers to coastal towns clog up the roads  and although they create revenue of a sort, there is still the clear up and cost to the infrastructure that is becoming increasingly difficult!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do agree with you, but some councils may throw the idea of a visitor/bed tax in to the arena.</p>
<p>Day trippers to coastal towns clog up the roads  and although they create revenue of a sort, there is still the clear up and cost to the infrastructure that is becoming increasingly difficult!</p>
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