David Davis – what a stand!

I agree with everything David said about the erosion of our freedoms. He expressed the frustration many of us feel about the build up of the controlling state – the way ID cards, spy cameras, the loss of Habeas Corpus, the daily assault on our freedoms by nit picking regulation – now add up to an unacceptable loss of liberty. He spoke for me when he listed the monstrous assaults on freedom this government has mounted.

His selfless act to give more prominence to this issue is a bolt from the blue. I do hope the Conservative party will allow him to fight the seat as he sees fit, and welcome him back if and when he wins. He deserves to win, for surely he speaks for the overwhelming majority of English people who want to keep their freedoms, or regain control over their lives after years of stealthy assaults on our liberties. It is a commentary on the way that this government has marginalised and sidelined its part time Parliament that a leading MP feels he needs to trigger a by election to get the message across.

Good on you David. I want you to win.

If Labour fail to put up a candidate we will know they are frit, unable to face the electors on a crucial topic where they claim to be on the popualr side of the argument. Clearly they do not really believe it is the popular side if they don’t want to fight.


  1. Susan
    June 12, 2008

    David Davis stands by his principles and I applaud his actions. More MPs like this please. I hope he has a resounding victory in the by-election.

  2. Graeme
    June 12, 2008

    Presumably you'll be announcing your resignation on the same issue later today then John, giving your constituents "the opportunity to debate and consider one of the most fundamental issues of our day"?

  3. Defamatory Vileness
    June 12, 2008

    Hear! Hear!

    Why don't more Tory MPs follow his example and force a mini referendum on the issue via a bevy of bye elections?

  4. Cliff
    June 12, 2008


    I too want Mr Davis to win!!

    Unfortunately, it does appear that it is being spun by the media as a political stunt, however, political stunt or not, the issues he raises are very important and I agree with what he says.
    We are seeing our country being dragged down towards the type of state our country would have criticised and had little to do with in the past.

    Between the EU treaty, the forty two days legislation, the ID cards and over zealous council officials that will use terrorist legislation to spy on their population, England is no longer a green and pleasant land in which to live. I suppose, as we move closer and closer, like lambs to the slaughter, towards the EUSSR, intrusion and interference in our lives is something we will need to get used to.

    Now the question is with hindsight, did we elect the wrong David to lead us?

  5. Simon_C
    June 12, 2008

    I'm compleatly against the 42 days. This government has increased the detention before charge from 2 days to 28 days, and now want it to be 42 days. That's 21 times the period we had during the Northern Irish terrorism problems. !

    But, I don't agree with David Davis' stance. With the current state in the political cycle, I can't see any way he could loose his seat, so it's a meaningless jesture in my view.

    Now, if the entire conservative party resigned, their seats: That would impress me. I've no idea what it would do to parliament, but it would force a constitutional crisis. It's not like Gordon can't force through anything he wants anyway, so why not make a real stand.

  6. Deborah
    June 12, 2008

    Principled politics…at last.

  7. Graham Doll
    June 12, 2008

    Well said Mr Redwood, I sincerely hope that all Tory MPs give vocal backing and campaign support to David Davies campaign (with one obvious exception). There is hope yet that we can salvage our hard-won democracy from Labour's degradations.

  8. Heartened Voter
    June 12, 2008

    What a man of principle – as a disillusioned voter I am really impressed by stand taken by David Davis. I hope he wins a landslide victory and sends a clear message to the PM that we are fed up with our liberties and freedoms being eroded by this cabinet of Scottish megalomaniacs.

    I sincerely hope that this by election can be completed in time for the return of these measure to the Commons (once it has been rejected by the House of Lords). It might cause a number of those who voted with the Government to reconsider their opinion and reject this dictatorial measure.

    Having worked in London at the height of the IRA threat, and been shopping in London when the bombs in Oxford Street and outside Harrods went off, I think it is a complete travesty to suggest that the police should need 42 days before bringing charges on a suspected terrorist. If the security services cannot crack any password protection or encryption on files allegedly containing evidence in under 7 days then they are very unlikely to in 42 days. The public is being misled by a Government with a track record of "sexing up " and spinning its claims.

  9. David Campbell
    June 12, 2008

    Should he return to the frotnbench if he wins? Should the leader bring him back to the Shadow Cabinet?

    Reply: I think he should

  10. Carroll Powell
    June 12, 2008

    I quite agree. But I'm more worried by the fact that Cameron has gone back on his proposal to repeal the 42-day law if it makes it to the statute book. This is what makes us so cynical about politicians: the belief that they will say one thing in opposition and something else in government. I would like the Tories to win in order to roll back the authoritarian, controlling state Labour has built up but if the Tories then let all those proposals stand, what's the point? David Davis was clear that he opposed and would repeal the ID Cards Act. Has David Cameron been so clear? Will Dominic Grieve say this clearly and unambiguously? I fear not. What is the Tories' position on the childrens' database, the restrictions on free speech, the restrictions on demonstrations outside Parliament, the fact that 240 agencies have access to our personal details, the use of RIPA to spy on people over trivial matters, the proposal to access all our emails and telephone calls etc etc. Perhaps you could comment on this.

  11. shelagh
    June 12, 2008

    Yes, good on you David we are all with you just shout it out to all of the UK we have had enough.

  12. Kit
    June 12, 2008

    Bravo! If you want show your support you can email David Davis here.

  13. londonerr
    June 12, 2008

    It would be good to see the Party 100% behind him to scotch the "Conservatives-split" story that seems to be developing, especially given the "personal" nature of DDs decision. This seems to be code for, 'we're not really behind this stunt'. I think it is a brave stance and a desperate measure to highlight the inadequacies of the House and the process Labour has diluted it to become. He needs full endorsement by David Cameron; and well done, John for standing up for DD.

  14. jane
    June 12, 2008

    I hope he pays for the cost of the election (£100,000+)and that no other party puts up a candidate. Further, I would never give him a job should he be returned as an MP. What on earth would happen every time an MP resigned over an issue and then expected to stand again representing his/her party? Would he not have been better placed to continue his fight as Shadow Home Secretary particularly as Dominic Grieve has stated that a future Conservative Government would repeal the legislation.

    There will be no contest for the seat if the Lib Dems do not stand. There is something odd about this decision as surely he has embarrassed the Conservative Party? The decision has weakened him and I hope local people in his constituency punish him for the expense his antics will cause. I am sure David Cameron is embarrassed – is Mr Davis still peeved about losing the leadership battle as he obviously has not given too much weight to this in reaching his decision? I am confused….

  15. alan eastwood
    June 12, 2008

    Mr Redwood.

    I find it odd that the Conservative Party say that this is a 'personal issue' the is an issue that, rightly, demands greater scrutiny by the people. The By Election with all the publicity that will attract will bring the issues of our hard won 'rights' back to the agenda.

    I, like you, do not believe those polls that sugested that the majority of people wanted 42 days detention.

    But when you listen to both BBC and Sky putting their Conservative Party in turmoil story over, I wonder what we have done to deserve such a partial media!

    Good luck to you.

  16. Richard Weatherill
    June 12, 2008

    Well done, John, for offering such unequivocal support to David Davis in his decision. As a fellow defended of long-standing British freedoms, it's no less than we would expect.

    Whilst his resignation has put David Cameron in a slightly awkward position, DD should certainly be allowed to stand as the official Conservative Party candidate and should receive support in his campaign from CCHQ.

    I'd be interested in your views on what the implications would be if Labour also decide not to field a candidate in Haltemprice & Howden.

    Reply: If there is no Labour candidate it reduces the publicity and the interest, but allows us to say they are so ashamed of their policy they dare not put a candidate up to try to defend it.

  17. Matthew
    June 12, 2008

    But there's not chance of him losing the seat, is there? He had a reasonably majority, the Lib Dems won't stand against him (something he knew when he made his speech). So it doesn't seem that selfless.

    He vote for the extension from 14 days to 28 days, so he's clearly pretty flexible on his principles.

  18. Steven Baker
    June 12, 2008

    I was overjoyed to watch David's speech. This will get the media and the country talking about liberty, privacy, the role of the state and perhaps even the way our constitution has changed in the last thirty years.


  19. Acorn
    June 12, 2008

    Now that is what I call “COJONES”. If we can’t get a general election, let’s have a whole series of single issue by-elections. We may even get a level of debate that the socialists have denied us in Parliament.

    Not exactly sure what the end product will look like when DD gets re-elected. Will an increased majority win be interpreted as a referendum on 42 days detention; the RIPA Act; ID cards etc?

    Is there another MP ready to do a DD; and, stand in his by-election for an EU Referendum say?

    This may be a new marketing strategy for party politics, in which case I hope it works. But, we still remain behind the eight ball till the next general election. By which time the Civil Contingencies Act may have been enacted by the socialists, for the security of the nation you understand.

    Election delayed for the foreseeable future – Mugabe style!

  20. AlanofEngland
    June 12, 2008

    This admirable act by Mr Davis is to be welcomed, but begs the question..why haven't there been any resignations about the transfer of powers to the EU? And then…why no resignations about the Labour and Libdem referendum manifesto lies? If only the politicians of all parties would allow matters of conscience lead them to seek public approval in this way we might admire them.

  21. David H
    June 12, 2008

    Well, what a stunner! One can only hope that he not only wins his election but wins it very handsomely.

    But, what is the plan? Does he intend to form a new party – The Real Conservative Party, perhaps?

    With the Brown Party utterly loathed by nearly everyone now, the Libs pointing in every direction at once in order to give the country away to the EUrocrats; there must now be room for a fourth party of principle to contest call me Tone I mean Dave.

    Watching this space with interest.

  22. NigelC
    June 12, 2008

    A rare man of principle

  23. Bishop Hill
    June 12, 2008

    All of us who supported DD for leader must feel that our choice was justified now.

  24. Bishop Hill
    June 12, 2008

    Mr Redwood

    Might I suggest that if this is the right thing to do, you should do the same thing.

    Reply: No, I will not. There is no need for another MP to do the same thing on the same issue, and it is going to be frustrating if neither Opposition party to the Conservatives has the bottle to stand to make a decent fight of it.

  25. GeoffH
    June 12, 2008

    I have been a Conservative voter since 1979 after having earlier voted Labour.

    If the Conservative leadership do not give the fullest, whole-hearted support for David Davis with all the paraphernalia of by-election campaigning then I shall, sadly and regretfully turn to the 'Can't be bothered' Party until the Tory party comes to its senses.

    I cannot believe that there should be any doubt let alone a debate about Cameron should do.

  26. Neil Craig
    June 12, 2008

    The Liberals aren't putting up anybody which, since they came a fair 2nd last time & Labour a poor third, means he will.

    In a way that is rather a shame since had they fought on the range of their policies he could have trashed them on a lot of their anti-nuclear touchy feely nonsense, which is probably why they won't. Certainly it isn't because they would be afraid of spliting the anti-bill vote since Labour are so weak there.
    Normally they expect by-elections to be their rallying point. I suspect they may be the greatest losers here.

  27. David Hannah
    June 12, 2008

    Well done DD. Now just add the lack of a Lisbon referendum to your list of reasons, and you'll ascend even further in the estimations of the nation. Good luck.

  28. Chuck Unsworth
    June 12, 2008

    Amen to that. Now let's hope that these are the opening shots in the war to recover our freedoms. If so, we can expect a long hard slog, but absolutely worthwhile nonetheless.

  29. Elizabeth Elliot-Pyl
    June 12, 2008

    So do I (want D Davis to win). This is a very courageous act, and almost unheard of in these days of career politicians who are just after what they can get from the taxpayer-funded trough.
    Finally, a politician has stood up for what he believes in – and it has thrown the others into confusion. They cannot understand that an MP is prepared to jeapordise his career on a point of principle.
    I think he has caught the mood of many voters on the subject of erosion of liberties under this government and I trust that he will be the voice of the unheard-law abiding-coping class electorate.

    (I hasten to add that I certainly do NOT include you, Mr Redwood, in my disdain for most MPs!)

  30. lucysharp
    June 12, 2008

    It was a wonderful speech, of the sort that I had all but given up hope of hearing from someone in his position. I wish DD the very best of good fortune and I hope more of his colleagues will do as you have done in supporting him so generously.

  31. Travis Bickle
    June 12, 2008

    As expected the Labour Party are trying to paint this exclusively as an issue on 42 days and a large tranche of the media are complicit.

    Whatever happens supporters must ensure that this action is warranted on the wider erosion of our liberties (the jumped up (officials-ed) who can enter our houses and look in our bins for any number of reasons, CCTV, databases etc etc). If David's actions make the sleepwalking , apathetic public wake up to what Labour have been doing to erode our privacy and liberty for past 11 years (largely unchallenged by opposition parties I sadly have to say) then this might go down in history as one of the most significant acts by any politician in a number of years.

    I only hope that people aren't tempted back into the Labour fold because it is all used to label the Conservatives as soft on terrorism. Listening to the awful McNulty this evening this is where Labour are trying to take it.

  32. Pete Graham
    June 12, 2008

    David Davis I salute you!

  33. Highlander
    June 12, 2008

    Good thoughts as usual, John, and right on the money. You do seem to talk about the English though, when I think – I hope – you mean the British. Perhaps it is only when you get exciteable?

  34. haddock
    June 12, 2008

    I'm wondering just how the erosion of our liberties, ID cards, the restriction of trial by jury etc can be discussed without reference to the EU.
    Is this the real reason for 'friction' between the two Daves ?……. our freedoms are incompatible with rule by Brussels.

  35. Brian Tomkinson
    June 12, 2008

    At last a senior politician refusing to accept the gerrymandering of the House of Commons and prepared to make a personal stand against the relentless attacks on our freedom from this authoritarian government. My spirits were uplifted by David Davis’s principled stand which contrasted so starkly with the actions of Labour MPs such as Austin Mitchell who was quoted in today’s Daily Telegraph that” he switched to support the government rather than abstaining to “save Gordon for the nation.” “

  36. Bishop Hill
    June 12, 2008

    Mr R

    You say: There is no need for another MP to do the same thing on the same issue.

    With respect, I disagree. The mainstream media will attempt to portray DD as some kind of a lone maverick. If, however, other MPs are willing to follow him, then this will stop them doing so, and it will highlight the issue still further.

    Good men have to stand up and be counted.

  37. Clarence
    June 12, 2008

    If Davis hadn’t, as a Government whip, rammed the Maastricht Treaty through the House we’d all be *a hell of a lot* freer. The 42-day limit (remember, it’s already 28 days) is as nothing compared to rule by those we cannot eject.

  38. wonderfulforhisage
    June 12, 2008

    I’m 100% on DD’s side and would also like to record my appreciation of Anne W’s principled stand. I also notice that you blogged in support of DD without waiting to see which way the wind was blowing. I don’t know how to put this without sounding patronising, none the less, “Well Done You.”

    One wonders what percentage of MP’s would ever contemplate taking a position based on principle – single figures? low teens? – not much more I’d wager.

    On the other hand if the overriding principle is ‘do what’s needed to be re-elected’ I suppose they’re all principled (honourable) gentlemen.

  39. Alison Saville
    June 12, 2008

    Yes, David Davis has shown his true colours – a genuinely independent politician who thinks for himself, doesn't just follow the party line or seek popularity by sacrificing his principles, and doesn't just accept it when wrong decisions are made by the House of Commons. Let's hope he wins, and then we'll still have two such MPs: David Davis and John Redwood.

  40. […] has also done the impossible and united people from across the political spectrum in […]

  41. Tuscan Tony
    June 12, 2008

    Whilst it is easy to dismiss his announcement as being driven by some hitherto unrevealed secret, or a deep Machiavellian intent, I for one believe he has done it for precisely the right and proper reasons; that being to draw attention to the salami-slicing erosion of the freedom of an individual in Britain.

    For that, I salute the fellow.

  42. Richard Calhoun
    June 12, 2008

    I applaud David Davis' act of political courage, hopefully this will be the beginning of the end of cynical politicians.

  43. John
    June 12, 2008

    Re: Jane
    The cost of the by-election is pitifully small if compared with this government’s waste of our money. The £29 million on the abandoned Bicester imigration centre to give but one example.

  44. mikestallard
    June 12, 2008

    The funniest part of all this was the sheer incomprehension of the Labour people.
    "What is the difference between 42 days and 28?"
    "It's all a publicity stunt."
    No wonder they cannot understand a man of real principle.

  45. Duncan McPhie
    June 12, 2008

    Well done, DD.

  46. Adrian Peirson
    June 12, 2008

    These Laws are aimed it us, the Problem is, schoolchildren are not taught about our liberties and constitutional protections, such as in Magna Carta, common Law and the Bill of Rights.
    So Straw can hack away at them and people do not know what he is doing.

    Is it Purely Coincidence that at a time when they are cementing into position the EU ConstiTraityTution we have the 7-7 terror attacks and the ever increasing loss of our Liberties ?

    It’s an interesting question and would not be the fist time Westminster has ‘fitted the evidence to the policy’


    Finally Criminal Investigations into Blair and Goldwater, ( But Don’t hold your Breath, It woldn’t surprise me if the Met decided to prosecute those bringing the allegations )


  47. Gavin
    June 12, 2008

    Somebody has to call a halt to the sinister erosion of our freedoms by this extraordinarily authoritarian government. I have sensed equivocation from Cameron / Osborne on these issues, which is troubling, but have been encouraged recently by David Davis’ consistent and principled position.

    As a Wokingham constituent I was also pleased to see John getting this right.

    I am not sure whether in the final analysis David’s resignation will prove to be a good decision. I am slightly concerned that this could be seen (or portrayed) as an abuse of process or waste of public funds, particularly if Labour does not field a candidate.

    But my strong gut feeling is support for DD.

  48. DBC Reed
    June 12, 2008

    As a pinko loser I applaud Mr Davis, but for a Conservative to be doing this? Is it wise? The public is four square in favour of being nasty to foreign terror suspects at the very least on a better be safe than sorry basis.Does Cameron want the Conservative Party to be identified as softer on terrorism than Labour? The Conservatives must know that the legal niceties will be lost on the majority of voters:having no illusions about the electorate is their greatest asset.
    42 days represented the opportunity to shake Brown witha Commons defeat but that having failed,Cameron must have been hoping to forget about it. Now Brown will patronise the Conservatives for being out of touch with popular fears, Police operational needs etc.
    Davis could commit Tory credibility to the wrong issue like Hague did with Europe.This is the second bit of luck Brown has had in 24hours.

    Reply: We are not soft on terrorism – we have proposed practical measures to catch and prosecute terrorists. We are tough in defence of liberty.

  49. Greg
    June 12, 2008

    I prefer a political stunt to a political . . . . !

  50. alan eastwood
    June 13, 2008

    Mr Redwood.

    The response to your excellent support for Mr Davis, and the response to the survey on Conservative Home, plus other blogs show massive support for David Davis.

    Strange then that the BBC and Sky plus, I read The Telegraph and the Times tomorrow are peddling the nonsense that the Tories are split! The Sun just follows what its owner tells them to print. They could suddenly change their view overnight- just as I expect them to change their view on the EU!

    The responses, though, do show that these political comentators have no idea whatsoever what we the people are thinking!

    Try to ask Brown at next weeks' PMQ's if any minister or official made any agreement with the DUP for them to support what they have, for years opposed, namely internment. 42 days without charge is internment!! Brown was particular in his replies that HE did not do any deal.

    Wishing you well.

  51. Curly
    June 13, 2008

    I commend and applaud David Davis for his principled and courageous decision, and wish that every opposition MP could resign their seats too, one after the other.

    Would Brown be able to resist the pressure for a general election?

    Hopefully a strengthened Davis returning to the Commons would force many of the libertarian small government issues higher up the agenda within the Conservative Party.

    Make no mistake, a commitment to repeal many of Labour's deeds from a moral high position would be extremely difficult for the electorate to resist.

  52. David Flisher
    June 13, 2008

    I support him completely, this is an issue that needs people of principle to place themselves on the line for, otherwise the lies and spin will subsume it.
    The immediate effect has been in my circle of friends to gather four labour voters into the Conservative clan for the next election, so concerned are they, even though they "still loathe Thatcher". Well done Mr Davis.

  53. Derek
    June 13, 2008

    David Davis must not be content to spend the rest of his political career producing policy reports at the behest of the Cameron Junta, the conclusions of which they then ignore, like IDS and others. Either that or being relegated to the New Conservative version of a John Prescott figure pacifying the disobedient Old Conservative principled minority. I don't know how it will pan out for David Davis, but Carpe Diem and fortune favours the brave.

  54. julian
    June 13, 2008

    I sensed the conservative party had parted ways with my values with the Matrix Churchill debacle…I am beginning to hope that one man's sacrifice of their career here will highlight the need for more principle – and I appreciate how hard this is in politics…

  55. Chris Smith
    June 13, 2008

    Thank you David Davis – at last a proper politician with principles who cares about his country more than his index linked pension. He has shown the world what a seedy, secretive place the houses of parliament is and how people buy votes to get draconian legislation through by the slenderest of margins. The Labour government has let the terrorists win – they have succeeded in destroying our democracy with just the threat of terrorism – are we really so weak and lily-livered as to let the government take away our fundamental freedoms in such a calculated way. Vote Davis Davis and I hope the Labour candidate loses his deposit.

  56. Peter French
    June 13, 2008

    I am not a Conservative supporter, and regard myself as being on the libertarian left and I would no doubt find that David Davis and I would not see eye to eye on many things. However, I think he is spot on in his support for civil liberties and his opposition to the ever-increasing state interference. I am not sure if David has done the right thing in resigning, but I salute his decision, and I believe he is a man of principle. I watched Question Time last night and two of the panellists, predictably the Sun editor and a Labour politician, accused David of doing a publicity stunt. Well, they would say that wouldn't they! I say, good on him for standing up for his principles. I have always thought David Davis as being a man of integrity even though I would disagree on many of his ideas. His stand on civil liberties has confirmed my belief. I wish him well.

  57. Ron Mole
    June 13, 2008

    I would have been more convinced but for a glaring omission. He above all should realise that the biggest threat to Habaeus Corpus is posed by the European Union.
    Thank God for the Irish !

  58. revinkevin
    June 13, 2008

    It is nice to see a politician who puts his principals ahead of his career and does what is right for the country, democracy and freedom.

    I only hope he goes on to win the by-election and the tyrant loving man from the Sun looses his deposit.

  59. E Sutherland
    June 13, 2008

    The problem facing the Tory party tonight is not the marvellous and principled stand of DD, it is the half hearted grudging support of David Cameron and the Tory party.
    No wonder it looks like a split.
    On an important and fundamental issue like this it does the party no good at all to stop financial and other help. The Tory party should be in enthusiastic support and so scotch any rumours.
    I think Mr Davis knew that Cameon couldn't be trusted at the end of the day and has acted accordingly and correctly too.
    If Cameron had half a brain and was a real Tory not a lib dem in borrowed clothes he would find another MP prepared to stand concurrently on the question of a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty. Shame Brown on two fronts.
    But as I do not trust Cameron and his clique on Europe either and I find it hard to believe he would want to put the government on the spot.
    DD is showing the true grit needed in a great Tory leader. Had he won election as leader I intended to join the party but because of the grave concerns i have over David Cameron and his cronies – Osbourne and Letwin etc I still cannot bring myself to even vote for you.
    DD may change that depending on the Tory response to his campaign.

    Reply: You are wrong about DC and there was no split on this issue

  60. Andrew
    June 13, 2008

    David Davis has shown that principled people are still in politics and that the New Labour age of spin has not destroyed all the decent politicians.

    New Labour have given in to the terrorists by doing their job of destroying our civil liberties for them. It now will fall to the likes of David Davis and the Conservatives to make a stand.

    New Labour says they have the support of the electorate for 42 days – well, they should show it by fighting a general election NOW by asking the electorate two questions:

    1: Do you support 42 days detention without trial?

    2: Do you support the Lisbon Treaty?

    If they are so sure about what the electorate thinks, then why not refresh their mandate and gave Brown his first?

  61. Rex Horwood
    June 13, 2008

    It is typical of a megalomaniac like Brown to describe the actions of a man of principle as a stunt and a farce. Just another reason to get Brown and his cronies out of power as soon as possible.

    It must make real Labour supporters extremely embarassed to have so many MP's who are not prepared to stand up for democracy and freedom, and act in a way that is totally contrary to the British way of life.

    David Davis deserves the support of everyone who believes that our fundamental freedoms, which you so eloquently describe, are worth fighting for, and his bravery and principled stand should go down as a victory for decency and common sense.

  62. Stuart
    June 14, 2008

    Well done David Davis. At the moment, this is perhaps the most important issue. It is not simply what this government is doing/not doing on the domestic front; it is also their history of disasters in international affairs. These are the same people who claim to be "supporting democracy" in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    Somewhere, someone claims that 67% of the electorate support 42 days detention without charge. Why have I not met anyone who actually supports any of the recent or proposed legislation ?

    How serious is the "terrorist threat" ? How compromised is our "national security" ?

    Though the attacks which have occurred in the UK have been horrible, they have not been so many and so severe as would justify this government's paranoia. If the terrorists are being apprehended before acting on their plans, why are there not more court cases ? (words left out)

    It just does not add up. Am I really living in a country where "the people" have become so stupid that they accept the words of "proven liars" ?

    The individual citizens of this country are now more thoroughly documented, monitored and watched than citizens of the Soviet Union in the days of Stalin. (words left out)
    Even were the "threat" a thousand times worse, these policies, laws and practises could not be justified. Such an invasion of privacy and removal of civil liberties could only be allowed if those who promote them can guarantee that we will never find ourselves ruled by some future (tyrantc -ed). I do not understand why this governemnt does not give such a guarantee – it would only be one more lie !

    For those who say "Why worry – if you have done nothing wrong and have nothing to hide…" I can only offer the unconditional pity that one reserves for the totally moronic and those totally bereft of any common sense. You may not want to hide from Mr Brown's government because they clearly care deeply for you and your family… but you may not feel so comfortable under a (nasty -ed)government.

    "It can't happen here…" It is happening and NOW !

  63. Stan Francis(Bromsgr
    June 15, 2008

    I couldn't find David Davis's web site or email so am sending it to you John, hope he reads this in support. What a guy, just when I felt that Tory were all the same!…(I was once one, but have learned to stand alone now)do I now say welcome to 'us' the Independents seeing as Cameron is now distancing himself from David, but is it spin or what(we still do not know)?…If you feel strong on an issue/s, you get out, create a by-election and stand again as a candidate as an Independent AND NOT A TORY AGAIN, for all you are doing, is confirming your electorates support, this I feel he has no matter what. So he wins again in the election, what will that do?….if Cameron agreed with him in the first place, which he doesn't, he wouldn't be taking the stance he is taking, he would support him and his thoughts on liberties, taxes etc, but CAMERON is a fence sitter to get votes only, Davis who I always supported as a leader of the Tories is showing they made a big mistake in selecting CAMERON as leader. CAMERON goes for windmills, cycling, hoodies, Davis goes for adult issues….if Tories are to win at the next election, I would rather see Davis at the helm as Prime Minister, same age as myself and same schooling, so we both know about real life?

    Reply: Cameron and the new Shadow Home Sec fully support the Davis stance on the freedom issues he has highlighted.

  64. Dave Roberts
    June 15, 2008

    Mr Daviis it has been a long time to see anybody at Westminster with the bottle to stand by a principle and be counted. all the bestwith your relection.

  65. Mike
    June 15, 2008

    David Davis' speach was the most genuine that I have heard in the House for a long time. His resignation underlines the fact that he sees this as the defining issue of the decade. He has my whole-hearted support and I am glad you support him too, John.

    I am not normally a Conservative voter and I do not live in his constituency but I would vote to re-elect him, were I in his constituency.

    Further, if the Conservative party was unequivocal in its support and David Cameron gave a cast-iron guarantee to repeal RIPA and 42 days and kill ID cards if elected to government, that would secure my vote in the next general election regardless of my views on other matters. Failing that, I will vote Liberal at the next election because of their stand on the issue of liberty.

  66. Nigel Palmer
    June 16, 2008

    I was born in a free country and until David Davis stood up for us all, I believed that I would die in a country in chains.

    It was very interesting that the Westminster village and political media failed to see the broad wave of support that David Davis' stance would attract – and typical of the Labour spin machine that their first reaction was to try to brand him as crazy.

    As a 57-year old gardener and grandfather I have in the last 4 years been:

    a) wrongly accused of defrauding the Pensions and Benefits Agency, had my bank accounts examined without my permission and my credit record seriously damaged. I was questioned under "caution" and despite the "case" being dropped some years ago have received no word of apology, nor any correspondence from them whatsoever.

    b) been "arrested" at a Police roadblock for stealing my own car (this was on television). What they did not show on television was the ensuing 9-hour nightmare where I was arrested, internally searched, drug-tested, fingerprinted and had my DNA taken. To add insult to injury, I had to pay £200 to get my car back and have been informed that due to changes in PACE, there is no chance of suing the Police for wrongful arrest. My Polish employees were absolutely horrified by the incident and told me that even under the communist regime, this would not have happened in their country.

    Make no mistake, this is a Stalinist regime and we all have a duty to fight it and regain our historic freedoms.

  67. Antireptilian
    June 16, 2008


    We have seen some principled stands by a number of conservatives, including your good self, over the past few months. I am not a conservative, but I admire the stance you chaps have taken. DD has my support, and indeed, the support of millions of ordinary people. I will donate to his cause should he require it.

    We are, in my opinion, under a concerted attack by powers seeking to destroy our nation state, and transfer our allegiance to the European super state. The “Big Brother” apparatus is being installed to close down resistance, to divide the public and to dog train us into accepting continual monitoring of our lives. Children are being fingerprinted in schools as part of this dog training, and our police services are gradually pressured into performing oppressive actions. The Common assessment framework, Terrorism legislation, Civil contingencies act are all forming a veneer that overrides our current legislation and rights.

    I quote Alex Jones

  68. Auntie Flo'
    June 16, 2008

    Well done for supporting David Davis's Haltemprice and Howden revolution, John Redwood.

    Wild horses won't keep me from supporting Davis either.

    Can't believe I was never a fan of Davis…I could kiss him now!

  69. Stan Francis(Bromsgr
    June 17, 2008

    Hi John,
    Back again and not sure if you want to keep this debate alive, or allow it to go off into the sunset along with Bush as he goes back onto the Prairie?…People are saying that last week we saw three issues hit the headlines. All on liberties, Ireland, Isle of Mann and DD. All three remind us of ‘FOR THE PEOPLE AND BY THE PEOPLE?’ which is our web site address?… If you say Cameron is with DD on his stance showing our freedoms erode, then why haven’t they gone further apart from lip service before(like this stance of DD’s) which we can all do called old spin?…John we are in a place now that we’ve never ever been in since the second world war where no one knew what the outcome could or would be. Why, was because we could see that our freedoms were about to be taken a way from us through a dictator called Hitler, Hitler has been replaced by ( a different threat in the form of -ed)the EU AND WE ARE NOT ALLOWED TO FIGHT BACK THIS TIME? … Well we are at the same cross roads once again in that our freedoms are going away so quickly, we all now feel the police state ‘is’ here and we will all be under interrogation for one thing or another in the future if not already?…Many people in this isle are law abiding people, but the new laws make us feel we are under some microscope. So okay without rabbiting on further, I have now made my point, so the question now, why is Cameron ‘still’ with the EU, he stopped an ‘anti-eu' petition by MP’s 9 months ago, why?….That’s not supporting the freedoms of MP’s acting on behalf of what the electorate are asking for John?…Many want a referendum on out of the EU and also one on the latest treaty. Cameron is only interested in the treaty and ignores the plea from us the English, ON COMPLETELY OUT with fresh negotiation to continue BUSINESS AS USUAL, what’s that say of Cameron when you say he supports DD ?..Cameron says it’s his euphorian light at the end of the tunnel, more like the light is attached to a fast moving train forever coming closer to completely mow us all down?… John, we the people of this country, want fairness, pay our taxes, see kids grow up properly, innocently, terrorism despatched back to whence it came.(terrorism was voted for by our leaders in invading Iraq, we weren’t asked) So when we vote on our required issues at election times in the future, we want a CONTRACT between the people and the providers, same as anyone in business. We have but one democratic right at present and that is to vote at the box, but vote for what?..You would say you put your vote in trust, sorry John, that’s for the weak to believe in and in the wake of New Labour?… So what I would like to see is an agenda of what a person/party will offer to gain election, then stick to these issues or at least show you are trying OVER A SET PERIOD OF TIME, or bring about a by-election on failure. I HAVE ASKED Bromsgrove District Council for a public scrutiny committee on decisions made and all we get is a scrutiny of councillors and handful of the public that they could never possibly win a major issue on. John, people are leaving this isle in the thousands, they are going because of what DD is now standing out on, my brother is about to leave for New Zealand at 68 years of age, he’s had enough, myself, well I will plod on at every election as an independent to get what I thought we should now have by now when I was a full blown Conservative, that’s let me down time and time again, my old school pal who's leader of Birmingham Council ignores me now on my issues and becomming an independent, this shows something!!
    If you want the residue of 66% of the electorate out at voting time, then give them what they want and that’s starting with FAIRNESS!…or you could just say that this isle is run for the rich and Royals and we are here as new style serfs?

  70. Stan Francis(Bromsgr
    June 17, 2008

    Okay John, here's another freedom issue…..and no answers?!

    letter sent to:-WEST MIDLANDS STRATEGIC HEALTH 7th June 2008:
    Dear Sir,
    For the attention of Steve Hilton.
    Fluoride in my tap water supply:
    I understand that you can answer questions on fluoride addition to the tap water supply in Bromsgrove area and that it is your sole decision on applying this chemical and that no public consultation ever took place before you added it….but in 2003, action(an act) was taken to ensure that fluoride could be added anywhere in the UK without public consultation from that date onwards, would it be therefore correct to say that the addition of fluoride was in fact illegal in 1985.
    It is also understood that many other Health authorities are refusing to add fluoride, could you ascertain for me from these other Health authorities why you feel it is necessary to add fluoride and others do not!
    Could you advise also why Solihull with the same amount of fluoride in the tap water sees less rotten teeth in children than Birmingham with the same level of fluoride in their tap water please and that Bromsgrove also sees less rotten teeth than Birmingham.
    Can you advise why the Water companies require indemnity against adding fluoride to the water supply, why would they want this, is it because it is in fact a poison.
    Please can you state why you do not teach children to brush their teeth and receive a balanced diet to give the fluoride required for healthy teeth, it is understood that Bradford have now started a drive in Mosques to teach them the benefits of healthy brushing and diet.
    Can you advise why you continue to add the fluoride when the York report in 1999 said that poor studies were furnished for analyses.
    Can you state that there are no lasting side effects to consuming fluoride, as I have read that colon cancer, bone brittleness, children's behaviour patterns being affected, headaches, indigestion problems.
    I have enquired if a test can be made on my own body for the fluoride effect and content but have been refused by my doctor because he says that the NHS will not do this test for me.
    Lastly please advise that as there is now 1ppm of fluoride in the tap water, how much food and water can I consume per day before I am in the danger zone, understanding that 1.5ppm gives fluorosis.
    I would appreciate your reply as soon as possible.
    This request was made sometime ago to your department but no answer came forth.
    Thanking you in anticipation and not wanting an answer that goes like Alan Johnson told you it must go in, as it is primarily your decision to add fluoride and no one else's.
    Yours faithfully,
    Stan Francis
    for Bromsgrove Clean Water Group

  71. Nick Millward
    June 17, 2008

    David Davis has demonstrated that honourble quality in politicians that many people thought had disappeared long ago and in doing so has restored faith that Westminster is not run by a PR spin machine. We are used to seeing politicians resigning from positions having clung on by their fingertips, only for the tabloids to finally claim their scalp, after which the minster will return to his job within 6 months.

    I hope David David wins his by-election and going by the popular support from the public at large, I have little doubt that he will do. If and when he does go back to the commons, I hope David Cameron will restore him to his position, shadowing Jaqui Smith.

    I read yesterday that Labour is considering putting up the baggage handler from Glasgow Airport on an anti terrorist ticket. If they do this then it will demonstrate beyond doubt (as if any more were needed) that this is a cynically rotten government, demonstrated further by it's arrogant position regarding the result of the Irish Referendum.

  72. Richard Palmer
    June 17, 2008


    Couldn't find David's email or website but just want to add my support to his campaign against our liberty. I really believe that the powers to be and the media have underestimated the swell of concern about the slow erosion of our hard earned rights.

    all the best


    June 19, 2008

    David Cameron beat Mr Davis to the Tory leadership in 2005, fact!. And now Cameron has wished his colleague well on his ‘brave issue of Freedoms’ but also warned him he is taking a huge risk. John that was the statement put out, but you say Davis has Cameron’s backing, so where’s the risk then?..if Cameron backs him it’s a shared risk surely on the ensueing general election?..no that’s not the risk he’s taking about because Davis would get elected on this one issue alone tomorrow. So what other risk is there that Cameron warns Davis of??..the only risk is not getting elected again which he is of course odds on favourite on him being re-elected?..Problem is John, knee jerk reactions when it’s a wrong reaction, has a habit of making you look a fool and an even bigger fool when you try to creep out of with the old cliché’— I didn’t mean that at all?..But Cameron is surely taking the risk in that knee jerk reaction and now wobbling over it, same as the other issues he’s tried to court the voter on..we don’t want a ditherer as a Prime minister John, we already have one..DAVIS IS OUR MAN, unless he’s another magician/charlaton and we’ve seen plenty of those in our past?..you cannot trust anyone these days, not even the church that says one thing and does another for their own purposes and not that of the people. For the people and by the people, what happened along the line where this was forgotten and only brought up as an anachronism.

    Reply: David Cameron is just stating the obvious, that holding a by-election on a single issue is a risk, as the main candidate cannot control events, the other candidates or the voters! I still wish David well and expect to see him returned successfully by electors who know he is a good MP.

    June 21, 2008

    …me too John, but will be watching this guy Davis now, always supported him from afar..Scepticity? Yes!….have been a local candidate many times and always wait for the 'punch line' , so let's see what DOES come out in the wash then?..and single issues?..well this single issue has caused controversy more than all Cameron's electioneering stunts has it not, this single issue is not single anyway, it contains the very fundamental basic framework of where we must now start again from after Labour's concerted debacle of society in this country, history shows the very reason we go into battle is to get better than we went in with, the battle now is getting Labour out… for the people about to take charge in years to come that's on the way up, scare me!..further, Davis must elucidate further, he's created the basis of taking over, we now want to know the rest….a lettle pinky in the water is not enough for me!

  75. Susan
    June 22, 2008

    Up unil recentlu I was going to vote Conservative but given the attitude displayed to David on such an important issue, it demonstrates once again the shallowness of many of our Parliementary memebrs. They appear totally intolerant of accepting that we are all born with free will and it's healthy to display it and fight for it.

    I for one thank David for giving me heart when I was so tired of the way my liberties are being eroded – legislation is ruining our Society. What we are now left are teh young pushing at the edge of the envelope because of the Government wanting to turn all of us into obediant robots.

  76. Duncan
    July 7, 2008

    The erosion of our laws started when the last Conservative government enacted a law that made it possible to confiscate
    the financial assets of people who could not prove that those assets were acquired legally. Assumption of innocence was no longer a pillar of the law. The same adminstration looked on and did nothing when demonstrators, witnessed by police and public, advocated the murder of Salman Rushdie.
    The rot did not start with this odious New Labour control freaks!

  77. Duncan
    July 7, 2008

    ref my comment awaiting moderation 07Jul 2008 at 10:43 am
    Please delete "this odious" and insert "these odious"

  78. […] and the rule of law — modeled after the still-growing and increasingly potent left-right coalition that has spontaneously arisen in Britain to fight against their Establishment’s […]

    July 13, 2008

    ..well now, there was no chance TAKEN was there in effect with our Mr Davis, I REALLY WANTED TO BELIEVE, but we knew it, he knew it, CAMERON KNEW IT!…So have changed my mind about him as I said I possibly would, a big cherade that's really seen what I didn't want to see and that is, the man along with the rest is as transparent as my grandsons' paper planes.
    Again I say to you John and I know it's wasted, but here goes, why can't we have a contract between the people and the gov't, is it because the gov't is run by big businessmen and the NEW ORDER that everyone is talking about is now really here AND PEOPLE ARE NOW LOOKED AT AS BEING A NUMBER, it's arrived and will be 'full blown' when Tories get back in?…the right wing antics of labour have cost us heavily in taxing everything and this weekend we see that women's bra's now have a tax on them?…keep up John?…Enter Tory, well Labour's left us with a massive hole and sorry but it'll be hard for a while whilst we get these…No John, I won't go along with that old line at all. I would rather you said, what you thought wasn't going to happen, now has, we'll tax you even more, you will sell your houses to the money men that run the EU and Central gov't and you will rent them…your car will be no longer, for you will use public transport and all 'EXTRA' taxes we want from you will be taken at sourse, we will assess how much you need to live on so you don't waste any more food, your medical attendtion will be via clinics on a conveyor belt system, children will no longer just appear, you will go on drugs to stop pregnances and you can then apply to come off them for a child we will sanction when we feel the population needs topping up, this way we keep the world in order, called THE NEW WORLD ORDER!…and not one person is responsible for this John, we all are, for we have gone along with it till it got to this state, the EU carried it along effortlessly, the name EU was just an adjective….what's next John?..anarchy, but we have a special force to contend with that now don't we, 600 Police in London a few months ago was mustered to sort out drug pushers/sellers, prostitutes, murderers etc, all with combat outfits on, but when you want a copper yourself, you get a reference number instead!

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