My Speech on Spring Budget debate – National Insurance

100 Comments

  1. agricola
    March 15, 2024

    Too little too late. A collection of pathologists stood round the slab discussing the cause of death, while looking at the array of daggers, and trying to assess the relative contribution and effect they had in bringing the corpse to where it was.

    The daggers, labelled VAT, IR35, NI, INCOME TAX all played their part in the death, all because the BOE, OBR and Treasury have little understanding or sympathy for how the self employed and SME bodies actually work. They have about as little understanding as an abattoire worker.

    Collectively politicians and the above mentioned government bodies have been living on the seed crop. As long as it continues famine is assured. The realisation only rests in the minds of 100 powerless, out of the 650 responsible. If this ill advised feeding continues after the next election the mortuary slab is the assured outcome. Those 100 and Reform are the only ones speaking for the enlightenment, I hope the electorate increasingly realise it.

    1. Peter Wood
      March 15, 2024

      Great analogy, a bit of gallows humour.
      When politicians are calling for tax cuts, but no spending cuts, you know it’s all just posturing.
      In the words of our host “We don’t believe you!”

      1. Peter
        March 15, 2024

        Another Conservative MP is stepping down – James Heappey Armed Forces Minister.

        Quite a few of them going now


        1. Hope
          March 15, 2024

          +many Agricola.

          JR, great speech, totally wasted on your party and govt. It does not want to govern but be led by EU. Quangos were meant and designed to implement EU law and regs on the QT, hence no bonfire.

          Sunak betrayed the nation to be a vassal state of EU under the EU sell out Windsor agreement. Treacherous just like May. Sunak has stopped UK diverging from EU forcing our country to ant in lockstep and he even imposed EU law into domestic legislation instead of scrapping over 4,000 EU laws. By now the manifesto and overwhelming mandate should be in place to act like a sovereign independent nation for the benefit of its citizens.

          Your govt Incapable of making the easiest decisions because the idiot ministers do not possess the intellect or ability to strategically act in our national interest from a conservative perspective.

          Election to rid us of the shysters in govt.

        2. Donna
          March 16, 2024

          Yes, he was “disappointed” that the Junta found no extra money for the Armed Services in the Budget – but bunged another ÂŁ6 billion at the bottomless pit of the NHS.

      2. Reform_Now
        March 20, 2024

        Peter Wood – no, cuts to tax RATES often produce more overall revenue.

        Our host has to be frequently reminded to talk not of “tax cuts” but of cuts to tax rates – when he stands up in parliament, he often seems to forget this and allows the socialists to control the lexicon of debate.

    2. Lifelogic
      March 15, 2024

      Other daggers Net Zero, the mad energy policy, market rigging in energy, heatpumps, EV cars, the vast size of the unproductive state, vast over regulation of employment, health and safety, planning…

      Still some good news it seems Rishi has delayed some heat pump/boiler market rigging (alas only delayed). Heat pump save virtually no CO2 anyway Rishi, This after the vast grid improvements needed and we have no spare low CO2 electricity to drive them from anyway. So they will be driven by Gas that wastes about 60% of the heat at the power station and in transmission! We are governed by idiots, crooks are crony capitalists.

    3. BOF
      March 15, 2024

      +1 Agricola
      Excellent analogy.

    4. Mickey Taking
      March 15, 2024

      I think the one with the hot barrel gun still pointing at the head ‘was the one that done it!’.
      The succession of half-baked leaders witness to the cries of ‘Et tu Brute’ between each knife plunge has culminated in the coup de grĂące.

    5. Paula
      March 15, 2024

      63 seats. (Express estimation.)

      That many ???

    6. Bloke
      March 15, 2024

      Very well expressed, agricola.

    7. a-tracy
      March 15, 2024

      This just makes me laugh.
      Reform are not going to form the next government.
      Have Labour or the SNP promised to raise the income tax threshold? NI has come down a lot since Jul 2022!
      Have Labour or the SNP promised to remove VAT from anything, or reduce VAT to 17.5 or 15%?
      Council tax is often higher in Labour areas (other than Cities and Wales), and services for niceties are cut.

      1. Reformer
        March 15, 2024

        So, atracy, you refuse to vote Reform, and you intend to vote Conservative because of what they “promise” to do, and you therefore intend to ignore the hard factual evidence of 14 years of these Conservatives increasing taxes, enlarging the state and adopting woke anti-conservative policies. Atracy, you deserve everything you are going to get

        1. a-tracy
          March 15, 2024

          I never said I intend to vote Conservative. I feel very betrayed by my Conservative MP and their vote for Sunak.

          We will probably get Labour Reformer. I know very well what people will get with them. Reform are a risk, Ben Habib doesn’t like Lee Anderson, LA called Richard Tice a pound shop Nigel Farage.
          I’ve seen upstart parties in action, they fell apart after election, falling out with each other. The truth is with Reform no-one knows what they will get other than a Labour SNP led parliament, its not Labour seats they’re trying to get they want to take down the right too.

          1. a-tracy
            March 15, 2024

            sorry there should be a comma, after Labour first line.

    8. Ian B
      March 15, 2024

      @agricola – Thank you…

  2. Michelle
    March 15, 2024

    The Government didn’t need to do an actual practical demonstration of what would happen if you closed the country down. Many could foresee the outcome, without aid of a crystal ball. Who would listen though?
    Correct, Starmer would have gone further for longer. Something the Conservatives should remind the public of, alongside the consequences of it.

  3. Lynn Atkinson
    March 15, 2024

    Apropos National Insurance. I am in favour of Employers NI being scrapped. They can increase wages by the same amount but the full burden of the cost should be apparent to the employee whom it benefits. I’m am against all the hidden cost of employment. The employee would be more aware of Government insatiability if he could see the full deductions on his wage slip, and he would demand more from Government as a result. That would put pressure on the Government to get some productivity out of the State/Parasitic sector.
    I am not sure that all state employees should not become ‘self-employed’ and be awarded short term contacts by the state. If they don’t perform the contracts dry up. That gets us around the horrors of sacking people which the British are far too weak to undertake.

    1. Lifelogic
      March 15, 2024

      But what they are actually doing is (in effect) putting NI onto everyone pensions and unearned income. By increasing income taxes with fiscal drag and removing Employees NI (not employers). It is another vast tax grab!

      1. acorn
        March 15, 2024

        More smoke and mirrors. The VAT threshold used to go up with inflation each Budget, that stopped in 2017. It would be circa ÂŁ110,000 today if it had continued; more fiscal drag. The average small business has a turnover of circa ÂŁ160,000, a move from ÂŁ85,000 to ÂŁ90,000 will take less than 300,000 extra of the smallest of five million small businesses, (less than 50 employees) out of VAT.

        Last time I looked, HMRC reckoned two thirds of the self employed / sole traders should be inside IR 35 as disguised employees. Until NI is recognised as a parallel income tax and income and dividend taxation are synchronised; the mess will continue.

    2. a-tracy
      March 15, 2024

      They do see the Employer’s NI on the payslip, they don’t care if it’s not them paying, as you say, it would be interesting if the person on ÂŁ30k had the employers NI on top of their salary = ÂŁ32405.34 then the 3% Workplace pension Ers = ÂŁ33,118.14 then saw the whole ÂŁ3118.14 taken out of their bottom line.

      1. Lifelogic
        March 15, 2024

        Employer’s NI is not shown on my payslip though as it is my company I have to pay it. To see how expensive taxes really are think about a loop tax from one employee to employee. If I fix my own car with my labour no tax is due but if I work to earn £200 take home after tax. Then circa £160 is due in tax and NIx2 before I get the £200 then I pay the garage then they pay VAT and the mechanic with his PAYE so he perhaps gets £80 take home. One loop the. £360 gross earning goes down to £80 the government taking £280. So unless the mechanic is 2.5 times better than you best to DIY and cut the government out. Or go on the dole and barter. Similar issues with paying for childcare.

        1. A-tracy
          March 16, 2024

          Most Employers show the Employers NI contribution on the payslips because its how the Employee can see the employer has made the contribution due.

          “Unfortunately, a small minority of employers fail to do this. If you are concerned that your employer may not be paying your National Insurance Contributions to HMRC, a low-key way of checking that your contributions are getting through would be to ask for a pension forecast from the Pensions Service. You could check to see if you have been given the right number of year’s contributions.”

          Childcare is going to go up from April 2024, the minimum wage has gone up 10% and the age dropped to 21. There are ratios of nursery nurses to the maximum number of children in their care. https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cdp-2022-0195/
          Most nursery nurses do long hours to wrap around care of the parents hours, 40-45, they will have to shift work them now to keep costs down, in fact it would be cheaper to use two part-time than one full-time (national insurance). ÂŁ23,795 for a 21 year old + Employers NI + Workplace pension, sick set off, + holiday pay cover. Trained nursery nurses will obviously want more than this as per their additional training.

        2. Mickey Taking
          March 17, 2024

          Dole as you put it pays nothing. Job seeker’s allowance is about ÂŁ85 per month, which soon disappears paying travel costs to interviews should you actually find a job you might be able to do.

    3. Lynn Atkinson
      March 15, 2024

      I see some of the bureaucrats who rule us are threatening to go on strike if ‘2 days a week in the office’ is enforced.
      We need legislation which defines ‘resignation’ as refusing to turn up to work without heath reason for a specified duration.
      That would cut the state sector by a vast percentage and those cut would be self-selecting.

  4. DOM
    March 15, 2024

    The more the state extracts for its own nefarious and malicious ends the more economic value it destroys. Tyranny is expensive to finance.

    Maybe John instead of focusing upon meaningless issues like National Insurance direct his considerable analytical skills to the danger of a state that has become an existential threat to the very nature of freedom and democracy itself.

    The threat comes from WITHIN not without

    1. Paula
      March 15, 2024

      +1

    2. a-tracy
      March 15, 2024

      Dom, Hope not Hate page 35 has JR as the Radical Right. He has two marks against him, Jacob Rees Mogg four he’s the bad boy of the group, only him and Marco Longhi score 4 negative hits.

    3. Mitchel
      March 15, 2024

      “War is when your government tells you who the enemy is.Revolution is when you figure it out for yourself.”

  5. Donna
    March 15, 2024

    All the time you were speaking Sir John, the fiddles were playing in the background and “Rome” continues to burn to the ground ….. which appears to be the Not-a-Conservative-Junta’s objective.

  6. Iain gill
    March 15, 2024

    I would have mentioned intra company transfer visas, national insurance exemption for work visa holders, British passports being handed out just for working here a few years, etc as they are all part of the same problem.

    1. Timaction
      March 15, 2024

      The Tory’s record on immigration and their refusal to deal with it is the reason millions will never vote for them again. Illegal immigration, their refusal to turn them around the same day, failure to deport them, refusal to get out of the ECHR. The scams of low wage workers never going home, or limiting to timed contracts. Family reunions only ever in one direction, here. The student scams where its really a backdoor immigration line, known by all but not tackled after 14 years. The consequences of all this is massive. Health has collapsed, building everywhere, taxation through the roof to pay for them, not covid. Then there’s the culture, heritage and dilution of the Nation state, particularly the feeling of extended family, values, beliefs and behaviours in our own cultural boundaries. Then the audacity of the non Equality laws, DIE, ESG to legislate to factually reduce English men to second, third and fourth class citizens in their own former Countries. Sir John, YOUR Government is responsible and you must go, never to return for your betrayal.

      1. Lynn Atkinson
        March 15, 2024

        I think these activities are included in ‘extremism’. Certainly throwing NI away is included. What does one do when one’s PM is defined, by his own Government, as an extremist?
        Well, you can’t vote to return him for a start, or you are aiding and abetting Extremism – which is illegal.

  7. Roy Grainger
    March 15, 2024

    OT John, but I see you are mentioned by name in Hope Not Hate’s State of Hate 2024 report just released. Apparently you are part of the Radical Right that “is a dangerous challenge to Britain’s liberal democracy”. Congratulations !

    1. Mickey Taking
      March 15, 2024

      hilarious!

    2. Sharon
      March 15, 2024

      @ Roy Grainger

      I think that makes the vast majority of the population to be ‘far right extremists’ because we don’t agree with the far left’s ideologies!

    3. Everhopeful
      March 15, 2024

      The problem with revolutions
they grind awful small.
      As I said sometime around Cameron or May
lessons should have been learned from the French Rev.
      I see that “Conservative Woman” is also in the cross hairs.
      Nothing to do with JR
he is a Thatcherite stranded in a sea of Marxism ( my probably unpopular analysis open to correction)
      But this is where appeasement lands us.
      And the web has been woven so tight as to strangle and silence us all!

      I suppose it is just possible that ever new draconian laws could be imposed to divert attention from 
maybe
investigations of some sort?

      1. Mitchel
        March 15, 2024

        Lenin:”Revolution arises only out of a situation in which objective changes are accompanied by subjective changes,namely the ability of the revolutionary class to take revolutionary mass action strong enough to break (or dislodge) the old government which never,not even in a crisis ‘falls’,if it is not toppled over.”

    4. a-tracy
      March 15, 2024

      Thanks for sharing that Roy.
      “Now, in 2024, it is fair to say that Britain has a fully
      fledged Radical Right movement, with one foot inside
      the Conservative Party and the other outside.
      In May 2023, we witnessed the formation of the
      New Conservatives, a Radical Right group inside the
      Conservative Party which, in its own words, stood for
      “the realignment of British politics”. Led by MPs Danny
      Kruger and Miriam Cates, the New Conservatives has
      attracted the support of about 30 other MPs, including
      Sir Iain Duncan Smith, Dame Priti Patel, Sir John
      Redwood and Sir Jacob Rees-Mogg.
      The New Conservatives have called for “legal”
      immigration to be halved; substantial tax cuts; the
      abolition of the workers’ rights we have achieved
      whilst in the European Union; preventing young
      people who fail their A-Levels from securing loans to
      enter Higher Education; banning “gender ideology in
      schools”; and giving all parents the right “to oversee
      the Sex Education their children receive”.

      Reply I do not sign up to New Conservative ideas whatever they are

      1. a-tracy
        March 15, 2024

        I know, it’s good that you now know what these people are spreading about you.

      2. Michelle
        March 15, 2024

        Pritti Patel??? She’s responsible for a share of the mass immigration. Even in the article above, she talks of ‘bringing in’ entrepreneur’s (and I bet I know where from). Unless of course it was a slip of the tongue.

  8. David Andrews
    March 15, 2024

    I hope the House was full so your speech was heard by many MPs and not nearly empty.

    Re pensions the pay as you go system in place works, as I understand it, so long as there are enough people working to pay pensions to those that have retired. Over time demographic trends will cause the balance between cash coming in from contributions and cash going out as pensions to turn negative. What then? Like the looming problem with other social security benefits the political class is living in La La land, with their heads in the sand.

    1. graham1946
      March 15, 2024

      Re your second sentence, of course, whilst pensions are kept so low, the lowest in our orbit. It will take decades of the triple lock, which looks certain for the chop (it was not even discussed before this government welched on it 2 years ago) to bring it up to anywhere near a decent percentage of the average wage. The answer of course is the fabled ‘growth’ which no party has any idea how to implement. Things just get worse and worse whilst the tax burden is where it is and so many people are on the dole. This is a copy of the heads in the sand approach to our power supply over the last 30 years.

  9. BOF
    March 15, 2024

    ‘The reason it is so high is primarily the huge expenditure the country, by general agreement, incurred to tackle the covid lockdown.’

    Pushed into general agreement by pseudo science, propagated by charletons, many with pecuniary interests and pressured by the likes of Fauci and Gates. I recommend reading the detailed and fully referenced book, The Real Anthony Fauci by R F Kennedy Jr. to realise the scale of the criminality of the last four years, and many years before that. It is a book packed with hard evidence that should put those two in the dock.

    1. graham1946
      March 15, 2024

      Carefully constructed lies to divert attention from the real cause. Blaming covid over and over will not wash. As I understand it, they spent about 400 billion on that (a huge sum of course), but what about the other 1.2 trillion (i.e. 3 times as much) they have incurred over the last 14 years? The interest payments on that alone must be staggering. If they hadn’t had covid to blame, it would be so apparent that that poor management by the Tories is the main or only cause.

      1. Timaction
        March 15, 2024

        According to the HMRC, in the tax year ending April 23, 12% of all of my taxes (I don’t know if they mean all taxation or just personal) goes on debt interest payments and 0.6% on payments to the EU, 0.5% on foreign aid. Vast sums and totally wasted due to Tory Government incompetence.
        This Tory Government has proven it is is unfit to hold office and if elected again will carry on with the same policies. Einstein’s madness rule applies about doing the same things and expecting a different outcome!
        Nut zero, a total scam to control us, based on NO science but models and the life giving 0.04% bogus CO2 plant gas. Just look outside every day, 65 years of same seasonal but varying weather to me.
        Mass immigration of all sorts putting them before English people. More non Equality laws and rules to keep us quiet and discriminate against white English men and boys. Promotion of all minorities and types to the higher echelons to ensure same mindset and values but the collapse of health and public service provision. Blairs politicisation of those services and quangos unchallenged by the supporting One Nation Liberal Tory’s.
        More woke LGBT xyxz etc prioritisation. More propaganda teachings in our schools to promote THEIR agenda’s and beliefs. More alignment with their beloved EU betrayal Windsor sell-out, EU Environment and Equality legislation. No fishing returned.
        More taxation and spending on all things unwanted.
        So I’m going to vote for the one Nation Liberal Tory’s again…………………….said no one, anywhere, anytime in the future with a brain, unless they want more of this garbage.

  10. Walt
    March 15, 2024

    That’s a good speech, Sir John.
    IR35 or similar provisions were needed to curb abuse of the system, disguised employment, etc. However, periodic review is appropriate, including a check that the cure is not worse than the ailment.

    1. a-tracy
      March 15, 2024

      If IR35 is a brake – what would stop businesses from just making all workers into self-employed workers, no more national insurance 13.8% savings, no more workplace pension 3% savings (this is going to rise), no more holiday pay 28 days out of 262 10.7%, no more SSP provision and SSP holiday pay, less employer’s liability insurance cover, less payroll administration and the administration and system costs of running paye,

      1. Berkshire Alan
        March 15, 2024

        a-tracy

        Indeed few who are employed on PAYE realise the huge costs of running a business nowadays.

        1. a-tracy
          March 15, 2024

          I wonder if Labour and this version of the conservative party want to get rid of small businesses that engage PAYE workers, price them out. You are competing with large concerns who sub-contract everything and thus pay less tax, have less insurance cover, no pensions, no sick pay. I know a lot of people now who are paying attention to what is being promised, and wanting to give up.

          How is it in any government’s interest not to have someone collecting all the tax for them, taking over all the care and insurance and not having a host of expenses that self-employed people can claim that PAYE workers can’t?

  11. Sir Joe Soap
    March 15, 2024

    This panoply of tax issues, outstanding and partially addressed, reveals that there are no go areas and that they relate mainly to SMEs and the self employed on the one hand-IR35 is the archetypal one – and to providing false equality on the other – work towards non-contributory systems so that recent entrants to the workforce don’t get too upset.
    We can feel the direction of LibLabCon on this and we need an alternative to meet your vision. You’re preaching to the deaf and blind in this Parliament.

  12. Richard1
    March 15, 2024

    The abolition of the non dom status hasn’t generated much comment and it was of course a political move. But economically it is foolish. There will be tens of thousands of wealthy foreigners living in the U.K. who also drive a great deal of ancillary service business who will re-think their plans due to this. And many others not yet here who will change their plans.

    If you signal a substantial increase in someone’s future taxes and they are mobile, then obviously they will leave in large numbers. An even bigger impact, and one not discussed anywhere, is the impact of bringing these people into the UK’s inheritance tax regime. Inheritance tax doesn’t exist in most countries, and where it does, with a few exceptions, it is much lower than it is in the U.K. do we really think that a successful entrepreneur or investor is going to make a life here in the U.K. with the threat of confiscation of 40% of his/her wealth on death?

    Much more sensible – and I’d urge Conservative MPs to push for this – would be to increase the annual charge for non-dom status. Give it another name if you want to keep it off the political agenda. But eg ÂŁ100k pa would be reasonable and would ensure we kept many such people in the U.K. we will get far more in tax receipts and other economic benefits that way than if we drive them out.

    1. Lifelogic
      March 15, 2024

      Indeed economic lunacy but then we have had that under these Tories since Cast Iron and Osborne cam on stage. Major, Blair & Cameron disasters too.

    2. Mickey Taking
      March 16, 2024

      So you think ‘ There will be tens of thousands of wealthy foreigners living in the U.K’ who will leave ?

  13. Javelin
    March 15, 2024

    Getting rid of NI is to make pensions means tested. The problem is that millions of migrants live have l recently arrived and millions of people live on welfare. These people will not be able to afford to live on the level of pension they will receive. So the Government is going to rob people who have paid into their pensions to pay for them.

    1. graham1946
      March 15, 2024

      If you pay in, you should get the pension. Means testing is not the way to go. If people (few I would suggest) have more than adequate money, that is their good fortune – it will be taxed, just as it is taxed for the already struggling – this is what needs to be addressed – freezing the tax allowances is cowardly, they just don’t have the guts to admit they are over taxing and wasting money on all kinds of spurious nonsense. Their large increase in salary is of course affordable so they say, which in percentage terms may not look too bad, but when you consider that is roughly half the pension the poorest are expected to live on in one go it looks different. A nice ‘all in it together’ might be to forego the increase this year, but of course that is required to buiild up the pensions of the hundreds who will get the sack this year, so that won’t happen.

    2. a-tracy
      March 15, 2024

      Won’t they have a pension from where they came from and worked, oh wait! No. We’re seeing the lifeboat we sent out sinking with the weight of numbers because people have been too generous trying to take in everyone.

    3. Ian B
      March 15, 2024

      @Javelin – more of the Worlds Old as Criminal boat people will find their way here, free pension, free health whats not to like

      1. Lynn Atkinson
        March 15, 2024

        Free jabs! Must be made mandatory as the boats arrive. The full panoply.

        1. Mickey Taking
          March 16, 2024

          including sterilisation?

  14. Hope
    March 15, 2024

    JR, very good. But your party was taxing way before covid. Your speech hides the truth of the high tax big state, high regulated, EU lockstep economy. Therefore to blame all taxation on covid is very specious.

    Instead of scrapping EU laws and regulation, Sunak has implemented ECJ judgements through EU law into domestic legislation in stark contrast to what we voted for and what we were promised. Sunak betrayed the nation by his Windsor EU sell out agreement to make sure the UK cannot diverge from EU and be a free sovereign competitive neighbour.

    We are reminded in our tax bill itinerary that tax is still taken for EU payments!! I note no heading for illegal immigration? Why?

    1. Sharon
      March 15, 2024

      Hope

      I can still picture the tv screen, one half, Rishi Sunak exhalting the amazing Windsor Framework and what it meant for the UK …. in the other half, Von der Luyen pronouncing the opposite to be true.

      One of them was wrong.

  15. Hope
    March 15, 2024

    JR, very good. But your party was taxing way before covid. Your speech hides the truth of the high tax big state, high regulated, EU lockstep economy. Therefore to blame all taxation on covid is very specious.

    Instead of scrapping EU laws and regulation, Sunak has implemented ECJ judgements through EU law into domestic legislation in stark contrast to what we voted for and what we were promised. Sunak betrayed the nation by his Windsor EU sell out agreement to make sure the UK cannot diverge from EU and be a free sovereign competitive neighbour.

    We are reminded in our tax bill itinerary that tax is still taken for EU payments!! I note no heading for illegal immigration? Why?

    1. a-tracy
      March 15, 2024

      Because Blair and Brown signed up billions of ÂŁs worth of PFI agreements. Then, the fake boom-bust. All those people allowed unsecured, non-deposit mortgages suddenly owned up they couldn’t afford them and stopped payments – bang. Recovering from someone spending like Billy-O on your credit card takes years.

      I agree about Sunak and the Windsor EU sell out. That was his job.

  16. Ian Wraggg
    March 15, 2024

    The government want to collect more in taxation. NO we want the state to collect less and get off our backs. Stop this war on motoring and severely cut the welfare budget especially for those who won’t work.
    Stop funding hotels and accommodation for the boat invasion and Stop giving money to lobbying so called charities.

    1. Lifelogic
      March 15, 2024

      Indeed kill HS2, kill net zero, kill energy market rigging, kill duff degree subsidies, kill benefits for everyone who can work…

      JR correctly says “higher tax rates do not always deliver the extra revenue that Treasury and OBR planners seem to think they will” Indeed most tax rates in the UK are well about the Laffer point already. Not that the taxes should be anywhere need the Laffer point they should be far lower at the point that does maximum good for the people. Circa 20-25% of GDP is about right

    2. a-tracy
      March 15, 2024

      The left is going to take much more in taxation; aren’t you listening to their promises right now? They want the welfare budget to expand and more money for the economically inactive. Just follow Starmer or Reeves social media. All the promises to their unions are going to cost.

    3. Timaction
      March 15, 2024

      Indeed. Tents and meagre rations as in France then they won’t come. Especially if they’re turned back or returned the same day. Our useless Government talks Rwanda, the world laughs at the fools. A quiet revolution is coming to deliver our wishes not Westminster woke.

  17. Lifelogic
    March 15, 2024

    There is virtually zero reduction in the tax on jobs. Fiscal drag and other tax grabs wipe it out for most people.

    “The reason it is so high is primarily the huge expenditure the country, by general agreement, incurred to tackle the covid lockdown.”

    The absurdly long lockdown was moronic as should have been clear to experts (and was to many) even before the first lock down. The reason is any lockdown could only delay a few infections of these perhaps on in a thousand or so could be serious but 999 in 1000 were not and were free vaccination for the healthy and young. So overall it was net damage to heath outcomes by delaying free natural vaccinations. Vaccinations that were more efficient and far safer than the big pharma ones that came later. It also did vast damage to other health care, mental health, the economy, children’s education…

    Other reasons taxes are so high:- HS2. Net zero, endless government waste where ever you care look, soft loan loans for pointless degrees 750K net low skilled migration, hotels for illegal migrants, benefits for people who choose not to work, the ÂŁ400 million sick joke Covid Inquiry, the woke and diversity lunacy, overseas aid, pointless wars, people (not really) working from home much… Also taxes being so high exports industries and investment so they then go even higher in a doom loop!

    1. Lifelogic
      March 15, 2024

      So was the lockdown pushed worldwide to delay natural vaccination so they could sell more profitable, but very dangerous (as is now clear) new tech vaccines later? The “experts” even moronically gave them (indeed several doses) to young people and those who had had Covid already – so why?

  18. Dave Andrews
    March 15, 2024

    It’s not just IR35 rules that need looking at. The whole of employment law needs an overhaul. The sole trader whose successful business demands he expand with an employee or two suddenly discovers he’s supposes to be a legal expert in employment law. Even if he does nothing wrong he may well find his employees make a mistake and he’s liable for a thick wedge of compensation that may well finish his business.
    If A employs B and C and B discriminates against C, A is liable even if he did nothing wrong and nothing to encourage it. What is needed is if A employs B and C and B discriminates against C, B is liable not A. That way A can take disciplinary action without the fear of turning up evidence to hang himself with. Under the current arrangements it’s in A’s interest to cover up and deny as case C becomes his adversary.

  19. Everhopeful
    March 15, 2024

    Let us apply a good stress test
    And see which small set ups come out best
    Well shut down their shops
    And call in the cops
    One sale and we’ll have an arrest fest



    What a good idea! Great way to run an economy.
    And now we are all paying the price.

  20. Mickey Taking
    March 15, 2024

    so much for a low tax Party. So much for wanting to be prudent (apologies to Brown).
    What happened to the ‘ fix the roof when the sun shines’?.

    The Walker Brothers ‘The sun ain’t gonna shine anymore’ 1966
    Loneliness is the cloak you wear
    A deep shade of blue is always there
    The sun ain’t gonna shine anymore
    The moon ain’t gonna rise in the sky
    The tears are always clouding your eyes
    When you’re without love.

    1. Peter
      March 15, 2024

      MT,

      Tenuous links to the 1960s hit parade?

      ‘I can’t help myself’. Lifetime Conservative voters?

      ‘It’s the same old song’. Manifestos from the major parties since the year dot.

  21. Paula
    March 15, 2024

    Where is it written that the Conservative Party has a divine right to be a major party ?

    The Conservative voting bloodline ends with me this year and I’m sure this is true for very many families up and down the country.

    You have continually rewarded people who will never vote for you at the cost of those who should.

    1. Peter
      March 15, 2024

      Paula,

      Agreed.

  22. Everhopeful
    March 15, 2024

    I can’t really see how the treatment of small businesses over the years could have been about anything other than handing trade over to large conglomerates.
    It has worked as far as vets and dentists are concerned 
to the customer’s detriment.
    And as for all other businesses I can scarcely bear the wokery and utter inefficiency.
    I mean I couldn’t give a single rat’s ars* whether milk is delivered “sustainably” yuk yuk!
    I just want it to arrive drinkable
which it often does not!

    Oh dear
I feel a “Health Navigator” moment coming on. It is the lunacy that scares me
plus the looming poverty and starvation.

    1. Christine
      March 15, 2024

      Some of the Sustainable Farming Incentives currently on offer to farmers from Defra to reduce our food production:

      Get ÂŁ798 per hectare for flower-rich grass margins, blocks or in-field strips.

      Plant a pollen and nectar flower-mix and receive ÂŁ739 per hectare,

      Create a 4-metre to 12-metre grass buffer strip on arable and horticultural land and receive up to ÂŁ515 per hectare each year.

      Receive ÂŁ151 per hectare per year to manage grasslands with very low nutrient inputs.

      Get ÂŁ593 per hectare for legume fallows or ÂŁ102 per hectare for legumes on improved grassland.

      I think our politicians want us to starve. What a huge waste of taxpayers money.

      1. Mickey Taking
        March 16, 2024

        It doesn’t seem like Food Sustainability matters!

  23. agricola
    March 15, 2024

    SJR, can I recommend you read , Reform UK, our contract with you, pages 3&4, Economy Personal and Economy Business. It covers all the elements of an economy and means to achieve it that you frequently espouse. It also comes with a sense of determination and sincerity that I cannot recognise among most of the current members of the Commons.

    I can commend reading all 30 pages of this Reform Contract, you might find it reasuringly Conservative.

    1. Jade
      March 15, 2024

      The main points in the Reform UK Party document are simple: net zero immigration and tax cuts (corporation tax from 25 down to 15% over the next five years, abolish IHT for all estates below £2m, raising the 40% tax threshold from £50,271 to £70,000). But it also includes part-nationalisation of energy and water suppliers (50% shares to State, 50% to British pension funds). Overall that seems to be, according to polls taken these last two years, what the majority of voters want: lower immigration, tougher crime policies, public ownership of utilities, higher taxation of the wealthy and stronger workers’ rights.

      I am not sure that everybody wants a smaller state and to be an ‘entrepreneur’ and that by doing so the UK would go back being at the forefront of science developments. These last 20-30 years most of such developments have come from start-up companies, established companies or universities.
      Can a self-employed really be the creator of a new medicine, new robotics, new microchips, new adaptative control systems, new graphene-like material, new advances in genomics, 
 ?
      I doubt it.
      See sciencedaily.com and count the number of self-employed ‘micro-entrepreneurs’ in the last 30 (or more) days of reporting.

      1. a-tracy
        March 15, 2024

        Is Elon Musk self employed, what about Jeff Bezos, or Steve Jobs, were they all self-employed entrepreneurs or not? What about the craft queen from dragons den wasn’t she a self-employed entrepreneur and if she’s paying loads of tax what does it matter that it isn’t high tech.

    2. Lynn Atkinson
      March 15, 2024

      Reform is unelectable because of the threat of PR, which destroys the voters power to sack the Government forever.
      I prefer Starmer by a military mile.

  24. oldwulf
    March 15, 2024

    “The contributory fund is primarily for the pension, which is reflected in the fact that everyone in receipt of a state retirement pension—or in expectation of one when they get to the relevant age—will have their pension based on their contribution record.”

    “If we suddenly went away from such a system, we would need to answer the question: how do we settle eligibility for state pension?”

    People who are more cynical than me might question whether the abolition of employee National Insurance contributions and changes to state pension eligibility are part of a plan to move to universal basic income as recommended by the World Economiuc Forum ?
    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/04/covid-19-universal-basic-income-social-inequality/

  25. a-tracy
    March 15, 2024

    Your government is doing nothing to defend your record and remind people of the spending you took on. All the left talks about is the Mone and another ppe waste scandal (but I remember the attacks on tv every night from the NHS from the opposition parties saying you weren’t buying enough PPE fast enough, turns out they didn’t need that much) then there was the ventilator episode, the NHS and all the opposition we need more ventilators, that was facilitated, oh no they’re more dangerous we don’t need them.

    This loud chatter is drowning out the good life-saving support that was given, and your MPs just let it pass without a bite back.

    The ÂŁ1.57 billion support for cultural organisations, listening to Starmer yesterday, they’re telling the arts and cultural world your party abandoned them, and they’re going to make everything right. The SEISS loans for cultural workers out of work because you closed down their industry but it only went to those paying taxes the previous couple of years. The Universal Credit support for everyone not covered by SEISS or Furlough. Why the heck aren’t you reminding people of all these support payments. Lots of people never went back to work when furlough ended they took early retirement. Or they figured they were better off part-time claiming universal credit.

  26. Bert+Young
    March 15, 2024

    A lot of the “wishful” in your speech Sir John . The budget was an ill-conceived approach and the Conservative Party are faced with the sort of challenge now they are likely not able to overcome – certainly not when led by the Sunak/Hunt partnership . There has been a foolish and il-conceived process in allowing management of the economy to be heavily influenced by the BoE and the OBR ; their errors and mistakes have cost voters support and the chances of a come-back are minimal . I am amazed that so far the letters of no confidence have not reached the necessary proportion to bring about the change necessary .

  27. Ian B
    March 15, 2024

    Sir John
    You have given us a lot to absorb today, and far too much to be able to comment on effectively.
    You missed a bit on the VAT, yes by now the threshold should have been approaching the ÂŁ250K. But your Government, your PM and Chancellor have signed to keep the UK under the control of the EU for VAT among many things, as such they have made themselves powerless to do what is right for the UK.
    It is the same ole, same ole – the refusal to get Brexit done, by ensuring that the EU dictates UK policy that holds us back. As the EU stated at the time of the WA the UK is now their Colony.

  28. Ian B
    March 15, 2024

    Sir John
    As you will be aware as reported by Guido this week, internal Treasury briefings are making quite the case for a low-tax economy
    https://order-order.com/2024/03/12/internal-treasury-document-establishes-case-for-large-tax-cuts/
    So, it would not be unreasonable to conclude it is this Conservative Government that are either irresponsible, not thinking things through, or are the malicious architects of decline through high taxation.

  29. a-tracy
    March 15, 2024

    I’m going to be controversial here, John, but why should self-employed people not pay their fair share of the Countries National Insurance towards pensions. It’s not like they get less pension than a paid worker, in fact if they haven’t put up for themselves in the workplace pension 5% (8% in total for paye workers) they probably can also get pension credits when they retire!

    If the Employer’s NI was added to the Employee’s gross wage, then deducted from gross in a double hit, and the paye worker realised how much they are paying, the self-employed wouldn’t get away with it. The self-employed worker would then have to charge in for that portion of their pay, the same that any small employer has to price it in to their charges to engage staff and calculate their taxes for them.

    The small business owner is doing all the PAYE tax collection for the government for free, indeed they either have to pay their accountant to do this monthly or buy a software package as tax is digital and the online filing of forms, including the pension reports required by deadlines or you are fined.

    Rather large companies were engaging lots of people self-employed, they’ve now got around this with mini franchisees where three ex self-employed workers work under one umbrella so the large company isn’t responsible anymore and the chance of a small employer with a team of three getting picked up for IR35 is remote. Government just needs to get out of the way. Tax everyone the same. Get rid of Employer’s NI and get this put onto the Employee’s gross and collect it at the same rate off everyone.

    Reply Self employed do not have the same rights as employees. They do not get sickpay and paid holiday etc

    1. A-tracy
      March 16, 2024

      No, I disagree, the government doesn’t pay holiday pay or sick pay whoever charges the client has to pay it. Whether you are a one man band, a micro 2 person, or 5 – 50 person business. If you’re self employed you are responsible for paying yourself sick pay and holiday pay, how is that different to a small business person with three staff who have to pay for all those things? They price that into their quote so why shouldn’t the self-employed, in fact they do as they take holidays, my Dad when self-employed has insurance from the federation he was member of that he had to put up for and add into his rates.

      Why should you be able to undercut a small business in the same field by not having to pay employers NI or putting up for the sick pay, sick pay holiday and holiday pay?

      1. A-tracy
        March 16, 2024

        By the way I’d prefer the government to take back over sick pay and charge everybody a % on every £1 to get the sick cover, everyone in the same boat.

  30. Ukretired123
    March 15, 2024

    “It is an absolute pleasure to listen to my right hon. Friend. I want to reinforce his point about IR35 so that our colleagues on the Government Front Bench are clear about how important this is”
    Sums up why the SME army’s “Contribution” growing the economy and productivity was decimated after Gordon Brown and New Labour IR35 sledge hammer / chain saw cut through to the bone, egged on by big business and consulting lobbies to reduce competition.
    Your speech was very important emphasising the noble and fairness “Contribution Principle” which encouraged everyone however humble to turbo charging the economy under Mrs T.
    By contrast today many adolescents brag on the internet how they spend their feckless days. So sad that the “Education, education, education” has produced so little.
    Civil servants are upset and going on strike because they are asked to go into the office for 2 days!
    They don’t know they were born compared to our previous generations.

  31. glen cullen
    March 15, 2024

    The totalitarian net-zero dictatorship continues – I received this letter today from my energy supplier
    
‘’As part of this nationwide effort, all energy suppliers are obligated by the government to stall smart meters in their customers homes’’ 

    I will never vote Tory again

    1. hefner
      March 16, 2024

      moneysavingexpert.com 08/02/2024 ‘Can I refuse a smart meter?’
      ‘Smart meters are not mandatory unless yours is faulty or at the end of its life’

  32. SR
    March 15, 2024

    Dear Sir John,

    Congratulations on an excellent speech.

    Concerning lockdowns, though its successful delivery was a big achievement of the UK Government, I believe our furlough scheme had been pernicious in its long term impact. It made people idle and underemployed. There’s also a feeling of not being valued. Of course chefs and airline pilots went on furlough, but a for whole panoply of employees who were in a grey area, companies selected who was vital, and who to park in furlough – that’s not a nice feeling for anyone. It’s not surprising that its long term fruits have been so negative. Germany’s scheme paid people to remain working. I appreciate that took patriotic, teutonic restraint for companies not to just place all their employees on furlough (or perhaps it was policed in some way), but the end result seems to have been that people stayed working. Sunak’s big success has been, I believe, a failure in the long term.

    Regards,
    SR

  33. Peter Gardner
    March 18, 2024

    It was indeed quite right that businesses and individuals should have received state support during lockdowns. That is just part of the cost of fighting a pandemic; it requires a national effort. The fault that can rightly be levelled at the Tory and Labour Governments is that the UK was almost bankrupt when the pandemic hit as a result of the big state policies of both. By contrast Australia had very low levels of debt and could well afford such support. there was an outcrey when it threatend to blow up to 35% of GDP because of pandemic support – an outcry led by the anti-lockdown brigade as it was in the UK. What the Anti-Lockdown Brigade never take account of is the economic cost and personal misery that would ensue had there been no lockdowns. Of course the lockdowns in the UK could have been better designed and implemented but that is another matter and it is in any case irrelevant as there will never be another lockdown in the UK. Ever.

  34. Ralph Corderoy
    March 19, 2024

    It takes 35 years of NI ‘stamps’ to get a full state pension, ten to get any state pension. Say one reaches state pension age with no stamps and no savings to speak of, etc. What percentage of a full state pension would instead be available through various benefits? Given the full state pension wouldn’t have me sat in the lap of luxury, presumably there’s not much of a gap between the ‘bare minimum’ from benefits and the full state pension? If so, are the NI contributions rewarded adequately in that case?

    1. Reform_Now
      March 20, 2024

      If you’re referring to the difference between a full pension and the Pension Credit system I agree wholeheartedly. Pension Credit payments are effectively allowing those who did no work to have a “pension on benefits”.

      The other problem is having out-of-work benefits notionally paying tax NI. This means people on the dole are accruing pension entitlement while not working! These two problems in the welfare system are a major factor in the number of people economically inactive and not seeking employment. They are being handed a free pass, why would they bother?

  35. Reform_Now
    March 20, 2024

    I was disappointed to see a suggestion that Employers NI would be used to assess pension entitlement. The implications were not thought through.

    Not everyone pays Employers NI – notably, not the self-employed. So would they no longer have a pension in the author’s suggested scheme, or would they suddenly be paying Employers NI?

    As an overall effect of removing Employees NI, we would then see pensioners and others paying the inevitable higher income tax rates due to abolishing Employees NI and the self-employed hit with employment taxes. That seems to have invented the concept of a lose-lose scenario (unless you’re the Treasury of course).

    And the Conservatives wonder why they are losing the battle for hearts and minds. Sigh. Making enemies of your core vote is not smart – they see through the pretence that this is somehow “doing something good”. It’s yet another obvious tax grab. Why did the author not actually say this in his speech? What is he afraid of – the party whips?

    That assumes that the incumbents in No 10 and No 11 actually care about being re-elected and care about what the core vote think. The evidence, such as these actions, suggest otherwise.

  36. Reform_Now
    March 20, 2024

    Self employed numbers dropped from 2020-24 largely with covid as a catalyst.

    However, the 2021 changes were a major factor as we emerged from the pandemic, as was the abysmal lack of support for the self-employed compared to companies with employees. The self-employed got loans while the employed got handouts – even the loan eligibility was based on profits and many small businesses such as B&Bs try to minimise profits.

    The seeds of this were long-standing, as Patel said. I’m frequently disappointed to hear our host only in favour of reversing the 2017/2021 changes, but not IR35 itself. IR35 has been a blight on the self-employed since 2001 and needs to go.

    The new taxes on dividends, reduced allowances against that tax are also factors in people leaving self employment.

    At Autumn Budget 2021, the government announced that the rate of Income Tax applicable to dividend income would increase by 1.25 percentage point to 8.75% for the ordinary rate, 33.75% for the upper rate and 39.35% for the additional rate from April 2022.

    Individuals with taxable dividend income above ÂŁ1,000 in the tax year 2023 to 2024 and above ÂŁ500 from the tax year 2024 to 2025. Note that this was introduced relatively recently and the allowance was ÂŁ5,000 initially. It has now been eroded by 90% in just a few years!!! Stealth tax on steroids.

    Once again, I’m disappointed to see our host not arguing for repeal of IR35 and removal of many of the taxes on the self-employed who are forced to work through Ltd Cos.

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