German GDP falls in 3rd quarter

Whilst UK Gdp rose by 0.6% in Q3, it fell in Germany by 0.2%. I don’t expect the BBC to say that’s because of Brexit, though they would have done if it had been the other way round!

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74 Comments

  1. Iain Gill
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 8:32 pm | Permalink

    I’ll never vote Tory again in my lifetime if they approve this & I’m a party member. We’re the 5th largest economy; she has shamed & humiliated us with this betrayal. “Britain never, never, never shall be slaves” … unless the Tory party betray voters, party & country of course.

    not my words, but thats the mood in the country

    • Richard1
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:34 pm | Permalink

      Who else will you vote for?

      • Sir Joe Soap
        Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:47 pm | Permalink

        1 UKIP or independent – if they have a good candidate
        2 Libdem – better in than this deal
        3 Labour – better in and broke than this deal

        • Zorro
          Posted November 15, 2018 at 7:39 am | Permalink

          Only way to get a sensible party again is get rid of theose who have betrayed the popular will of the country, and most definitely the English constituencies.

          Zorro

          • Hope
            Posted November 15, 2018 at 9:26 am | Permalink

            Corbyn might nationalise utilitiyncomapnaies and the railway, so what? Good price to leave the EU. He would then be gone after five years.

      • Anonymous
        Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:50 pm | Permalink

        Richard 1

        Corbyn is coming. Get used to it.

        • Lifelogic.
          Posted November 15, 2018 at 7:15 am | Permalink

          Corbyn/Mc Donnall/SNP can still be avoided. This despite May’s very best efforts for them. But May and Hammond must clearly go first they are soiled goods with broken compasses. Wrong on Brexit and on tax to death, over regulation, expensive unreliable energy, climate alarmism, endless government waste, employment laws, endless political correctness and an idiotic economic strategy too.

          What have they actually got right? Opt out organ donations perhaps, but they have not even managed to deliver this yet have they?

          .

      • JustGetOnWithBrexit
        Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:14 pm | Permalink

        Same for my household.

        Voting for the nearest candidate, likely to unseat our Mr Jeremy Hunt.

        3 votes will narrow the gap by 6.

        • Lifelogic
          Posted November 15, 2018 at 8:28 am | Permalink

          Jeremy (PPE yet again) Hunt, the man who was so good at elegantly apologising for the endless, dire incompetence, outrages and deaths caused by NHS negligence and delays for so many years. Unfortunately the man did nothing to change this appallingly structured and financed organisation.

          This could have prevented many of the hundreds of thousands of such deaths and tragedies.

          It can never work well as currently organised a dire state monopoly free at the point of rationing, delay and general incompetence.

      • mancunius
        Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:26 pm | Permalink

        But I predict a comeback for Ukip, that would destroy the Tories in the marginals.

        I assume the CBI have promised post-election directorships for the current Cabinet and any Tory remainers who vote for this sellout.

      • Alison
        Posted November 15, 2018 at 5:42 am | Permalink

        I’m hoping a new party will emerge very quickly. Either that or UKIP, despite reservations about it at the moment.

        • Lifelogic
          Posted November 15, 2018 at 8:34 am | Permalink

          The only way to avoid Corbyn is for the sound wing of the Tories to take over the Tory party.

          It seem the Michael Backstabber Gove (who lumbered us with Traitor May rather than Boris) is continuing to be a serial traitor to the Brexit cause and is supporting this appalling proposed deal.

    • Nig l
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:35 pm | Permalink

      Well said

    • Gary C
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:32 pm | Permalink

      Same here Iain, this perfidious PM seem’s unable to comprehend the amount of damage her betrayal has done to this country.

      This is not democracy and cannot be sold as such, the government has lied to it’s people and will be punished at the next GE.

    • oldtimer
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 5:07 am | Permalink

      Toxic May and any party she leads will not get my vote in the future. Her words are meaningless. Her arguments are tendencious. She is unfit for purpose – the latest manifestation of the Peter (Petra?) Principle.

  2. Duncan
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 8:39 pm | Permalink

    Welcome to Marxist Britain. After tonight’s appalling scenes YOUR party will be crucified at the next GE. It used to be my party but the idea of voting for a candidate that belongs to the party that sold the UK to the EU and committed our nation to a future of subservience fills me with vomit

    May is pure vileness on a scale even worse than Blair and Corbyn.

    We can only hope that UKIP rises from the ashes and destroys Labour and the Tories

    • Richard1
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:36 pm | Permalink

      No chance. Waste of a vote. It’s Tories or the Trots

      • Sir Joe Soap
        Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:49 pm | Permalink

        Trots it is then. If this deal is done, we’re done for anyway.

        • Richard1
          Posted November 15, 2018 at 7:30 am | Permalink

          Bad as this deal is Corbyn would be far far worse.

          • libertarian
            Posted November 15, 2018 at 9:22 am | Permalink

            Richard1

            Nope Corbyn will implode and we can get rid of him.

            With this deal we are locked into the EU forever . No thanks

            I’m going full Marxist

      • JustGetOnWithBrexit
        Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:19 pm | Permalink

        That threat is over Richard. Voters will not fall for that one now.

        You underestimate how strongly people feel, about the way May has brought National humiliation upon us all, by her surrender.

        The Tories will be lucky to Poll much over 30% at the next GE…the only Poll that really counts.

      • Yossarion
        Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:24 pm | Permalink

        Who now gives a FF

      • Original Richard
        Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:27 pm | Permalink

        You may be right but remember that UKIP came first in the 2014 MEP elections.

      • mancunius
        Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:29 pm | Permalink

        Vote for who you like. If this measure passes through parliament I shall upsticks and take all my assets to a country that is not afraid to be independent.

        • libertarian
          Posted November 15, 2018 at 9:23 am | Permalink

          I will first move to Scotland and put all my resources behind Scottish independence

      • Bob
        Posted November 15, 2018 at 12:16 am | Permalink

        That’s the kind of thinking that resulted in the electoral paralysis that allowed the Tory Party to morph into what it has become; people like Sarah Woolaston, Amber Rudd, Anna Soubry and Nicky Morgan led by Theresa May and Phil Hammond. Sometimes you have to take a risk and do something different, because doing the same thing over and over expecting different results is insanity.

    • Bob
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 12:02 am | Permalink

      @Duncan

      “We can only hope that UKIP rises”

      Don’t just sit there hoping, join up, get involved.

  3. Iain Gill
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:04 pm | Permalink

    sadly I think you are wasting your time now John.

    the Conservative party is toast now.

  4. Peter
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:07 pm | Permalink

    Another media claim is that ‘No Deal’ is impossible because we have run out of time to implement it. An offshoot of this is the claim that because the government gave it so little attention it is no longer an option. So May’s agreement with the EU is the only option and she has undermined a clean Brexit.

    This assumption never gets questioned on TV or even in the press.

  5. Paul H
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:12 pm | Permalink

    You lot had a chance to sort out the BBC a few years back but, in the normal spineless fashion, ducked it – even ‘though it is anti-Tory.

    I am sorry to say this but, after today, I am in agreement with Peter Hitchens. The Tory Party no longer serves any useful purpose.

    • Lifelogic
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 8:42 am | Permalink

      Well MAYs agenda is pretty much the same as the daft BBCs wrong on everything. Cave in to the EU, highest taxes for 40 years, endless more red tape, anti landlord, anti small business, anti the gig economy, for bloated incompetent government, unfair competition from the BBC, for the dire state monopoly NHS, anti car, for climate alarmism ….

  6. Nig l
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:12 pm | Permalink

    It’s irrelevant. Brexit is no more. The arch Remainer, Theresa the appeaser has won.

    • Richard1
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:53 pm | Permalink

      Based on the gloating reported from Brussels it sounds like the EU has won. You have to hand it to Barnier he has played a blinder! I think Boris Johnson is right – remain would be better than this. But let’s wait to see the full text.

    • Alison
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 5:44 am | Permalink

      She hasn’t won yet. And I will do my utmost to stop her winning. And I know I am not alone.

  7. Steve
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:23 pm | Permalink

    The BBC doesn’t really report much to do with Germany, mostly because of what’s going on there, which is deemed not good for us to know.

    Incidentally Mr Redwood, I’ve been wondering what you might do with yourself when the Conservative party is removed from politics altogether at the next election. It would be a great loss if you were to leave government because the Conservative Party wrecked itself.

  8. Chris
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:28 pm | Permalink

    I am sorry, Mr Redwood, but I do not care that German GDP fell. What has just happened with Theresa May and her Cabinet is a monumental betrayal of the electorate. It is quite staggering what has happened, and it is your Party in government that has done this. Utterly treacherous and unforgiveable. Unless any of you resign or take other effective action, you will be seen as supporting her and her betrayal.

    • John C.
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:42 pm | Permalink

      I suppose the really appalling thing is that not only are we being told that this is really Brexit, when it clearly isn’t, but that it leaves us in a worse position than we were before, and have agreed, for a very unclear reason , to pay out billions and billions for the privilege.
      The anger on the net is unprecedented.

    • Sir Joe Soap
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:53 pm | Permalink

      This is true.

      The minute this deal gets through Parliament, you all need to resign.
      The correct course of action as said here many moons ago was to boost UKIP with your numbers. This course of action now is for all Leaver MPs to resign their seats unless you can force an election and or oust this hopeless woman imminently.

      Why do you want to hang on and go down with the rats in your sinking ship?

    • Rien Huizer
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:03 pm | Permalink

      Do you believe this will get through Parliament? The point is what happens after the deal is rejected in Parliament, especially after the Council has met and approved.

      Of course this is formally and “exit” but I reckon it will not please anyone: the closed shop people will have less foreign competition for jobs but there will be immigration from elsewhere too. The Nostalgia crowd will be disappointed because there will not de effective autonomy (nonsense anyway, but for a while some people dreamed about a global and independent Britain). The pro-US crowd is not going to get a deal from Trump because he wants somehing that benefits the US (meaning agriculture, car parts etc) not a token of the special relationship. And so on.. The only good thing is that at least there will be no UK representation in the European Parliament, so bye bye UKIP.

      • libertarian
        Posted November 16, 2018 at 11:48 am | Permalink

        Rien

        One day the remainers will wake up and finally realise that the reasons YOU think people want out are NOT the real reasons.

        Anyway I’m glad you feel happy being led by someone who is unelected and can’t be voted out but who turns up to a major political event in odd shoes ( not socks, shoes!) He actually had one brown and one black shoe on. That sciatica has gone rogue it seems

        I’m glad you feel happy being led by the French President & The Chancellor of Germany telling you that you need an EU army to fight the USA, China and Russian. I mean its not as if we’ve been there before is it?

    • Turboterrier.
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:42 pm | Permalink

      @ Chris.
      What has just happened with Theresa May and her Cabinet is a monumental betrayal of the electorate.

      Unless a few go away and think about it like Davis and Boris and resign it just proves that May surrounded herself with a lot of kippers. All two faced and gutless each and everyone of them all with their own agenda.

    • James
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 11:03 pm | Permalink

      I hope a sufficient number of Conservative MP’s will now send in their letters to the chairman of the 1922 Committee. It really is time to remove the present prime minister, who has brought a whole new dimension to the words ‘breathtaking incompetence’. We changed prime ministers during the most grave and perilous time of the Second World War, from Neville Chamberlain to Winston Churchill. That worked out very well for us. We need to be rid of the current Neville Chamberlain.

    • L Jones
      Posted November 14, 2018 at 11:25 pm | Permalink

      Let’s hope there’s some sort of ‘effective action’, Chris. Otherwise, there’s no doubt whatsoever that the Conservative Party will lose countless numbers of supporters. And the sad thing is that Mrs May probably won’t care. But why don’t others around her care – those with the power to at least ATTEMPT to put things right? (Present company excepted.)

      Are there so many of our politicians who really don’t care about our country, but only about their own careers? How utterly, unspeakably tragic.

  9. Richard1
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:40 pm | Permalink

    The coming bailout of Italy is going to be expensive for eurozone countries. Perhaps a new phase of austerity is feared as a result.

    • fedupsoutherner
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 10:06 am | Permalink

      Richard1 Yes, but our payment of at least £39b should help and wont’ it make you feel so much better knowing your taxes helped?? You couldn’t make it up.

  10. Peter Divey
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:45 pm | Permalink

    Quite extraordinary…a bad-deal is better than a no-deal…but that is not even the point. The pitch is this non-Brexit, or no Brexit at all. This will lead to a Corbyn Government in short order, and all traces of Brexit will be eradicated. Even though Venezuela this way comes, i will sit on my hands at the next GE.

  11. Anonymous
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:48 pm | Permalink

    In order to reunify the country it is now the duty of Leave politicians in the Conservative Party to tell the country why we can’t have Brexit. We will not listen to Theresa May.

    Otherwise stop taking the money !

  12. Chris
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 9:59 pm | Permalink

    There are now 16,000 comments, posted in a short space of time, responding to the article in the D Mail online announcing Theresa May’s betrayal. That should send some warning bells to you and your Party, Mr Redwood. I no longer wish to be associated with the Cons Party any more.

  13. Peter VAN LEEUWEN
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:09 pm | Permalink

    HELP! The Netherlands also fell! (from 0.8 to 0.2% ). Must be the UK’s fault 🙂
    Fortunately our y-o-y growth is still much better than that of the UK (2.4% versus 1.5%).

    • Richard1
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 7:32 am | Permalink

      Start saving for Italy

  14. IanT
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:21 pm | Permalink

    I think you will get elected again Mr Redwood – I couldn’t vote for you under Cameron and would not do so under May again now – but I think she is the one who is toast – not yourself. I expect it will be someone else leading the CP when (the now inevitable) General Election takes place.

  15. Fedupsoutherner
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:28 pm | Permalink

    I feel sick to the pit of my stomach over the cabinet approving May’s deal with the EU. All Brexiteers have shafted us. What a useless, spineless lot. May is a liar and is still lying go the nation. I cannot bring myself to vote Tory again. What a waste of time this has been. A politicians word is worth nothing. I wish I could put down in writing on this site how I really feel.

  16. Fedupsoutherner
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:29 pm | Permalink

    What Brexit?

  17. Freeborn John
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:37 pm | Permalink

    Stop making irrelevant posts at a time like this. You need to take Theresa May down. If it takes more than one shove so be it. Put she needs to be weakend, weakend and weakened again at every opportunity. Get those letters in. If she survives one day, she may fall the next. The get to it with a mission or we will be trapped indefinitely in the EU customs union and single market long after she is gone.

  18. Original Richard
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:40 pm | Permalink

    Mrs. May’s and the EU’s plan all along was to produce such a bad withdrawal deal that the UK would vote in a second referendum to remain in the EU rather than leave without a deal.

    The BBC has been tasked in the meantime with making daily reports on how terrible would be a no deal.

  19. Fedupsoutherner
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:41 pm | Permalink

    Quite frankly John I couldn’t give a toss about Germany and knowing we will be bowing and scraping to them for ever more is prime puking material. My country has been fed to the dogs and all those so called Brexiteers should be shot.

  20. Andy
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:50 pm | Permalink

    How’s your Brexit going guys?

    This is what you all voted for.

    Literally laughing my head off.

    Tory complete capitulation.

    • Fedupsoutherner
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 7:14 am | Permalink

      Andy, what a silly post. Obviously this is not what we voted for. Its there for you to read within the comments but you don’t seem to understand your own language. Perhaps French would be easier for you. I just hope conscription into an EU army doesn’t happen. You might not be laughing then. It shows your true metal when you think it funny that your own country will be worse off. We really could do without people like you. Have you got your passport to hand?

    • Richard1
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 7:33 am | Permalink

      Well not quite yet it has to go through Parliament.

    • Al
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 8:30 am | Permalink

      **How’s your Brexit going guys?
      This is what you all voted for.**

      I think you’ll find most Leavers voted to Leave. The problem is the government is not delivering that. Most Remainers voted to Remain. The government is not delivering that either.

      Your last line however I totally agree with.

    • Anonymous
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 8:56 am | Permalink

      It isn’t what we voted for.

      I was a fool to have ever been a working class Tory voter and you have made very clear what the officer class really think of me.

      So Corbyn it is.

      I want your kids out of private school and your wealth redistributed.

  21. zorro
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 10:52 pm | Permalink

    Well, let’s see how long this decision lasts contact with the fresh air!! The supplicant, prone UK state on its knees before the EU – requesting permission to breathe…. David Gauke on Newsnight talking about ‘crashing out’ and ‘No deal’ being a disaster – whatever

    zorro

  22. Student
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 11:05 pm | Permalink

    What a disappointment from the political careerists in government.

  23. Sir Joe Soap
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 11:11 pm | Permalink

    Great news, but give me one good reason to set up a business in the UK now.

  24. Oggy
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 11:23 pm | Permalink

    Tories and toast are words that come to mind.

  25. Steve
    Posted November 14, 2018 at 11:26 pm | Permalink

    Chris

    “Utterly treacherous and unforgivable.”

    Indeed, very appropriate wording Chris.

    I find myself thinking of what they said by way of; ” we are no longer the nasty party”

    …..seems then they must have set themselves up as the shyster party instead.

    The DUP must be absolutely livid, and rightly so.

    I wonder what the Queen thinks of these criminals who have ensured the break up of the UK.

  26. Steve
    Posted November 15, 2018 at 12:13 am | Permalink

    “this is the best deal we could get”

    NOT GOOD ENOUGH !

    If these shysters think we’ll re elect them at the next general election they must either think they can utilise the perceived fear of Corbyn, or simply have their heads in cuckoo land.

    The reality is thus; the majority of former conservative voters and quite probably all leave voters will actually be voting for Corbyn. What’s to loose ? It can’t be any worse. Plus we get the satisfaction of voting the conservatives into non existence.

    Besides, unlike May, Corbyn is a Eurosceptic at heart and more likely to do as the electorate says, especially when he sees what we do to government that betrays us.

    I reckon the storm is not over yet, with the DUP thrown to the lions by Theresa May, Corbyn will see his chance pretty soon, and at that point the Conservatives will be toast, simple as.

  27. PaulDirac
    Posted November 15, 2018 at 1:14 am | Permalink

    My Leave friends, I sincerely hope I’m absolutely wrong on this, but;
    I think we have lost and the UK will now remain in the EU for a long time.
    When TM came out with her hopeless plan it seemed that the parliamentary arithmetic is against her and that she is bound to lose the argument and her job.
    But then there is the SNP, the more awful the plan – the more they will like it, but mainly TM will buy them off, they will get virtual independence and a huge increase in their money allocation.
    At a guess, once the plan is approved, we will have a second referendum and will meekly vote to remain in the EU.

  28. Sir Joe Soap
    Posted November 15, 2018 at 1:49 am | Permalink

    “Where provisions of Union law made applicable by this Protocol provide for the indication of a Member State, including in abbreviated form, as markings, labelling, tags, or by any other means, the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland shall be indicated as “UK(NI)” or “United Kingdom (Northern Ireland)”. Where provisions of Union law made applicable by this Protocol provide for the indication in the form of a numeric code, the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland shall be indicated with a distinguishable numeric code.”
    This constitutes
    a/laws on our sovereign territory being made elsewhere and
    b/separation of NI from the rest of the UK

  29. hans christian ivers
    Posted November 15, 2018 at 6:48 am | Permalink

    JR.

    This is a long term game, we had growth in July but not in August and September.

    The Germans have had 12 quarters of more growth than us prior to the Q3 2018 and will have more in Q4 as well, so no there is not much of a story, but you seem to want to make one.

    We as a nation are falling behind , because of issues you do not wish to acknowledge in public

    • libertarian
      Posted November 15, 2018 at 9:37 am | Permalink

      hans

      Give it up, the day before yesterday you falsely told us the figures were wrong. Now you’re trying to claim they dont matter. Its why economics should be banned as a subject. Its practitioners are charlatans

      We are falling behind where we could be

      This is why

      1) Massive skills shortages ( failed education system, too many PPE & economists not enough trades people)

      2) Lack of investment in 21st century infrastructure ( broadband, 5g, roads, runways NOT trains)

      3) Being tied into the regressive, backward looking , over regulated EU ( trying to kill digital, financial services and advanced engineering)

      4) Over taxation and insane company/business legislation ( IR35, reclaiming retrospective tax, rafts of anti self employment rules , over inflated business rates, digital taxes etc)

      • libertarian
        Posted November 15, 2018 at 1:45 pm | Permalink

        oh and hans

        So how are European economies going?

        France
        Wage growth 0.4% Unemployment 9.1%

        Germany
        Wage growth 0.5% Unemployment 3.4%

        Italy
        Wage growth 1.9% Unemployment 10.1%

        Britain
        Wage growth 3% Unemployment 4.1%

  30. Narrow Shoulders
    Posted November 15, 2018 at 8:09 am | Permalink

    Is there any correlation between the fall in GDP in Germany and the fact they are not increasing their population substantially any longer?

    UK GDP continues to rise at a lower rate than population growth, per capita GDP continues to fall.

    Reply UK output is rising faster than population. Germany’s population had a big migrant surge recently

  31. Ron Olden
    Posted November 20, 2018 at 7:49 pm | Permalink

    Both German and UK GDP figures have been heavily distorted by disruption to car production following model changes.
    Germany is nearly back to normal now whereas the UK will still likely have one more bad months’ figures still to come which will depress the growth rate to below Germany’s for that three month period only.
    Statistics are now issued on a three month rolling basis. Every month is now the end of a ‘Quarter’ so they might start to appear more volatile. I would expect the three month to the end of October to show virtually zero growth.
    Following that, UK Growth will converge again with Germany’s.

  • About John Redwood


    John Redwood won a free place at Kent College, Canterbury, and graduated from Magdalen College Oxford. He is a Distinguished fellow of All Souls, Oxford. A businessman by background, he has set up an investment management business, was both executive and non executive chairman of a quoted industrial PLC, and chaired a manufacturing company with factories in Birmingham, Chicago, India and China. He is the MP for Wokingham, first elected in 1987.

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