Comments on: The EU after Lisbon http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/ Incisive and topical campaigns and commentary on today's issues and tomorrow's problems Thu, 09 Feb 2012 18:18:37 +0000 hourly 1 By: Yugoslavia Stamps http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21897 Yugoslavia Stamps Sat, 13 Feb 2010 11:21:17 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21897 This is good website. Check out my blog , to check out fresh news about Yugoslavia Stamps, This is good website. Check out my blog , to check out fresh news about Yugoslavia Stamps,

]]> By: Harry http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21896 Harry Thu, 21 Jan 2010 15:50:36 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21896 Well Mr Redwood, many Euro Enthusiasts may well be satisfied to wait until an exhausted British sceptic population concede defeat without ever having a say over a grotesquely changed constitutional settlement; though I would put it to you that Germans are not so relaxed: <a href="http://www.german-foreign-policy.com/en/fulltext/56307" rel="nofollow">http://www.german-foreign-policy.com/en/fulltext/...</a> If you read the language used within this article you will begin I think to feel a little uncomfortable that we have not yet confronted the political establishment in a way fitting to force these ivory tower liberal nitwits to listen. The EU Project is a hybrid created through the hijacking of its true purpose and imposition of the Corporatists agenda. I want none of it and nor does the great majority of the general public. I see the EU Collective as a communist entity; a collective. Another factor worth considering is that the Collective Dictatorship of this criminal Enterprise (SFO) fully understand that the only mandate they can claim are the Euro elections, where we get to vote for MEP's that are impotent: Mere rubber stamps. A tool of aquiscence to enable dictatorship rather than democracy. That being the case the Kommissars have made it law in four countries to enforce voting in EU elections. Just as it was in soviet Russia, so it is in the EU Collective. Amen. These four countries where the Law is in place to compel the population to Vote are: Belgium Luxembourg Greece Spain At this time the law is only enforced in Belgium and Luxembourg, but is in place ready to be enforced if the Voter turnout drops. Democracy, Soviet style. We must leave this oppressive dictatorship. The day may well come when a unified Europe is desirable; then again it may not. Either way the people of Europe must never again relax that powerful men subvert our lives as has been done. Well Mr Redwood, many Euro Enthusiasts may well be satisfied to wait until an exhausted British sceptic population concede defeat without ever having a say over a grotesquely changed constitutional settlement; though I would put it to you that Germans are not so relaxed:
http://www.german-foreign-policy.com/en/fulltext/…

If you read the language used within this article you will begin I think to feel a little uncomfortable that we have not yet confronted the political establishment in a way fitting to force these ivory tower liberal nitwits to listen.

The EU Project is a hybrid created through the hijacking of its true purpose and imposition of the Corporatists agenda. I want none of it and nor does the great majority of the general public.

I see the EU Collective as a communist entity; a collective.

Another factor worth considering is that the Collective Dictatorship of this criminal Enterprise (SFO) fully understand that the only mandate they can claim are the Euro elections, where we get to vote for MEP's that are impotent: Mere rubber stamps. A tool of aquiscence to enable dictatorship rather than democracy. That being the case the Kommissars have made it law in four countries to enforce voting in EU elections. Just as it was in soviet Russia, so it is in the EU Collective. Amen.

These four countries where the Law is in place to compel the population to Vote are:

Belgium
Luxembourg
Greece
Spain

At this time the law is only enforced in Belgium and Luxembourg, but is in place ready to be enforced if the Voter turnout drops.

Democracy, Soviet style.

We must leave this oppressive dictatorship. The day may well come when a unified Europe is desirable; then again it may not. Either way the people of Europe must never again relax that powerful men subvert our lives as has been done.

]]> By: Dorothy Wilson http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21895 Dorothy Wilson Mon, 18 Jan 2010 12:39:43 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21895 Don't be so silly Mr Gretton [Collis aka John]. There is no way I am squirming. As far as the Lisbon Treaty is concerned, the sceptics may have won the battle because of the treachery of Labour and the LibDems and specifically Gordon Brown. However, it is more than likely that - and before too long - the blinkered supporters of ever-closer integration will find that Lisbon was the straw that broke the camels back. Additionally, the extent to which the German Constitutional Court criticised the EU's approach to democracy have obviously passed you by. I would also, once again, remind you of the fate of the Roman Empire. That collapsed when it became corrupt at the centre and over-expanded at the edges. As for looking at the cost of the EU on the trumpeters site, well I have better things to do. As that site seems to be run by you and Peter Valentine the figures are likely to be based on your usual selective approach. I prefer to look at the figures from a more rational, analyical and realistic viewpoint. Don't be so silly Mr Gretton [Collis aka John]. There is no way I am squirming.

As far as the Lisbon Treaty is concerned, the sceptics may have won the battle because of the treachery of Labour and the LibDems and specifically Gordon Brown. However, it is more than likely that – and before too long – the blinkered supporters of ever-closer integration will find that Lisbon was the straw that broke the camels back.

Additionally, the extent to which the German Constitutional Court criticised the EU's approach to democracy have obviously passed you by.

I would also, once again, remind you of the fate of the Roman Empire. That collapsed when it became corrupt at the centre and over-expanded at the edges.

As for looking at the cost of the EU on the trumpeters site, well I have better things to do. As that site seems to be run by you and Peter Valentine the figures are likely to be based on your usual selective approach.

I prefer to look at the figures from a more rational, analyical and realistic viewpoint.

]]> By: Collis Gretton http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21894 Collis Gretton Thu, 14 Jan 2010 19:02:43 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21894 Squirm as much as you like Dorothy. Re the Lisbon Treaty the sceptics have lost again and the European project progresses. On total costs read the article on the trumpeter site. It's prominent on the Welcome page. Simply click. Squirm as much as you like Dorothy. Re the Lisbon Treaty the sceptics have lost again and the European project progresses.

On total costs read the article on the trumpeter site. It's prominent on the Welcome page. Simply click.

]]> By: Dorothy Wilson http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21893 Dorothy Wilson Thu, 14 Jan 2010 13:17:14 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21893 John [aka Collis] Gretton has always had some trouble with his understanding of the cost of the EU. He mistakes the cost of the annual membership fee [ie our contribution to the budget] with the total cost. John [aka Collis] Gretton has always had some trouble with his understanding of the cost of the EU. He mistakes the cost of the annual membership fee [ie our contribution to the budget] with the total cost.

]]> By: Citizen Responsible http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21892 Citizen Responsible Thu, 07 Jan 2010 15:24:57 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21892 Have you read the Lisbon Treaty then? Let me get this straight. You, are accusing me, of inventing its contents in support of my prejudices??? Motes and beams Mr Goodyer. Motes and beams! Have you read the Lisbon Treaty then? Let me get this straight.
You, are accusing me, of inventing its contents in support of my prejudices??? Motes and beams Mr Goodyer. Motes and beams!

]]> By: Eric Goodyer http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21891 Eric Goodyer Wed, 06 Jan 2010 17:35:40 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21891 I suggest that you read the Lisbon Treaty then. Inventing its contents in support of your prejudices is no substitute for arguement. However I am not worried, the overwhelmingly majority of the British population want to stay in the EU, and 80% of votes cast last June were for pro-EU political parties. Game set and match to us then. You have a lot of work and convincing to do. In the unlikely event that a politicial party who wants britain to leave the EU ever gets elected then I will accept the result of the ballot box. However that is unlikely to be soon, with David Cameron pledged not only to stay in the EU but to expand it. Labour & Lib-Dems also want to stay in. You are in a small but very vocal minority. I really do think that this is the end of the debate - you lost it by a landslide last June! Reply: Both the Conservative party and UKIP fought the last European election on an anti federalist anti Lisbon ticket. You should be careful how you spin the views of voters. I suggest that you read the Lisbon Treaty then. Inventing its contents in support of your prejudices is no substitute for arguement. However I am not worried, the overwhelmingly majority of the British population want to stay in the EU, and 80% of votes cast last June were for pro-EU political parties. Game set and match to us then. You have a lot of work and convincing to do.

In the unlikely event that a politicial party who wants britain to leave the EU ever gets elected then I will accept the result of the ballot box. However that is unlikely to be soon, with David Cameron pledged not only to stay in the EU but to expand it. Labour & Lib-Dems also want to stay in. You are in a small but very vocal minority.

I really do think that this is the end of the debate – you lost it by a landslide last June!

Reply: Both the Conservative party and UKIP fought the last European election on an anti federalist anti Lisbon ticket. You should be careful how you spin the views of voters.

]]> By: Citizen Responsible http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21890 Citizen Responsible Wed, 06 Jan 2010 13:59:47 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21890 You can’t give the EU all of the credit for giving us decades of freedom and security. NATO, led by the USA, has made the biggest contribution to Europe’s freedom and security since World War ll. The Lisbon Treaty is not “merely the Rule Book”. It is an EU constitution in all but name. Your assertion that the treaty “returns power to member states” is a joke. I quote from Mr Redwoods “Lisbon Lies” post of 4th November: “The passerelle clauses, which give the new EU the right to take more power in the future without a renegotiation, clearly cannot apply in the UK. The UK will need to regain its rights to control its own criminal law codes, employment law, foreign policy and much else.” As I understand it, the Lisbon Treaty is self amending. There will be no need for any more treaties. Lisbon is the last one. Herman Rompuy, who was appointed EU President by the EU elite, has announced his intention to “streamline” the EU council meetings. “Streamlining” is code for weakening democracy by moving power away from national electorates to a chosen few. And as for reducing costs, Mr Rompuy has said the EU needs to raise more taxes to pay for the changes called for in the Lisbon Treaty such as the EUs’ new Foreign Service which reportedly will employ 5,000-6,000 staff. You can’t give the EU all of the credit for giving us decades of freedom and security. NATO, led by the USA, has made the biggest contribution to Europe’s freedom and security since World War ll.

The Lisbon Treaty is not “merely the Rule Book”. It is an EU constitution in all but name. Your assertion that the treaty “returns power to member states” is a joke. I quote from Mr Redwoods “Lisbon Lies” post of 4th November:

“The passerelle clauses, which give the new EU the right to take more power in the future without a renegotiation, clearly cannot apply in the UK. The UK will need to regain its rights to control its own criminal law codes, employment law, foreign policy and much else.”

As I understand it, the Lisbon Treaty is self amending. There will be no need for any more treaties. Lisbon is the last one. Herman Rompuy, who was appointed EU President by the EU elite, has announced his intention to “streamline” the EU council meetings. “Streamlining” is code for weakening democracy by moving power away from national electorates to a chosen few. And as for reducing costs, Mr Rompuy has said the EU needs to raise more taxes to pay for the changes called for in the Lisbon Treaty such as the EUs’ new Foreign Service which reportedly will employ 5,000-6,000 staff.

]]> By: Eric Goodyer http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21889 Eric Goodyer Wed, 06 Jan 2010 08:27:20 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21889 As a strong supporter of the EU, which has given us decades of prosperity, freedom and security, I am very grateful to the Conservative Party. They have succesfully conned so many people who want to to leave the EU in to voting for them. David Cameron's strong support for British Membership of the EU is the one policy of his that I can agree with. Well done Cameron, and well done to the Conservative Party for ensuring the long term future of Britain within the EU. The current Tory Party proposals to expand the EU to include the Ukraine, Georgia, the rest of the Balkans and Turkey is an important Europhile policy shift. It is now inevitable that in time the EU will absorb more Muslim nations, Kosova, Albania and Bosnia will surely join this great organisation of European Democracies in the next decade - Turkeys accession means that there will be a bridge to Asis Minor and Africa. I look forward to democracies in Northern Africa joining the EU. Fortunately EU membership is supported by the overwhelming majority of the British people - as proven by the results in the ballot box and all recent opinion polls. The Lisbon treaty is merely the Rule Book and I welcome the opportunity to debate the rules of membership - had it been rejected it would only have meant that we stayed in the EU under the old rules, and as pro-European I see no problems with that. Debate over the Lisbon Treaty is pointless, it simply streamlines the operation of the EU, reduces its' costs and returns power to member tates. What those who rabbit on about it are afraid of is the real debate 'should Britain leave the EU' - because they know that they would lose that debate - as they did last June when 80% of the votes cast were for political parties who want Britain to stay in the EU. So I can only repeat the first point thank you David Cameron for conning so many anti-EU voters to vote for you, and I welcome your continued support for Britain remaining a member of the EU. Reply: Your Labour spin will have to be better than this. You help me make my point that Labour want Conservatives to vote UKIP so Labour can stay in government! As a strong supporter of the EU, which has given us decades of prosperity, freedom and security, I am very grateful to the Conservative Party. They have succesfully conned so many people who want to to leave the EU in to voting for them. David Cameron's strong support for British Membership of the EU is the one policy of his that I can agree with. Well done Cameron, and well done to the Conservative Party for ensuring the long term future of Britain within the EU.
The current Tory Party proposals to expand the EU to include the Ukraine, Georgia, the rest of the Balkans and Turkey is an important Europhile policy shift. It is now inevitable that in time the EU will absorb more Muslim nations, Kosova, Albania and Bosnia will surely join this great organisation of European Democracies in the next decade – Turkeys accession means that there will be a bridge to Asis Minor and Africa. I look forward to democracies in Northern Africa joining the EU.
Fortunately EU membership is supported by the overwhelming majority of the British people – as proven by the results in the ballot box and all recent opinion polls.
The Lisbon treaty is merely the Rule Book and I welcome the opportunity to debate the rules of membership – had it been rejected it would only have meant that we stayed in the EU under the old rules, and as pro-European I see no problems with that. Debate over the Lisbon Treaty is pointless, it simply streamlines the operation of the EU, reduces its' costs and returns power to member tates. What those who rabbit on about it are afraid of is the real debate 'should Britain leave the EU' – because they know that they would lose that debate – as they did last June when 80% of the votes cast were for political parties who want Britain to stay in the EU.

So I can only repeat the first point thank you David Cameron for conning so many anti-EU voters to vote for you, and I welcome your continued support for Britain remaining a member of the EU.

Reply: Your Labour spin will have to be better than this. You help me make my point that Labour want Conservatives to vote UKIP so Labour can stay in government!

]]> By: Andy http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2010/01/02/the-eu-after-lisbon/#comment-21888 Andy Tue, 05 Jan 2010 19:45:06 +0000 http://www.johnredwoodsdiary.com/?p=5202#comment-21888 What a load of piffle. We, the people, were promised a referendum on any treaty that emerged from the negotiations: Lisbon is that treaty. So where is our referendum ? The liar, Gordon the Moron, ratified the treaty without the promised referendum presenting the Conservatives - the ONLY party which has behaved honourably - with no choice to but abandon their pledge. However once in Government I hope they wont allow matters to rest as they are. What a load of piffle. We, the people, were promised a referendum on any treaty that emerged from the negotiations: Lisbon is that treaty. So where is our referendum ? The liar, Gordon the Moron, ratified the treaty without the promised referendum presenting the Conservatives – the ONLY party which has behaved honourably – with no choice to but abandon their pledge. However once in Government I hope they wont allow matters to rest as they are.

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