This Parliament went to war with the people when it decided to delay Brexit. Labour andĀ government supporting Conservative MPs who were elected to implement the referendum decision decided to support a Prime Minister who broke her word and begged for an extension of our membership of the EU. From that moment the two main parties went into freefall in opinion polls and elections. Both hit just 28% in the locals with no Brexit party on offer, and then slumped to 14% and 9% in the European election when there was a pro Brexit partyĀ many wanted to vote for. Never have the two main parties been so low in support and esteem.
You would have thought this would wake up all those MPs who promised Brexit and then spent the next two years trying to dilute or delay it, or even to reverse it. Yet listening to the continuing conversations in both parties there are many who still do not get it. They want to believe the European election was just a warning or a by election or a flash in the pan. They want to believe it will all be different when we get to a Westminster election. They should try reading the latest opinion poll. That shows the Brexit party clearly in the lead at 26%, with Labour on just 22% and the Conservatives on a near wipe out score of 17%.
All those currently jostling for the position of Leader of the Conservatives have to understand the magnitude of Mrs May’s decision to lose the trust of the people by delaying Brexit. In February the Conservatives were still on 43% in the polls because people believed her when she said deal or no deal we would be out on 29 March. Polling made clear they did like not her Agreement which had already been decisively rejected by Parliament. Many Leave voters did not see the Agreement as leaving, whilst many Remain voters thought the Agreement worse than staying in, so the Agreement lacked friends. If Mrs May misunderstood this, she surely now must understand it. Her Agreement was the only thing she offered in the European election, and the Conservative party was the only party offering it. It went down to a catastrophic defeat. Many former Conservative voters wanted to leave without the Agreement, and were happy voting for just that policy when the Brexit party came along with it.
Any person wanting to lead the Conservatives to success from this disastrous current showing in the polls has to deliver a clean Brexit as soon as possible and apologise on behalf of Mrs May and the outgoing government for the needless delay. It is difficult to see Ā how someone who stayed in the government and argued for the Withdrawal Agreement could convincingly pull this off.Ā The new leader then needs to move rapidly to using the new freedoms, the extra money and the other advantages of being a self governing country again to show the wider nation that Project Fear was wrong and that there is a good and prosperous future for us once out.
Meanwhile Labour has not even got to the point of contemplating a change of leadership as its civil war between Remain and Leave continues. If it lurches further to Remain and offers clearly a second referendum it will lose many of its remaining Leave supporters. It then has to go head to head with the Lib Dems and Greens in a very crowded political marketplace. Conservatives haveĀ a poorĀ future if they do not win back lost Brexit voters. Labour has an evenĀ poorer future if it is a half hearted version of the Liberal Democrats.
June 5, 2019
Mrs May still does not get it. In the joint press conference with President Trump she was still claiming she had negotiated “a good deal”.
I am not sure that those seeking to succeed her fully get it either in terms of how hated and damaging the draft WA actually is.
June 5, 2019
And do not forget that a sudden clean break (which I support) on 31st October is going to be traumatic too.
June 5, 2019
JR, chooses to forget how Cameron threatened Red Ed and Sturgeon to get elected, then Mayhab enacts and builds upon Milibands policies! Central economy promises broken for nine years! Deficit still not balanced, debt still increasing, Highest taxes in forty years after promising 80/20 split between cuts and tax rises, no bonfire of quangos, no limit to public sector high earners- 30 percent increase of the amount who earn higher than Ā£100,000!, MPs get a whopping 2.7 percent and still no right to recall promised by Tories fiddling still going on 377 MPs having their credit card suspended, knife crime and murder rate at forty year high, criminal justice system in a complete mess, Tory trying to scare with Corbyn and then go into bed with him to make him the Brexit king. Corbyn turned them down! Just a few things that escape JR’s memory.
June 5, 2019
Quite possibly, although I think it would also be fair to say that many Leavers are willing to navigate any bumps in the road rather than see our country fall into possible permanent vassalage as a result of the WA. And since outright Remain is absolutely not an option for the majority, that only really leaves a clean Brexit on WTO terms — preferably making use of the provisions provided by GATT to smooth the way (for both sides) while a new FTA is considered.
The annoying thing is that it has taken three years of turmoil, uncertainty and rising division and hatred for the country to reach the conclusion that was clearly evident before we even voted in 2016 — the EU had made it perfectly clear they had no intention of making it easy, only painful.
Our MPs should have listened. But they, of course, knew best. I can only hope they all, on both sides of the house, read Sir John’s piece today, for never was a truer word written.
June 5, 2019
If the country can survive three years of unprecedented misrule it can survive exit from the EU with all the agreements which have been made in advance.
June 5, 2019
Oh I don’t know, it could be cathartic. Any malice or bad faith from the EU will only highlight what a good idea it was to leave.
June 5, 2019
Good to see out of touch Gauke scrap short prison sentences under six months. How many convictions before even being sent to jail? Crime and disorder and the criminal justice system under Tories worse than a sick joke. Nevertheless he has given high court judges 25 percent pay rise to Ā£227,000 and 15 percent pay rise to crown court judges to Ā£155,000. Oh dear.
Johnson issues a mind numbing message today how he will be a virtue signaling environmentalist! Zero emissions by 2050! How much will this cost us on our household energy bills; at what cost to industry! Has he read the plight of British steel! Just when you thought the Tories could not get any worse.
Candidates for PM appear to be applying for captain of the Titanic half way across the Atlantic!
Come on Brexit Party in Peterborough tomorrow. We need to rid the swamp.
June 5, 2019
Johnson would be a disaster, in my view. He seems lazy to me, not bothering to find out the real truth behind such issues as the global warming scam and the huge unsustainable costs to the country, instead preferring to virtue signal simply to win more votes. The One Nation Tories apparently are putting climate change on a par with the threat from terrorism. Stark raving bonkers, in my view. Bankrupting the country on the basis of flawed science defies common sense. However, it is a way of generating huge wealth for the few, and of keeping the plebs under control and making their lives a misery. I am all for responsibility and careful use of resources but the ecozealots have a different agenda.
June 6, 2019
How does mass immigration impact our carbon footprint? Enough said they cannot be taken seriously!
June 5, 2019
“Candidates for PM appear to be applying for captain of the Titanic half way across the Atlantic!”
There are now so many MP’s tying themselves to the anchor chain they don’t need the anchor.
If they want to save the Conservative Party there is only one thing to do. . . . . Leave now with no deal!
June 5, 2019
Mike
Maybe, we don’t really know. Project Fear has over-played their hand. It’s all bluff and very little substance…
You cannot say ‘is going to be traumatic too.’ How do you know? Based on what information?
Us being in ‘limbo’ is surely traumatic? Not leaving when we should have is surely traumatic?
Businesses want certainty, and they are not getting it.
Plus, having to accept the Euro is going to be pretty traumatic, as is losing the City of London!
June 5, 2019
The withdrawal agreement is Brexit. It is what 17.4m people – including most of the contributors to this blog – voted for. Oh no it isnāt some of you say. Oh yes it is. It is what Brexit really means – even if you did not realise it in 2016.
Now that you know the withdrawal agreement is Brexit – and, no, no deal is not an alternatively as you will ultimately still have to sign the withdrawal agreement anyway – do you still want it? And if so, why? What is wrong with you for wanting to inflict such a mess on your children and grandchildren.
June 5, 2019
17.4m people voted to leave the EU and its institutions. The WA did not achieve this objective. How many times does this have to be explained to you?
June 5, 2019
@Andy; The WA is indeed Brexit but it might not be what the majority voted for, you are thus just as much in the wrong to claim the WA is what people voted for as those who claim it is not – no one knows as no one has been asked.
Funny how you never join my in asking for a second referendum that would ask the electorate to chose between the WA and a WTO exit, wonder why?…
June 6, 2019
Jerry, Theresa May’s dWA is not Brexit because, whilst it takes us out of the existing EU treaties, it is a treaty which puts us right back under EU control immediately. As I have said before the dWA is a revolving-door Remain – out, then instantly back in again.
June 6, 2019
@NickC; So you keep asserting but legally the WA is ‘Brexit’, we will have left the “European Union”, just not how you, I and most on this site wish.
June 7, 2019
Jerry, Article 6 of the dWA states plainly that the EU and UK will be a “single customs territory”. Whichever way you twist it, that does not put the UK outside the EU.
June 8, 2019
@NickC; How many times… Norway, Monaco, Switzerland and Andorra are all not members of the “European Union” but are members of a CU with it, Likewise Mexico and Canada are not states of the USA but are members of NAFTA, a customs union of sorts.
Whichever way you twist it, the WA is still LEGALLY leaving the “European Union”.
June 5, 2019
I think somewhere in your logic is the belief that the WA is similar to a divorce agreement. I’ve never heard of a divorce in which all the assets and all the money and all the decisions lie with one party and none with the other. Such an agreement would not stand in court .. and nor does the Capitulation Agreement no matter how huffy the likes of you get.
June 5, 2019
Andy, we voted leave to take back control of our destiny as an independent nation. The servitude treaty was never a consideration. Mayhab made clear leaving all EU institutions not half in and half out. She lied. Mayhab has done her upmost to keep the U.K. Associated with the EU in servitude until she could get the country back in.
What you write is a fiction in your own mind. Hope you get better soon.
June 5, 2019
Yeah the Earth is flat and the Sun revolves around the Earth . Allelluha for those with blocked minds, we need a laugh in adversity.
June 5, 2019
What is Remain, Andy ? Which version did you vote for ? Why do you want to inflict such a mess on your children and grandchildren ?
June 6, 2019
Theres no such thing as remain
Its do you want to be part of a single federal EU State or do you want to leave
June 5, 2019
A few beauties there Andy and practical impossibilities. 17.4M people voted to leave the EU and its institutions as clearly explained by Cameron/Osborne in their helpful government leaflet.
They did not vote for the faintly ridiculous shadow EU surrender treaty which was ‘negotiated’ by T May. She still thinks it is a good deal – wow there’s a recommendation!
There is no legal necessity to sign the withdrawal agreement anyway so I don’t know why you continue to spout these absurdities.
zorro
June 5, 2019
Andy …..I’ll say this for you, you certainly have stamina and blind faith in your bizarre views. Most normal people who can balance views and change/adapt as new evidence on an issue arises can accept a losing position. You however REMAIN.
June 5, 2019
Fred H, I think Andy is the non de plume of PM May.
June 5, 2019
nom not non.
June 6, 2019
Fred H
“can accept a losing position”
“Nigel Farage:
āIn a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way. If the remain campaign win two-thirds to one-third that ends it.ā
So unfinished business it is.
June 7, 2019
Margaret Howard, Do you keep getting this wrong out of ignorance, or malice? Farage was talking about continuing to campaign not actually halting Remain, as the Remains have halted Leave.
June 5, 2019
Rubbish mate
June 5, 2019
” you will ultimately still have to sign the withdrawal agreement anyway”
Why do you say that? While a Withdrawal agreement may be signed, and I am not sure that legally one needs to be, there is no reason it should be the current (a.k.a. May’s) Withdrawal Agreement.
June 5, 2019
You make me tired, you really do. Same old bilge. Take a day off man. You lost and you will keep on losing.
June 5, 2019
What kind of Remain did you vote for, Andy?
Remain a trifle detached, or progressing towards adopting the Euro? Do you want to be in or out of Schengen? In or out of a true financial Union, in or out of ‘ever-closer’ Union as detailed in the 5 Presidents’ Report? Do you prefer to see the UK as a province or as independent nations?
June 5, 2019
Put the keyboard down Rory.
June 5, 2019
It won’t be if enough voters listen to the talk by Prof Prins about May’s ‘cell’ of civil servants, Hammond and Duncan in the FO. He gives the details of the betrayal quite brilliantly and the video of this is going viral. Any MP that wants to rehash the WA or be associated with this Brino will have to answer questions from his constituency. It would be advisible for Messrs Robbins and co to book their ticket to Belgium while the going is good. It’s going badly for EU shills. Best go to your retreat in France.
It’s on Briefings for Brexit.
June 5, 2019
https://briefingsforbrexit.com/brexit-and-the-us-uk-defense-relationship/
June 5, 2019
Andy,
As a contributor to Johnās column I thought you would have realised that the WA is not what the Leave community voted for. The WA is not a proper Brexit.
So let me help you understand the difference between Leave, which was voted for in the Referendum and Leave under the WA treaty. Under the WA treaty the UK leaves in name only. The UK will still be responsible to adhere to the laws of the EU and any future laws they wish to introduce. To give you an example leaving under the WA treaty would mean the UK immediately takes back control of its fishing waters. Shortly after, within days no doubt, the French, the Spanish and Dutch etc would complain that they are barred from fishing in the UKās waters. So the EU introduces a law which entitles all the EU countries to fish in the UKās waters. Under the Leave WA treaty the UK will be unable to do anything about it. And you believe this is Leave!
Leave (under WTO rules) means that the EU countriesā fishing would be illegal. That is unless the UK Govt decide otherwise. Note the authority and decision making lies with the UK Govt.
I hope you can now understand why there is a substantial difference between Leave with the WA treaty and Leave which was on the Ballot paper.
Essentially Leaving under WA treaty is an artful misnomer. It should be āLeave to become a vassal state of the EUā treaty.
I hope you will eventually understand the difference.
In the meantime I do hope your children and grandchildren have a better understanding of the law than you currently do.
June 5, 2019
Categorically no, Andy. Not in a million years is this slavery act what we voted for.
We voted to leave the EU, not be permanently chained to it’s corpse.
Thus No deal is really what we wanted. Of course, the middle ground getting us out is to join the EFTA. Then to negotiate further but May seems to ignore that.
TO be clear – because you don’t seem to understand – the Withdrawal Agreement is not Brexit, thus is it not Leave, thus it will be thrown away.
June 6, 2019
Nick
“we wanted to leave the EU”
Nigel Farage:
āIn a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way. If the remain campaign win two-thirds to one-third that ends it.ā
So unfinished business it is.
June 6, 2019
I fail to see how this quote by Farage is relevant Margaret.
You have the right to oppose the Referendum result.
As many are doing in Parliament.
But we have legislated to leave, now on 31st October.
June 6, 2019
Margaret Howard, Farage was not proposing to halt Remain. That is the difference. He was simply saying he would go on campaigning. I have no objection to Remains doing the same. It’s just that Remains must not discard Leave – because if they do, all democracy is lost.
June 7, 2019
That was after the Ā£9m government leaflet campaign and interference from Obama.
June 5, 2019
To paraphrase the Illiberal Undemocrats…
B*ll*cks.
June 5, 2019
Just repeating this post regularly doesn’t make it any less nonsensical andy.
You should realise as a business owner that positions stated as firm prior to a deal being negotiated are often modified during negotiations.
June 5, 2019
I was very clear what I was voting for. It was not for May’s “deal”. As for leaving a mess for children, I can think of nothing worse than the fundamental breakdown of civil trust that would follow revocation and the unpredictable political consequences that would trigger. Be careful what you wish for
June 5, 2019
I agree a break down in trust is a problem.
Perhaps Brexiteers should not have lied in 2016 about what Brexit meant?
Instead you promised a cake and eat it Brexit. All the benefits of EU membership with none of the costs. It was always a fraud.
June 6, 2019
Read the Leaflet.
June 6, 2019
Andy
There aren’t any benefits to being in the EU
June 6, 2019
Andy, There are no benefits to EU membership.
June 6, 2019
Andy, Which Brexiteers lied, and what were the lies? So far you have failed to come up with any examples, still less the hundreds your fake claim implies.
June 6, 2019
oldtimer
“I was very clear what I was voting for”
Not everybody was as the following clearly shows:
Nigel Farage:
āIn a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way. If the remain campaign win two-thirds to one-third that ends it.ā
So unfinished business it is.
June 6, 2019
As you keep saying Margaret but this quote has no relationship to someone saying “I knew what I was voting for”
June 6, 2019
Margaret Howard, Continuing to campaign is not the same as preventing our vote from being implemented.
June 5, 2019
Whatever you’re on, can I have some?
June 5, 2019
No matter how many times you repeat that Andy, I’m still not convinced.
June 5, 2019
Yawn, it is on,ply Brexit in the eyes and febrile minds of Remoaners.
Leaving is Brexit, signing another treaty from which we cannot withdraw without the EUās say is not Brexit, it is the very opposite of Taking Back Control, it is madness.
You cannot read my mind nor speak for me or the 17.4m others.
June 5, 2019
You are sounding more and more desperate, young(?) man! You know that it’s errant nonsense that you post. The WA is the EU’s attempt to head off a hemorrhage of member states from the protectionist bloc and punish the UK. Ably supported by May and her cohorts. It’s the work of bunch of spiteful and undemocratic losers. ‘Brexit’ doesn’t actually exist but leaving the EU does. A mechanism to exit (Art. 50) was, thankfully, proposed and enabled by Labour’s Gisela Stuart.
June 5, 2019
Andy
Yawn!
June 5, 2019
absolute rubbish , typical remainer tosh. The WA was not leaving and now we have confirmed that the wordage of A 50 has been altered by OUR civil service so May can go on extending. Brexit if we must use that word , is leaving cleanly and shaking of these shackles which Mrs. May had promised to do , though she knew she would not. The Civil service , the cabinet and the PM have colluded with the EU , a foreign power and what is most shocking is that they , in their arrogance thought we were too thick to notice.
June 5, 2019
Andy
You couldn’t find your own head with your own hands , so stop telling the rest of us what we thought
We know we voted to leave, we want to leave THEN we might consider negotiating a FTA with the EU , depends on how desperate they are by then
Our children and grandchildren will have good, well paying jobs unlike most of the rest of the EU
Wake up Andy
June 5, 2019
You are so, so wrong. Leavers did not vote for Mays Deal because it is not leaving in any way, shape or form. How are you so sure that remaining is so good for our children & grandchildren when we have no idea what will happen to the euro or the E.U. in future years. At least with leaving we are masters of our own destiny & not that of the E.U.
June 5, 2019
Fool, the WA did not exist when we voted to leave the EU.
June 5, 2019
Andy just seems to be clickbait. I see that it has provoked 29 people to waste their time replying. Is that what was intended, I wonder?
June 5, 2019
oldtimer
Afraid Mrs May is absolutely clueless, and has been totally and utterly out of her depth as a Prime Minister, she was a poor Home secretary as well.
Her management and negotiation skills exposed as unfit for purpose.
The fact that she still thinks her deal is a good deal says it all really, totally blind to reality.
She actually looked like a broken person yesterday if you looked at her body language, there, but not really taking part. Trump looked comfortable in his own skin, happy to talk about anything.
June 5, 2019
She also said she was a woman of her word. š¤£š¤£
Iām sure there must be an expression for that kind of statement.
June 5, 2019
“Deluded plonker” perhaps.
June 5, 2019
She also made a gratuitous, spiteful reminder of how she turned down the President’s advice, as if she were the clever one of the two.
June 5, 2019
May does not seem to know when to stop digging….
June 5, 2019
I believe the word you search for is ‘lies’.
June 5, 2019
It depends which words you choose. There are plenty and they mean something completely different.
June 5, 2019
I agree. Many of the candidates seem to think that tweaking the backstop arrangement is sufficient to win the day. I hope the new leader is one that dumps the WA.
June 5, 2019
JR, you too were slow on the uptake. The public are no longer listening to your party, the trust is gone. Like an alleged reformed spouse trying to say he/she will change. The tipping point has passed. No matter what your lying Party says it will not be believed. Hammond still on the offensive to remain! Undermining all those candidates new promises. Brandon Lewis still supporting all the EU fanatic MPs, acting against the public will and govt policy, over their associations who want them gone!
Tim Bradshaw in Conservative Woman cogently explains why trust in your party has gone. Another article explaining how Mayhab and her traitorous cabal giving away our jewels of security, defense and intelligence to the EU and being prepared to be subordinate and shunned from Galileo! Dishonest KitKat policy in action! There must be an investigation for All those concerned.
June 5, 2019
We have to hope she has the insight for this to have been a self-mocking statement, but I fear not.
June 5, 2019
Many Conservatives assume that BRINO delivered by a more personable leader will get them off the hook.
Failing that, they hope to cling on for as long as possible until a General Election is unavoidable.
The leadership news is a bit of a sideshow now. I would like someone half decent to be in charge, but what I really look forward to is a general election. That will not provide an instant solution either, but at least the fractured parties will not then be able railroad through a surrender agreement and MPs will realise that the electorate will ultimately hold them to account.
June 5, 2019
Donald Trump was having a bit of fun with her knowing full well she is deranged and deluded. Even now, she thinks her deal was the best deal, and everybody else got it wrong, just as another deluded individual some 74 years ago.
As for Sir John’s post, he got it spot on! Thankfully, these ostriches in parliament who bury their heads in the sand and ignore public opinion will go the way of the Dodo. And not before time!
June 5, 2019
“… May still does not get it” – Spot on! And what’s more, she will never get it! She is impervious to evidence and logic.
As she continues to ignore the democratic voice of the voters, she should be subjected to a Middle Ages remedy for her condition:
A week in the stocks on College Green would surely show her the way and the light!
June 5, 2019
I have just read in yesterday’s joint press conference, that May boasted “She was a woman of her word.”
I don’t think it would be too difficult to find 17.4 million people who would disagree with that! And I suspect a good number of the fair minded other 16 million would also agree!
June 5, 2019
I see the establishment got Gove to meet Donald. No doubt their preferred option for PM.
If Boris isn’t in the final two there will be a rebellion.
June 5, 2019
Doubt it, we’ll just vote for the Brexit Party.
June 5, 2019
Just a short time ago I’d have thought that likely. Now I think trust has gone and it doesn’t matter who leads the former Conservative Party as they are more liberal and cannot be believed.
June 5, 2019
We certainly do not want Gove with his let’s kill (or tax to death) all private schools agenda and his greencrap with Gerta. He is the reason we suffered the appalling Theresa May. He supported her putrid agreement three times, voted confidence in the woman, cannot stack a dish washer, took his driving test seven times and he has very little electoral appeal. He is hated by the state education establishment too. Also he is an Oxford English Graduate so almost certainly has very little numeracy, logic, negotiation, business, understanding of science, engineering or game theory. Slightly better than PPE perhaps.
June 5, 2019
Or rather Greta (Thunberg).
June 5, 2019
If Gove gets it, there will be no Conservative Party. He is treacherous and determined to delay and eventually thwart Brexit in my opinion. Come 2022 (if it gets that far) the Tories would be done for with no Brexit to show. The Tories have a death wish and always, always choose the wrong one. Anyone think it will be different this time?
June 5, 2019
Ian wragg
So you REALLY think Boris is a fit man to lead this country?
A liar, adulterer and fornicator who will turn whichever way the wind blows.
And you think you can trust him? And this in a country with past leaders like Churchill and Thatcher!
How low we have sunk.
June 6, 2019
Margaret Howard, I would certainly trust Boris above Theresa May. Wouldn’t you?
June 5, 2019
If Boris, Raab or Baker are rejected and we have another Remainer in the post the Tories will be out of power for a generation at least. There will be no cushy numbers as the Opposition Party either as TBP will either be running the show or the main opposition party.
June 5, 2019
Gove never had that heavily trailed private meeting with President Trump, merely a brief exchange of words. He apparently waited for that invitation for a private meeting the next day, but it never came. Nigel Farage had a private meeting though with P Trump.
June 6, 2019
Chris
“Nigel Farage had a private meeting though with P Trump”
Not in his gold lift this time.
That tells us all we need to know.
June 5, 2019
in the event Trump didn’t find the time to meet the loser. A smarter cookie than most give him credit for?
June 5, 2019
Good morning
There are two things at play here. First is time. MP’s can afford to be difficult, we are not due GE for another 3 years. The second thing at play is their career. No MP wants to damage their chances. After all judging by the number of applicants, most MP’s think they should be PM.
I hope TBP do well tomorrow. Perhaps then some might cone round to see that they are not just another flash in the pan like the CUK’s. Tee-hee š
PS Please don’t take Anna Soubry MP back. That really would be stupid.
June 5, 2019
Soubry wonāt be back after the next GE that is for sure, but thatās simply not soon enough.
June 5, 2019
I think you’re overlooking La Soubry’s entertainment value.
June 5, 2019
The BBC will probably keep having her for interview regardless. I suspect we won’t be rid of her appearances on the screen that easily.
June 5, 2019
At an individual level they may not feel the need to behave with integrity due to the 3 year breathing space, but if they agree to the WA the transition period will run up to the next election, possibly longer. They will be held responsible for another failure, one which could last forever. A clean Brexit allows them to start to deliver on that period.
June 5, 2019
Caterpillar
Totally correct. We are at last heading for a no hiding place process. Where responsibility and accountability will be transparent.
June 5, 2019
My thoughts entirely
June 5, 2019
I think CUK’s failure is a pity. Leaving aside Brexit there is surely scope for a Blairite Labour alternative to Corbyn’s hard-left. On Brexit, the more parties there are to split the Remain vote at a GE the better. Their problem was in allowing disruptive Conservative MPs to join, thus alienating their potential Labour base, and letting those Conservatives turn it into a purely Remain lobby group.
June 5, 2019
Blairite Labour alternative to Corbyn’s hard left?
You have one -the Tories,particularly under Gove(or who knows,at some future stage,a returning George Osborne).Gove,Osborne and Cameron worshipped Blair as the “Master.”
June 5, 2019
To leave one party may be considered unfortunate, to leave two in quick succession should be considered hubristic.
Do these people never stop to consider they may be wrong?
June 5, 2019
It’s a truly sad indictment of your assessment that it only has two considerations, and both of these relate to the personal ambitions of MPs.
They simply can’t get their heads around the fact that if they got us out on WTO terms NOW, they would have the autonomy and hold the power to use the next 3 years to prove their Conservative credentials. They’d have a huge chunk of the Ā£39b and the value of the diverted membership fees to cushion any “catastrophies”, which many of us believe would more likely be caused by parliamentary incompetence than anything else.
I totally agree with your observations about TBP; perhaps their ongoing success will finally bring a sense of awareness to those we elected to reflect our views.
I’m also incensed that others elected to post on a Brexit ticket think it’s acceptable to Party-hop at will, without seeking the consent of their constituents. The electorate rejected the LibDem viewpoint at the last GE, so to gain additional MPs through this deception is abhorrent.
Just imagine the impact if the single consideration in politics was to be elected, not to deliver a manifesto. Candidates would be able to jump on any popular Party bandwagon simply to be elected, then move to their true Party at will. Then imagine a raft of MPs elected on the Tory Party manifesto declaring that the Labour Party was always more to their liking.
June 5, 2019
Letās hope this is not the only MP who gets it! I will vote for Baker if he stands, else Boris who has to kick his Remain family into touch and deliver Brexit fast – 5 years of failed negotiations is enough surely?
June 5, 2019
Kick his family in to touch? In your new Brexit Britain is everyone required to agree with you?
June 5, 2019
The public voted to leave the EU. Whatever your personal opinions, the UK referendum commanded our servants to enact our will – to leave the EU.
June 5, 2019
TBH, I’d imagine that the Thought Police were more suited to your side of the political debate.
June 5, 2019
They are not allowed to undermine the will of the majority, and sadly that is the objective of Borisā family. His Remain ex-MEP father who campaigned avidly during the Referendum for Remain even claimed to have been a Leaver after Leave won. Lying is not a great way of winning respect and Mrs May has found – (or has she, she seems incapable of basic comprehension).
June 5, 2019
Ah – so the dear leaderās family are required to agree with him in your Brexit Britain.
Thatās exactly how it works in North Korea too.
Do you propose the same sort of punishments for those who transgress?
June 6, 2019
Andy
For someone ( you) who posted the most despicable comments on here about your own mother because she disagreed with you I think you’ve just reached peak hypocrisy
June 6, 2019
Andy, I recall you boasting about how you are teaching your own children to love the great leaders of the corrupt anti-democratic EU. Thatās exactly how it works in North Korea too. Do you propose the same sort of punishments for those who transgress?
June 5, 2019
Snap.
June 5, 2019
we don’ know when the next GE will be, there might not be much time if Puddleglum Hammond and his cohort of remainers brings the house down. If that happens every self respecting person who voted to leave should vote for the Brexit Party. My party membership hangs by a very fine gossamer thread.
June 5, 2019
my choice is Steve Baker too. The rest of them just blow in the wind. We need someone with a vision and some INTEGRITY.
June 5, 2019
We definitely need a cabinet FULL of Spartans – else 0there is really nothing to āconserveā.
June 5, 2019
I agree about Steve Baker, BB. I always have thought Owen Paterson as principled also. Sir John is too of course, but I want him to be Chancellor!
June 5, 2019
Will the current MP’s welcome the first Brexit Party MP tomorrow?
June 5, 2019
@Bob Dixon; Quite possibly, seeing that by-elections are traditional protest events, heck even MRLP candidate’s do better, cometh the General Election thought….
June 5, 2019
If it wasn’t for the DUP, he would be Billy-no-mates.
June 5, 2019
Perhaps they could discuss his partyās policies with him? And when that 10 seconds of their day is over perhaps they could get on with their work and leave him to his rantings.
June 5, 2019
No point discussing manifesto policies related to Brexit with any of the main parties as they have not been honoured.
June 5, 2019
Can’t understand this ongoing obsession with Brexit Party having a manifesto and policy positions.
Surely all they have to say is we will deliver Brexit and then trigger a GE so a govt. can be elected to get on with governing the country. Given how little is getting done because of Brexit dominating it’s no worse a position than we currently seem to have
June 5, 2019
Andy
Seeing as the rest of them never stick to their policies I really dont give a RA what his other policies may or might not be
You really ought to get out and meet some ordinary people instead of sitting in your little two up two down terrace pretending youre a wealthy playboy
June 5, 2019
They should win. Not sure they will actually āwelcomeā him though.
June 5, 2019
Fingers crossed.
June 5, 2019
I actually like the fact that the Brexit Party are not publishing a manifesto prior to the Peterborough Election. After all, the main parties manifestos were no more than promises that were then broken .. better to be known for action rather than words. We know their main policy .. leave as voted for by the people in 2016.
June 5, 2019
You should send this accurate summing up to all MPās, a lot of whom are still in complete denial at what is going on. Will they wake up After the Peterborough by election tomorrow when the first Brexit MP is elected – probably not – as many still seem to have their heads up their backsides.
June 5, 2019
Utter rot. It is impossible to implement the referendum decision because the referendum decision was a total falsehood. The Leave campaign told us that we would leave and have frictionless trade with the EU (‘the exact same benefits’), yet have no need to sign up to any of the EU’s rules or institutions. An utter fairy tale! Parliament is not blocking the referendum decision, Parliament is exposing the deceit at the very heart of the Leave campaign. The country is in a mess but the blame lies squarely on the shoulders of the many Leave campaigners who weren’t straight with the British people (and they still aren’t being straight).
June 6, 2019
Henry Carter, If, as you insist, the Referendum decision to leave the EU treaties cannot be implemented, please explain: 1) why Parliament passed the 2015 EU Referendum Act offering the option of Leave; 2) why neither the Act, nor the campaigns, nor the government, stipulated that one of the two options – Leave – would be discarded; 3) why Parliament invoked TEU Art50 which specifies that leaving means leaving the EU treaties; and 4) why, uniquely among the other 165 nations in the world, the UK cannot exist outside the EU treaties.
June 5, 2019
This morning we are inundated by utter rubbish about the NHS and the US and Trump, with most of the contenders for the Tory leadership and so the UK premiership feeling duty bound to chip in with their own nonsense.
Even Dominic Raab, who normally talks something like sense:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/brexit/9223014/donald-trump-state-visit-nhs-row/
“I want to see the UK get fair deals on trade with the US and many other countries when we leave the EU. But the NHS is not for sale to any country and never would be if I was Prime Minister.”
Interestingly earlier in that article there is a quiet admission that the NHS has in fact long been “for sale”; indeed not to the US but to 27 other countries, the EU countries, plus in fact the 3 more in the EEA:
“US healthcare firms are keen to compete for privatised NHS contracts on the same basis as British and EU companies do.”
As pointed out in my comment yesterday:
http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2019/06/04/what-d-day-means-to-us/#comment-1026537
“The NHS is not for sale to the Americans, but this is a French company so thatās OK:”
I well recall more than a decade ago some Labour MPs strenuously objecting to provisions in the Lisbon Treaty, a treaty agreed by their own leaders, which they claimed could open the door to EU companies taking over the NHS; now Labour is determined to prevent our government having the power to operate an independent trade policy in case the wicked Tories sell it off the evil Americans.
June 5, 2019
For example, from February 6th 2008:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7231646.stm
“MP fears EU ‘could control NHS'”
“The issue was raised during the fourth day of topic-by-topic debates on the Lisbon Treaty – signed by Gordon Brown in December – but which has yet to be ratified by all parliaments across the EU.”
“Mr Dobson claimed that “neo-liberals” in the European Court and European Commission were increasingly exposing healthcare to “internal market forces”.
“It would appear that our National Health Service is, and will remain, the exclusive responsibility of the British Government, but it isn’t and under the Lisbon treaty, it won’t,” he said.”
Now this issue has been distorted into a reason for staying in the EU.
June 5, 2019
Sky News is claiming that at their joint press conference President Trump had to ask Theresa May to explain what was meant by the NHS.
That is a straight lie, as can be seen in this video excerpt:
https://twitter.com/i/status/1135902593492955136
It would be extraordinary if he did not recognise the name “NHS” as he had talked about it, and acknowledged that it had a special place for the British people, some days before he came here.
However as we know “a lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes”, and especially if the prominent figure who is best placed to contradict that lie – Theresa May – chooses not to do so.
June 5, 2019
Whatever minor temporary economic disruption might be caused by a ‘hard’ Brexit, it is inconsequential to what would be caused by a Momentum/Corbyn government.
The only sure Tory candidate for defeating Corbyn is Boris Johnson and if Conservative MPs act to stop him being one of the two names on the final ballot, then the party is doomed.
However, Boris must deliver a clean Brexit on October 31, but without May’s terrible surrender/Withdrawal Agreement. Should this happen, there may be some Tory Lib Dems in disguise who would support a Corbyn No Confidence motion in Parliament forcing a general election.
Given the stark choice between a Venezuelan style future or freedom, the electorate is likely to abandon the Brexit Party for the Tories and Remainers would be split between Labour, the Lib Dems, Labour and Change UK (if it still exists). The result would be a Tory electoral landslide.
If the Tories fudge the Brexit issue, it will likely be replaced by the Brexit Party and Remainers might still be able to force the maintenance of the status quo.
June 5, 2019
Do not the Leadsons, Hunts, Goves etc realise that they are as complicit as Theresa May in this sell out. Up to a month/six weeks ago they were all supporting a deal that they now say they agree should change and they are the person to do it.
It defies belief that that they think they have the ability to be PM let alone attract the voters and says everything about their complete lack of any principles, their sole aim is to continue up the greasy pole for personal glorification.
Peter Obourne in an article quite early on said one of the unintended consequences of Brexit was that it highlighted the paucity of talent in the Cabinet. How prescient!
These are political minnows with zero credibility. If any of them is chosen by Remain MPs to get the softest Brexit possible or some personal animus to Boris, Rory Stewart springs to mind, I and I suspect millions of others will not vote for them and you will be ādestroyedā.
Are your MPs prepared to listen to us or merely their mirror because if it is the latter the P45 is on its way.
June 5, 2019
A lucid, cogent statement that alas may well be news to many of your colleagues.
Yesterday my own M.P. (a steadfast May Withdrawal Surrender supporter) emailed about Brexit, revealing his view that May wished to satisfy Remainers and Leavers alike with her deal. I think he has some clue it satisfied no-one except him and the other 200 or so but that is not certain.
Alarmingly, he is shown by Guido Fawkes as backing Mr. Johnson for the leadership (something he failed to disclose in his email). Does this indicate that Mr. Johnson may try to resurrect Mayās Surrender deal (which we recall he voted for once), perhaps modified for the sake of form by some trickery over the Irish backstop nonsense? If so, he would never restore himself to being the peopleās Blue Boris but would ensure his place in history as the last ever Conservative to be prime minister.
June 5, 2019
Boris supported the WA. Was it due to pressure or opportunism? Neither bodes well for him. In my view, he is unsuited to being PM and cannot be trusted. He will not deliver Brexit, but instead some fudge.
June 5, 2019
“Does this indicate that Mr. Johnson may try to resurrect Mayās Surrender deal (which we recall he voted for once), perhaps modified for the sake of form by some trickery over the Irish backstop nonsense?”
Boris had my vote until he voted for the WA (Mayās Surrender deal) now I cannot trust him.
June 5, 2019
I think Conservative MPs and candidate leaders need to stop referring to the WA as a deal. It is not, there is no trade deal. It is a list of uncosted obligations, a commitment to follow rules with no say or representation for 21 to 45 months, and the possibility of being trapped in a backstop forever.
June 5, 2019
Absolutely, it is more akin to the imposed Versailles Treaty and we all know what that led to. It’s most sickening aspect is that May and her team played a lead role in writing it. Better evidence of traiterous behaviour and intent it would be hard to find.
June 5, 2019
exactly.
June 5, 2019
It’s basically the new Federal European treaty, to be foisted on the EU27 in a few years time. Hopefully, more nations will come to their senses and reject the whole shooting match before it degenerates into a real one. Attempting to move EU officials and employees outside of the justice system is a sinister move that should be rejected outright.
June 5, 2019
But why were Labour and Tories prepared to sacrifice their parties?
Why would neither deliver a stonking Brexit to consign the other to history?
( If, that is, the EU were not in truth their MAIN concern).
Was the sacrifice on both counts for the good of The EU Project?
What about the EU Defence Union quietly going forward ( shhhhhhsh!) it is said ?
And still planned to carry on even in the event of No Deal.
( How did TBP rise so quickly and why are the legal voices claiming we left de facto on March 29th being stifled??).
June 5, 2019
@Everhopeful
“How did TBP rise so quickly?”
The easy answer is the mainstream party’s have failed!
They have taken the country in a direction the people did not want to go.
They sold out the soul of the people to a foreign power.
They have lied.
They have lost the respect of the electorate.
They have lost the trust of the electorate.
They are still ignoring the voters that elected them.
Why on earth would anyone want to vote for any of the Lib/Lab/Con party’s now?
June 6, 2019
@Everhopeful; TBP have not risen quickly, they are UKIP under a different name, in the same way as the original SDP rose quickly in 1981, themselves being the moderate wing of the Labour party under a different name.
June 6, 2019
Jerry, If you think that TBP is UKIP by another name I can assure you that you are wrong. I know you are wrong because I am a UKIP activist. Whereas you are not.
June 6, 2019
Nick
“I know you are wrong because I am a UKIP activist. ”
Oh dear, says it all. Even Farage deserted you.
June 6, 2019
@NickC; By being a “UKIP activist” you are hardly going to give an unbiased opinion, unlike those without an axe to grind!
But on second thoughts, perhaps you are correct, after those in TBP have a first clue, those in UKIP don’t, very different parties indeed! š
June 6, 2019
Jerry, Make your mind up: first you say that TBP and UKIP are the same, then you say they’re not. But at least try listening to someone who knows instead of pontificating in your utter ignorance. Ohhh . . . .
June 7, 2019
@NickC; Irony is obviously lost on you, along with āemoticonsā
As for ‘knowing’, how many spouses have backed up their partners when the police come knocking, only later to find out the truth during the court case…
June 5, 2019
“This Parliament went to war with the people when it decided to delay Brexit.”
There has been no test of public opinion since Brexit was delayed, other than the EP elections, in those the majority (63%) gave no opinion on who should represent us their area never mind saying anything about the wider issue os Brexit. On whose authority are you basing your claims Sir, certainly not the people…
If you do believe in democracy and that the public agree with you then you will surely have no problem in returning the question (How should the UK leave the European Union) directly to the people.
June 5, 2019
Democracy is now based on the unknown wishes of those that could not be bothered to vote? On this basis the referendum vote should be ignored without being implented. Utter nonsense.
June 5, 2019
@Longinus; “Democracy is now based on the unknown wishes of those that could not be bothered to vote?”
We have NEVER been asked HOW we want the UK to leave, just IF we want to leave the European Union.
Tell me, how do you know that 8.75m of those who voted to Leave in 2016 want the same Brexit as you?
Stop trying to claim a democratic mandate that doesn’t exist. Also the EP elections were to elect MEPs, not decide how Brexit is carried out, what ever Farage and co say.
June 6, 2019
Jerry, Stop trying to claim that we did not all vote for the same Leave. Your attempt to change the outcome (end result) – which mandates leaving the EU treaties – into somehow not leaving the treaties, is false and bad faith. In fact, typical of Remain propaganda.
The Leave option did not mandate a trade deal, so that is open for debate. But leaving the EU treaties is the “Brexit” all of us – who voted Leave – voted for. Even TEU Art50 confirms it! There is no other Brexit or Leave result possible which conforms to our vote.
June 6, 2019
I agree NickC
I read the Leaflet and listened to the speeches made by our PM
It seemed quite straightforward to me.
June 6, 2019
NickC; “Stop trying to claim that we did not all vote for the same Leave.”
Not that failed argument again. If you keep insisting that there were not 28 different leave manifestos/campaigns then the referendum must be declared void as the party you are an activist for (UKIP) not only had their own manifesto but campaigned on it with gusto [1] – illegally it would appear, by your logic, as the only manifesto and campaign should have been the one from the official Vote Leave group.
The referendum did not mandate any course of action, Leave or Remain, that’s the problem, and would you really accept (had Remain won) Euro federalists now claiming that the Remain vote means we should join the Euro, give up our opt-out from the Schengen Agreement etc? Like hell you would!…
[1] and do not try to deign it, we all remember that despicable UKIP poster on the day Jo Cox MP was murdered
June 7, 2019
Jerry, There were far more opinions than 28 on both sides, but there were only two options on the ballot paper – to Remain in the EU or to Leave the EU. We voted to Leave. Unless the final destination sees the UK outside the EU, then 17.4m people have been cheated. Partial Remain was not offered and by definition is not Leave.
June 7, 2019
@NickC; “There were far more opinions than 28 on both sides, but there were only two options on the ballot paper”
So tell me NickC, which opinion made you vote Leave?… Stop trolling.
June 5, 2019
Well said, Longinus.
June 5, 2019
Well thats is a very odd spin on recent events.
Many opinion polls show a dislike of the Withdrawal Agreement and a lead for the new Brexit Party.
To call those that did not vote a majority is a ridiculous spin on the results.
They did not take part. Only the votes cast can be counted.
June 5, 2019
So what you are saying Jerry is that Leave should include some degree of Remain.
A better idea would be to leave cleanly with no ties and then tell the EU we are amenable to an FTA if they want one.
Much less expensive and we get our sovereignty back.
June 5, 2019
Jerry
Oh dear
There is only ONE way to leave, that is to trigger Art50 ( done) then exit on the agreed date ( not done so far). Once we’ve left we can then argue about what we might do next .
June 5, 2019
libertarian
Oh dear
Wrong as usual Walter, but thanks for your opinion non the less.
Should the UK, for example, leave via the WA that takes us into a Transitional Agreement period, not fully out of the EU, & still bound by EC/EU27 rules, although we loose our voting rights to make them.
During that TA period the UK might then apply to join the EEA, our membership to become effective at 23:01 hrs on the day the TA ends – meaning that we do not actually leave many of the rules and regulations of the EU at all although we have left the “European Union” and the Govt of the day is thus in full compliances of answer to the question actually asked back in 2016.
If you think membership of the EEA is not leaving the “European Union” best you tell Norway that they are members of the EU…
June 6, 2019
Jerry, Norway is effectively a member of the EU. The EEA Agreement was a con set up by the EU to keep Norway “onside”. Even the EU and the Norwegian establishment could not get away with full membership after the referendum. Being in the EEA obviously does not comply with our decision to actually leave the EU, unless you re-define “leave” to mean partial Remain.
June 6, 2019
@NickC; According to international (treaty) law Norway is NOT a member of the “European Union”, it matters not what you think. quod erat demonstrandum.
Legally UK can be a member of the EEA having legally left the European union, and thus compliant with the referendum result [1] it matter not one jot what you think. quod erat demonstrandum.
[1] want a more legally defined instruction, best we have that second referendum then, asking the How-to question…
June 7, 2019
Jerry, You are confusing only yourself by ranting on about “How?” all the time. No amount of “How?” can change the outcome we voted for – which was to leave, exit, be outside, no longer be subject nationally to EU control. By definition signing up to the EEA (which is not on offer) is a partial Remain – we would have to comply with EU law domestically, not just for exports to the EU.
June 7, 2019
@NickC,; Stop trolling, stop spreading UKIP misinformation.
Once again Norway is not a member of the “European Union”, and membership of the EEA might well be on the table, should the UK adopted the WA process, it’s just that it would be close to impossible to leave the “European Union” at 23:00 hrs and join the EEA at 23:01 hrs the same day, in the same way as many countries will not sign FTA until we have formally left the “European Union”.
June 5, 2019
Well judging by what I am hearing nobody trusts your party even now John. With all the different views on Brexit from possible future PM’s it is obvious the party is not behind a true Brexiteer even now. They have a suicide pattern of thought. Hopefully, Farage will do well tomorrow but I don’t think even that will wake them up from their slumber. I for one still wouldn’t vote Conservative if there were a general election tomorrow. All trust is gone . How can we be confident of a clean Brexit when all the party is doing is bickering and most of the cabinet are still saying they won’t allow no deal? They really are a dim lot. Corbyn’s popularity must have taken more of a tumble after yesterday’s ridiculous anti-Trump protest. What a load of rabble. Most looked as though they would be straight down the benefits office afterwards to claim their disability benefits or unemployment benefits. Corbyn looked as though he was (lacking in judgement Ed) – oh, but then he is. As for Labour’s latest idea about a garden tax, well you couldn’t make it up. People work hard to get a home with a garden for their family and now we are to be taxed for that little luxury. Many OAP’s grow their own vegetables and enjoy gardening. Not all want to be stuck in a little flat. Freedom of choice seems to be not an option anymore.
June 5, 2019
The big question:
If we leave on 31st October this year as planned, trade with the Continent will deliberately be very restricted. The EU will not be pleased and will make sure this is so and they have already said so many times both in writing and in words.
We do a lot of trade (cars, pharma, agriculture, electricity to name but a few) with the continent at the moment. Can we survive without that trade?
Mr Trump is above all a businessman. He represents American agriculture, American pharma and American industry. He wants a deal. Can he fill the gap?
The left wing, including the BBC think all American chicken is bad, by the way. And, don’t forget, Mr Trump is about to buy the NHS too! :0)
If these two questions are not answered, we are in for a period of austerity which will bring a glow to Emily Thornberry’s cheeks.
June 6, 2019
Mike Stallard said: “If we leave on 31st October this year as planned, trade with the Continent will deliberately be very restricted“. So you’re saying the EU will deliberately stop selling us goods and services after 31 Oct? Can you explain why, and how that will work, given that it is contrary to WTO rules, and is a prime example of self-harm?
June 5, 2019
Indeed, yet most Conservative MPs still do not get it. Only Boris, Rabb and Mc Vey (of the leadership contenders) are remotely acceptable. The rest are continuation May socialists, as is our appalling tax to death IHT ratter, landlord and tenant mugging Chancellor who wrongly claims he is reducing government debt.
Poor Trump having to listen to ādo as I say not as I doā, homeopathic enthusiast Prince Charles with his 0ver Ā£1 million annual travel spend – who suffers from the Climate Change exaggeration religion so badly. Trump is quite right to concentrate on clean water, clean air and similar – the sensitivity of the World to CO2 has been hugely exaggerated.
Far better to spend money on things we know actually work like clean water, better sanitation, nutrition, inoculations, access to birth control, better medical care, malaria, disease control and the likes rather than wasting it on expensive and intermittent ārenewablesā. Climates have always changed and always will. We just have to deal with whatever comes as best we can. Atmospheric Co2 concentration is not some world thermostat – as the BBC/Greta/Prince Charles/Attenborough types foolishly seem to ābelieveā. Sensible, honest, independent physicists & scientists do not really believe there is some warming world catastrophe round the corner.
June 5, 2019
The next PM should also, ŵlike Trump, revoke the Paris Climate Accord and abolish Ed Milibandās insane Climate Change Act and cancel the subsidies driving the premature technologies of ārenewableā energy technology and electric cars. When it works and is competitive it will need no subsidies no point rolls out until it is. And certainly stop the environmentally insane biofuel importation to burn at Drax.
June 5, 2019
Interesting to see Dr Fox avoiding picking Mr Gove or Johnson, presumably wanting to keep his position.
June 5, 2019
Hunt is not a good choice for Fox. He is a remainer, clearly a lefty big state socialist not remotely a Conservative and another Oxford PPE graduate too. He did nothing to sort out the disaster of the NHS that kills thousands. He was however quite adept at endlessly saying sorry for its appalling incompetence. He had a lot of practise.
Had he been in charge of a private organisation that killed so many people he would surely have been jailed for life. The Grenville fire killed perhaps circa 0.1% of the number of people the NHS kills PA.
June 5, 2019
Listening to many of the candidates for PM, you are right. They are just the same as May (version 2).
Hammond needs to be got rid of, or brought into line. He alone is causing much damage to the future of the UK by failing to allow a full on preparation for no deal.
What’s the alternative to no deal? We know it can only be a bad deal, or no Brexit. The first will damage the UK for decades, the second will destroy what little democracy we have left.
June 5, 2019
Indeed I tend to think Boris is the only hope, even then there are huge challenges as the daft lefty remainer Tory MP are āonly talking to themselvesā as JR put it. Perhaps on Thursday the penny will finally drop.
June 5, 2019
Caterpillar
Surely it is a treaty albeit by a different name.
June 5, 2019
Shirley
You should have stopped at “just get rid of”
June 5, 2019
Now we know the NHS is on the table in your post Brexit trade deal with the US, how much will the Tories sell it for? And who will ultimately profit? You can bet it wonāt be nurses, or doctors, or patients, or taxpayers. Hedge fund managers? Rich Tory donors? Perhaps.
20 years from now, do you think the public will view Tory NHS privatisation as fondly as they now view Tory privatisation of the railways, the water companies and power firms?
And when are Brexiteers going to be honest about Frankenstein foods? The US has made it clear that agriculture is a priority for them. They want to send in vast quantities of GM foods, hormone injected beef and chlorinated chicken. Are you going to bother to ask voters if they would be happy feeding their kids such freak foods which have done wonders for the health – and waistlines – of Americans.
Tory Brexiteers have some very hard conversations coming up on the doorsteps. Itāll be fun – but not for any of you.
June 5, 2019
For someone who tells us they are a very clever and successful business owner you fall for every piece of left wing propaganda going andy.
Maybe do a bit of research before you just repeat quotes from the Guardian and Independent?
June 6, 2019
Edward2, “Andy” is working on the living wage to a script. No business owner with a growing family could put in the hours he does on here. There are all sorts of clues – from “his” children who do not age; to the oddity where he must be middle aged yet unthinkingly calls himself “young”, to his inability to engage with quoted facts, to his declaration that he puts in but doesn’t take out yet has spent months in NHS care, etc, etc.
June 6, 2019
NickC
I know nothing about ‘Andy’ but there is one thing I’m certain about:
He wouldn’t waste his time making up a story about your supposed background.
Can’t you just stick to facts rather than compose idiotic imaginary scripts?
June 6, 2019
Margaret Howard, Too close to the bone? In fact Andy does spend much of his time telling us who we are (17.4m angry far right Tory pensioners), how impoverished we are, how poorly educated we are, and why we voted Leave. So, yes he does waste his time making up stories about our supposed backgrounds. Neither you nor Andy stick to the facts.
June 5, 2019
The NHS is not on the table re a deal. LISTEN to what President Trump said.
June 6, 2019
Ah, chlorinated foods and being forced to eat USA meat. Here’s me thinking we lived in a free world where we had the ability to choose what to buy and what to eat. We however don’t have a choice about the chlorinated water in our taps that is treated for health reasons. The NHS needs modernising, please note that your dream world in Europe has health care offering privatised medical treatment for most citizens with specific insurances wholly or partly paying treatment costs. None have the UK system.
June 5, 2019
As somebody who vacillated between refusing and allowing Theresa May her deal I would not automatically condemn an MP who held his nose and voted for it on the third time of asking, under the intensifying duress of being threatened with no Brexit at all.
June 5, 2019
You think that illustrated a strength of judgement? Those numbers merely encouraged May to try again, before she was told enough was enough. I’d hesitate before voting for anyone who touched that WA with a bargepole.
We are better off where we are than had that passed.
June 5, 2019
I would agree if the MPs concerned made official announcements in the media that in fact that was their position and they apologise for the “wobble”. JRM needs to take note of this and come out from behind his book.
June 5, 2019
I still don’t understand how May could threaten BO Brexit. She could not overturn the referendum without a re-run.
I’m sure most of the ERG would have brought the government down with a VONC.
June 5, 2019
So you will happily lose your freedom in the hope that your enslavers might sell it back to you ?
June 5, 2019
Don’t be so stupid.
June 6, 2019
Denis Cooper, Neither do I condemn an MP who “held his nose and voted for it on the third time of asking, under the [threat of] … no Brexit at all”.
June 5, 2019
Members of the HoC have been found to be largely unfit for purpose. A collection of headless chickens.
Donald Trump was generous in the extreme to May in letting her get away with her mental delusion that she had produced an acceptable means of exiting the EU. We are now all aware that she and her advisors orchestrated the toxic WA for the sole purpose of keeping us shackled to the EU in a comatose state unable to influence our position as their cash cow.
There are two steps at which the conservative party in the HoC can ensure their absolute demise. The first through their own misguided actions would be to exclude Boris Johnson from their chosen pair. The second would be for the elected PM to hesitate in removing us from the EU by even bothering to listen to his party in the Commons. All he would get from them is a cacophony of speaking over speaking over speaking such as the chattering classes give us on Politics Live.
It is established that there are two ways out of the EU. Leave on WTO terms without a deal, leave on WTO terms with a FTA in discussion while Art 24 of GATT prevents any change in current trading terms until the FTA is agreed. The choice is stark and simple for the EU. They would have to decide where self interest lay.
I want this done in the recess, out of the way before the annual conference. The latter can then be a forum for mapping out the future direction of Conservatism.
June 6, 2019
Posted at 06.19. Now a day later 187 moderated and this not. One begins to despair of giving you good advice and having it ignored. However as 17.4 million have had their advice ignored by the dusfunctional gathering to which you belong I should not be surprised.
June 6, 2019
Agricola – you might want to try and modify your arrogance, which diminishes the value of your comments.
Just saying.
June 5, 2019
JR: Theresa May did this, that, or something else.
Is she still in Downing Street? If so WHY?
You had a deputy prime minister post for Hestletine, Clegg, but when we need one, the political class doesn’t seem to be able to find one.
I conclude the holders of the Deputy Prime minister post were just leeching off the system and the British Tax payer. They should be instructed to repay their salary for that post.
June 5, 2019
You want that Liddington running the country?????
Give me strength!
June 5, 2019
She should be in Downing St for the third electoral disaster she has engendered.
June 5, 2019
There is a de facto deputy PM (Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster): David Lidington.
Be grateful, very very grateful, that Mrs May did not hand over to him the other day.
June 9, 2019
sm: “There is a de facto deputy PM (Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster): David Lidington.”
I presume the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster is the dpm?
Then, WTF did we employ Hestletine & Clegg for the role?
Sir Joe Soap: “You want that Liddington running the country?????”
Perhaps the better question is why does the Tory party promote such duds? ( I take your word that he is such) .
June 5, 2019
JR rightly opines that anyone who stayed in the government and argued for the Withdrawal Agreement could not be considered as able to deliver a clean Brexit. That seems to narrow the field to just BoJo, who provides pizzaz, and Raab who appears more reliable and of sterner stuff.
However the dominant Remain makeup within the Tory MP ranks must surely indicate one or more Remainers in the finally selected two, realistically Gove &/or Hunt.
So, barring an outsider, it seems we need to āpermā any two from four: Johnson, Raab, Gove, Hunt.
Please preserve us from either of the last two.
June 5, 2019
But ‘Bojo’ and Mr Raab both voted for the WA (though I’m not sure how much they ”argued” for it). As did all the other hopefuls.
So doesn’t that narrow the field even more?
June 5, 2019
Duyfken.
Definitely not the last two,
June 5, 2019
Am I not right in thinking it is parliament that selects the final two candidates? If this is so you can guarantee that it will be Gove and Hunt. Unless Boris can slip in unseen.
June 5, 2019
didnt both Raab and Johnson vote for MV3? , it dosnt endear them to me.
June 5, 2019
The idea that the Conservatives will be OK at the next general election with the first past the post system is totally misguided. The FPTP system benefits parties with the largest support and the Conservatives came fifth.
Cameron only just scraped an overall majority when UKIP faded away in 2015. If Brexit have any significant support at the next general election (as they surely will have) then the Conservatives have no real chance of winning. Unless they both deliver Brexit and do some deal with the Brexit party.
June 5, 2019
As usual John your summation of the situation on Parliament this morning is absolutely correct.
Indeed so bad has Parliament got, I think it is time we had some written rules for our so called constitution.
We have an ……… Speaker who seems to be acting like some sort of (controller Ed), interpreting situations for the benefit of his own views, imposing them on everyone else, and who seems to be able to set his own exit date and indeed the terms of it.
We have a Prime Minister, if reports are correct, who appears to have totally exceeded their remit, without cabinet approval, and who has cost the taxpayer Ā£Billions, as well as humiliating us in front of the World.
We have Cabinet Ministers who appear to be frighted to speak up to express their view, and we have Mp’s who refuse to listen to the people and their constituents, and now seem to want to change sides and Parties without being willing to re stand in their new guise at a by election.
In short we look, and are acting like a Nation in absolute chaos, because those who have been entrusted with some power, are totally misusing it !
At the moment Parliament is unfit for purpose because of those who inhabit it.
June 5, 2019
Thank you, Sir John, for your honest and incisive appraisal. It’s good to read that at least you get it!
I sense the US President’s visit has had a salutary impact on this pitiable scene. He seems to have brilliantly outflanked the enemy on every hand, and emboldened those standing for truth. Goliath has been lured into the open, and his pernicious hold on vividly portrayed. Who will now wield the sling, and cut off his head with his own sword?
Whilst the die hard stumble on, many in the ranks are aghast, as the blood of D-day cries out against us. Yet for the fathers’ sake God sets before us a path of mercy, from what is otherwise one of eternal ignominy. Which shall we now choose?
Above all, watch out for great David’s greater Son… (1 Samuel 17; Psalm 2).
June 5, 2019
Mr Redwood, I agree with your comments but do not see how a ā no dealā Brexit can be accomplished. The wreckers in parliament are still there and still donāt get democracy. They still believe that the electorate is stupid and that they have the wisdom to correct the error of our ways. They also have the assistance of an unspeakable Speaker. How can a new PM get a WTO deal past an undemocratic Commons?
June 5, 2019
Especially as her extension deal specifically states no renegotiation on the withdrawal agreement until 31.10.19. Please let me know when she’s selling her house as she will take take no deal off the table and I’ll get it for a song!!
June 5, 2019
WTO, or rather leaving the EU, has been legislated for, it’s on the statute books , so it’s not a matter of voting for it, it’s a question of can they stop it. As long as the Government doesn’t propose any legislation that the Remainers can amend to outlaw Brexit, and the Executive refuses to enact any Parliamentary made law, which is their right, then the only way they can stop Brexit is if Conservative MPs vote down their Government in a vote of confidence , and vote for an election. Whether we get Brexit or not is really a matter of Prime Ministerial will.
June 5, 2019
a very good question. It seems to me to require an enormous number of Tory MPs to wake up and support a clear Leaver NOW candidate for PM. The alternative is to willingly accept a major collapse in Conservative support at the next GE, so much so that they will only have any power if asked to join a coalition, maybe a flexed ‘confidence and supply’. Others might be rather more harsh and refer to the time sitting MPs refused to give an apology and condemned themselves to being unemployed.
June 5, 2019
Dr Jenkins, the answer lies in the hands of the voters in the constituencies of these dreadful, undemocratic remainer MPs. They have the power to make or break these MPs and must now use it. They must put their MPs on warning that if they do not now accept a full Brexit, they will be deselected.
June 5, 2019
Constituents voted No Confidence in Philip Lee, Bracknell, the other day. He didn’t bother to turn up to the meeting apparently.
June 5, 2019
I don’t see why the new PM would need to get a WTO deal past the commons .. if he/she goes to the eu and offers a FTA it’s then up to the eurocrats. If they say no way then that is reported to the commons .. i.e. the eu have forced the uk to leave on WTO terms. But it won’t happen, the eurocrats will bend under the pressure of european business who will demand continuation of their export market.
June 5, 2019
In the EU elections of 2014 UKIP got 27 % , they kept 3% this time . So 24 % per cent of BXPās vote (30%) came from UKIP and 6% from elsewhere(presumably the Conservatives)
In the 2014 EU elections, the Tories got 24 % of the vote, 15% higher than this time .
If the 6% was lost to Nigel then 9 % was lost elsewhere, probably to the Liberals.
Do the maths -The Conservative Party losing its last remain votes a larger number than Brexit votes.
PS
In the 2015 general election, appx 40 per cent of Conservative voters, around 4.4m people, voted for remain. Those left may well oppose No Deal.
June 5, 2019
Hmm.
How many of the 63% abstainers were ex Tory ? With art 50 still active.
We know that virtually none followed Soubry.
June 5, 2019
The Tories have massively overestimated how many votes they will lose to Farage.
And they have massively underestimated how many they will lose to the Lib Dems.
June 6, 2019
Then let people vote LibDem.
Why have two LibDem parties ?
What is absolutely certain is that the Tory Party will perish if it continues following LibDem policies.
And as I pointed out to Newmania. We have a very clear indication of Tory supporters who want to indicate that they are Tory supporters protesting about leaving the EU. They’re the one’s that voted for Anna Soubry’s CHUK, but not even all of those.
I expect she’ll still be the Tory voice on Brexit on Sky, BBC etc.
June 5, 2019
The Remainers talk a lot about cliff edge, but the only cliff edge they are facing is their own electoral cliff edge. The Conservative MPs have one remaining chance to get this right in this leadership election , screw up this time and they are history. Deliver Brexit on the 31st Oct or don’t bother coming back to ask for our votes again. The Remainers in the Government , like Hammond, Gauke, Clark, Perry who got May to take No Deal off the table have to ask themselves are they going obstruct Brexit again? If so they will have delivered No 10 to a Marxist, and rather than their unwarranted fears of Brexit making us poorer, they would have played their role in bankrupting our country by delivering it up to Corbyn.
June 5, 2019
So Change UK is falling apart already. What on earth made these silly dopes think there was room for yet another left wing, big government knows best, pro EU party? We already had the Libdims, Labour, Mayās fake Conservatives, SNP and Plaid Cymru already.
Perhaps the mad Soubry and the rest will now do the decent thing and hold some by elections – but they clearly wonāt.
June 5, 2019
Goodness me and look what a large majority those terrible remainy Parties are.
June 6, 2019
We’ll take half the Tory vote, half the Labour vote and ALL of the 63% who stayed at home with article 50 doing its work.
June 5, 2019
Duyfken.
Definitely not the last two,
June 5, 2019
Lifelogic
Do the decent thing?
They don’t understand the meaning of the word.
June 5, 2019
A majority of the current Parliament are working on delaying Brexit until the next GE is forced upon them in the hope that there will be some event, planned or unforeseen, to reduce the popularity of Brexit.
In the meantime they, with the Civil Service, the quangos, the educational establishment, the BBC, the BoE, the CBI (whoever they represent because they do not publish a list of members or from whom they receive their funding) etc. will be pushing hard with project fear and running down the country in the hope of producing a recession that they can blame on Brexit.
June 5, 2019
Indeed and of course most of the legal profession and judiciary, who benefit so much from the endless increased complexity, endless changes in the laws and multi-level and often conflicting courts.
Not the rule of law but largely the rule of unelected anti-democratic lawyers.
June 5, 2019
It’s not that they don’t get its, so much as, they don’t believe any repercussions will be inflicted on them….
It’s not that they do not understand how badly their efforts to keep us shackled to the EU will be for the UK, for they are so in love with the EU, so convinced that its acceptable to betray their own people for what they see as ‘the future’, that they can easily justify the pain they cause short term.
This is the type of delusion the EU creates in people – The EU believes the dogma they dish out, and so do the followers of this Statrek style nightmare.
June 5, 2019
They do not believe that we have the right of consent
June 5, 2019
Well said, Bryan.
“…ACCEPTABLE to BETRAY their own PEOPLE” puts it in a nutshell!
June 5, 2019
Also Bryan, I think your observations should be recast into the definitive question that ought always to be put to remainers, particularly of the HoC variety:
“Why in a supposed Democracy, do you believe it is ACCEPTABLE to BETRAY your OWN PEOPLE?”
June 6, 2019
Good question Doug – Perhaps we should all be asking that of our MP’s
June 5, 2019
Good morning Sir John
Itās a constant surprise to most of us as you as they say āGet Itā that the majority of Parliament are so out of touch they seem to believe the problem is with others not themselves.
The conclusion would therefore be our system of government is totally un-repairable and broken so much so that against my instincts and better judgement we need a General Election now. Only then will those refusing to serve up the will of the people may āGet Itā.
There are so many Remain MPās in Leave constituencies that have majorities in the low hundreds who then would then be out a job. I doubt even then they would believe they were the problem.
Even amongst the Conservative Leadership hopefuls they are still asking for a deal with the EU, renegotiate a treaty that can not be renegotiated! ā what are they on.
Hammond has done his best to keep up project fear with the concept of damage to the UK economy. Without explaining what form that might take. Is the UK economy just about the EU of course not. Most of the UK economy is our own internal market, with great industrious people being held back and carrying a cost burden because of our membership of the EU. So it is the EU that is damaging the economy, it needs setting free.
The people voted for a āClean Breakā from the EU nothing else. Itās the UK Parliament that has tried to contrive alternatives and they need punishing for it.
June 5, 2019
This shambles has proven what many outside the Westminster bubble have known for years, they do not hear the voice of their electorate while living inside an echo chamber of like minded disconnected peers.
The silver lining to this cloud is the electorate have woken up and these perfidious MP’s have had their day.
I’m looking forward to the next General Election.
June 5, 2019
Gary C
Quite right. Citizens eyes have been well and truly opened by the Political class’s abominable self-serving shenanigans?
This political epoch stems from pulling back layers upon layers of egomaniacal political deceit, which has been foisted upon UK citizens over generations; due in large part to the disgraceful anti-Brexit (anti-citizen democracy) debacle!
June 5, 2019
me too Gary C , I want the satisfaction of kicking them out , those self serving MPs . Ive run out of negative adjectives to describe them , I watched with horror and disbelief every falsehood and treacherous move on BBC Parliament.
Save for a few good people like Sir JR (thank you Sir ) and the wonderful Sir Bill Cash and others who never faltered , I have nothing but contempt . My rage has only abated somewhat as I now have an alternative party to vote for.
June 5, 2019
Well said John Redwood but without a clean sweep of the House of Commons and their leader John Bercow, we can’t do it until we have enough Genuine Brexit MPs to do it but if it takes three years so be it, but the boiling anger at the dis ideal of true democracy will not go away.
June 5, 2019
Maybe it’s because you run this blog but you seem to be one of the few MPs that really gets the feelings of the country away from the Westminster bubble. I felt embarrasment at how many of our elected officials and the media treated Trump. He’s doing what a leader should do which is putting his people first. There is only one option for the Conservative Party to survive and that’s to get us out of the EU cleanly and quickly then make a success of it. I do think that until your party clears out the depressing Remainer MPs this won’t be possible. We still need the Brexit Party to do this job. They are the only ones who can take the Labour leave vote. Peterborough will be of great interest.
June 6, 2019
Christine, I couldn’t agree more with this opening statement of yours:
“Maybe itās because you run this blog but you seem to be one of the few MPs that really gets the feelings of the country away from the Westminster bubble..”
I think it is precisely because Sir John has expended huge time and energy on this blog and has been prepared to engage with people (and deal very fairly with criticisms or worse) that he is very clued up indeed. He always has seemed to be principled, but when you combine principles with real awareness and knowledge of the electorate, and throw in a good dose of common sense, then you have a winning combination. Thank you, Sir John.
June 5, 2019
The 2017 snap election prevented us from having a general election
one year after Brexit was betrayed – an election which could have focused
most MPs’ attention on 29th March this year. Also, UKIP had only one
member of Parliament returned in 2015, in spite of their success the previous
year in the EU Parliamentary elections.
Returning a Brexit Party MP for Peterborough tomorrow is the first step in
overhauling Westminster. The goal now is not to shake MPs’ complacency,
but simply to get rid of them at every opportunity. They have three years
in which to cause a lot of damage, should they feel so inclined before the
next general election. If anything, however, the energy for Brexit has increased
since 2016. After the referendum, MPs probabiy thought we would withdraw to
our regularly scheduled television programming. They were wrong then, and
now, little by little, they are going to find out by how much.
June 5, 2019
The new leader then needs to move rapidly to using the new freedoms, the extra money
The freedom to be unemployed , the freedom to have services cut, the freedom to dump a load of debt onto our children to disguise the grim reality of No Deal Brexit disaster ?
On the plus side I think we get blue passports, apples sold by the pound and an opportunity to travel to Frankfurt Paris and Dublin where our jobs will now be
June 5, 2019
Since it’s going to be official policy when the new PM is in place to take a running jump at the cliff edge I think the Leave side needs to focus much more on explaining the consequences. I know it’s repetitive, but if we get to mid-Oct and the public still believe project fear it most likely won’t happen. Eg Ken Clarke on Today the other day said WTO brexit means immediate tariffs on all exports to the EU, and UK pharmaceutical products will not be approved for sale in the EU. Leave are not doing enough to counter such claims in detail.
This also of course means that if the EU see project fear is running it’s course they know parliament will block no Deal and so have no incentive to change anything in the WA.
To me it still feels like we’re heading for a new referendum as a condition of extension after parliament & maybe also a new PM balk at WTO brexit on 31 oct
June 5, 2019
Sir Jr,
Good analysis of the state of the state of the two main parties.
However, I am not sure about your economic predictions, as we still need to make deal with the EU, to have any more money on the bottom line.
June 5, 2019
Do we know which leadership candidates are against trade and for protectionism?
We know Mr Stewart is for protectionism and against reducing food prices given his comments against beef from S. America and wheat from N. America. We can suspect Mr Hancock is also for protectionism being against USA health provision – presumably not wanting competitive delivery to drive improvements in healthcare.
June 5, 2019
Sir John, you state that May lost the trust of the electorate for delaying Brexit. No, the principal reason was her WA, which represented a vassal state sell out – complete capitulation according to Charles Moore. She betrayed Brexit, the electorate, and the country by trying to fob them off with something that was not Brexit. What is more, her MPs kept supporting her on this. This is why the PM and the Cons Party are toast
June 5, 2019
“…You would have thought this would wake up all those MPs who promised Brexit and then spent the next two years trying to dilute or delay it, or even to reverse it. ”
Like Mr Gove!
June 5, 2019
Yes I think there is a feeling in the Conservative Party that if they hang on in there for long enough the public will become bored of Brexit and lose interest. Some people have expressed those views already. But when Boris Johnson talks of tinkering with the Brady amendment and nothing else relating to the wretched WA I think we are all in trouble. If he or anyone else considers that enough to get Brexit done and dusted we will feel just as much betrayal. We have to be bold and start again.
June 5, 2019
Almost worth voting for a remainer Tory PM.
Then Con,Lib,Lab are all fighting over 48%.
UKIP is dead, so TBP pick up their votes.
Libs lose lots of votes because EU nationals can’t vote in a GE.
That would give TBP a super majority and the deal is cancel.
Easy to cancel. Court case that the government doesn’t fight that the extension was illegal. We then surcharge existing MPs. Or we have a spending bill and refuse to fund it. That also kills off rejoining as 80 bn a year in costs won’t get passed a ‘plebs vote’
June 5, 2019
The 75th anniversary of D-Day should be a salutary reminder to our political representatives that their primary task is the protection of our freedoms.
June 5, 2019
Agreed the WA is not brexit, worse still its six months on and attitudes have hardened with the brexit parties success. Any conservative leader who tries to implement a modified version of it and live with its real restrictions until the next election will be in for a shock.
The public want us out, we hear president Trump wants a free trade treaty, the USA is our biggest trading partner.
A route to success would be a WTO brexit, money set aside from that which would have supported the withdrawal agreement to cover companies who need to reconfigure due to EU tariffs and then win a large number of FTA’s worldwide.
Lower taxes and less regulation will do the rest, we should use the excuse too of an American free trade agreement to open up the NHS and get rid of many quango’s, less government here is very healthy.
I have heard Boris here talking about modifying the withdrawal agreement, it would need vast editing that the EU will refuse, WTO deal going straight to a US deal (along with Australia, New Zealand and Canada) is what we need, then let the EU decide between its survival or protecting its member states market share in the UK.
That is the trolls choice, die fast or die slow, but it isn’t our problem, in the end a Europe free of the EU will be a more prosperous place.
June 5, 2019
One Nation politics. An exercise in political avoidance. It is an admission of surrender to a form of politics that’s destroyed this nation, its culture and its values of freedom, liberty and individualism. Boris Johnson can go and jump in the Thames. The last thing we need is another Heath. We need another Thatcher who stands up, recognises the deep seated problems, confronts them and then solves them. We don’t need Johnson’s rhetoric and warm, fuzzy words
June 5, 2019
Agreed, Dominic. Boris Johnson is way behind the times, and he does not seem to realise it. He thinks he can rely on his former appeal, wit, and London Mayor record to see him through. The problem is that the electorate is now very savvy, and wise to the deceit of politicians. They have decided enough is enough, and they have an alternative now, The Brexit Party. They want no spin, but simply clear speaking. If there is any hint of double talk or fudge from a politician, (which is apparently what Boris is doing) then woe betide him/her. The electorate is not in a forgiving mood. Very much the opposite.
June 5, 2019
” This Parliament went to war with the people when it decided to delay Brexit. ” Should there be the word “openly” between went – and – to ? Different govts have always treated the majority of voters with utter contempt. They just kept it quiet. They wanted a vote – nothing else. Here to be taxed – and talked to at election times. Full Stop.
June 5, 2019
Well done Sir John, at least you get it. I would challenge this: “has to deliver a clean Brexit as soon as possible” – No! As soon as possible – but the latest 31.10.19.
Anything beyond and even you, a true-bred Brexiteer will be in danger at the G.E. which would inevitably be precipitated.
BTW, what did May commit us to in order to receive the latest extension? LotsofMoney obviously, but also a security pact with the EU ??
June 5, 2019
I am wondering about the timing of the hustings. Did they have to have them then?
June 5, 2019
Another article which overlooks a fundamental point, which is that there are multiple forms of Brexit and there is no agreement by those who argued for and voted to leave on which form is preferable. While the 2017 Conservative and Labour manifestos talked about delivering Brexit, they certainly did not agree on how.
Michel Barnier published a simple slide on this back in 2017 (available on the internet for anyone to view). There are 6 “steps” and the UK can choose any which one, the 6 being Norway, Switzerland, Ukraine, Turkey, Canada and Mauritania.
While we still have leave supporters like Dan Hannan arguring the case for being like Norway (EFTA/EEA) while John Redwood argues the case for being like Mauritania (WTO), is it any wonder the whole thing is an utter shambles.
June 5, 2019
Leave never told us what Leave means. They still canāt
June 5, 2019
Penny ….Are you used to using a dictionary? No? Well open it carefully near the first pages. Turn a chunk at a time until you find L at the top, and all the printed words begin with L. Slowly turn pages until you find LE – lots of words begin with LE. If you work slowly you will eventually find the word Leave. Read the meaning slowly and with luck you might be able to digest what it says and understand. Good luck!
June 5, 2019
Oh dear Penny another one like Andy that can’t understand what they have been reading. Try going back to Janet and John books.
June 5, 2019
Spot on. Three years on I have yet to speak to a Brexiteer who gets it.
June 6, 2019
What you mean is you have yet to convince a leave voter that your view on the EU is rational.
June 5, 2019
Mr Redwood, in a couple of years parties will be judged on what they did to minimize the damage from brexit, either bij having useful arrangements with the EU to replace present ones or by having agreements with third parties as valuable as the ones currently in place. Of course this leaves out the effects of successful spin to cover up failure.
June 5, 2019
You are totally correct they just don’t get it, complete Denial
The conservatives are now fighting for survival and they don’t know it
The Chancellor must go people want vision and change
We need someone who will stand and fight for our identity and values
June 5, 2019
Most MPs are in denial about Brexit and need reminding how vulnerable they are daily until Well overdue Brexit occurs.
They are like detached driftwood hoping for Brussels to rescue them. Some chance!
Having lost credibility they will panic for excuses after Peterborough.
June 5, 2019
“…many Remain voters thought the Agreement worse than staying in”.
Many Leave voters too.
If we stayed in we could leave; the WA is eternal subjugation with no route to leave, even under international law. Which is why anyone starting from there would be wrong.
It is certainly true that anyone who has remained in Cabinet is tainted as untrustworthy. I’m not sure I even trust Boris to be honest.
I would add to your thoughts in the article. If the Conservative MPs believe that slapping a Brexit sticker on any old thing and saying ‘job done’ will work, it won’t. People have never been more engaged in politics before, you are now dealing with a very knowledgeable electorate who will not be easily fobbed off with a fudge.
That said, to get past the MPs leadership candidates may need to show some degree of cunning. Showing some attempt to renegotiate the backstop while adding in another 150 or so ‘minor points’ (which are actually rater major ones) and ultimately failing… then WTO, refuse royal consent when they try to take control, prorogue if necessary etc may be the way this has to be delivered.
Basically, do what May did – as at 29/3 she was perfectly placed to say “Nope. Tried my best but they won’t budge. WTO it has to be, that’s what I promised”.
Underhanded? Maybe – but definitely fighting fore with fire in view of the disgraceful behaviour of Grieve, Letwin and co. Who, if anyone, do we trust to do this as and when it becomes necessary?
June 5, 2019
Mrs Ed Miliband. High Court judge. The living embodiment of Labour’s client state
The Judiciary should be impartial, objective and apolitical. It is no longer fulfilling these fundamental requirements.
Mrs Miliband is a feminist, a political animal and a Remain supporter
New Labour came to power in 1997 and completely infected the State and the public sector. What did the Tories? They did NOTHING to stop it and we are now in a situation where Miliband and others like her are able to block Brexit by a multiple of means
This is why Johnson’s One Nation tosh is just that, tosh.
Dismantling of Labour’s client state is fundamental to turning this country in a decent, moral, depoliticised nation once more
June 5, 2019
What a ridiculous post. She is perfectly entitled to do a job. She is perfectly entitled to marry who she chooses.
And you have no evidence that her personal life in any way impacts her job.
June 6, 2019
Andy
Blair’s missus was a legal bod as well. Politicians should not have spouses in the legal profession – they simply cannot be trusted.
“And you have no evidence that her personal life….”
That’s the point, their positions make it impossible to detect collusion. So, too risky.
June 6, 2019
Dominic
Fully agree with your post. I think we’ll find that the labour client state will not go away because we ask nicely. Other means will be necessary.
June 5, 2019
I found the supplementary polling assuming different PMs that Lord Bell had YouGov do on their poll that had the Lib Dems as the top party of interest. Putting the results through Electoral Calculus I found that the Conservatives would get
333 seats with Boris Johnson
232 seats with Sajid Javid (Lab 238 LD 62 SNP 56)
175 seats with Michael Gove (Lab 262 LD 78)
196 seats with Jeremy Hunt (Lab 238 LD 65 SNP 55)
278 seats with Dominic Raab (Lab 236 LD 48 SNP 56)
110 seats with May (Lab 202 LD 119 SNP 55)
June 5, 2019
Sir John, you probably know that at least one of the candidates has said clearly that Bercow can and will find an imaginative way of stopping ‘no deal’. Do you agree? If so, what can be done to deal with this threat before the nation gets confronted with a stalemate in parliament like the last time?
June 6, 2019
JiminyJim
“Sir John, you probably know that at least one of the candidates has said clearly that Bercow can and will find an imaginative way of stopping āno dealā”
Read the news, Jim. Traitor Bercow has already done just that.
The man’s a cheap bent ref, in my opinion.
June 5, 2019
I see Mrs Ed Miliband is Boris’s High Court Judge. Have they no shame?
June 5, 2019
To leave without a deal will be like a car crash..borders will close..lights will go out in the channel ports and we will be left with trying to get something off the ground with the Americans..but we don’t have a merchant navy anymore nor do the Americans so we will be left with the chance to charter suitable ocean going ships, largely owned in EU countries, denmark, germany the netherlands and France..and this for an island nation of 65 million..mind boggling?
June 6, 2019
Oh my God……we’d better capitulate then !
June 5, 2019
John, Living a few miles from Wokingham I just wish we had you as our MP and not Theresa May. She is an embarrassment, People like you, Mark, Priti and Steve understand the damage done. Unfortunately I have no faith in Boris or any other standing in the leadership race. We need an ERG member like Steve to take this forward. His paper A CLEAN MANAGED BREXIT needs to be followed by the net PM.
June 5, 2019
This article by Katy Balls on Coffeehouse reporting on the first night hustings by the One Nation Tory group (Amber Rudd and Nicky Morgan key movers) for leadership contenders tells you all you need to know about how the majority of these Cons MPs have still not got the message, and they are apparently adamant that they would not work with Farage, and they would resist a pull to the right, they would reject No Deal Brexit and they would put climate change on a par with terrorism….Oh dear. Beyond hope in my mind.
Worth reading the Comments section.
Boris, Javid, Leadsom and Stewart last night faced the One Nation Caucus. Tonight Matt Hancock, Jeremy Hunt, Michael Gove and Dominic Raab.
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/06/inside-the-one-nation-tory-leadership-hustings/
June 5, 2019
I have just watched the odious Emily Maitlis and the interviewer at those hustings, gossiping and sneering about what a disaster Raab was because he wouldn’t rule out co-operating with Farage, wouldn’t rule out proroguing Parliament to ensure Brexit, and wouldn’t admit to being a feminist. They said he could have been in a different party! They really thought they were damning him beyond recall.
June 6, 2019
” they would not work with Farage”
Honestly, you have to laugh at the sheer hubris.
They won’t be given the opportunity to work at all, if the people have any say in the next election.
June 5, 2019
Sir John, I need not tell you – as you must know it yourself – that only by replacing wholesale about 200 of the current crop of Tory MPs with a new lot who are firmly pro-Conservative, pro-Brexit, pro-UK future, pro-capitalist, pro-family, and untainted by self-serving political cowardice, will the Tories survive.
But then, a quick read of the 1972 Hansards has made me wonder if during the 1972 EEC debates you might well have even then looked round the House and thought something similar.
June 5, 2019
Yes, I reckon it is about 200 too. The ones who kept her in.
June 5, 2019
Michael Gove want a long delay, Jeremy Hunt thinks he can get a better deal. The worse case would be if the choice was between these two as I think both still think they can avoid leaving with no deal. That choice would mean the MPs have learned nothing and would put their futures at risk.
June 6, 2019
Unless a leader has the guts to go firmly for no deal and not allow Brussels to deliberately waste his time with pretend discussions about their Versailles 2.0 Treaty, there is no chance of brexit. Once we are out, everything will change.
I see now Johnson too is saying that a no-deal exit will be difficult and bring ‘some disruption’.
We want government to govern, for God’s sake, not to keep telling us how difficult it all is. If an orchestra has to play Mahler’s Sixth, they learn the damn’ thing, they go through it non-stop for hours, days, rehearse with the orchestra. The conductor doesn’t turn round and tell the audience ‘Actually, this is quite a difficult piece, and there may be some disruption.’
June 5, 2019
It is bewildering, nay “Mind blowing” that yesterday, during their Press Conference, Mrs May told the President, in answer to his suggestion that she stay on as PM, she actually said she was a woman of her word. I did not know whether to laugh or to scream! Instead I shouted at my PC Monitor, “What about ‘Brexit means Brexit’, ‘No deal is better than a bad deal’ and ‘We will leave the EU on March 29th 2019’ and lately, ‘There will be no second referendum’? I am sure many will remember the diabolical U-Turning on those, her “Promises”.
Surely, after the pounding the Conservatives have had in the Local and the EU Elections and their dire standing in the public Opinion Polls, ANYONE who thinks they can now run the Country would instantly take it all on board and immediately change tact to one which would satisfy the 2016 Referendum decision of the people. Especially those who have been at Mrs May’s side during all of this debacle!
Hmm! So why do Messrs Hunt and Gove now propose to EXTEND the 31st October cut off date? What have they missed? Are they wearing blindfolds? Are they really fit to govern us? Do the Tory Party wish to maintain a presence in Parliament or not? Such madness is to ensure Tory Party genocide.
Having said that, I am also concerned that Mr Johnson, the front runner, turned down a one to one with Mr Trump which could have been seen as an insult to our greatest ally and our future major World Export Market. Hustings is hardly a good dodge, is it? So what was the real reason, Boris?
So! It now occurs to me that the Conservative Party will require an experienced member of the ERG to stand now, to ensure that the 17.4 Millions who voted to leave the EU WILL actually get what they asked for and what the majority voted for in a democratic National Referendum where the winners take the prize. FREEDOM!
June 5, 2019
One thing is for sure; If the new PM does not deliver the the Conservative party are done for. You have one chance to get this right now and most of those running for PM are not even thinking of trying. Most would be back in the position of May within days. I suspect Johnson has not thought his plan through ruling out the perogue of parliament or to consider calling a GE. No one has said they will make delivering Brexit a confidence matter and deselect MPs who refuse to deliver Brexit without an expensive permission slip from Brussels.
June 5, 2019
It may be useful to look at the Conservative government in Canada which was virtually wiped out in the 1993 election and never really recovered. It looks as though they have had to merge with other parties to survive in any useful form.
A brief look on the web suggests that they were generally unpopular at the time and a new leader had to take over at this stage, but their unpopularity coincided with the emergence with new parties that were competing for their core supporters!
June 5, 2019
The people I speak to, hundreds in the last few weeks, do not single out Mrs May. Complicit in all is the whole of parliament, the senior civil service and the media. A change in leader will have a job to do to convince them that any exit is not a fudge. The suspicion is that it will be followed by a sneaking back.
The job is to get us out and reform those institutions and fly the flag for Britain. And that job will make the labours of Hercules look like a walk in the park.
June 5, 2019
Bookies no longer taking bets on Farageās party winning in Peterborough. What else will it take to get through to your party members John? Canāt they see theyāre committing political suicide? Why donāt they listen?
June 5, 2019
Boris and virtue signalling? Yes I want clean air and water, but these proposals are not based on sound science, and will simply bankrupt the country, in my view.
@BorisJohnson
“Today is #WorldEnvironmentDay and a pivotal moment for our planet, our climate, our wildlife. A government I lead would win our bid to host COP 2020, legislate for net zero emissions by 2050 & embrace the opportunity of green growth for the UK as a global decarbonisation leader”.
June 6, 2019
āŖ[No Statement Without A Reason] Create 10 reasons please why Brexit will benefit the UK. Each of the 10 statements must contain a reason or evidence. Then 10 reasons why Boris is best leader for party. Five reasons why Farage will benefit the Tory party. ā¬
June 6, 2019
I’m waiting for one reason why we should remain in the failing sclerotic undemocratic eurocracy.
June 6, 2019
JR
“Project Fear was wrong and that there is a good and prosperous future for us once out.”
A pity you can’t persuade your own party!
June 6, 2019
I’m waiting for one reason why we should remain in the failing sclerotic undemocratic eurocracy.
June 7, 2019
Wow! How can an elected MP be so rude and arrogant? At least have some respect for Theresa May – at least she has tried to get a deal which suits everyone. If it wasn’t for the right wing idiots in the Conservative party we would have already left the EU!
I think it should be the ERG who are apologising for being a pain in the backside and making noises but doing nothing to help. There is no ‘I’ in team and sadly we have some particularly selfish, arrogant and delusional politicians who haven’t got a clue about the real world. They are the problem and any new leader will have the same problem.
We do need change – we should remove the extreme far right and far left politicians and get back to the middle ground to work for everyone.
Reply Trying to get the verdict of 17.4 m people in a referendum implemented is not an “extreme right” policy!