Remembrance

Today we remember the many who died in the two world wars of the last century and later conflicts. I will lay wreaths in Burghfield in the morning and Wokingham  in the afternoon.

As this year is part of the centenary remembrance of the Great War, there have been plenty  of historical films and books of what happened in that prolonged and devastating conflict.

There have been attempts to defend and explain the actions of those in charge of the armies which  suffered such terrible losses in attack after attack. All too often  the promised impact of preparatory bombardment did not work, leaving the attacking troops to be killed in their thousands  as they stumbled through barbed wire onto machine gun emplacements. There was little understanding and little ability to handle the many medical conditions  brought on by the water, mud and  disease that spread in the trenches, and even less sympathy for  the psychological conditions many soldiers developed after prolonged exposure to shells,  mortars and bombs.

The recruitment of massed citizens armies made politicans and Generals more blase about the extent of the  losses.  Wellington in the Peninsula was careful to protect his troops and avoid battles where losses would be large because he knew he could not easily replace his professional small army. In contrast   the Generals in the First War on both sides just assumed they could recruit many more replacements. The French had to face a mutiny when troops protested about their mistreatment, whilst many  Russians ended up as revolutionaries appalled by the suffering they had experienced in their army.

The bad  political failures included  the Peace Treaty at the end. The terms of this seemed to help set up another gruesome conflict twenty years later. A war is only successful if after victory the victors secure a stable and well founded peace.

The two wars have cast a shadow over the lives of those of us who came after the carnage, as we have sought to understand the suffering of our grandparents and parents and the sacrifices of many in their generations. It cast a far worse cloud over those who lived through the violence. Twice liberty was defended and the allies were  ultimately victorious, but only after herculean effort.

We should  take away from the events of more than one hundred years ago the need to expect more of politics to avoid conflicts becoming so violent. Where armed conflict is unavoidable we should  expect those who do lead or direct troops into battles to take more care of them, working out how to concentrate and use force more effectively than either side managed for much of the First World War. That war is infamous for the deployment of chemical weapons on a large scale, for the cruel dominance of the machine gun and shell, and for the many heroic but  too often futile attempts by infantry to break through massively strong defensive positions.

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65 Comments

  1. Trumpeteer
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 6:00 am | Permalink

    The Donald in Vietnam LIVE. It is astonishing how an American President can stand in Hanoi. His speech should amaze all the leftie-liberals who speak stupidly of Trump being a warmonger or a racist or both and more. It seems only yesterday when grandees from Labour were demonstrating against the USA through the streets of London. Amazing they do not wish Trump to visit the UK. Mr Speaker wishes him not to set foot in Parliament but the President of Vietnam Trần Đại Quang whose people fought America tooth and nail, welcomes him with open arms. We have some Parliamentarians who need to start studying politics and international affairs. Donald’s words are coming from a real person.
    The world is safer with our Donald than if we had a Mr Flowery Pompous Pants in charge

  2. Duncan
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 6:45 am | Permalink

    We will always remember them, each and every one.

    D

  3. Jack snell
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 7:11 am | Permalink

    Don’t know how you can expect anyone to comment on this..what happened was murder and criminal on many levels but particulary at the top. As one commentator remarked recently the Kaiser who largely started the first war was allowed to escape over the border into the Netherlands one day before the armstice came into being and no more was heard. The old field marshals and generals who showed total disregard for the welfare of their men took their pensions and medals and retired off into old age comforted by the fact that they knew the British public would be forgiving. It was indeed an age of ignorance which we still remember..poor british innocent youth mass murdered- germans and french too

    • eeyore
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 8:04 am | Permalink

      Jack Snell – with respect, this will never do. Those who think their forebears ignorant do no service to their memory. The millions on both sides who volunteered, marched off singing and died for their countries knew what they were doing. I interviewed many old Tommies 45 and 50 years ago and know that for a fact.

      Nor were the generals donkeys leading lions. There were no heaven-born soldiers, no Alexanders, Marlboroughs or Napoleons, in the Great War, but no man can do more than his best. It was a period when the defensive had an overwhelming advantage over the offensive. Circumstances dictated a war of attrition, and that is what Europe got.

      After the war Lord Haig uttered not a word in his own justification. Instead he devoted the rest of his life to serving his veterans. It is neither fair nor true to say men like him pocketed their medals and retired in comfort.

      • Anonymous
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 1:31 pm | Permalink

        Correct.

        The public schools and mansion houses of Britain are adorned with memorials to the young of men the aristocracy. The Lords and Generals would have been well aware of the cost.

      • Prigger
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 3:05 pm | Permalink

        eeyore
        WWI was the concentrated outcome of trade wars.
        WWII was the same, though most of us will not or cannot think it yet.

        It is hard thinking your kith and kin, parents, uncles, sisters , even yourself marched off to fight for a trade advantage, oil and rubber, ownership and control. But such things feed our faces, heat our homes in preference to others who suffer cold, have lousy food if any. So we’ll sing songs and con ourselves one nasty man with a a bit of hair above his lip caused it all.
        But next Remembrance Day, insist there are no uniformed marches, just a respectful walk with real living poppies to honour people who despite the lies, did their duty and now showing life is sacred and death should not be a duty.

    • sm
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 8:42 am | Permalink

      Reading this blog is not conditional upon anyone commenting.

      And despite saying you didn’t know how John could expect anyone to comment on his reflections about Remembrance Day, gosh….you just did!

    • Ian Wragg
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 2:35 pm | Permalink

      As an arch Remainiac you have very little good to say about Britain or its population.
      This makes me think your not British but more allied to Brussels.

      • Richard1
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 8:05 pm | Permalink

        What a ludicrous response

    • Man of Kent
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 10:22 pm | Permalink

      Jack Snell ,

      Sorry for this late post , but please read ‘Goodbye to All That ‘ the auto biography of
      Robert Graves .

      It explains very well the importance of the Regimental System and how a sensitive but physically courageous 19 yo subaltern learned about life in the trenches and his relationship with Siegfried Sassoon , Thomas Hardy , TE Lawrence and others less well known .

      He understood PTSD ,which he called neurasthenia , trench foot and how to prevent your men falling sick with it .It is a supremely courageous account of a life threatening experience. With none of the lions led by donkeys meme to which you clearly adhere .
      Quite a few digs at staff officers but ’twas ever thus .

      Do please read it and any others who might see this very late reply . Apologies !

  4. Cheshire Girl
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 7:41 am | Permalink

    Sadly, I feel that successive Governments have not done enough to protect the things that those people fought for. Many of our customs and traditions have been carelessly thrown away.
    I often wonder if those who sacrificed so much, were alive today, if they would think it had all been worth it.
    However, on this sad and solemn day , ‘We Will Remember Them’.

    • Nig l
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 7:57 am | Permalink

      Beautifully put

    • stred
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 9:30 am | Permalink

      There was an old soldier on the radio yesterday who told about his experience of fighting in a tank, when he was the sole survivor after a hit. He was around a hundred years old and had a midland accent. It was as if my dad had returned. He would have been the same age and had the same accent. He died at 64, probably from stress, and he told me that the same happened to him when fighting in the Libyan desert. The driver was missing on the day his tank, which he commanded, was hit and he had to take over as driver in the front. His crew were destroyed.

      Yesterday, my better half turned on the Remembrance Day memorial in the Albert Hall. All the old soldiers from later useless disastrous wars trooped around and then the camera turned on to Mrs May watching with Mz Greening. These two have decided to teach the Transgender agenda to children, capitulate to Verhofstadt and Junker and trash the armed forces. I said it made me want to puke and that my it would not have pleased those who fought and died. I was called an embittered old man. I don’t know how any decent politician can stand the stench.

      • Hope
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 12:26 pm | Permalink

        Well said.

        May needs to stop this transgender promoting nonsense. This is not the way to educate our young people. May has already repeatedly shown she is out of step with the public and way off the mark with Tory voters. Lord Tebbit wrote an appropriate article about it.

        Enough of these political rabble today is about the honourable few who sacrificed their lives for our country.

      • zorro
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 5:09 pm | Permalink

        The only thing we can do is for each and every one of us ro resist the cultural marxism being foisted upon us in every way possible. Until we have a politician who can mobilise the silent majority within England who voted for Brexit, someone who can be convincing, who is not fearful and truly loves their country we will have to muddle along. The Tory part is not in a good place as it doesn’t believe in itself. Its leaders vie to be politically correct and somehow persuade people to vote for it who have no intention to do so, whilst ignoring the views of those who feel unable to vote for the current political concensus……

        zorro

      • DaveM
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 6:57 pm | Permalink

        May and Greening are just unaware – the sight of Cameron, Blair, Brown et al at the Cenotaph made me sick.

    • Barbara
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 11:07 am | Permalink

      Judging by their own comments in the book ‘The Unknown Warriors’, by Nicholas Pringle, the answer would be no.

  5. alan jutson
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 7:59 am | Permalink

    And now this week of all weeks, the EU is sending out the message, we want more money from you, or we will not talk.

    Once again it appears we will be on our own.

    History repeats itself in strange ways sometimes.

    • alan jutson
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 8:01 am | Permalink

      We will remember them.

      • Ian Wragg
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 2:37 pm | Permalink

        We must never forget. Brussels obviously has.

    • talkingStraight
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 4:58 pm | Permalink

      Alan Jutson..We should never have joined the EU in the first place, we were never suited to it, DeGaulle knew this in his time as did others in Europe but we pushed until we got our way. Now we want to get out and some Tory types thought it would be easy but the EU is an economic club with many different strands built up over 45 years, it is not NATO the UN, FIFA, the Red Cross or some other international body that we can opt in and out as circumstances permit so it’s not correct to say that the EU wants more money like as if they have changed the amount. They want what we committed ourselves to, what we owe for the present budgetry period and for other commitments already signed up to, they want to agree a formula to work all of this out. I don’t think this is unreasonable and neither does the EU side, but DD and others in government would like to do it on the cheap, but according to Barnier that is not going to happen, so unfortunately that is where we are stuck until the problem is resolved. Certainly they are determined that the other conditions have also to be met ie. the free movement of EU citizens and the Irish border question before we move on to talk about the future. All of this has been said repeatedly for over a year now however some people still express surprise that we have reached an impasse- on another note if this all goes bad then, apart from Britain, Ireland is also bound to be the other place both north and south that is going to be badly affected both politically and economically. So bringing it all back to earth..we must remember this is about talks on the economy and the future direction of British/EU trade relations it is not about the evacuation from Dunkirk.

  6. fedupsoutherner
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 8:36 am | Permalink

    Yes, John, we will remember the sacrifices our young men made to keep us free. I will remember my brother who fell in the Falklands conflict. Many of us have relatives whom we will remember in particular today but they are always in our thoughts no matter what day it is.

    Let’s strive to keep the freedoms they gave us so many years ago.

    • Lifelogic
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 9:15 am | Permalink

      Indeed and let us ensure they are properly and efficiently equipped to do so. Military procurement has, in general, been run appallingly badly.

      • Hope
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 12:30 pm | Permalink

        Our military is in dire straights because of this govt. It gives away billions and our army 4000 personnel short Staffed! Navy on a a ferry service mission for the EU collecting immigrants while ships sold off because they cannot afford to be run! Wake up May.

      • Lifelogic
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 12:48 pm | Permalink

        Excellent sense from James Dyson on Marr today.

        On the EU, we should not pay anything and walk away and they will come to us we have a very strong hand.

        We desperately need to move to easier hire and fire

        We need more engineers and stem subject people and should let as many good ones who graduate here stay on as possible.

        Spot on – I would add we should move to cheap on demand energy, have a bonfire of red tape everywhere and stop the state pissing money down the drain all over the place.

        • Lifelogic
          Posted November 12, 2017 at 12:56 pm | Permalink

          Mind you his “jet engine” hand air driers are far, far too noisy – what is wrong with a nice silent paper (or other) towel?

        • Lifelogic
          Posted November 12, 2017 at 1:38 pm | Permalink

          Good, loyal, performance on the World at 1.00 today – but can T May (and P Hammond) really be turned round and given working compasses at their age?

          They need someone sensible to guide them back to economic, regulatory and smaller government political sense.

          • Lifelogic
            Posted November 12, 2017 at 1:40 pm | Permalink

            It rather looks as though Hammond will give us a completely misguided budget again next week, can this still be stopped?

  7. Anonymous
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 8:40 am | Permalink

    I think most who died in WW1 and WW2 would have despised us.

    – for our lack of duty

    – for our slovenliness

    – for our materialism

    – for our weakness

    Since nuclear weaponry there won’t wars like those again so I don’t think there is anything to learn but humility.

    The Germans have been given a free pass because *the Nazis* did it – be this in drama, documentary, academia or news but particularly in film. We English, on the other hand, are the Hollywood villains and guilty of everything.

    We allowed our own heroes to be portrayed badly or written out of history altogether.

    We hold our manhood cheap.

    We were actually invaded by a foreign power in WW2 and adopted their culture, traditions and mannerisms thereafter.

    We became Americans and have danced to their tune ever since. A great evil was averted but our nation was sacrificed doing so.

    All I have to say at the war memorial this morning is that I’m very sorry we allowed it to happen.

    • Lifelogic
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 9:16 am | Permalink

      Some truth in this alas too.

      • Anonymous
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 1:36 pm | Permalink

        Thank you, Lifelogic.

        I meant to use the word ‘occupied’ rather than ‘invaded’.

        Our nation’s awkward nature is not down to a hankering for the return of Empire (long beaten out of us by left wing teaching) but of being a slave to two masters:

        The EU

        The Americans

        • Anonymous
          Posted November 12, 2017 at 1:46 pm | Permalink

          I’m actually proud to be called a Little Englander.

          What on earth is wrong with being so ? My ancestors were slaves down mines and in factories too !

          • Mark B
            Posted November 12, 2017 at 7:28 pm | Permalink

            Ditto

            🙂

    • The Prangwizard
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 12:18 pm | Permalink

      Well said. We are constantly being sold out and foolishly do nothing. England needs new leadership. Those who will do more than pay lip-service to supporting and promoting our nation and its people.

      • Anonymous
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 7:45 pm | Permalink

        Thanks.

  8. agricola
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 9:09 am | Permalink

    Politicians create wars either through their neglect or their fanatical ambition. Generals have in the past tried to re fight the previous war, you do not find many free thinkers in the senior levels of the military. They get where they are by not questioning the status quo. Both the fighting and the free thinking come from drafted civilians. It is the civilians in uniform who carry the burden and end on the Menin Gate, not to forget those not in uniform who suffer similar consequences.

    In support of my view consider the following. The Treaty of Versailles that gave rise to Hitler. The ignoring of fascism by France and the UK at the outbreak of the Spanish Civil War . Ignoring Hitler’s first moves at European domination. The BEF expecting to fight the 1914/18 war all over again. The French in similar vein in the Maginot Line with an open door via Belgium. The disdain for Hugh Dowding who was a free thinker. The fighter aircraft we got through the wisdom of civilians, and so it went on until the civilians got control.

    If there is an answer it is to improve the quality of politicians, and I would suggest the first steps have been taken in the election of the Donald. Most professional politicians are about as useful as an ashtray on a motorbike.

    • Rien Huizer
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 1:18 pm | Permalink

      Interesting and refreshing point of view the election of Mr Trump is apparently an important step towards improving the quality of politicians. Only a true conoisseur would say that. Maybe i should use the English word “expert” instead.

    • Ian Wragg
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 2:40 pm | Permalink

      I agree that Donald is shaking the tree . No wonder there is so much hostility towards him.
      We brexiteers know how he feels.

    • mickc
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 6:13 pm | Permalink

      With respect, I believe you are wrong. There are many senior military officers who understand that Trident is militarily useless….but dare not say so. Modern wars cannot be fought with nuclear weapons; they need properly trained and supported manpower.

  9. Oggy
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 9:14 am | Permalink

    WW1 affected every family in the UK. I often wonder how my grandmother coped who lost both her husband and her young brother aged 20 – my grandfather and great uncle. My great uncle is still out there on the Somme battlefield somewhere with no known grave. If somehow we could ask them, if they could see the UK today would they say it was worth it ?
    Remembering my and all families whose losses and sacrifices were so great.
    Lions led by donkeys.
    “We will remember them”.

  10. Sakara Gold
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 9:55 am | Permalink

    In my view, Haig and Rawlinson should have been shot for what they did in WW1. Their tactics – using patriotic volunteers to march slowly towards enemy trenches whilst weighed down with heavy packs, rifles at the slope – were used much earlier during the American civil war with similar results. Lloyd George said that Haig was “brilliant to the top of his cavalry boots”, but was unable to dismiss him. Haig was not a Wellington.

    Nearly every family in the country was affected by Haig’s military stupidity and incompetence, brilliantly satirised by Rowan Atkinson in Blackadder. I will be at my local war memorial today, remembering my lost grandfather, great uncles and my wife’s. What was it all for, really?

  11. Javk swelke
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 10:07 am | Permalink

    On this special day of rembrance we have Gove again on Marr still spinning his old tripe..assuming EU aboutturn mode..pretending to be concerned about Boris …talking about hedgerows…and blatently out there on manoeuvres.. Mrs May better watch out

  12. Mark B
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 10:18 am | Permalink

    Hear hear.

  13. acorn
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 10:20 am | Permalink

    While you are listening to the Remembrance ceremony, have a read of the following. There are some from the last century or more, who still think the UK has an empire and still leads the world. https://tradebetablog.wordpress.com/2017/11/08/uk-wto-leadership/

    “Brexit will allow Britain to lead the World Trade Organization (WTO), the Legatum Institute claims in a new paper published on November 4, 2017. […] “Britain stands ready to take a leading role within the WTO,” International Trade Secretary Liam Fox said in a speech at the WTO almost a year earlier on December 1, 2016.”

    Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right, this is not going to end well.

  14. Bert Young
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 10:20 am | Permalink

    Wars and the consequence are terrible things in our history . Whenever I get my nose into a book that recalls and describes what went on I invariably think of how wasteful and stupid it was to become involved . On the other hand one has to think of whether staying out would have been beneficial in the long run . Dominance features throughout the past , it seems to be ingrained in human nature . I was fortunate not to have been called to serve in the Korean War ; my demob number was 120 and had it been 121 I would have gone with the regiment I was attached to .

    I am always moved by the ceremonial at the Cenotaph and I respect and admire all those who made the supreme sacrifice .

  15. graham1946
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 10:33 am | Permalink

    We cannot do much for those who fought 100 years ago, but we can and should do more for current serving men. We treat those who have lost limbs etc fairly well, I believe, but there is virtually nothing for the mental stress and many ex service personnel are living rough or alone and some commit suicide.

    It is shameful and your government could do something about it today if they wished. They found a magic money tree to buy themselves a HoC majority but cannot find anything for our fighting men. When they go to war they are lionised and politicians take every photo opportunity they can with them, but when they return mentally damaged they are treated as rubbish and consigned to the scrap heap. What a difference in America, where they appreciate such people. I urge everyone to write to their MP about it and maybe find something in their will for the charities these people rely on, for it is certain that no politician is interested enough to get government funding. Utterly shameful.

  16. Simon Jones
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 11:04 am | Permalink

    Tomorrow, we are signing up to the EU army? This is empire building, just the scenario that led to the Great War.

  17. formula57
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 11:05 am | Permalink

    “… we should expect those who do lead or direct troops into battles to take more care of them” – perhaps so but we might first look to demanding that the politicians see to it that:

    – Troops go into harm’s way properly equipped. (So no repeat of the shameful under-provision of armoured vehicles and helicopters seen in the recent Afghanistan war, for example.)

    – Injured combatants are provided for not by having to rely upon charity (the efforts of the Royal British Legion and similar) but through the State recognizing and accepting and fully meeting such obligations.

    We might also look to politicians to avoid commitments and entanglements that see the UK assume unnecessary and unwelcome obligations to defend far away countries of which we know little and should care less. The obligations in respect of Ukraine come to mind.

  18. Rob Jump
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 11:22 am | Permalink

    The most important thing to remember is that all those dead died to further the profits and power of the global elite. Not one single war that Britain has ever fought benefited the ordinary man in the street but every one made some people very, very rich.

    • eeyore
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 6:54 pm | Permalink

      Rob Jump – no doubt you do not mean to exploit the sacrifice of others to score political points. Even so, Remembrance Sunday seems a particularly odd moment for such a comment.

      With great respect, your generalisation is false. Not just Britain’s welfare state but all of modern Europe, with its colossal social superstructure, is a direct consequence of the two world wars. Those who fought, those who died, had both a vision of a new society and a moral argument which was not to be denied. Our present-day utopia was forged in the fires of their hell.

      We should not forget also the technological advances that result from the demands of war. It is one of God’s little jokes – or maybe one of His mercies – that the worst of human activities so often leads to huge gains in material good.

      Finally, your comment about the “elite” ignores the exceptional sacrifice of the sons of the upper classes, to which a comment above draws sombre attention. In Britain one in four of those young men never came home; no doubt the German figure was even higher.

      • The Master
        Posted November 12, 2017 at 8:52 pm | Permalink

        eeyore
        I hate to say I appreciate your contribution. I have thought the way you do, I want to think the way you do. At times , I do actually think the way you do. But when I did, when I do, I was and am wrong. It makes me feel comfortable living in country with such bravery, such pomp and ceremony. It is a facade.
        Had Germany and Britain, just muddled through 1914-1918 and 1939-1945 without war, we would both be five times if not more as wealthy as we are now.Our people would not have been brutalised in their minds. We both would not have needed immigration. So many problems would not have happened and will, happen.
        Our elite have never cared for us. As a guide, look what happens with your relation when they get paid a penny per hour more and they are given a long job title for emptying a midden. They put on airs and graces and think you not fit to lick their lavatory wall. Our elites are proportionately so raised to the yawning heights of stupidity. With every penny more, their morality and kinship makes you a race apart. They even try speaking differently..posh…the twang of a nineteenth century Oxfordshire peasant.

  19. anon
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 11:37 am | Permalink

    I remember along with others.

    Note. In order to not personally fund the BBC and to comply with current in law.

    I was unable to watch this live broadcast even from a foreign broadcaster.

    Remove the BBC tax and enforce a encryption & subscription model for paid content and contract out free to air for public service funded material.

    In my view this organization is “captured” along with many “institutions” by other interests and in my view a great impediment to free thinking and speech.

    • Mark B
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 7:40 pm | Permalink

      I whole heartedly agree with you.

      When you consider that the technology BSKYB use is decades old it makes you wonder if those above actually want this.

  20. Anna
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 12:21 pm | Permalink

    My father served with No. 6 Commando during WW2, came home grievously wounded and carried the scars to an early grave, so I remember him, and and all his brave comrades, every day, but especially today.

    How can we best honour their sacrifice? Not by the false and spurious union of the EU empire, but by building strong democracies. It is a point I have made here before, but it bears repeating. There is no example, since the emergence of the modern, fully-functioning democratic nation state, of two democracies going to war. Not one. Tyrannies fight each other; democracies fight tyrannies; but two democracies at odds settle their differences by negotiation and compromise.

    So we should nurture democracy in the nation state; hold our leaders accountable; encourage patriotism (giving of your best to your homeland) not nationalism (thinking your nation superior to all others); treasure our cultural traditions; build prosperity through industry and trade; aim to live in friendship with all who do not wish us harm. That is the best tribute we can pay to the fallen.

  21. Christine
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 12:30 pm | Permalink

    JR, I’m very concerned about this PESCO (Permanent Structured Cooperation) aka EU army letter that the UK might be signing up to tomorrow. Apart from LBC I haven’t seen or heard any debate on this. How can we be contemplating signing up to something so monumental when we have voted to leave the EU? One of the reasons I voted LEAVE was the concern I had about the EU controlling our armed forces and the power they had to conscript our youngsters into their proposed army. Now they are proposing a Military Schengen zone where they can legally cross European boarders. What’s going on? Is there any truth in these rumours? And if yes why is the British public being kept in the dark?

    • Mark B
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 7:43 pm | Permalink

      I keep telling people but no one is listening.

      We will leave the EU but, we will sign up to everything except Schenghen and the Euro.

  22. miami.mode
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 1:07 pm | Permalink

    On a cold day at the Cenotaph, most of the dignitaries and regular servicemen and women in their overcoats and the poor old veterans with their devotion to duty in their blazers. Hope they had some warm underclothes.

  23. Rien Huizer
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 1:14 pm | Permalink

    Now here is a post no one can disagree with!

  24. zorro
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

    John, what you say is true, but why is the government signing up to this….. http://facts4eu.org/news.shtml

    The EU are merrily trying to form their own military force and the UK is signing up to these initiatives. Why?

    The EU is not a force for peace and is actually a threat to the sovereignty of nations. Its leaders foment dissent in other countries along with wars in Yugoslavia and threaten to extend its border up to and beyond the Urals. Does that sound like a peace loving entity? I think not!

    zorro

    • Anonymous
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 6:45 pm | Permalink

      Well.

      Let the Remainers tell us why this is a good thing they knew all about the EU when they were selling it to us … telling us we were idiots for leaving it.

  25. Local Lad
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 5:52 pm | Permalink

    eeyore
    WW1 would never have been fought in that manner if there had been a general who was not a donkey. Just suppose Wellington had been born 100 years later!
    None of these recruits knew what they had let himself in for. My father with so many others volunteered in 1914 because war was seen as glamorous and they were shamed into going by the infamous Kitchener poster and the white feather campaign. It was also seen as an escape from the awful grind of poverty.

  26. Miss Brandreth-Jones
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 6:06 pm | Permalink

    And so well documented by Wilfred Owen , Siegfried Sassoon and other poets who could only turn to art to express their suffering.

  27. DragE
    Posted November 12, 2017 at 7:36 pm | Permalink

    Listening to Gove today on the Andrew Marr show tryong to defend Boris by shifting the blame onto the Iranian authorities..without any thought to the added damage already done only makes me sick..what a bunch of low lifes?

    • The Master
      Posted November 12, 2017 at 10:09 pm | Permalink

      So the Iranian authorities are not to blame but Boris is. Typical leftie-liberal nonsense .Liberalism is indeed a disease.

  28. sulis
    Posted November 13, 2017 at 12:04 am | Permalink

    It is an honour to be bound to them. My reverence extends to all the elderly who endured heartache and hardship from the wars, which is why I find it deeply disturbing when politicians target them financially – they have paid enough!

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    John Redwood won a free place at Kent College, Canterbury, He graduated from Magdalen College Oxford, has a DPhil and is a fellow of All Souls College. A businessman by background, he has been a director of NM Rothschild merchant bank and chairman of a quoted industrial PLC.

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