The world must say that Taliban rule is already unacceptable in Afghanistan. A country should not block its citizens from taking civilian flights to places that will accept them. A government in waiting should not so terrify many of its citizens that they queue up at an airport to try to get a flight to anywhere that might take them. It is tragic that they live in the hope they can start a new life somewhere else with nothing more than a suitcase of personal items to show for their life to date. Nor should those who claim to have control allow chaos to make the suicide bomber’s task easier. The sad deaths in Kabul yesterday made the tragedy worse.
We should not regard it as a norm that civilian aviation is cut off from a country, or that a group of armed individuals can settle the fate of thousands of people wanting to move by making instant judgements with a gun pointing at the applicant. One of the most attractive features of advanced democracies is the ability and right to travel freely within your own country or to leave it to go to anywhere which will let you in without needing permission.
There are some in the UK who think we should be willing to take tens of thousands of Afghans who would like to leave their country now. I strongly support the heroic efforts of our troops and border staff in seeking to get all UK citizens home who wish to come, and to give free passage and the right to live and work in the UK to all those who worked for our government and military in the past and are now at risk because of that. I am not convinced that it would be right to make a wider offer to Afghans more generally to come to the UK.
The first sad truth is we will only get a limited number of people out in the time left with access to a runway and with permission to fly in and out to pick people up, a right we have to share with our allies who all need to do the same. The second is even if we offered more places to Afghans to come and could find a safer route to let them do so we could only ever offer it to a small fraction of the 40 million living in Afghanistan today. Helping cream off more of the bright and motivated people with more liberal views from the society will make the plight of the millions who remain worse. The Taliban might behave even more unpleasantly if too many more Afghans are assisted out. We would wish to make sure that anyone invited to live and work in the UK can do so with a decent living standards. We are already very short of homes, and there are limits to how many more we can house from overseas to acceptable standards.
There is no alternative to working with the world community to try to prevent the return of the Taliban to the barbarism of their past. The former policy which President Biden undermined of assisting a far from perfect democratic government in Afghanistan to widen human rights and raise living standards made sense and was working to some extent. Given the way an armed group has displaced an elected government, we have to accept that our influence is much less. However, all the time the Taliban led country needs western currency and goods and expects some continuation of aid and technical support there is the basis for some agreements to try to limit the damage. It is also the case that countries with more influence than us like Pakistan and China need to be brought into the conversations, as they too should not want a rogue state that harbours terrorists who might harm them as well.
Yesterday President Biden contradicted his promise to end the for ever US war in Afghanistan. He instead threatened retaliatory action against the people who murdered so many at the airport, implying a future new chapter in Americaâs war.
August 27, 2021
“I am not convinced that it would be right to make a wider offer to Afghans more generally to come to the UK.” – but the Home Secretary will let them in anyway provided they arrive by dinghy.
I asked a few weeks ago when a record 400 arrivals were reported if she could aim for 500. That number has been generously exceeded and now the target is 1,000 a day. Can Mrs Patel reach it? Yes she can! So do not be so self-limiting for within c. 80 years we could take in all 40 million Afghans.
August 27, 2021
It’s not just a daily rate of 800+ illegal migrants, though, it’s their future generations (av. 9 per family), too. It’s easier for the government to support criminal activity in the name of a false view of humanity than to worry about the true cost to this country in the name of security. Who exactly do they think will be running our country in the future?
August 27, 2021
I’m more worried about the one’s that slip though the net….the un-recorded illegals
August 27, 2021
BJC – the current govt believe they will be living with the elite – – – in reward for their treachery,
August 27, 2021
National newspaper investigative journalists were reported last month to have identified the three “Mr Bigs” who are organising the illegal transfer of economic migrants from France accross the Channel. These criminals, an Iranian, a Syrian and an Afghan were reported to have obtained “leave to remain” documentation from Priti Patel’s Home office and in one case, a National Insurance number. The sums involved are huge, ÂŁ10,000 per migrant was reported.
Why have these criminals not been apprehended by the authorities?
August 27, 2021
âThe world must say that Taliban rule is already unacceptable in Afghanistan.â It is one thing to say it. It is quite another thing to take it upon the country to change that by use of military force.
Regime change is costly and has not exactly been a roaring success in the Middle East. China is better able to purse naked self interest, untroubled by internal critics or domestic do-gooders. So they will find a way to extract the Afghan mineral resources and pay off the people in charge. Just like they are doing in Africa.
The U.K. should move towards an isolationist stance protecting our own shores. People donât want Afghan refugees – but the people will continue to be ignored and we will get them anyway.
Biden has shown himself unfit to be President as many had suspected. I would imagine he will be replaced by Kamala in the not too distant future.
August 27, 2021
@formula57; More to the point, once here they are stuck here, and there is little or no reason for France to stop such illegals, the rabid anti migrant Brexiteers have certainly enriched the fortunes of the people smugglers…
The Schengen common travel area might have its faults but it does allow people to come and leave, as such there would be little reason for these migrants, whilst in the EU27, to get their official EU immigration/asylum application status formalised even if their intended destination is still the UK. The UK can then make what ever employment laws etc we wish, migrants like any other non UK citizen not able to support themselves could still be sent back to their country of origin, of migrants with EU papers that means the EU27 country that issued their EU papers – quite possibly without the usual deportation hearings..
Far from solving the illegal migration problem, as UKIP claimed, Brexit it has actually made the problem 50 times worse.
August 27, 2021
It was T May who committed the UK to the UN migration pact in 2017 I believe.
August 28, 2021
@Agreatdaytocome; Are you seriously trying to suggest there was no problem with regards illegal migrants crossing the channel before 2017?! If so you do realise you are also calling the ex UKIP leader a liar, after all UKIP had been banging on about (illegal) migration since 2009, if not well before, as an under-current within their wider policies.
August 27, 2021
The government has no interest in stopping the channel taxi service.
Replacing the indigenous population with a more pliable one is the aim.
Remember we Brits are all racist so it’s the governments job to dilute us by Importing millions of other ranks.
August 27, 2021
A GB News presenter said yesterday that he went to the Science Museum and looked at a steam engine (presumably ‘Rocket’) but accompanying the engine was a display interpreting it in terms of ‘colonialism’.
August 27, 2021
+1
August 27, 2021
You are being rather over-cynical, especially concerning a Conservative government which has no real interest in importing many poor immigrants from a group (Muslims) that is already overwhelmingly Labour voting. So they are just being over-generous in ignoring that as well as terrorism and the religious fundamentalism that is rampant in their community. Indeed I would only allow Afghan interpreters and those who worked for the British army to settle in Britain as a last resort if we could not find a satisfactory third country (supported by some of our foreign aid budget) to take them. I also note when America withdrew from Cambodia and South Vietnam in 1975 when their enemies took over they only evacuated their main colluders in senior positions, not their casual employees or auxiliary helpers.
August 27, 2021
Formula57, Droll, but accurate. This government has now firmly established a reputation for promising but not delivering; for posturing before practicality.
Hence operation BINO, which allowed the EU to annex Northern Ireland, is interspersed with with “ultimatums” which everyone (except the government nudge units and Boris Johnson) knows are vapid posturing.
Or immigration, where a flurry of “crackdown” announcements is rapidly followed by the next dinghy load. Then there’s electric homes, electric hydrogen, electric cars – but no extra electricity generation for the next 20 years.
It’s not just that the government is failing, it’s that they expect us to swallow their blustering too.
August 27, 2021
We have seen all the dreadful deaths, injuries and damage that can be caused by just one or two suicide bombers. Should we be taking anyone in without being sure of their intentions?
August 27, 2021
It’s not just their intentions but those of their descendants, as we have seen from the number of homegrown terrorists and those who have rushed to join the Islamic State. Our politicians gamble with our security to look good on the world stage.
August 28, 2021
+1
August 27, 2021
This Government has imposed mass immigration on us at a very alarming rate of 720,000 a year for the last 20 odd years plus illegals of unknown number. They have no understanding of National Security as they let in every one regardless. If we keep voting for them, nothing will change, it’s time for change and a right of centre party that is truly conservative, not these liberal, woke leftards.
August 27, 2021
Time action. +100
August 27, 2021
Got anyone in mind?
August 27, 2021
âA country should not block its citizens from taking civilian flights to places that will accept themâ.
It might be in a different context, but thatâs exactly what the UK government has done since the arrival of Covid. Such decisions have been pretty much instant and, while not at the point of a gun, rushed through without normal democratic scrutiny and backed up by harsh penalties. Whilst the Taliban are brutes, our standards have slipped and our democratic credentials are no longer what they were.
August 27, 2021
Absolutely.
It is only a nicety of degree.
Prison Camp U.K.!
August 27, 2021
Indeed.
August 27, 2021
Oh, we’ve always been ready to do down our friends, Beebtax. Think of handing Rhodesia to ZANU-PF, where ZANU was China’s puppet, and ZAPU was USSR backed. It’s no different in principle to handing Afghanistan to the Taliban. Though I have to admit the Rhodesia handover was rather more professional than Biden’s vacuous and lamentable failures in leaving Afghanistan.
August 27, 2021
“….to give free passage and the right to live and work in the UK to all those who worked for our government and military in the past” – to make reconciliation of the numbers work, is it true that each British soldier had four interpreters?
Reply The UK employed more than just interpreters locally
August 27, 2021
Reply to reply
Crikey that could include anyone, the cleaner, the cook, the butcher, the baker and the candlestick maker and anyone else whoever carried out a task, along with all their families.
August 27, 2021
But not the abused and abandoned animals, apparently. Bad optics.
August 27, 2021
@J Bush; Your point being what? I suspect the numbers will be no where near those of Ugandan refugees we had to accept back in the early 1970s. Such people, refugees from persecution, are happy to be safe, they accept our best efforts, perhaps accommodation no UK citizen would want, and because they all to often feel a debt to the UK they try and put back into the UK economy, doing jobs that many a able bodied UK citizen refuse point blank to do.
August 27, 2021
Whilst that is true of the Ugandan Asians (ie people originating from India), Jerry, it is not true of many of the people from Pakistan and, I suspect, from Afghanistan too, who will put religious and tribal loyalties way above assimilating themselves into the British way of life. I do wonder why so many people come here for a “better life”, yet put all their energies into re-creating whatever hell-hole they originally escaped from.
August 27, 2021
NickC :
Agreed.
It is indeed a puzzle why our governments are so keen to import more and more people from the religious tribal hell-holes.
A country is not defined by its geography but by its people.
August 27, 2021
+1
August 27, 2021
@ jerry – the point surely is plain enough: it is that the supply of refugees is nowadays practically unlimited in contrast to our ability to absorb them. We live in an era where substantial portions of populations now see fit to remove themselves across the globe.
We also live in an era where people do not expect to adapt to their host and assimilate, but expect the host to accommodate their values and beliefs. This adds to the problems of the task of absorbing refugees.
You may have a point about feeling a debt in some cases. Recent history has shown that it is more typical for it to be the second generation that resorts to domestic terrorism.
August 27, 2021
formula57 :
I agree with all your points except for your last paragraph.
I now believe that the second generation would not have resorted to domestic terrorism without the strong influence of their parents.
August 27, 2021
@@formula57 (and @NickC); Sorry I thought we were talking about those leaving via the NATO airlift?…
August 28, 2021
Jerry, You compared the Ugandan refugees with the Afghan refugees (favourably). So did I (unfavourably).
August 28, 2021
@NickC; Indeed, and as such it said far more about your true attitude to immigration, period, not just the problem of illegal migration that you hide you real opinions behind. etc ed
August 27, 2021
Indeed. Well done to Peace Envoy Tony Blair and the appalling Joe Biden!
August 27, 2021
Agree with your post JR, we cannot take everyone, and should limit the numbers to those who worked, assisted or helped the UK operation in some way over the last 20 years.
I see it is being reported in the Times today, that unfortunately our embassy staff in Kabul appear to have not shredded or destroyed enough documents before leaving, as unfortunately lists of names and addresses of a number of interpreters, staff, and applicants have been left behind.
Fully aware that this was not deliberate act, but knowing that the Taliban were fast taking control weeks ago, I would have thought that such basic destroying of all documentation within the embassy would have been planned and completed well in advance.
I hope all of the electronic information held was also destroyed before the staff left.
Perhaps we should hope the Data Protection Act will help those unfortunates who remain, and who’ve been left behind.
August 27, 2021
That alone makes one think doesnât it?
Weâre they really that inefficient?
Or were they like PP going out to welcome incomers?
August 27, 2021
Everhopeful
“We’re they really that inefficient”
Well it would seem so.
But remember these people in our Embassies are supposed to be the brightest of the bright, the problem would appear to be that there can be a danger in over thinking matters, instead of thinking basics.
Can you imagine the scene with them all queueing up to take turns to use the shedders, when it would have been so much easier to douse all the files, desks, and computers, and every room in the whole embassy with petrol, and then set light to it.
They seem to have lacked any basic thoughts or skills.
All they had to do was take a leaf out of any rioters or looters book !.
Job would have been done in less than an hour by a couple of people.!
August 27, 2021
+1
August 27, 2021
Who says it wasn’t deliberate.
August 27, 2021
+1
August 27, 2021
I imagine that the documents were intended to be in support of proper visa applications, for which there might still have been time for proper processing or destruction had not Biden slunk most of his forces out in the dead of night with no forewarning.
August 27, 2021
Not that many though. And they were volunteers and were paid. I have nothing against them and in fact became quite good friends with the 3 I worked with (we had 1 âterp per company btw). Iâm not saying we should abandon them all to certain death; we should provide sanctuary if possible for the time being. But the British taxpayer doesnât owe them and their extended families a living and a home for life.
August 27, 2021
+1.
August 27, 2021
It was Blairs war and not in my name. So he should pay to rehabilitate those who wish to leave to a ………….muslim Country.
August 27, 2021
Everything that is happening in Afghanistan is the direct result of Donald Trump’s surrender to the Taliban in Doha in 2020. That made clear to every single member of the Afghan army and police that time was running out, and they should not oppose the Taliban once the West fled. Your attempt to blame Biden for Trump’s appalling misjudgement shows your interest here is only to support ‘your’ side irrespective of facts or truth. Just as you followed the Tory party whatsapp line on supporting Mr Raab’s beach holiday. You used to be independent of mind. No longer
REply Trump did not surrender. His deal was conditional on Taliban good conduct.
August 27, 2021
@ Gary Megson â it is hard to follow how President Trumpâs news that the American military, by then numbering less than c.5,000, would leave Afghanistan “made clear to every single member of the Afghan army and police that âŠ. they should not oppose the Talibanâ as you assert. Was the Afghan army willing perhaps to fight only to the last American?
Moreover, does your attempt to blame Trump for Bidenâs appalling misjudgement as to execution of the withdrawal show your interest here is only to support âyourâ side irrespective of facts or truth? It does look like it.
August 27, 2021
No excuse for the lack of withdrawal strategies and no excuse for not reversing the decision, seeing as Biden reversed so many other policies.
This is Biden’s baby and there is a distinct lack of scrutiny and criticism from one Mr Sopel of the BBC.
August 27, 2021
@NLA; Without knowing what the Trump administration had previously agreed with the Taliban it is wrong to suggest Biden could have simply reversing the decision, doing so we might well still be were we are, but with an even less tolerant Taliban towards our belated efforts.
This is at least 80% Trump’s baby…and there is a distinct lack of scrutiny and criticism from the hard right MSM, both in the USA and here in the UK, all seem to be suffering from selective memory loss.
Reply Read the Doha Agreement. Biden had no need to pull out under that.
August 27, 2021
You didn’t blame Obama for lack of Covid preparation !
August 28, 2021
@JR reply; Would that be the Doha Agreement, signed by Donald J. Trump on February 29, 2020, that saw the US reduce involvement from 13,000 to 8,600 personal by July 2020, and by the time Biden took office there were only 2,500 US troops left in Afghanistan. Would this be the timetable that should have meant the NATO allies should have been relocating “at risk” Afghan employees and their families to a place of safety since at least July 2020, never mind advising their own non-military civilians (NGOs, media, etc) to leave?
Your argument against Biden is akin how the Labour party blamed Mrs Thatcher, six months into her premiership, for the inflation rate & industrial strife she had inherited upon taking office…
Reply Not so This was a conditional agreement. trump did not evacuate all the troops in time for the election though he wanted to, because the Taliban were not meeting conditions and Trump must have taken advice on how much equipment and people the US needed to keep in Afghanistan to support the Afghan army. It worked – they got it right.
August 28, 2021
@JR reply; “Trump must have taken advice on how much equipment and people the US needed to keep in Afghanistan to support the Afghan army. It worked â they got it right.”
No, Trump got it 100% wrong, there should have been no withdrawal, no Doha ‘peace’ Agreement, unless taking the same approach to an unwinnable war as the USSR did in the late 1980s, just get the hell out, as safely and as quickly as possible (which, good or bad, appears to have been the approach Biden took), given the Afghan govt forces have never been willing or competent to undertake what NATO forces have been doing since late 2001, that is why neither Obama nor Bush Jnr. before him felt able to withdraw troops, despite Bush claiming “mission completed”, and Obama eliminating Bin laden, and why Trump deployed his own ‘Surge’ shortly after taking office.
But even if the Doha Agreement, and the original withdrawal of 13,000 personal, were made in good faith why was a further 6,000 odd personal withdrawn between July 2020 and Jan 2021? Only inexperienced politicos would have ever take the Taliban’s word, after all this is not the first time they have gone back on their ‘word’. By the time Biden took office the fate of Afghanistan, its people and many others had already been sealed, does anyone truly believe, by 21st Jan 2021, with just 2,500 military personal left deployed, some who will have been non-fighting rear-guard support, the USA was going to protect Afghanistan, doubtful they could have protected other NATO forces or just Kabul from the revitalised Taliban.
But carry on spinning the anti Biden line, the combined efforts of the international right wing might get his scalp yet, then you’ll have President Kamala Harris to do business with, that should make the G7 etc. interesting, I wonder if the first woman POTUS will bring Hilary Clinton back into high office, as VP perhaps, or might that post go to one Bernard Sanders of Vermont?!… đź
Reply The position remained stable with fewer troops from January to July. It was Bidenâs dangerous decision to withdraw all remaining support without the Taliban delivering Doha promises that caused chaos. I am not spinning anyoneâs line, just analysing the facts. Biden could have sent more troops if he wanted.
August 27, 2021
Yesterday’s tweet from Nigel Gould-Davies,Fellow for Russia and Eurasia at the IISS, hits the mark:
“Amazed at the impotence of the West.Soviets fought alone and lost to US-supported mujaheddin.Taliban fought alone and defeated entire western coalition.Now dictating withdrawal terms,while Soviets withdrew in good order in 1989.What’s going on with power?”
August 27, 2021
Biden ripped up the conditional deal Trump made. The problems in Afghanistan now are directly the result of Biden doing so.
August 27, 2021
Exactly, and of the 26,000 evacuated so far, only 4,000 are US citizens – the rest UNVETTED Afghans – seeding the taliban to a village near you on your dime.
August 27, 2021
A terrible mistake.
August 27, 2021
I see Biden is “close” to backing Italy’s call for an extraordinary G20 meeting next month.Italy holds the G20 chair this year.
This further demonstrates the irrelevance both of the G7(of which Italy is also an -irrelevant -member)and the UK,current chair of the G7.And, frankly,it is irrelevant-a forum that comprises just the USA and it’s vassals;what sort of meaningful conversation can that body have on global issues?
Russian FM,Lavrov, is in Rome today,giving his backing.
August 27, 2021
NO. This was Blairs war. Put the blame at his and his Party’s door. I didn’t want it and protested against it, but as always is now expected to pay for the consequences. Enough and be gone you useless legacies.
August 27, 2021
Pathetic. Biden has been president for 8 months. He is trying to blame everyone but himself for this unfolding catastrophe. Biden is an unmitigated disaster. I did not find President Trump an appealing figure, but the world was a safer place during his presidency.
August 27, 2021
@Richard1; “Biden has been president for 8 months”
Meaning he or his administration can not possibility be the sole authors of this catastrophe, NATO forces have been pulling out for at least the last 12 months. Why has it taken until now for the UK to relocate many of the people we say we now want to get out of the Afghanistan (be they British, allied citizens, or Afghan employees, same for the USA, the media -both left and right- have been full of such stories for the last few years, not all these people were working with NATO countries up to the lass moment.
August 27, 2021
Who’s pulling the strings, it certainly isn’t Sleepy Joe and Harris is a none starter.
August 27, 2021
So you apparently think that Trump was not being naĂŻve, to trust the Taliban to maintain “good conduct” and yet you accuse the Left here of lacking realism?
And you’re more than happy after eleven years of Tory rule here to blame Labour for the latest mess here too.
Really, Richard, I mean, really…
August 27, 2021
what do you mean?
August 28, 2021
Not everything is a matter of slogans, Martin, even though the hard left do love them. President Biden did not follow ex-President Trump’s Doha agreement, so it is perverse to blame Trump for things that Biden has categorically authorised.
August 27, 2021
‘Everything that is happening in Afghanistan’ is due to the entirely crazy notion fostered by President Bush and PM Blair that the country could be transformed into a proto-democracy by armed force.
ps. I am most definitely NOT an apologist for President Trump.
August 27, 2021
Goodness. Relying on the Taliban to uphold good conduct is akin to expecting an alcoholic or addict never to relapse.
âThe world must sayâ etc etc as if China and Russia are going to do anything other than further their own interests, like acquire vast deposits of lithium for instance.
Trump politically gave a very clear signal that America had no appetite to continue its occupation and I heard no blizzard of criticism from his western partners thus emboldening the Taliban. Biden was elected on a mandate to withdraw totally, such mandates I know you place such store upon, apart from I guess like the triple lock when you can spin justification.
We now see Boris trying to claim success âbeing readyâ getting people out when people have been banging on about getting translators etc out for well over a year and HMG did nothing, a bit like the Foreign Secretary, Mandarins etc being on holiday as this crisis unfurled.
This post is yet another naive after the event comment totally ignoring the reality of the history going back to the experiences of the Russians. I think I recall quite recently someone asserted that the Taliban would not mean a proliferation of terrorist groups. How long did that last and they now have a 50 billion arsenal left by the Americans so the world is now a much more dangerous place.
Like Vietnam, the Balkans, more recently the Middle East and now Afghanistan we see the results of the actions of in denial hubristic politicians and yet again it is the people that suffered.
Of course we will see an inrush of immigrants. Like inaction over Brexit torn apart in a paper this morning and in many other areas, we get hollow words presumably said expecting us to believe them
We donât. Your governments pronouncements led by the âoven readyâ Johnson have zero credibility.
August 27, 2021
Gary Megson, Yet this debacle happened on President Biden’s watch, as a direct result of decisions Biden took, that he need not have taken. You may not have noticed but Donald Trump is no longer President. Blaming Trump for PotUS Biden’s misjudgements is delusional but typical of the irrational “orange man bad” hysteria of the more embarrassingly outspoken Democrats.
August 27, 2021
? FoxNews, 29/02/2020: âJohn Bolton blasts Trumpâs âObama-styleâ Taliban dealâ.
Axios.com 20/08/2021 âTrump officials back away from 2020 Taliban peace deal after withdrawal chaosâ.
And question to Sir John: what measures did the Trump administration apply between 29/02/2020 (Doha agreement) and 09/11/2020 (US elections) (or 20/01/2021: inauguration of the new PotUS) to make sure the Taliban were keeping their side of the bargain?
Reply The Taliban did not negotiate a peace with the Afghan government so Trump did not remove the troops
August 27, 2021
Between February 2020 and end of July 2020, the number of US troops in Afghanistan went from 13,000 to 8,600. As part of the Doha agreement 5,000 Taliban prisoners were also released. According to factcheck.org
August 27, 2021
Aye, those facts, again…
August 28, 2021
Yet the Taliban did not take over the Afghan government between February 2020 and July 2020, Martin. Aye, those “fact” checkers, again . . . .
August 27, 2021
Gary Megson : âEverything that is happening in Afghanistan is the direct result of Donald Trumpâs surrender to the Taliban in Doha in 2020.â
President Trump had the right idea to negotiate with the Taliban a peaceful exit from Afghanistan.
As an article last Sunday in the Mos observed the puppet government set up by the US did not represent the people of Afghanistan and were involved in massive fraud (electoral and financial), corruption, drug dealing, smuggling, sexual slavery and blatant theft which took place in Afghanistan as result of the $trillions of US aid pumped into the country.
The UK also lost ÂŁmillions in aid fraud.
And it is these people who ran Afghanistan as a Kleptocracy who are now fleeing from the Taliban and who our Government desperately wants to bring over to the UK.
BTW, just because Afghans are fleeing from the Taliban does not mean that they are all benign, UK law abiding âasylum seekersâ who will be eventually beneficial and friendly towards our country.
President Biden, who could have reversed President Trumpâs decision to exit Afghanistan, did not continue with the negotiations with the Taliban and as a result has made a complete mess of the exit.
August 27, 2021
What is your alternative? US troops in Afghanistan for ever? The truth is that the evacuation was inevitable, but it’s been handled completely incompetently this month.
August 27, 2021
Good morning.
REALLY !!! Try going on an anti-vax protest or similar. Unless you are one of the approved protest groups you won’t be able to. Plus. Leaving as you so please does not extend to the right to go to another country uninvited. Unless of course you are the UK.
Well your leader seems to thing it is OK. He has just offered places for 20,000 ! This on top of all those Hong Kong Chinese and anyone else it seems. And no, we are not short of homes, just too many people !
Again I say; “Who are the Taliban ?” Because to me they look, sound and act very much like the people who already live there. It is like the Americans in the Vietnam war. They spoke of the Viet-Cong as if they were a completely separate from all the other Vietnamese. They never were ! They were the same people FFS ! And so too are the Taliban.
I do not care what the Taliban or any other government or regime does. Their house, their rules ! We voted to Leave the EU so we could do that, why can’t the people of Afghanistan be left to do the same ?
August 27, 2021
+10
August 27, 2021
Iâll raise you 1,000.
++1,000
Superb comment!
My anger expressed exactly.
August 27, 2021
@Mark B – if only we had left EU rule, that will be the day. All talk and ‘virtue signaling’
If the Taliban this time around doesn’t nurture and provide a safe haven to those that wish to attack the wider world we might just be alright. If however they do revert we are lost we no longer have a defensive capability for that type of scenario,
August 27, 2021
Its a bit of a worry that the Taliban let everyone out of jail
August 27, 2021
what happened in N.Ireland?
August 27, 2021
I can’t understand why all these nations of a particular religion refuse to stand up for themselves. 75000 Taliban and 40 million population.
They know who they are so should sort them out.
August 27, 2021
Look at us though.
Sitting and watching our country being torn apart.
By how many?
August 27, 2021
+ million (I mean upticks not people to come, but I’m sure we’ll see that and more)
August 27, 2021
Indeed Mark.
August 27, 2021
Indeed all very depressing.
Religion, irrational belief systems and the politicians, war leaders and religious leaders who endlessly misuse these have done (and continue to do) huge harm. Even now in the UK with the net zero carbon religion and many the faith schools that cause such cleavages in society.
.
August 27, 2021
Attributing their actions to religion is just mis-direction. They know what they do is wrong, even if they decide to interpret their religion to support it.
Plenty of examples of people who have committed atrocities without religion in the past 100 years. Their atheism allowed them to regard questions of humanity merely as abstract concepts, to be ignored if they so chose.
The real problem is the evil heart of man, with or without religion.
August 27, 2021
Is it easier to find suicide bombers if they think there is a heavenly afterlife awaiting them and are driven by religion or if they are atheists? What proportion of suicide bombers are atheists I wonder?
As the theoretical physicist and Nobel laureate, Steven Weinberg once put it, “With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil – that takes religion.”
August 27, 2021
The religious element makes it easier for others to follow them though Dave.
August 27, 2021
+1
August 27, 2021
Yes, for the near-perfect example look at the Brexitians.
August 27, 2021
Not religion at all a rational desire to live in a real democracy, with a sensible demos by people one can remove in elections. Not by puppets who always nodded usually idiotic EU rules, laws and regulation through. One held by the majority of the voters.
August 27, 2021
I wonder what your thoughts would be on 10 years of rule by Boris Johnson, simply because some other politicians chose him? I take it you dislike democracy?
August 27, 2021
I hadn’t heard a religious argument for or against Brexit, but would welcome you saying those that motivated your comment.
August 27, 2021
Yawn.
August 27, 2021
The referendum outcome was the expression of ‘the cleavage in society’, a demand that the interests of the UK people be put first for a change, not the cause of that cleavage.
August 27, 2021
+1
August 27, 2021
Nah – it was mainly old people being scared of anyone who didn’t speak English as a first language.
August 27, 2021
I’m sorry, MiC but those ‘old’ people went into the Common Market (EU) after twenty years of people without English as a first language coming here. This was purely about the enlarged numbers being forced upon us and it turns out they were right. Lorry drivers WERE underpaid because of imported labour.
August 27, 2021
I see you are playing your race card again MiC
You will get lefty bonus points for including ageism as well.
Pathetic.
August 28, 2021
Martin, Most of those “old people” you sneer at for being “scared” of anyone who doesn’t speak English, voted to remain in the EEC(EU) back in 1975. Still, logic was never your strong point.
August 27, 2021
Actually, Martin, it is perfectly rational to be outside the EU – most of the world is. And being inside the EU is rational if you wish your country to be a mere colony of an empire. But not many people share your wish. Thank God.
August 27, 2021
are Andy’s Brexitists different?
August 27, 2021
Brexit caused Kabul. We all knew that was coming.
reply Yes, absurd idea
August 27, 2021
J Meirion Thomas today in the Telegraph says what I have been saying for 40+ years.
âVets serve pets better than GPs do the public
General practice has no financial incentive to give taxpayers the service that they have a right to expectâ
A dire state virtual state monopoly, free at the point of delay, rationing, incompetence and often non treatment, pain & death. MRI scan for your dog? Just fine sir pop in this afternoon at 2.00. Can you do my knee at the same time too please? No sir we are not allowed to. Just wait six month in pain and the NHS might do it eventually.
August 27, 2021
Indeed. I pay ÂŁ300 a year pet insurance and my dog would have been seen quicker than me ! (I pay around ÂŁ10k to the NHS I estimate.)
August 27, 2021
Great post L/L.
August 27, 2021
“One of the most attractive features of advanced democracies is the ability and right to travel freely within your own country or to leave it to go to anywhere which will let you in without needing permission.”
Are the Johnson regime aware this is supposed to be a democratic country? Because as I write they are in the throes of putting in putting in a dictat that we must have evidence to prove we have had at least two of their ‘clot shots’ to be able to go about freely within our own country! And if the argument is because of their ‘pandemic’, why are they inviting thousands of these ‘vulnerable’ people into our overcrowded country?
August 27, 2021
Any country which does not allow people it to leave it is surely effectively a large prison. It does not get people to stay by having to be an attractive place to live with competent government, individual rights, sensible laws & tax levels. It does it by force, by imprisoning its citizens & often by effectively enslaving them.
August 27, 2021
It almost seems that the MPs donât realise what they are doing.
Or just donât want to acknowledge it?
As you say they certainly arenât logical..but liars seldom are.
Clot shots + liberal invites = Blatant Replacement maybe?
August 27, 2021
EverH – – Absolutely 100% spot on. They know EXACTLY what they are doing – – destroying this culture and replacing it wth everyone else who couldn’t be botheres to make their place decent.
August 27, 2021
+1
August 27, 2021
“One of the most attractive features of advanced democracies is the ability and right to travel freely within your own country or to leave it to go to anywhere which will let you in without needing permission.”
This is satire I presume? That’s exactly what this Government has done to British citizens for the past 18 months. And if “vaccine passports” go ahead in the UK the same Government will be deliberately setting out to make this a two-tier society ….. except instead of actively discriminating against people on the basis of their sex, they will be discriminated against on the basis of their medical history.
We should not be taking tens of thousands of Afghan citizens. The implementation of mass immigration to the UK over the past 25 years has hardly been a resounding success, (etc ed). We have an integration crisis; a housing crisis; a public services crisis, particularly the NHS ….. which has all been caused by mass immigration. It has to stop.
As for that senile old man in the White House, he may not have been responsible for the bomb which killed American soldiers yesterday, but he is responsible for creating the conditions which allowed it to happen. And this is just the start.
August 27, 2021
Yes!
+ a few million.
August 27, 2021
Indeed. When there is a new virus around that is killing people, we should – of course – be allowed to move around as we like and spread the virus as quickly and widely as possible.
August 27, 2021
Mike, Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. It wasn’t you, but when I suggested closing our borders (back in Feb/Mar 2020) I was roundly denounced as a “xenophobe”. By the very same people who later went on to admire New Zealand for doing exactly that. However we are now in a very different situation where covid, and many variants of it, are spread throughout the world. Given these changed circumstances, I cannot see why there are still mask and movement controls for the general population (by all means isolate the sick and vulnerable, as we have done for other infectious diseases).
August 27, 2021
Thatâs what we always used to do.
And look..according to some, the world population is still too great!
August 27, 2021
How do you know people who are moving around are spreading the virus? Are you possibly making assumptions, like SAGE/Johnson?
If they don’t have it, they can’t spread it.
What they did was lock up an entire population when the vast majority were perfectly healthy.
August 27, 2021
I agree Donna, it has to stop. But who will hear us?
August 27, 2021
Excellent
August 27, 2021
The most frightening thing is, he has not even completed one full year of his term and the wheels are starting to come off.
Taiwan, South Korea and Japan must be deeply concerned.
August 27, 2021
If Afghanistan is going to progress from here, the people will need to engage with the Taliban themselves, and persuade them their oppressive behaviour is wrong, and they will need to change. It seems though there is little good in that country. With 20 years of foreign occupation, the government put in place just engaged in corruption and the opium trade mushroomed.
In time perhaps the country will mature to the point where they can elect their government and those in power will be of good character. Yes I know – fat chance.
August 27, 2021
”engage with the Taliban themselves, and persuade them their oppressive behaviour is wrong”
The Taliban are (like many of their neighbouring countries) just following the teachings of the Koran
August 27, 2021
Glen,
I don’t believe that they are following the “teachings of the Koran” they are following one line of interpretation of the Koran. This is the problem with most religious books, they were written in such a way that the words can be interpreted in many different ways, either due to the use of ancient language (the Koran was written in ancient Arabic I believe) or the real meaning “lost in translation” or just plain written in an obscure way.
A typical example is that the Koran says that Men & Women must dress modestly, but as we know this is interpreted as women must cover themselves up completely and men can wear what they want !!!
August 27, 2021
The deaths yesterday in Kabul were indeed most regrettable, but entirely predictable given the total chaos that the Americans have organised at the airport. According to a Reuters report last night, this has extended to giving their 20year enemy the particulars of 1700 Afghans with American passports, green cards and visas, ostensibly so that they can be given preferential treatment at Kabul airport entry gates. The orders to do so came from the White House.
The Taliban were reported as going from house-to-house last night, searching for the unfortunate transators so that they can be beheaded as collaborators.
August 27, 2021
Or alternatively …. we could just let the Afghans run their country the way THEY want – and the Taliban ARE Afghans. Those opposed to the Taliban are a tiny fraction of the Afghan population. Brexit was successful because we don’t want to be told what to do by foreigners. Why is it so difficult to give Afghans the same sovereignty and independence that we want for ourselves? I bitterly resent it when some interfering foreigner opines on the UK, and not being a hypocrite I do not opine on how others run their own countries.
Of course it would be different if Afghanistan were a menace to us – by harbouring international terrorists, for instance. Then we would have a perfect right to bomb them to hell. But the Taliban today are (it seems) actually opposed to ISIS, so this may not be a problem. We shall see. A watching brief is all that is required for now. They have different moral, cultural and religious values to us, but then, they are a different people to us, so why shouldn’t this be the case? People ARE different – that’s precisely why mass immigration doesn’t work! As long as they keep their practices to themselves it doesn’t bother me one iota.
August 27, 2021
seems reasonable
August 27, 2021
In your opinion.
August 27, 2021
Hear hear.
People forget, that there are some countries we do an awful lot of business with, who have practices very little different fr0m that of the Taliban, and yet, we say nothing.
August 27, 2021
“Those opposed to the Taliban are a tiny fraction of the Afghan population.”
Really? Well, we will all be able to test this claim, since if all but a tiny fraction of Afghans support the Taliban, life in Afghanistan will be peaceful and calm, because you don’t have to use terror against tiny fractions.
August 27, 2021
The hitherto governance of Afghanistan has been so very “far from perfect” that few in that country were prepared to defend it, John.
We must accept that countries such as China and Russia will now be far more influential there than the UK and the US.
I’d suggest engaging constructively with these, therefore.
August 27, 2021
You would, Martin. Any tin-pot ruler is good enough for you, whether von der Leyen, Putin or Xi.
August 27, 2021
So we could ask Putin for his list of Russians he would like forcibly flown back to Moscow?
That would be constructive and suddenly we’d be better friends?
August 27, 2021
Now apply that reasoning to 1939.
August 27, 2021
It is regrettable that the ex Royal Marine Pen Farthing has been prevented from evacuating the staff and animals at his Nowzad rescue centre in Kabul. He is reported to have a chartered plane waiting at the airport – but is prevented from boarding by unnecessary redtape and the intransigence of the SoS Defence Ben Wallace, who is clearly not an animal lover.
Maybe Wallace should go on prime-time TV again and have another nervous breakdown about it. He should be investigated by the RSPCA if any harm comes to Pen Farthing’s homeless dogs and cats.
August 27, 2021
Apparently many MPs have been inundated with messages of support for Mr Farthings animals – demanding we take them.
I am an animal lover but I find it really rather sick that we have a campaign to help the animals in Kabul and not one to help the people.
August 27, 2021
The animals will need to undergo a full 6 month quarantine if they come to the UK. That better not be at taxpayer expense. The places they take on aircraft deny exit to others.
August 27, 2021
Farthing should never have been indulged, that he hired an aircraft to fly his stray cats and dogs out doesn’t remove the danger he put people in to do this. His stray cats and dogs charity is going to prove to be a very expensive one for the British tax payer, as the costs he has loaded onto the country doesn’t end with the flight, for I doubt he will be paying for the houses (we don’t have) for his staff, neither will he be picking up the bill for the education , health and all the other services they will need.
This stunt appears to have been facilitated by the Prime Ministers wife , whose meddling yet again proves to be an expensive bit of indulgence.
August 27, 2021
Thanks SG.
I’d say that if your comment were read by the general Tory vote here, then it would cause far more outrage than what is likely to happen to perhaps millions of decent human beings in Afghanistan.
August 27, 2021
On the other hand…
We could be a nation that flame-grilles such animals’ alive at festivals to make the muscles tense and the flesh more succulent.
If you’re going to pillory the British people over a solitary (and *private*) drop-in-the-ocean flight then you must be prepared to do it to a people who are capable of such cruelty and are prepared to imperil the whole human race by using wet markets (or was it a lied about lab leak from gain-of-function bioweapon research ?)
August 27, 2021
PS, Martin
Re your objection to me saying what you liked and disliked regarding masks the other day.
(You want them enforced)
I say this.
For 18 months I did my bit. I wore a bloody mask for up to six hours a day helping to keep the country running while you hid at home. I did so in spite of claustrophobia and I did so in some very stuffy and uncomfortable conditions.
I took a vaccine that I did not want so that I and others might be free.
Now you are STILL ordering me about. “Get your mask on or you are a bad person.” is the emotional blackmail you use. “By wearing this mask I protect you, now you protect me.”
NO.
Don’t you worry about me, Martin. If you believe in mask wearing worry about yourself. Get your N95 on and let the rest of us behave like normal human beings.
August 27, 2021
No, I did none of that, but fantasise to your hearts consent.
August 28, 2021
Martin, You frequently called for longer harsher untargeted national lockdowns using the Chinese as your exemplars.
August 28, 2021
When and where, Nick?
August 27, 2021
It would be a much-needed PR win for the cosplay conservatives to get/let Pen Farthing and his animals out. The animal-loving British public are unlikely to forgive and forget if they donât.
August 27, 2021
Farthing is out of touch with reality. I hope that not a single British serviceman is exposed to any danger related to the evacuation of his staff and animals.
August 27, 2021
+1
August 27, 2021
Agreed! Sea_Warrior. What a load of nonsense when we really need to get the bootnecks out in one piece.
August 27, 2021
Under the circumstances, I don’t think there is any rationale reason to bring those animals out.
The charity’s staff were offered passage but insisted that the strays came too. I’m pretty sure a lot of Afgans would have liked that choice for them and their families! “Pets before People” ?? – what about “Children before Cats & Dogs”
The UK doesn’t control the airspace at Kabul (the US military do) and flight slots right now are extremely precious – a “Charter” (e.g. Civilian) flight into this area (effectively a war zone) was a pretty risky idea. Why should anyone (especially Ben Wallace) pander to some daft animal charity with all the chaos going on there currently and with other far more urgent/important things to worry about – like getting our troops out in one piece.
This is really complete lunacy. You would think an ex-Marine would have more common sense.
August 27, 2021
Yes, the cats and dogs – that’s where the Defence Secretary should focus his attention…
August 27, 2021
Well, maybe the Chinese will take them off his hands?
They would at least make some beneficial use of them.
August 27, 2021
Ben Wallace has clearly got some at least of his priorities right.
August 27, 2021
The world must say that Taliban rule is already unacceptable in Afghanistan.
Words are cheap. Unacceptable? Only if the world is indeed not going to accept it, and do something about it.
It is accepted already. The US clearly accept it. The Chinese donât seem to be interested. Itâs not obvious that Pakistan could do anything, even if they wanted to, but actually they are Taliban fans.
No-one else could contemplate an invasion.
Sanctions never work.
We have to accept the Taliban rule in Afghanistan. And Afghanistan as a safe base for terrorists.
What we could and should do is make it exceptionally difficult for terrorists to enter the U.K.. Not invite thousands of poorly vetted refugees into the U.K. mainland and high streets.
August 27, 2021
Indeed. And pigs might fly
August 27, 2021
Spot on, profound and wise words that our government should note
August 27, 2021
What started as a proxy (cold) war between the capitalists and the communists will get more complicated. The US should stick to over the horizon proxy wars, just supplying guns and dollars. On occasions when they go toe to toe with the local tribes they usually get smacked.
The next episode in Afghanistan will be between Pakistan and India. The latter has paid for much infrastructure. The former has tribal ties in Afghanistan.
August 28, 2021
Good job you’re not our Foreign Secretary, then, Acorn. The tribes in Pakistan adjacent to Afghanistan barely recognise the government in Islamabad.
August 27, 2021
And in other news, we now see a Remainer driven campaign to allow vast amounts of cheap labour to come in because of supply chain problems. How long before this weak government crumbles?
August 27, 2021
Next week is too long.
August 28, 2021
I’m quite happy to see wages for lorry drivers, harvesters, bar staff and the rest go up.
I’m also happy to pay more for food, drink etc. to finance that.
The Tories know that not many of their new voters are, however, especially as the likes of Tim Martin said that brexit would make them cheaper.
It’s a hoot!
August 27, 2021
Afghanistan is their home. It is not a solution to relocate large numbers of them to the UK.
August 27, 2021
Correct – its a civil war
August 27, 2021
The Taliban have been waging war against the allies for the past 20 years of occupation. Guerrillas do not function without tacit support and acceptance from the occupied population so we can safely assume that many Afghans agree with their doctrine.
None of the population or national security forces stood up against the Taliban as it took over cities and provinces within the country, that also suggests a certain acceptance among the population for the Taliban’s rules and presence.
If the Afghanis will not fight for their own country why should we? Why should we accept anyone from that country to come here and need support to survive? Why do 68 workers and immediate family of an animal shelter qualify for a visa to come here?
The handwringing of the political classes and those wishing to show how worthy there are to be seen to be doing something (with our money) is sickening. The Afghanis capitulated, let all but those who collaborated with us and any (real) UK nationals stay to reap what they sowed.
August 27, 2021
John Redwood’s prose can be a delight to read and he is at his best here. His first paragraph states the case for the Liberal West as well as anything I have read. What a pity he is wrong about about almost everything
August 28, 2021
His opening sentence implies some form at least of global governance.
Interesting, what?
August 27, 2021
US back to war could be the scenario? A tortuous but probably only possible route has been set in train. Maybe?
Add to the 700% arms profit ?
What about popular support though?
I noticed a couple of hawkish speeches in the U.K. Parliament.
No one can really want China and Russia getting all that lithium plus other buried wealth!
August 27, 2021
Secret service pensioner Dame Pauline Neville-Jones,judging by her Sky interview this morning,wants to.So I assume would that Sarah Bernhardt of globalism,Tom Tugendhat.
BTW neither Russia nor China is looking to jump into Afghanistan for it’s resources in the forseeable future,it’s too unstable.Also,Russia has significant lithium deposits of it’s own,already being extracted in increasing amounts from it’s Arctic region,and as yet unexploited in it’s far eastern region.
August 27, 2021
Ah ok. Thanks for that.
Yes that the blokeâs nameâŠvery dramatic indeed, as you say!!
Also thought Mrs M was a bit hawkish? Save the girls etc?
August 27, 2021
A great deal of sense in today’s post. I would completely agree that a country should not prevent its nationals from travelling by air. Unfortunately, one way to do that is to make international travel unaffordable. The government requires them when they return to have paid large sums to private companies for Covid test results. I see 82 out of 403 such companies may be struck off for overcharging (or then again they may not be). I wondered if these were among the small business startups Sir John was hoping to see springing up thanks to the Covid crisis.
August 27, 2021
The history of British soldiers leaving Afghanistan is not good.I fear history will repeat its self.
August 27, 2021
I really wouldn’t want to be detailed to be the perimeter guard for that last military flight out of Kabul. The penultimate scene of ‘Where Eagles Dare’ would keep coming to mind.
August 27, 2021
Surely a squadron of helicopter drones can be deployed. We have those, don’t we ???
August 27, 2021
Sir John – I agree with the outrage, but that is just words.
The UK is not able to back the Words up with any thing more than more words. When we first got involved in Afghanistan all due thanks to Blair and Co, we had 3 times the number of service personnel and were vastly better equipped than now.
Now we cant get involved actually move around the world anywhere unless it is a puppet of the US, then it is only a token to allow the US to call their involvement International.
Time to be realistic, and I don’t think it is the right approach, the UK is no longer a military capable country at best it is just a local defence force. Even defending the UK’s borders is beyond the capability of the UK. Time to admit it if we now don’t want to play any meaningful part in the world.
In contradiction to the Defence Secretary wars are not all Cyber and only Cyber – feet on the ground face to face has more impact does more good than hiding away in an office.
August 27, 2021
While agreeing that the UK should do its best to provide a safe haven to those fleeing for their lives. UK Government destroys that desire by ensuring those illegal’s therefore criminals have stolen the places and the good will for the legitimate.
August 27, 2021
A massive defeat for the forever war political elite here and in Washington. Still, on the bright side for them, I suppose now they can concentrate on importing foreign cultures by the boat and plane load whilst imprisoning, poisoning and sterilizing us.
August 27, 2021
Once again you are unwilling to break the taboo about discussing the wishes and welfare of the indigenous British, putting everything in terms of the welfare of non-British instead. I sympathise with the plight of liberal Afghans and the compulsory wearing of the hijab for women, but if your government persists with its mass immigration policy then in fifty years time hijabs will be compulsory for women here.
August 27, 2021
Total drivel. Your nonsense needs to be called out for exactly what it is.
August 27, 2021
You don’t explain why, Andy.
The demographics show us what the UK’s religion will be at this rate of change.
It cannot be challenged. It cannot be scrutinised. Therefore it is all powerful and woke-ism and LGBTQ is going to be swept before it.
August 27, 2021
Coming from you, that is very amusing.
August 27, 2021
+1
Always framed thus.
August 27, 2021
We must now stem the flood. Any refugee arriving in this country must face a real prospect of immediate (next day) deportation to their homeland. Those allowed to stay must be given nothing other than an NI number and directions to the nearest farms with caravans, needing labour.
August 27, 2021
You claim to be a warrior.
I can’t get what it was, that you imagined that you fought to defend, that any decent person might have considered worth defending.
August 27, 2021
He was defending, for example, your right to wear an N95 mask and my right not to be bullied into wearing a surgical pad by you, MiC.
You protect you. Don’t worry about protecting me. I’ll look after myself and behave like a normal, healthy and free human being.
And here again – this comment you claim to make from your moral high ground which is, in fact, a dung heap.
August 27, 2021
Amazing – you are telepathic.
August 28, 2021
Amazing – you tell us what you think, and are then amazed when we know what you think, Martin. Amazing . . .
August 27, 2021
Claim? I wear three campaign medals and served in Afghanistan. You?
August 27, 2021
Slightly disagree on part of your premise, Sir John. The UK Government is well aware their ‘friends’ the US signed the Doha agreement with the Taliban back in December. That agreement was for all foreign forces to leave by May of this year. The UK Government did nothing. We are now in August some 3 months on from the deadline so any one suggesting there is now an unheard of problem – is a little out of kilter.
As many keep repeating, because of other ego style agendas the UK Government is going down a path that ensures the UK is no longer resilient and self reliant, therefore heading to world obscurity. The UK is being stripped and depleted of the means to survive on its own going forward (Must be a rejoin the EU scenario, after all the HoC is still remain). To me this policy seems almost malicious – punish the peasants as my ego is what matters.
If the Government was to take up its responsibility of ensuring we are all safe and secure, with a strong resilient economy, I might have a different view. But the Government is heading in the opposite direction to the needs of the people and the Country.
On balance anything the ‘talking heads’, the MsM and this Government along with the HoC says with regards Afghanistan the Taliban is just meaningless weasly words. Which is why people commenting here talk of the ‘grandstanding’, the political gesture and ‘virtue signaling’. We can’t now get beyond this fault line in our political structure unless there is a refocusing of putting the people the country therefore the economy first and foremost. We need a Government that serves the People, not the headline or an Election.
REply The Doha conditions to leave had not been and were not going to be met so THE UK did not prepare to leAve
August 27, 2021
@Nota# – I hate the idea of yet another election, we would have to destroy a lot of well meaning MP’s first to get rid the problem of ego agendas and rebalance. Then were are the leaders the inspirationalist and a political party that is not an ideological Socialist Party
August 28, 2021
Heritage Party?
August 28, 2021
Nota#, JR is right, though I agree with much of what you say.
August 27, 2021
Afghanistan has become even more of a tragedy than it ever was, and more innocent westerners will die because of the insane woke US government, and its incompetence, trapped in a country that doe not do ‘human rights’.
We shouldn’t be surprised at the barbaric killings – everybody knows, or should do by now that they
There are a great deal of people that would love to escape the tyranny imposed by western governments using covid as their excuse to destroy our society.
August 27, 2021
Ooops that was premature
August 27, 2021
Todays Daily Telegraph – sums up how ineffective UK words are going forward
The Taliban now has access to $85 billion worth of American military equipment and the biometric data of the Afghans who have assisted soldiers over the past 20 years, a Republican congressman has warned.
Jim Banks, a former US Navy reservist, said that the vast amount of hardware left behind includes 75,000 vehicles, 200 airplanes and helicopters and 600,000 small arms and light weapons.
âThe Taliban now has more Black Hawk helicopters than 85 per cent of the countries in the world,â he said in a speech in Washington.
August 27, 2021
And some of it has already been moved over the border to Iran.
August 28, 2021
M, Are you telling us of the reconciliation between the ardent pro-Saudi Arabian Sunni Taliban and the Iranian Shias? If there is any bit of proof in your assertion, thatâs a worldwide scoop! Whatâs your reference?
August 27, 2021
Eh? The UK is somehow responsible for US weapons transfers to the Afghan Army? How so?
August 27, 2021
We have no right to interfere in other countries.
I donât believe the British are a superior race to any other and therefore I see no reason for us to impose our standards and ways of living on other cultures.
We do have some responsibility to make amends for our interference in Afghanistan but our aim should be to stop attempting to police the world, stop arrogantly trying to impose our will on other countries and to bring our armed forces back to the UK and properly enforce our borders.
August 27, 2021
That’s horribly confused, unless you are saying that terrible human rights violations are acceptable for some “races”.
August 27, 2021
And there other races who consider that we routinely violate “human rights” within our own country.
One culture judging another culture by its own standards is where the confusion lies.
August 27, 2021
People cannot be governed by politicians not of their choice. This is what will eventually lead to the disintegration of the EU.
We in the West may have our own views on how the Afghans behave and live, but they are our views, not the Afghans. If the Afghans desire freedom of movement, the Taliban will not be able to deny it forever. It must be for the Afghans to choose how they want to live. Not us.
August 27, 2021
The vast majority in this country didnât vote for Boris Johnson or the Conservative Party. We are literally governed by politicians not of our choice.
PS: the EU isnât disintegrating. Yet more disproven Brexitist nonsense.
August 27, 2021
Yup. You should have disenfranchised the white working class BEFORE you started slapping them around.
August 27, 2021
How many people in the EU voted for or against UvL?
August 28, 2021
How many people in the UK voted for or against the President Of The Law Commission here?
August 28, 2021
Don’t be tedious, Martin. The EU Commission is the powerhouse of the EU, but the Law Commission isn’t the powerhouse of the UK.
August 28, 2021
No, the twenty-seven proud, historic, sovereign nations of the European Union and their people are its powerhouse, and their representatives are their leaders in the European Council.
The Commission answers to them, and all proposals must be approves its parliament and by its council of ministers.
August 27, 2021
In which case neither Blair nor Brown were legitimate leaders by your logic Andy.
If you add up the votes for every single candidate who lost then the total will nearly always be more than the winner.
Or you just allow two candidates.
August 27, 2021
Or in Labour’s future one party state, just one.
August 27, 2021
Worry not, the Afghans are guaranteed a warm welcome in the UK whether we like it or not as are Priti much anyone who would like a life on benefits!
Do the blue socialists think that the Electorate havenât noticed and we will still put an X in the box next to the Tory candidate?
Is the plan to import the Dominion voting machines?
Perhaps Elections will not be permitted, I never expected a âconservativeâ government to act in the manner that this one has
Brexit hasnât happened because there a border down the Irish Sea.
August 28, 2021
Lester, Queue another “crackdown”!!
August 27, 2021
Iâve said it before and will say it again like the illegals invading across the channel to the mass of âAfghansâbeing flown in you really donât know who your letting in, god help any party in power if there is disasters of mass destruction further down the line, the Tory 2019 manifesto stated it would protect the people of the U.K. and get immigration under control what a joke, whatâs needed now is a new party formed who will stand up for the British people or should i say the English/Scottish/Welsh/Northern Ireland
August 27, 2021
Assad was once an ally of the west. Why did the odious Obama-Merkel partnership turn against him and Syria and unleash a wave of terror and violence
Please stop portraying these politicians as though they have any concern about human beings. They don’t give a toss about humanity, only political advantage.
And Biden? Well, Biden’s a stop gap for a Marxist psychopath who will unleash a wave of terror against the American people in a manner that will see them oppressed and their rights obliterated
I like John’s blog but he’s a party politician and adheres to a culture that rejects inconvenient truths, I fully understand this but it contributes to an environment that encourages self-censorship and that is detrimental to democratic accountability, good governance and accountability.
I don’t want to talk about free-lunch politics any more ie state spending. It helps politicians to deflect attention away from non-economic issues that are of far greater importance
Politicians have become the Child Catcher in Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
August 28, 2021
Assad was (also) an old ally of the Soviets/Russians;he blocked the western-backed Qatar gas pipeline proposal.The “civil” war broke out immediately after that decision was made.
August 29, 2021
Great post !
August 27, 2021
I thought Biden would be Jimmy Carter 2.0 – but with wokery and without some of the sensible supply side reforms which Carter did domestically – and so, unfortunately, he has proven to be. Letâs hope we have a Reagan in the wings in the shape e.g. of Pompeo or de Santis.
August 27, 2021
Don’t worry John, Andy and his mates assured us we had adults in the White House now following the last election so I’m sure they’ll sort it all out.
What is never commented on is that it is at least possible that the Taliban command majority support in Afghanistan – maybe not in Kabul but in the country as a whole, so their policies which run contrary to Western identity politics best practice may in fact be justified pseudo-democratically. So why are we complaining about them ?
August 27, 2021
Sir John,
Regarding your last paragraph, I wouldn’t take anything President Biden says too seriously. Increasingly he looks as though he’s about to fall asleep at the podium. Now that the mainstream press are finally turning against Biden and trying to get him to account for his inept actions, the pressure may prove to be too much. I can’t see him lasting another three years in a job for which he is clearly unfit. Unfortunately he would be replaced by Kamala Harris, now considered to be the worst Vice President to have ever held the office.
August 27, 2021
‘I am not convinced…….’.
Typical fence sitting, so Sir John is open to persuasion we should let tens of thousands of Afghans come and settle here.
Meanwhile those of us who expect our borders to be defended from illegals and which has been promised by openingly deceitful ministers are ignored and ridiculed while those in authority who daily fail to defend us get away with it.
Reply I am not fence sitting!
August 27, 2021
Reply to reply: ‘I am not convinced’ does not mean you are opposed. State your position more directly if you have one or are prepared to commit to one.
reply Yes I disagree!
August 27, 2021
Should we go back to where this all began, or should I say with whom this all began.
A man still haunting the place and it seems who is still listened to on a range of topics, not least how to control us all further.
One Mr T Blair who saw his opportunity as George Dubya’s side kick to arrive on the world stage with a bang, literally.
He not only helped destabilise whole regions elsewhere but committed our forces to places he’d no business doing so which led to far too many deaths and permanent disability (excellent presentation by Godfrey Bloom on you tube on this)
I don’t deny that there’s a case for helping those who in the initial stages of occupation/military endeavour such as interpreter’s and possibly a few others. I can’t imagine it was a network of 10’s of 1000’s. Even if it was at some point the British Government has to be forced to realise it’s first duty is here to the people of Britain who cannot keep being the cash cow and the ‘go to’ place for the world and its ills.
Most never wanted intervention in these places, our service men used for personal glory of leaders, yet it is always us who have to pick up the pieces. Shuffle up, pay up and shut up.
August 27, 2021
I would like to ask why we are seeing scenes of Afghan’s here waving their flag, who have clearly been here some time and are clearly anti-Taliban. Their claims of being let down are puzzling to me. Why I ask were they here and not in Afghanistan helping rebuild, strengthen their nation before any of this happened?
How many will be demanding we bring in more, quite a few I should imagine.
As for the continual spin on who worked for who, you could be forgiven for believing that the whole Afghan society and its institutions were working ‘for us’.
Surely for quite a long time now they have been working for themselves, in government etc.
We have spent huge sums of money, helped equip and train their army as just two examples, and yet we seem to be being told it is us that was having our hand held through it all and must now open our doors to all.
August 27, 2021
A bit of a story: I really had to go to France. I had my PCR Fit to Fly at Madejski Stadium, Reading, with the results (negative, promptly arriving 20 hours later). I booked my day 2 PCR test, it arrives promptly 30 hours later. So far so good.
Then surprise when departing from LGW nobody checked whether I had a PCR F2F: the proof of double vaccination (NB: on a piece of paper appears to be preferred by the authorities) is enough. Idem arriving at destination, nobody asked for my PCR F2F, only the proof of vaccs.
I am now told by locals who at the end of July travelled to the UK by car that they only ever had to show their proof of double vaccs. They had taken the proof of less than 24 hours negative LFTs with them but no-one had checked it in Dover. And for what I suspect they did not have the equivalent of a day 2 PCR after entering Britain. They are now back in France having like me got PCRs before leaving the UK for France but nobody ever checked them.
For what I understand thatâs a lot of ÂŁ50-80 PCRs for nothing.
Then, according to some biologist in the know (who had actually been involved in such things for four months) bits of actual PCR tests are put in a big âpotâ containing stuff from 12×12 tests. If no covid signal is detected from such a pot, all are declared negative without any further ado.
Only if a positive signal is detected from the âpotâ are the 144 original tests further going individually for full genetic sequencing. Interestingly the price of a PCR test to the âconsumerâ is obviously for the full operation, which these days is only performed on the 1 to 5% positives among all the tests.
Nice âpotâ of money if you can get to it (or are the MP (Cambridge History graduate) drawing âconsultancyâ money from that pharmaceutical company).
August 27, 2021
To quote Charles C W Cooke from Twitter yesterday,
âBidenâs position is that this sort of thing was always going to happen, which is why it caught us by surprise, which underscores why weâre leaving, and thatâs why we need to strike back, so the mission will go on.â
August 27, 2021
Priti Patel
@pritipatel
·
“2h
Yesterday, I was proud to welcome eligible, at-risk Afghans brought to safety by the ARAP scheme, like this young woman & her little sisters I spoke to. Theyâre now safe to grow up with an education, go on to have a career, contribute fully & know freedom â not fear & oppression.”
Don’t live in a place of fear and oppression – – come to England – where the people live in fear and oppression – – LOCKDOWN !!! stay indoors or else you’ll be arrested, took to court, fined and get a crminal record. Oppression – you can only have a social life if we stick a never ending amount of ??? in you.
Thank god I have what I have.
August 27, 2021
Really Sir John! You very nearly contradict yourself.
You start off saying WE should not allow blah blah blah.
It never was anything to do with us. Not our business.
It wasn’t even this government that got us involved!
Then you switch to the opposite side:- We can’t get so many out. We don’t have room etc. etc. etc.
And what are you doing telling other countries what they should do to ‘help’ these people?
That again is not our business.
I’m most disappointed in your diary.
For heavens sake get a grip on England’s and UK’s whole Immigration Problem.
It is quite simple THERE IS TOO MUCH IMMIGRATION INTO OUR COUNTRY!
August 27, 2021
‘If you ever feel useless, remember it took 20 years, trillions of dollar and 4 US Presidents to replace the Taliban………with the Taliban’
August 27, 2021
words from the Master Statesman:
“The British government should keep some form of diplomatic back-channel open to Isis in order to help move towards a political solution in Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.
The Labour leader told the BBCâs Andrew Marr Show that some Middle Eastern countries were clearly already in touch with the militant group and that there had to be âsome route throughâ to its leadership.”
Independent, Sunday 17 January 2016
August 27, 2021
According to Spiegel today, Germany decided to cut and run on Thursday, suspending all evacuation flights and leaving thousands of Afghans who had worked with German forces behind.
August 28, 2021
They did manage to evacuate all their beer and wine stocks though!
August 27, 2021
Biden is going no further with this Bush/Blair debacle as a seasoned politician he’s been looking at the Middle East stuff for decsdes and knows there is no future for the white man in following this path. So victory to the Taliban as it should be and now for ourserlves nothing else to do except to decamp go home and lick our wounds
August 27, 2021
Jeez John as if you really care? Maybe time to take a holidayđ
August 27, 2021
Instead why don’t you give us a straight up and down answer about where we are going? For instance I havn’t heard a peep from Liz Truss about these new deals with foreign countries and places we were promised. Furthermore I don’t know where the foreign workers that used to work here in our factories and hotels have gone – they went home because of the pandemic i think – but so far have not returned – hotel is still closed – no workers – no tourists
August 27, 2021
Dear John Redwood
The situation with Afghanistan could have been avoided if Boris Johnson was more on the ball and decided that Global Britain would step up to the plate with regard to operations in Afghanistan to keep the Taliban at- bay. As soon as Donald Trump announced the withdrawal of US troops there should have been a commitment- by the Conservative Government – to double spending on defence to 4% of GDP- complete with bolstering the Armed forces and procuring some more nukes. This could be funded by bearing down on quangos and slashing the size of Whitehall.
With double the size of our Armed Forces Britain could- if need be- have committed to unilaterally maintaining a presence in Afghanistan to keep the Taliban at bay. This would have prevented the unfolding of tragic events as has happened this month- at considerable cost to this country in having to take in potentially 20,000 refugees who will all need to be housed, watered, clothed and fed. There will also be an additional cost of translators to help them learn English, and to help their kids learn English in the Education system. In any case, as other have commented here, Britain is bursting at the seams and we cannot really take in a further 20,000 people- or indeed the boat-loads crossing the English Channel who are being put in hotels, provided food and shelter, etc.
The big lesson that Boris Johnson must take away from all this is that we can no longer trust the USA: President Joe Biden, a Democrat is pro-EU and loves the Irish, so is happy to do the EU’s bidding to get Britain to toe the line i.e., “Respect the Northern Ireland Protocol…or the USA Trade Deal is OFF!”: I just hope that Boris Johnson is aware of what the USA/EU/Britain Realpolitik is, that if push comes to shove the Democrat-run USA will side with the EU against Britain. So, Boris Johnson needs to hold firm with the EU, override the Protocol for the benefit of folk in Northern Ireland and be willing to face not having a Trade Deal with the USA or the EU. The Government needs to be looking to the Commonwealth to strengthen our links with them instead, and for Britain to be prepared to go her own way in the World if that is what is takes.
If Britain had double the expenditure on (and size) of the Armed Forces, RAF and Royal Navy- and more nukes- this country would carry more clout on the World stage. That would stop other countries from feeling that they can push this country around. It is disheartening that Boris Johnson could not persuade President Biden to keep the US troops in Afghanistan just a few more days. This is why we need an Army with half a million fine soldiers, not less than 150,000 as is the case today.
August 29, 2021
+1
August 28, 2021
If the Taliban Government wish to avoid deprivation and poverty, we have some leverage because one third of Afghan GDP is foreign aid and because a lot of Afghan assets, including their foreign currency holdings, are in the New York Stock Exchange. There are a few things we should tell the Taliban:
– If you want your talented people such as doctors and engineers to stay, it is a good idea not to go round killing people. The same applies to persuading foreign technicians to visit and maintain elevators, air conditioning etc.
– Educating girls of ability to a high standard would also be useful, both for its own sake and persuading their fathers and mothers to stay.
– Tapering off foreign aid slowly will allow you time to develop your own economy, preferably not based on poppy products.
I think that we might succeed in persuading the Taliban leadership to liberalise in Kabul and some other cities but out in the sticks it may be a different matter. Afghanistan has a history of regional governments and warlords.
August 29, 2021
I read with some bemusement reports from Washington that Mr Biden resents the criticism by our Parliament and government of his action (and inaction) in Afghanistan, and will seek revenge against Britain for what he sees as a personal slight on his intelligence. He should be satisfied with the chaos and defeat he has already inflicted – which is far greater than any he could now wreak through any wilful attempt.
What a pity he did not choose ton defend America against her enemies, instead of now threatening her allies.
September 3, 2021
We never had a duty to any Afghans to bring them here. Our overriding duty is to our own people. We should not be following policies that will push us into minority status in 40 years’ time. The Tories are globalists, not patriots. They don’t recognise any commitment to work for the interests of our own nation. We don’t need to intervene around the world, take in any refugees at all – all this will lead to the end of Britain as a country where the native British (and I don’t mean everyone with a passport) are the majority. At least the Tibetans know that something bad is happening to them with China’s demographic engulfing of Tibet. In this country, it is becoming almost illegal to point out we are sliding towards minority status. If this happens, we don’t survive as a nation. It’s that simply. And Redwood supports it.