We already have digital money. You and I have money held in a commercial bank which is just an electronic line in their accounts. We can use it to buy something, transferring our digital money to someone elseâs digital account electronically. We have a digital credit card which we can wave at a machine to pay. If we save money in a deposit account that too is digital. The banks do not keep all our monies in bank notes, just having enough till money to meet usual demands for physical cash with a margin.
Some people have created different digital tokens like Bitcoin. These do not fulfil the normal characteristics of money. You cannot use them to buy things. Most shops and websites decline bitcoin. They are not a store of value as a sound major state currency is, with wildly fluctuating values. They are not  a standard of measurement. Few quote  prices in bitcoin where many quote them in dollars or pounds.
There are things called stable coins which seek to link their value to a well known currency. Some achieve this, but there could in some cases be failures to do so. If they succeed what advantage do they have over holding  the currency itself?
The Bank of England and other leading central banks are thinking of issuing digital versions of their own currencies. Given the way commercial banks already do this I assume it means the  Central bank itself offering a current account to regular customers. This would be a big diversion  from their current functions and would not offer much that a commercial bank does not already offer.
People worry about the way the state could use a CB digital currency to increase surveillance over people and even control their money. I cannot see them making everyone have a CB account as the  Bank of England would not  want millions of small accounts. Existing digital money through commercial banks is already under plenty of surveillance to prevent crime and money laundering.
July 9, 2023
Indeed perhaps the BoE should concentrate on a currency that does not devalue by 9% PA. At that rate it will halve in less than 8 years.
When I went up to Cambridge (late 70s early 80s, Maths & Physics) my tax free student grant was ÂŁ1,100 plus in the holiday and with a bit of sponsorship I had I earned about another ÂŁ1,600 on top (this virtually all tax free). In those days you could also even claim unemployment benefit in the Easter, Christmas and Summer holidays if not working. Allowing for inflation this is would be about ÂŁ20,000 after tax today. It was enough for me to live comfortably, pay rent on a studio flat, run a car, go on a couple of holidays… My full time salary on leaving was about ÂŁ56K in real terms today.
Yet today full time Junior Doctors in their first jobs currently get about ÂŁ24,000 after tax, but many have student debts of ÂŁ150K & interest on it of circa ÂŁ10,000 PA. So after that they are getting 70% of what I had as a student 43 years back in real terms plus they have the ÂŁ150K of debt hanging over them and rents are far higher still than inflation.
We have had vast increases in technology and manufacturing efficiency and yet (per cap) so many people are far worse off in real terms after 43 years of “progress”. So why? Mainly the relentless growth in largely parasitic government, over regulation of everything, endless parasitic jobs in compliance and regulation, far too many lawyers, tax advisors, far too many benefit claimants living of the backs of others, absurdly complex and very high taxation, open door low skilled immigration…in short 43 years of appalling misgovernment.
Without this we should surely be at least 4 times better off just due to the vast technology efficiencies we have made.
July 9, 2023
Yes, FIAT currenices – whether in coin, paper or digital have been not been a good ‘Store of Wealth’ ever since the Gold Standard was abandoned. But Governments like inflation, it reduces/devalues their debt (as well as the currency) but when you let the Genie out of it’s bottle, it’s very hard to get it back in, as we are about to find out…
July 9, 2023
I am concerned not only that the BOE explains exactly why it think it needs to launch a digital currency, in the light of the facts as they stand described accurately by JR, but also about the proposed new Reserve currency backed by gold.
The only reason we need to waste time and money digging up gold then storing it underground is because politicians of the world refuse to manage honest money. They deliberately debase the money for their own amusement – many think they are becoming rich but actually those are the same people who donât understand Bonds or inflation. They have reverted to baby talk âcost-of-living-crisisâ.
So the value of gold is in inverse of political ability and honesty. So it looks as if the only way to control the idiot political class is to revert to Keynes proposal at Bretton Woods for a gold backed Reserve Currency.
This is the measure of the failure of the Tory Party. So âinclusiveâ that the only people excluded are capitalist conservatives. So xenophobic they prefer to do without oil and gas than face the terror of Russia, which they assure us is âjust a gas station with a country attached, a trifling economy, a hated President, a disorganised, useless, untrained, badly equipped militaryâ.
Hell, imagine the humiliation of NATO being defeated by such an outfit. Imagine the humiliation of the U.K. being party to deploying cluster bombs and shelling a Nuclear Power Station – with our world-leading Green Credentials!
July 11, 2023
Yes, absolutely right Lynn but I fear the temptation is too great for them to do anything else – in the short term it is an ‘easy out’ and Politicians these days have very little interest in longer term solutions because they will be someone else’s problem.
Waiting to see what the BRICs do at their meeting in August with regards a dollar alternative.
July 9, 2023
Good morning.
A Digital Currency would see the end to the Black Market. No more cash-in-hand.
It will also allow the State to gain unprecedented control over our lives. “Should you really be buying that bar of chocolate ? What with you being overweight and all. It will impacy on your NHS credit score and Social Tokens”
And so on.
No, let us not look to the CCP as an example on how to treat people.
July 9, 2023
Addendum.
And what happens if there is a power outage ? How are we going to pay for things then ?
July 9, 2023
Commerce exists where buyer and seller agree to exchange whatever they regard as value. Solomon Islands folk used shells to trade. British islanders can use whatever any group of them mutually agrees as working.
July 9, 2023
Indeed. Shells, tooled metal and so on were always fine as tokens of exchange. Cash/money tried to standardise and allowed government/rulers to take a slice, that’s all..
I smile at Sir J’s comment that “Sound major state cuurencies are a store of value”. True over the short term (days and weeks). A blatant falsehood over years and decades though.
If you want a store of value buy gold. An ounce would get you a nice toga in Roman times and a Savill Row suit today. There is inflation protection in action.
July 9, 2023
+1. And we need to cut the government out of every transaction. Itâs insatiable.
July 9, 2023
+++
Yes and when EVERYTHING is done via computer and we need masses of electricity for heat pumps and cars and cooking ( not that it will be affordable) and all we have are windmillsâŠâŠ
July 9, 2023
25.5GW of wind farm installation currently generating 3.1GW.
July 9, 2023
With the swipe of a barcode your purchase is identified as a gas boiler, your digital/online purchase is declined âŠ.youâre only allowed to buy a heat-pump âŠand probably only from a government authorised and sanctioned shop
July 9, 2023
Glen
That would not surprise me, likewise purchasing diesel in a garage, or food that contains too many calories.
It is the tip of the iceberg for total control.
July 9, 2023
The one thing that would save from this evil is to go back to barter!
My friends and I do it regularly as we have skills that others need!
The ingenuity of common man will always win!
July 9, 2023
You can’t barter with British Gas, or Council Tax or TV Licence
July 9, 2023
Stop watching the BBC – and stop paying the TV licence. I have not funded that crew for a decade!
And we donât miss them!
July 10, 2023
Do not have a TV as most programs are rubbish, as for the BBC- I do not like liars so they are out.
Low gas usage and council tax are not a problem. I buy from local farmers and only use local trades, most of whom will trade with prices.
July 9, 2023
Not if there’s a power outage but when
For the next several years we’re in dire straights with power supply so get used to sitting in the dark
And it’s fairly down to 13 years of miss rule by the anti business tory government.
July 9, 2023
Mark B : âAnd what happens if there is a power outage ? How are we going to pay for things then ?â
A very good point as Net Zero will inevitably, as intended, lead to perpetual rolling blackouts.
July 9, 2023
Or an internet outage, which is more common. Both will become more so, I sadly and confidently predict.
OFCOM has dictated that all the UK is to have the (very expensive) solution of fibre to the premises for its internet. Hence, from 2026 your ‘home phone’ won’t work during any significant power cut. Nor will your mobile – if you have a signal – work for more than 60 mins.
For the past 100 years, if you had a BT landline, and suffered a power cut, the phone would work for days. They’re powered from the exchange.
July 9, 2023
Mark B
That already happens with card payments. My wife was in the supermarket when the system went down. The two customers in front of her abandoned their shopping, but she had cash…….
July 9, 2023
One coin to rule them all
One coin to bind them
One coin to bring them all
And in the darkness bind them.
In the land of tokens where our Masters are.
Had this scheme been established before the chaos of the last few years, before we as a nation had lost our trust in the great offices of State and those sitting in those offices, the anonymous ‘they’ might have got away with it.
Now, even with a greatly expanded Nudge Unit and a supine Press, I doubt it.
JF
July 9, 2023
Well said.
July 9, 2023
Excellent
July 9, 2023
I agree fully with John on this topic, and with many of the comments here.
However, they’re a great distraction from this: A leading Tory Brexiter – George Eustice no less – calls on ministers to reopen the UKâs borders to tens of thousands of young workers from EU nations in order to tackle acute post-Brexit labour shortages that he says are driving up inflation.
They really are all over the place, aren’t they?
Reply Mr Eustice is no longer a Minister and is not standing for re election.
July 9, 2023
“Reply Mr Eustice is no longer a Minister and is not standing for re election”
Just as well….but I wonder how many in Government share his opinions?
July 9, 2023
Does not matter as they will not be in government long.
July 9, 2023
I think actually that the terrible power of The Ring was less awful than the prospect of this dreadful digital currency. Our lives will not be our own. The Shire will be just a faint dream.
We need a Frodo to save us!
July 9, 2023
Mark B. I saw a video clip from the WEF bunch, and the chap talking said that children can be introduced to currency, but obviously they would be unable to buy sweets with their quota of âmoney!â He also said that digital âmoneyâ would really âallow usâ (them) to control spending.
Id say with no uncertainty, digital currency from central banks is most certainly about us being controlled.
July 9, 2023
Sharon,
Correct. It is about yet more control. Itâs difficult to pay cash in lots of places already.
I feel like an impoverished student using a card for trifling sums.
July 9, 2023
What happens when the Banks refuse to let you have an account?
July 9, 2023
An excellent video by Dr John Campbell (just release) on the figures from the British Heart Foundation showing nearly 100,000 excess cardio vascular deaths since Covid started and the Vaccine rollouts (from official figures). Circa 500 a week or a Genville Tower death toll very day. Yet almost no government or MSM discussion of this disaster. Another one on the vast variations of vaccine adverse effects by vaccine batch numbers clearly different batches were very different products. Good coverage on GBNews (Neil Oliver) yesterday too. So long as you ignore the surely deluded Dr David Lloyd presumably there for “Balance” to keep Ofcom happy.
July 9, 2023
+++
And I see they are concentrating on how ill heat makes you feel.
Our unspeakable council put out a heat health check on its social media page.
If you are feeling unwell today it is probably the heat (along those lines anyway)
YesâŠall get indoors and stay there!
July 9, 2023
Yes Lifelogic , I watched that programme too, and doubted the intelligence of that gentleman!
July 9, 2023
They were carrying out a mass pharmaceutical experiment: it therefore stands to reason that they would have had variations on the concoction – to test the efficacy of different formulations.
July 9, 2023
Yes, he is very good.
July 9, 2023
Interesting post. Yes, I don’t see any use for a CBDC, other than to restrict its use once it’s been widely accepted, by the CB should it wish to do so. All currencies, other than gold and silver coins, are FIAT money, ie notional value based on confidence in the issuer alone, perhaps losing confidence in the current stuff is the reason.
Should the CB offer it, through an intermediary, and it replaces the one in circulation now, what use would banks be to the economy? All lending could be peer to peer, or from the CB. AI will no doubt decide who can have money and who shouldn’t.
Brave, and dangerous, New World indeed.
Barter will return…
July 9, 2023
+++
I hope it does.
I would have expected to see at this point a bit of door to door selling.
But nothing yet.
Too many benefits. Too dependent.
July 9, 2023
Cuibono
As I mentioned once before on hereâŠ.I spoke to an intelligent man who tends not to use cash, and he just assumed with digital currency, weâd just use our debit and credit cards and drop the cash.
Interestingly, the last time we met a week or two ago, he was using cash to pay!
July 9, 2023
Yes..what do they say?
Use it or lose it.
Cash = FREEDOM
July 9, 2023
Central Banks should focus on solving the problems they caused instead of creating new ones through increased thoughtlessness and lack of foresight.
July 9, 2023
They’re busy rebranding toilets and counting carbon footprint ….on instruction from the government
July 9, 2023
It does however appear that money is already being controlled for political reasons?
If you differ in opinion from the establishment your money can be withheld/taken.
Would digital somehow get the govt.s/bankers/whoever out of the hole they have been digging since pre 2008? I canât really se how unless they digitalised and then drastically reduced the value.
July 9, 2023
Are they going to force digital on us?
Silly question maybe?
July 9, 2023
The closing of physical banks has been a shameful and disgusting trick.
And so dreadfully typical of this country.
Get a population used to something, make it ( like cars, trains, banks, flying) a foundation stone of their lives..
And then bossily, sanctimoniously, cruelly withdraw it.
(Closing of banks was one good way of destroying the High Streets)
July 9, 2023
And!! It certainly is NOT green, we now have a twenty mile round trip to a bank! Thank you guys!
However, because of that we now draw out cash !
For convenience đ€đ»
July 9, 2023
MFD
You are lucky. Our round trip to a bank is 40 miles!
July 9, 2023
If I operated a bank Iâd have offered counter services to the other banks to rent and kept mine open with people able to give and explain loans/repayment schedules debt management, pension, mortgage, savings plans, financial advisors with rooms to rent. They however must be privy to what is coming, no cash just one conglomerate bank that controls us and âprotectsâ us from our own mismanagement. Ooops youâre spending too much on alcohol your card will now be restricted to just x purchases per week. Ooops too many sugars in your diet you can no longer till out barcodes with high levels of sugar. The next thing will be to legalise drugs and allow prostitution so they can arrange digital payment and then what people held to bribery and tax. But you know, why do you care theyâre not things you do so what does it matter. The EU told them in 2014 just how much they guessed the UK had added to our GDP and taxed us on it. There may be something you do though that you take for granted that will be retractable you know like travel or perhaps you buy an unhealthy amount of Coca Cola. Ai can read billions of items of digital notation a day GDPR canât save you from that.
July 9, 2023
Governments have lead the way in the decline of the high-street, continued business rates, limited/expensive parking, ULEZ/LTNs and the costs of energy & net-zero âŠ.every business, like the banks, that can afford to close is closing and going online, only the small family owned shop, charity shops and betting offices remain
July 10, 2023
And a full range of supermarkets glen. They did far more damage to Mum and Dad independent shops like grocers, florists, bakers, butchers. They offered full ranges, as the independents closed down so did their butchery departments etc. Now you get just the pre-packed choices in the main. Unless you are lucky and live in a nice posh area where they can charge a premium for those goods.
July 9, 2023
The point of a digital currency is to have complete data on the public’s spending patterns. Then to have control over their spending as and when desired. Until then, the data will be marketable, and a huge source of potential profit.
July 9, 2023
The bad – access to full information (alongside the online safety bill) on every individial.
The likely incompetent – “improved” monetary policy transmission mechanism.
July 9, 2023
In parallel with this is the drive to force everyone to own and carry a smartphone. Already many railway stations have replaced timetables with QR codes (‘Just scan the code with the camera app on your phone’) and some sporting and cultural events are phone-only. You can’t even upload and display a QR code, the ticket has to be uploaded to an app. Remember when we were urged not to click on unidentified links in e-mails? You have no control over what code is in these apps, one of the more innocuous functions is ‘data mining’, where the app collects your personal data and sends it to advertisers.
July 9, 2023
There do not seem to be any good reasons for this, presumably the real intention is to increase control. An advantage for an interventionist govt / central bank such as weâve had in recent years is if everyone had their account at or mirrored by CBDCs, financial repression would be easier. It is a huge distraction for the BoE as you say – their mission under Carney already crept to include vague political objectives which are the proper preserve of Parliament which we elect.
We want the BoE to do 2 things: 1) hold down inflation (0% would be a better target than 2%) and 2) supervise the banks. On this the only measure that really matters is the one they donât focus on – leverage. Iâd suggest 0% inflation objective and 5x leverage ceiling for banks and no one employed at the BoE should spend a minute thinking about anything else. No wonder weâre in such a mess.
July 9, 2023
A digital currency has no zero bound. Its interest rate can be negative, which can be an attractive addition to a central bank’s tools; especially if cash is withdrawn or made impracticable to obtain, hold and use.
July 9, 2023
I find John’s flaccidity and complacency on this most fundamental of all issues somewhat unnerving.
Digital currencies are totalitarian in nature and have one primary purpose, control over every aspect of a person’s economic life. That is Communism. That is fascism. Consider the horrific implications and shiver at that thought.
The West is now under the control of people and organisations who have no love for liberty and freedom and they labelled Thatcher as evil and uncaring. She was a pussycat compared to those now in power. Indeed she was the living embodiment of freedom and liberty.
July 9, 2023
”Company scrip is scrip (a substitute for government-issued legal tender or currency) issued by a company to pay its employees. It can only be exchanged in company stores owned by the employers. In the United Kingdom, such truck systems have long been formally outlawed under the Truck Acts.”
July 9, 2023
Bitcoin’s value seems to be based on a perception of its value. Sterling is very similar, there is nothing solid like gold in a vault to support it.
Why are banks and central banks so keen on digital currency. It can only be an instrument of greater control and for the parasitic forms of government to exercise that control. You infer that they already have that information, which I agree with, but there is always the desire among the power hungry to have absolute power, and we already know where that leads. I trust the military when necessary to protect the nation, I trust a consultant surgeon with my life when necessary. However I would not trust government at any level, political or administrative any further than I could spit. Take that as a no to digital currency and a vote in support of cash.
July 9, 2023
The output and assets of the British people support Sterling. The British people produce wealth on which half the world, it seems, live.
Better than gold which produces nothing.
July 9, 2023
They want CBDC (not just in the UK, it’s being developed in the EU as well) in order to control “the peasants.” It’s necessary for a Chinese-style Social Credit System and they’re playing a long game.
We will be told that when they’re rolled out, we will still have the option to use cash or other forms of digital payment. They will then start a process of gradually eliminating them, by making the use of cash and credit cards increasingly less convenient and more difficult and with small financial bribes (like store cards which give you a small reward so they can mine your personal information) to encourage us to switch to CBDC.
And when the trap is finally sprung the State will be able to control your every move: what you buy; how much you buy; where you go; how you get there; your contribution to CO2; your compliance with official policies and therefore what you can say or think.
They are creating a financial Gulag and everyone will be in it….. except “the Elite” of course. They are to become the prison Masters.
Use cash.
July 9, 2023
Donna
You are quite right. Right on the modus operandi and right on the ultimate aim.
USE CASH. Not doing so gives central banks and governments the best reason for withdrawing it.
July 9, 2023
Withdraw plenty of cash, and don’t withdraw a large amount in a single operation, break it into two or three withdrawals. To decide if it’s viable, the banks monitor the number of times a cash machine is used, not the total cash amounts withdrawn.
July 10, 2023
Correct. My small west country town still has 3 cash points and I use all of them every week, withdrawing small amounts.
July 9, 2023
Donna
They have already attempted to stop transactions/payments by cheque, so they have form on this.
Then there is the limit on overdrafts and credit, just a click away, or a change of policy.
July 9, 2023
Yes, this is true, but the way that digital funds & ID has been sold to the public is the issue. We are told we need a NWO to control us. That digital ID is needed to control us. The same reason to have a cashless society! That we will ‘own nothing & be happy.’ There is only one way to sell products & ideas. Show the customers what the benefits are for THEM. Yet all we see is how this digital economy can have negative impacts on our lives. Restrict our mobility, restrict our travel, restrict access to our money etc.. As we see with the Farage case. It all confirms that Government control will never make us happy. Quite the opposite, as we the people cannot benefit when others control us! As we learnt from the horrors of two WW.
July 9, 2023
“What is the point of a Central Bank digital currency?” Authoritarian Control, nothing else.
It enables authorities to attach an ID, age, ethnicity, religion and so on to the ownership of the money. These additional impositions have already been stated by the people that the BoE have contracted to look into to introduction, are possible. It is already been stated by them that it could be used to confirm ID.
Of course the Government the Authorities will say they would never insist on that. That is were we get the phrase âsalami sliceâ come in, say something to get it started then attach things as they go along. The EU project was according to its creators âjustâ free trading, then it clearly became the United States of Europe.
Some things have gone to far down the road of Authoritarian Control, its time to step back with a proper legal framework attached. No one, not even the Authorities should be able to delve into who or what a person is as a matter of course. Some mealy well mean words will be expanded as to why some things should be access by any sort of authority. However there is no truth in that other than control from the personal view of the proposer, it should not be routine, allow for âfishing expeditionsâ. The Courts should be the avenue to gain access then with a âjust causeâ situation. Otherwise it becomes a political weapon.
July 9, 2023
You only have to look at the range of governmental-related organisations/authorities which it has been disclosed will have access to ALL of your personal information when you have the digital ID which will underpin the CBDC to understand that this isn’t about money.
July 9, 2023
This idea came out of the same box as HS2: a vain attempt to make it look as if the Government was ‘With it’ and doing something. Both are totally unnecessary.
July 9, 2023
The Sage of Omaha – Warren Buffett, CEO of Berkshire Hathaway, ninth richest man in the world and one of the planet’s leading investors, has spoken scathingly about cryptocurrencies. He has described Bitcoin etc as âa mirageâ which âdraws in a lot of charlatansâ and which will âwill come to bad endingsâ
The obvious alternative to charlatans creating digital money out of thin air is gold. Physical gold bullion has been used as a store of value for millenia. The Asian community (Sunak included) know this and after good harvests in India, farmers buy gold with their ruppees.
Gold bullion is real money, you can physically pick up a 1oz Krugerand or a British Sovereign and feel the weight of it. Whilst Sterling still has some value Hunt should be emulating the central banks of Singapore (buying 51.4 tons so far in 2023) Turkey (45.5 tons) China (39.8 tons) India (28.8 tons) and buy gold. In March this year gold-backed ETFs added 1.4 million ounces as investors piled in (source Bloomberg). Gold buying by central banks reached its highest level in 55 years this February 2023, according to the World Gold Council. Wars are good for gold.
July 9, 2023
In 545 the mint in Bamburgh minted money in base metal. The word of the King of Northumbria was worth all. Thatâs sophistication. Hoarding gold is barbaric. For people who have no honour, no intellect and no sophistication.
July 9, 2023
The proposers of this type of element as a State, Government, Authoritarian type of Control over the individual, should be removed from the positions they hold and barred from any sort of âOfficeâ or work for the State.
If there is a need, private enterprise will pick it up, then there will be competition and options to change from one service to another.
I remind people the State owns and runs the NHS. They also run the BoE. Me suspects, this is really about Graham Bailey playing politics to deflect from his personal failures of many years. Note, recently he has taken up the Political stance to slam petrol companies for over charging â 72% of the petrol price goes to the Treasury 28% is shared between the producer, the wholesaler and the retailer. – Why did he not slam the Government? He is also hitting the Media interfering in Politics on many other subjects â he is an unelected state employee.
Government are never good at running anything, there job should be to facilitate the free up of the individual, enterprise and industry to be the best that can.
July 9, 2023
Private enterprise has tried to pick it up, but are being blocked by the banks: Quite a number will simply not allow companies that bank with them to work with crypto, which is crippling the UK crypto industry. Cases can be provided if required. They also often close accounts from individuals working with crypto or holding crypto which is why so many local and face-to-face exchanges have sprung up.
That said, there are some inaccuracies in the article
“These do not fulfil the normal characteristics of money. You cannot use them to buy things. Most shops and websites decline bitcoin. ”
That was true in 2016. Now, despite the banks’ unfriendly nature, the acceptance of bitcoin has grown from intiially web services and technology to everywhere from newsagents to solicitors, where it is in fact used to buy things. Most British shops decline the euro, but that hardly means it is not a currency.
“They are not a store of value as a sound major state currency is, with wildly fluctuating values.”
No, but they are more stable than many minor state currencies (Zimbarbwe or Ecuador, perhaps?), and not subject to decisions such as quantative easing or state devaluation.
“Few quote prices in bitcoin where many quote them in dollars or pounds.”
The places that accept Bitcoin certainly do, and in the west few quote prices in the yen, or gold sovereigns.
“There are things called stable coins which seek to link their value to a well known currency. Some achieve this, but there could in some cases be failures to do so. If they succeed what advantage do they have over holding the currency itself?”
The advantage is far faster transactions: send money round the world in five minutes (or seconds), not five hours, and the blockchain stores all transactions publicly so they can be reviewed at any point by anyone. Bitcoin traders use it to lock in gains or stop losses from more volatile crypto as it is far faster than trading for cash.
However Tether, the most popular stablecoin is apparently pegged to gold reserves to keep it equal to the dollar, but there is no way currently to confirm what backs a stablecoin. Even when they are backed, there’s the risk of crashing out like the pound did to the ERM. Many may be scams upfront. As highlighted by the collapse of TerraUSD (Corporate FInance Institute, October 13, 2022, & July 7, 2023) backed only by math and now being sued by the SEC for fraud (FT, Feb 16, 2023), if a stablecoin claims a direct link to fiat currency it needs to be regulated and fully backed.
July 9, 2023
+1
I have been saying this for ages.
Less is more.
July 9, 2023
Hold the front page – fantastic news! Parliament has approved a referendum on controlling migration! At last!
Oh wait. It’s the Polish Parliament.
July 9, 2023
Yes. A bit hypocritical of them don’t you think ?
Both ourselves and the German’s rebuilt their country and their economy.
July 9, 2023
They are calling for 400,000 immigrants a year.
July 9, 2023
âWhat is the point of a Central Bank digital currency?â
For control, and by people who are unknown and unelected, as we have seen with the recent experiences and revelations of bank account cancellations.
The giveaway was when our PM, then Chancellor, said at COP26:
âSo our third action is to rewire the entire global financial system for Net Zero.â
July 9, 2023
I do not believe for one instance that the BoE is creating a digital currency without the support and authorisation of the government, the treasury and ministers âŠlike HS2, ULEZ, VAT & Net-Zero you could stop them tomorrow âŠyou choose not too
July 9, 2023
Central Bank Digital Currency, NO thanks, their record to date in managing what they have got is simply awful.
Could the government even trust them ?
July 9, 2023
Answers to the headline question are provided here:
https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/the-digital-pound.
The European Central Bank explains further:
https://www.ecb.europa.eu/paym/digital_euro/faqs/html/ecb.faq_digital_euro.en.html
“All major central banks are examining the possibility of issuing a central bank digital currency … There is a common understanding at the G20 level that cooperation is needed when it comes to the international use of central bank digital currencies.”
July 9, 2023
It is partially summarised in the last paragraph, but there is much more to it.
With CBDC the government will know every last thing about us, how we spent our money, who we were associated with, where we went, what we did – Nothing would be hidden from the oppressors.
We can all pour disgust on how banks can so easily close personal bank accounts at a whim, but with CBDC the government would be totally in control, and could target just about anyone they disliked, for any reason. Let’s face facts, HMG can be vindictive whenever it suits them, and withdrawing the ability to use digital money, where real cash has been taken out of circulation, means a death sentence on those attacked!
Central Bank digital currency has no other purpose than to become just another stick with which to beat us with.
July 9, 2023
Home Office data as at 8th July 2023
Illegal Immigrants – 384
Small boats – 7
July 9, 2023
1000 have come over the last two days and 200 reported so far today. The Home Office have commented ‘The number of people risking their lives is unacceptable’. This is the only concern, no thought for the wishes of the indigenous people of this country who never voted to be replaced and are being made to pay for all this. Perhaps after the next election they will be able to install a more direct ferry service.
July 9, 2023
glen, so in one day they have almost filled up the new Barge which is costing how many ÂŁmillions to refurbish. !
Clueless, absolutely bloody clueless.
July 9, 2023
Mervyn King, former Governor of the BoE and now in the HoL, shares your opinion and I recommend this video of a speech he gave at RUSI on the outcome of a HoL Economic Affairs committee investigation into CDBCs:
https://www.youtube.com/live/Qy1rkw6CCWs?feature=share&t=609 [watch through to 26mins for his remarks].
“At this point, a CBDC seems to be a solution in search of a problem” he says, and I agree.
July 9, 2023
Yes, that speech was given as an introduction to the HOL report on CBDCs (as Rishi calls them) and was entitled Central Bank Digital Currencies â A Solution in search of a Problem? I have seen nothing since to convince me that they have any new positive effect for customers and a helluva lot of negatives! Rishi is a big plan and wants the UK to be one of the first – surprise surpriseâŠ.
Zorro
July 9, 2023
I can’t see the point of it also . I am too old to bother about this indicated approach and I certainly wouldn’t trust the BoE to administer such a scheme . I like to have a few proper ÂŁ notes in my wallet and use cash as my means of exchange .
July 9, 2023
I too always keep a few quid laying around just in case.
July 9, 2023
Sir John,
The Central bank should be offering current accounts as a bank of last resort. By this I mean for Nigel Farage and people like him who have been blacklisted by the commercial banks.
If you are a UK citizen, or a UK taxpayer, then you should be entitled to a UK bank account.
July 9, 2023
The thing is, NF’s bank is owned by the State đ€š
July 9, 2023
It’s all about either, (A): consensual power of sovereign nations, with democratic checks and balances, like Brexit, or (B): centralized global control by the WEF or the WHO (Cf. China’s social credit score).
(A): “And if thou sell ought unto thy neighbour, or buyest ought of thy neighbourâs hand, ye shall not oppress one another:” Leviticus 25:14.
(B): “And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: and that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. ” Revelation 13:16-18.
Take your choice!
July 9, 2023
As I keep telling the youngsters, you need cash, gold (jewellery will do if good carats), card (essential even if you don’t want it) and whatever other fad that takes your fancy. I have not been through a war that invaded my country but speaking to those who have when you have nothing else to barter for food or whatever (besides your body) then you need cash, grown stuff or as above. Don’t let us be silly with these people after our money. We must get some sensible people into government from younger generations that have studied history and listened to first hand accounts of having nothing to eat. Of course, war is always a good way of cutting populations which is one of the reasons it is started.
July 9, 2023
I can see no point in a BoE digital currency. Our present systems of transferring money via the internet are swifter, cheaper and safer than Bitcoin and its brothers. Bitcoin and other digital â currencies â have not proved a satisfactory alternative to money – their value fluctuates too much to be a store of value, costs of transmission are too high and security is weak. What advantages do they bring other than to those engaged in nefarious activities ?
July 9, 2023
The whole point of Bitcoin & crypto is independence from a centralised monetary source. The current blockchain and iuts transactions are run and audited by hundreds of thousands of machines worldwide simultaneously (mining), and is therefore uneditable without the majority of miners agreeing, which prevents changes or roll backs on transactions. It also means that every transaction that has ever occurred is visible and if someone tries to change the chain, people notice and the system mines the change out.
A Central Bank currency will almost certainly have a hidden blockchain which is not publicly available, and one miner controlling that chain. This removes the entire point of crypto, as they could roll back or reallocate currency whenever they chose without the owner’s consent and it becomes impossible for third parties to trace transactions or know how much currency is available. Cryptos with a single miner have a very bad name for a reason: there can be no trust.
Can’t they stick to messing around with the pound?
July 9, 2023
âMiningâ is the process of creating a crypto coin. The blockchain has nothing to to do with mining.
July 10, 2023
Mining is the process of adding to the blockchain by resolving a cryptographic algorythm to solve or confirm a block (the next segment of the chain). Each block mined usually adds transactions to the blockchain, for which the miner receives a small fee (rather like credit card processing) or, much more rarely, the miner discovers a new unique key in that block which is a coin.
With most standard blockchains, multiple miners must resolve a block before it is confirmed. With a single miner like a centralised digital currency? That’s like an accountant with no auditor.
July 9, 2023
Government involvement in anything digital/internet is lamentable.
The first thing they do in agreement of what they call authorities is work out how they can spy on the individuals as a means of control. All well meaning phrases such as to stamp out crime, protect the young and so on. What they miss is every action they include that gives them over arching access, also by default gives access to those that seek direct harm. Criminals use the dark web for communicating between themselves.
This digital currency along with the âonline safety billâ exposes the whole country to abuse to those with malicious intent, be it foreign powers or criminals. As soon as you create access – you create it for all. Governments are not as good as they think they are. Government has is all in reverse order, the internet therefore any digital currency is for all. Every one hopes and expects they are not being monitored by anyone other than those they are communicating with. The Government reverses this, in all their actions and thinking. All communication should be at their minimum encrypted and via VPN – with no built in back door.
This does not stop legitimate Authorities gaining access via the Courts on a âJust Causeâ reasoning. What is would stop is nefarious snooping by individuals that for one reason or another seek wrong doing.
The Government is weakening not only the security of the individual but also the security of the Country.
July 9, 2023
This week I had a client wishing to introduce what was defined as a âFreeâ app into their communication structure. They forgot there is no such thing as a âfree lunchâ. What this free system did was allow the owners of the free system to monitor, and collect the data of not only the individuals that used it but everyone they were in contact with(email clients/programs have contact lists open to all). It doesnât seem to be much at first. But, there was also a chain, as they facilitated the same collection by others. In all this one âfreeâ facility provided over 400 other entities with personal and private data from each individual using it.
It was possible to find out who some of these entities where, but others were blocking access to their own details â why? Would all users bother to check? The over-riding situation was that all these 400 plus data collectors were outside of the UKâs legal jurisdiction. People, Companies, Foreign Powers all farming UK data â why?. As with all these situations the Government could not carry out their first duty to protect, as they are the ones opening the door. All the Governments proposals put everyone in the UK at risk, you could even suggest it is malicious intent by what the term Authorities.
If the Internet therefore maybe even a digital currency is to be secure and safe for all and have a purpose going forward, the security and safety for the individual has to be put first and foremost to the front long before any Government notion of Control and their fear of the People. In all honesty in a Democracy, the last people to try to run this sort of setup is Government as they are demonstrating they are the problem.
July 9, 2023
Starting with Nigell Farage and then percolating throughout the population we have unwarranted account closure by high street banks. Time to reign this nonesense in and establish in law the obligations that banks have towards their customers and to put an end to their political, at times, cowboy behaviour. I would include the abyss like discrepancy between what they pay for money and what they sell it for. Scrooge looks benign by comparison.
July 9, 2023
Oh the bankâs margin seems to be sacrosanct!
Time for tax cuts – i.e a pay-rise for all, including those without a union.
July 9, 2023
In recent times there has been concern about the removal of cash, particularly when it comes to things like parking. Councils are using outside apps to organise and collect payments. These apps then collect and monitories the data they collect form individuals. Who is responsible? It would appear the Councils although they are facilitators they consider themselves not legally responsible for the chain of data that is collected. – this needs to be reversed, they are the seller they are therefore the facilitator
July 9, 2023
âExisting digital money through commercial banks is already under plenty of surveillance to prevent crime and money laundering.â
Monitoring the âPeopleâ routinely without a just cause, without formal legal intervention on individual case is something should strike fear in everyone in a Democracy this is the CCP in action.
This is nothing more than Governments in fear of the People and wishing to control, it doesnât stop any of the things it suggests as its reasoning – crime and money laundering.
July 9, 2023
You need to read the Treasury report:
The Digital Pound: A New Form of Money For Households and Businesses?
to understand what the Government has planned for us. Of course, the majority of people donât have the time or inclination to read and absorb such a mammoth document and this is how governments bring things in under the radar.
For a good summary and analysis of the report, view on YT Neil McCoy-Wardâs video (45 minutes)
The UK: ‘Central Bank Digital Currency’ – FULL ANALYSIS/REVIEW!
It’s well worth a listen.
July 9, 2023
He’s good ….and yes it is alarming
July 9, 2023
@ Christine – I will have to take your word for it for Mr. McCoy-Ward’s introductory remarks seemed to dwell on the nonsense point of use of the Royal Arms and skipping randomly to much later he was warning about mortgage rates not coming down as banks found getting wholesale deposits more expensive post digital currency introduction. I did not persist.
July 10, 2023
Excellent link. 20% of people prefer cash. As I said elsewhere one of the main reasons is because they have a better sense of the value of mney if they can see the money. It is as simple as that.
July 9, 2023
What is not recognised, we have a digital currency it is called a Credit/or Charge Card, direct debit and so on. So is it then Governments fear is that without interference of the Courts they cannot routinely monitor peoples activities? Or is it just deflection?
You have to ask what is the fear that Government has? They have legal access through the Courts when there is suspicions about individuals, or they should have, and that is all that is necessary. The proposals and structure has nothing to do with providing better service, reducing criminality or so-called money laundering, it doesnât interfere or stop any of that. So the question is why? It would suggest therefore Governments have got ahead of themselves have distorted truth and reality all with malicious intent, seeking control, seeking to stamp out political views, even free speech other than their own.
Who decides on what a “politically exposed persons” is, Oh yes those in power!
July 9, 2023
Anybody who deviates from the politically approved narrative is a âpolitically exposed personâ. Many of us are unpaid, unlike Nigel Farage.
July 9, 2023
Revelation 13. 16 -17 And it makes everyone -small and great, rich and poor, free or slave – to receive a mark on his right hand or on his forehead so that no one can buy and sell unless he has the mark; the beast’s name or the number of its name.
An interesting thought from the bible. A few years ago, you could have said it was nonsense. Now with Debit & Credit Cards, & banks closing accounts, we are part way there. CBDC will just complete the way a future evil government will have total control over us.
July 9, 2023
I wonder why a great many MPs aren’t fighting against CBDC
July 10, 2023
Well said Glen.
July 9, 2023
No one, so far, has been honest. We like to be able to cheat the system, by not paying VAT, or tax on black market transactions. We donât want to be taxed, so â be truthful and vote for any party that advocates keeping cash.
July 9, 2023
Sometimes, when the roof is leaking and you canât afford to give the Govt itâs 20%ncut, you use a cowboy because they are not VAT registered. Thatâs not âchoosing not to pay VAT. Thatâs topping your house falling down at a price you can pay, legally.
July 9, 2023
fishknife,
I note there is another poster today called Norman.
So I am reminded of the line âPhone for the fishknives, Normanâ.
July 10, 2023
The Inland Revenue, like all tax authorities makes many mistakes some of which do great harm to individuals. When I emigrated they got very stroppy about continuing to tax me on my UK income. I found that my case was split between several departments that don’t talk to each other. I even had to send copies of letters to me from one department and to other departments because they didn’t copy to each other. It was I, not one of them, who quoted chapter and verse of the double taxation agreement which stated categorically they had no such right. You would expect someone in the Inland Revenue to have known that and to have told the others wouldn’t you? In the end I threatened the Inland Revenue with legal action. Only then did they cease their harrasment.
A digital currency would make the inland revenue even more arrogant and sure of itself and do nothing to improve its competence. You’d never get beyond ‘Computer says, no’. Same with that BBC licence fee.
July 9, 2023
Another trustworthy move by a sect that thinks its ok to seize others assets. /s
A dystopian future. Lets face it. That is where we are . We have controlling prison guards, in a country , with prison guard controlled scrip depreciating rapidly.
Who is going to hold that? unless compelled by force of arms?
How does CBDC interact with GDPR? A principal being don’t collect data you don’t intend to use.
Oh i bet they exempt themselves or where necessary just conveniently ignore the law and enforce it selectively.
Perhaps we should apply it only to politicians, donors , bureuacrats & the super rich. Specifically offshore transactions. With the data being publically available.
Are they unable to control the money supply and private bank lending boom bust in any other way.
If only , it was backed with something tangible, to stop centralized grifting. Perhaps decentralised with zero trust or minimal trust required.
July 9, 2023
â I cannot see them making everyone have a CB account as the Bank of England would not want millions of small accounts.â
It might be more a question of the state and the BoE imposing their will to enforce compliance onto the smaller banks, who already run millions of small accounts.
July 9, 2023
Correct the BoE doesn’t make policy …the government does
July 9, 2023
Maybe the BoE want the same power as commercial banks to withdraw banking facilities from people who disagree with them.
July 9, 2023
Wow – what a thought. All the Banks want to close!
July 9, 2023
I don’t trust the government, parliament, or the Bank of England, to do anything for the benefit of the majority of people, whom they seem intent on impoverishing and exercising increasing control over. On the other hand they will do all they can for the already wealthy minority and their globalist masters. Anyone who believes in freedom and liberty must resist.
July 9, 2023
Give me control of a nation’s money and I care not who makes its laws.
Amstel Rothschild.
It’s about total control. We saw the bank flex its muscles and orchestrate the ousting of the Truss government. It wants the power over all of us.
July 9, 2023
Half the country knows the name of the suspended BBC journalist and I say that because everyone in the media who wants to know knows the same with the police and the whole BBC itself ITV and Sky etc and from that all of their cousins up and down the country who want to know can easily find out. The people who don’t know are the other half of society who have no connections with media or the police and that includes me but with a little research I also know. So then why do we go on with this charade every time we have an incident like this it’s a load of old nonsense that heralds back to the 18th century
July 9, 2023
CBDCs provide a secure and reliable means of digital payment and remittance and could increase financial inclusion and stability. A very complicated subject, but one that deserves a detailed investigation by the BofE. A great pity (I think it was a certain G. Brown) that the BofE lost its banking accounts, that kept it in touch with ground level banking. Because he wouldn’t allow it (funny, it’s independent) to alter its systems for Faster Payments, Govt accounts were transferred to a clearing bank.
July 9, 2023
“…different digital tokens like Bitcoin. These do not fulfil the normal characteristics of money.” – agreed, but a central bank backed digital currency could, one would expect.
Surely a good part of the reason for CBDC is to drive out private Digital Currency, a phenomenon that might well have destabilizing effects on the financial system.
And the key distinction with a CBDC over electronic entries on some commercial bank’s ledgers is that the digital currency is itself wealth (allowing that one still has to ask the Monarch to pay the bearer on demand) rather than a claim on wealth. It therefore would be directly akin to CB issued notes and coins. To be as portable and transferable as notes and coins would require holders to possess and control their own digital wallets: I see the Bank of England seems to expect digital wallets to be provided by commercial banks (or other providers) so control might be achieved but possession is very much more problematic.
July 9, 2023
They donât fulfil the normal characteristics of YOUR money. You know, the characteristic that you can create more and more money and create your old friend inflation. That magic trick you use to devalue the money you borrow.
And you could buy things with Bitcoin until governments and central banks decided to stop it. There is only ever going to be a limited number of Bitcoin so your money creation nonsense wouldnât work if we all bypassed your currency and used Bitcoin instead.
July 10, 2023
There was a case a few years ago of a forger who printed a few thousand quid in forged notes and was charged with debasing the Queen’s currency and sent to prison. As someone quipped at the time when the Bank of England does it to the tune of billions it is perfectly legal and everyone applauds.
The purpose behind replacing cash with digital currency is simply state surveillance of the entire population.
July 10, 2023
Sorry to be boring but why hasn’t the Governor of the BoE Andrew Bailey been sacked? He had one task – to hold inflation to 2% pa – and has signally failed to achieve it. Ultra low interest rates and unnecessary QE throughout 2021 led to the great inflation; what’s more, Andrew Bailey was told that this would happen. He is now overcompensating by raising Base Rate drastically, which will cause a lot of human misery in the housing market and cause a recession.
Sir John should ask a PMQ demanding that the Prime Minister should tell the House of Commons why he hasn’t sacked Andrew Bailey.
Quite why an institution – the BoE – that is entrenched in failure should be given additional roles is puzzling. Why the NHS, which is not running a good health service, has been given responsibility for social care, is also puzzling.
July 10, 2023
For many people money means a lot more when they can see it. They know what handing a fiver over means for their budget. But a mere wave of a digital wallet or credit card has less meaning. Doesn’t the uk have a personal debt problem, overspending on credit cards? The solution for many of these people – and they are not just the poor – is to take their credit cards away and revert to cash, whether voluntarily or not. Money that looks like money. Doing away with cash will make such problems worse for there would be no alternative to the credit card.
July 10, 2023
@ Peter Gardner “…there would be no alternative to the credit card” – a debit card might overcome some of the objections though, particularly where available balance remaining was discoverable in real time.
July 10, 2023
I think the vision might be to get rid of cash (notes and coins).
I suspect Central Banks and Treasuries like the idea of trackable transactions to shrink or eliminate the black economy. Add to that savings in benefit fraud and tax evasion by cash traders and anybody can see why the treasury would be interested. The argument, to a government trailing in the opinion polls before an election, would be obvious – want to offer a few pence off the income tax rate, cut crime and still have some cash left over for some goodies? It would be easily sellable to the public if say their council tax or income tax was to be reduced.
Privacy is as mentioned a big problem. It would be interesting to know how much of the Oyster type journey history stored by London Transport (TFL) has been leaked/abused or even legally requested by the Police/Defendants regarding court cases. Using an Oyster Card as opposed to a bank card means that while TFL knows where I go, the bank does not – it only knows where the Oyster Card was topped it up. So one less privacy leak point. So there needs to be a lot of thought about privacy.
July 10, 2023
Who gains from a digital currency and the end of cash? The banks would gain a transaction fee on the 11% of all transactions that are currently cash. The banks would gain valuable data on the cash market and black economy they could then sell. Market research companies and consultants would be able to improve the accuracy and reliabiilty of their market research products. With enhanced market research marketing departments could better target their product offerings, promotions and advertising. The Government and its agencies would have complete surveillance of all money transactions and could thus exercise greater control of individuals through complete control of their money. Some crime is financed by cash transactions. Digital transaction could be easiyltraced, so that would be a benefit. But it is the only one I can think of and certainly does not outweigh the disadvantages. Neither does it outweigh the advantages of cash for most people for certain common types of transaction.
July 10, 2023
In defence of Bitcoin aimed at Sir John’s audience…
It’s the first digital scarce commodity.âIn the digital world, bits can be easily copied to give identical bits, e.g. an ebook.âSolving the problem of creating scarcity is one of the major technical breakthroughs of Bitcoin.âIts monetary inflation rate is known in advance as part of its programming and will give about 21 million bitcoins.âNo central authority or government can increase this; the money printer cannot go brrr!
In some countries today, people are already preferring to store value in Bitcoin rather than the local government money.âThey’re used to wild currency fluctuations, ones which only ever end in less value.âWhereas Bitcoin has always trended up over the medium term to date.âTheir Bitcoin can easily move with them should they flee the local high inflation unlike the money controls stopping their government money from leaving.
Bitcoin’s transaction technology, the public ledger stored as a blockchain, is slow and has a relatively low throughput of transactions.âIt’s more like SWIFT or phoning your bank to make a CHAPS transfer.âBut just as the Internet is built in layers, from the bottom up with Ethernet, IP, TCP, TLS, and HTTP, so ‘second layers’ are now sitting on Bitcoin.âOne is Lightning and it gives sub-second non-refundable very cheap transfers suitable for buying a newspaper.âThis is much better for the vendor as he gets his money now not when Visa hand it over in a month assuming there was no charge-back.âIt’s Lightning that’s being used in El Salvador where Bitcoin is legal tender.
Another exciting second layer is Fedimint.âThis allows a ‘federation’ to form where the Bitcoin funds are held under an N of M signature, just as three company directors must sign large cheques out of a board of ten.âTransfers within the federation are free and private as they are not stored on the public blockchain.âThink of schemes like the Brixton Pound but without lack of privacy.
Currently, Bitcoin’s price fluctuates but that is clearly dampening down over time when measured as a percentage.âIt’s driven by speculative leveraged investment but that impacts less as more long-term holders arrive.
Lastly, all ‘crypto’, i.e. all digital tokens other than Bitcoin, are essentially worthless.âThey often have centralised control by the creators who change the rules to suit them, just like a government.âThey’re ramped up like penny shares just to suck in new money at the bottom of the Ponzi.âIf there’s one thing to learn it’s that Bitcoin and ‘crypto’ are very different and Bitcoin is worthy of more study.âIt’s quite the rabbit hole, bringing in Austrian Economics, philosophy, geopolitics, energy production and more.
Reply This site does not offer investment advice. Bitcoin is very volatile.
July 10, 2023
I think the last few weeks re bank accounts being declined and our friends in Canada having their bank accounts frozen are good indicators of where this could lead.
Tie in your programmable money to your social credit score and anything you do that the government of the day doesn’t like means you can be cut off from society.
To answer your question, I think its all about control. I say this as someone who invests in crypto currencies.