My Interventions on the Public Procurement Motion (3)

59 Comments

  1. Ron
    May 15, 2024

    You are right but you could also have mentioned the role of the FCDO and their insistence we play by these theoretical international rules on not unfairly ‘subsidsing’ indigenous production. FCDO think we should play by these rules as we do in cricket! I jest not

    Reply
    1. Ian wragg
      May 15, 2024

      We’ll soon see which way the wind is blowing when the government orders the new Close Support Ships to replace Albion and Bulwark. What’s the betting they go to a French or Spanish yard for their hulls and Belfast for fitting out under EU supervision.
      These shysters can’t be trusted because any activity contravened net zero rules. Better the skilled and highly paid jobs are exported abroad

      Reply
      1. Hope
        May 15, 2024

        JR,
        Our last war ships are being built in…Spain! Your party and govt is beyond help. When considering procurement think of manufacturing, steel production, glass production, ceramics production given away to China and India because your party and govt somehow think it helps the planet to move all industry to these countries which are made from energy created by coal fired power stations!

        Please help me understand how the stupidity in your party/ Govt. works or is it so treacherous it puts our national interest last. The NHS is reputedly the largest employer, why has procurement not been addressed across the nation? How can it if your party has allowed NHS to be devolved? With your party creating regional devolvement through mayors, no one wants, it can only get worse. Any joined up thinking from your govt.?

        Today in the news the NHS will pay obese men £400 to lose weight while many cannot even get operated on for ailments through no fault of their own! A hernia operation does not pass the NHS functionality test for retired people, yet, your govt. will pay people not to be fat which is solely a personal choice! The functionality test being that a hernia does not stop a retired person going to work etc. So unless it becomes strangulated or bulge so much the retired persons quality of life is based on sitting around all day not to strain or agree are by movement! Atkins makes me weep with her sheer incompetence.

        How about telling fat obese people to eat less and exercise more because you will be barred from NHS unless you do so, same for drug addicts no methadone at pharmacies at taxpayers expense, same for alcoholics, same for smokers, same for people who need psychological help rather than operations to change a penis to a vagina? Oh, perhaps those multiple millions of welfare claimants your govt imported do not get free NHS treatment until they paid x into the pot or have private health care insurance? Hunt was going to sort that out.. but then did nothing.

        Reply
      2. Ian wragg
        May 15, 2024

        Today wind is generating 1.32gw and we’re Importing 22% of our energy mainly from France
        Northern Ireland under EU law and you reckon we’ve taken back control
        Marvellous

        Reply
        1. glen cullen
          May 15, 2024

          …and it will only continue, under this government (and labour)

          Reply
        2. Lifelogic
          May 16, 2024

          +1

          Reply
  2. Lifelogic
    May 15, 2024

    Exactly but we need to ditch the self inflicted lunacy of net zero and get reliable, on demand energy at US prices – circa 1/3 of ours.

    Reply
  3. DOM
    May 15, 2024

    I’m sure things will change for the worst when real Socialists come to power in November. If you think waste is bad now just wait for the real professionals who truly understand who to abuse the public purse for political and union gain. The weapon of public procurement will be used to threaten private companies to impose ultra-woke and union control over all the private sector

    Reply
    1. Lifelogic
      May 15, 2024

      We have socialists in power. In league with crony capitalists and v. dangerous organisations like the WHO.

      Reply
      1. Hope
        May 15, 2024

        LL,
        You cannot get a govt. contract unless signed up to the DEI, ESG, S.172 company Act. JR forgot that bit of extreme socialism and small companies cannot afford all the EU laws, regs, directives and the level playing field on state aid ie UK is not allowed to be more competitive than the EU but UK must still allow all EU countries to submit tenders!

        Let us not forget the border down the Irish Sea and checks on goods from one part of our country to another! How these unnecessary costs to small businesses the Tory party imposed on them? After claiming no British PM would ever sanction it!

        Reply
    2. a-tracy
      May 15, 2024

      I’m looking forward to the previous Tory council residents who stayed at home to make a protest against Sunak with their new labour council.

      Labour Councils have different priorities than tidying and planting up roundabouts and pretty verges, instead, you’re left with long weeds and broken scenes; they prefer wilding every verge in the Town with just a thin mown messy strip, leaving mown grass to rot like hay blowing everywhere and then growing in the roads, some roundabouts are left dangerous because the high weeds mean you can’t see approaching cars, add not cleaning curbs and drainways, leaving broken windows on the public buildings (more boarding up), not sending a pavement cleaner down as often, and it’s my town that elects most of them! I can’t think of one thing locally that has improved since 2019, but I see a lot that has worsened, and now they have more control.

      Council Tax on a band D £2237.10 band E £2734.23, and they still can’t manage their budgets, blaming central government for giving them less ‘in real terms’ even though thousands of new homes have been built, they’ve had over £1.2 million from the levelling up fund – new estates they’re building are just not finished, they take three times longer than the private estates. When they finish these estates, they really are left in a state of weeds waist high, old posts left to rot, roads unfinished, and buildings unfinished that get thieves in, so it costs more to put fencing and cameras up because they can’t be rushed.

      Reply
      1. Hope
        May 15, 2024

        ATracey,
        It is true the govt cut grants, however, councils deliberately fail to tell the whole storey. They get NHBC for every new house built based on square footage or old unoccupied house put back into residential use. They also get a reduced rate for new commercial property. Additionally councils also get Community Infrastructure Levy. As the name says for infrastructure, however, councils use it for anything including pet vanity projects. The person who introduced it was Nick Boles as community secretary currently supporting Labour. Boles introduced Reeves last week! So depending on your new homes build in your council area there are huge amounts of money from these two funding streams. Designed to force councils to build when Boles introduced his planning legislation reforms in 2010.

        Sadly you hear nothing from any of the Tory community secretaries to refute councils claims.

        Reply
      2. dixie
        May 16, 2024

        @A-Tracy – “wilding” the verges is exactly what the Conservative now LibDem-ish Wokingham council has been doing – except within the area of the town itself of course. Outside the town we have high weeds growing out of the curbs and mown grass left to clog drainage and promote more weeks and moss.
        The result is a state of neglect and disrepair despite increased rates.
        The disrepair of parks is downright dangerous with lift paths and free draining water that become ice patches in the winter.
        This can’t be because of lack of money – the council is able to spend large amounts in a questionable solar farm investment.

        Reply
        1. a-tracy
          May 17, 2024

          Our wilding is right through the centre of town, and by August, they are 5ft high. There’s not one nice planted area. We used to have a flower circle planted outside a church on a large roundabout, but it’s got smaller and smaller until it’s not worth planting up. Nearby towns get all the spending on flowers and plants, although I believe they’ve been budget cut since the last local election, too.

          They have local community punishment orders; why aren’t they scraping moss off paths, so many slippy areas, grass growth over tarmac making pavements half the width, and grit on all the pavements flicked off the roads?

          Reply
  4. Lifelogic
    May 15, 2024

    The Civil Service is trying to cover up the true scale of migrant crime
    If a social democratic, high-trust country like Denmark can publish data on migrant crime rates, there’s no reason why Britain can’t.
    GUY DAMPIER in the Telegraph.

    The Civil Service and this government they also trying to cover up the data & truth on the vast levels of Covid vaccine damage and the net harm done by the lockdowns, by large, low skilled immigration to wages levels and to the economy. Also endlessly lying on the vast costs and zero benefits of net zero.

    Also Unrepentant Bank of England refuses to learn from its failures
    Threadneedle Street’s distinct lack of contrition spells bad news for Britain’s future
    JEREMY WARNER and

    The Tory party has dug its own grave. Nothing will save it now
    The Conservative record after 14 years: highest ever taxes, highest ever immigration and a floundering economy. That is why they will lose
    TOM HARRIS

    Sunak and the Tories are still digging. Still 180 degrees out on almost every policy. Still failing on nearly all his pledges, still pushing the net zero lunacy.

    Reply
    1. Peter
      May 15, 2024

      LL,

      A triple “ x is surely right in today’s Telegraph’ post.

      Is this a first from you ?

      Reply
    2. Hope
      May 15, 2024

      LL,
      Met. Commissioner Paul Condon published the figures of crime, both victims and offenders, in the 1990’s the Tory party stopped it. The figures are on every crime report. May effectively made stop and search so difficult that police have effectively reduced/stopped using the power for fear of being labelled racist.

      New York Bill Bradnoch made compulsory touch downs, stop and search to us, by every police officer in New York on every shift and the murders, assaults, drugs, weapon crimes all went down! It turned Central Park from a crime ridden hell hole to a pleasant place. One article I read claimed many black parents would rather their children searched than dead. Compare to current lawless London where knife crime and deaths are a daily occurrence.

      We had the Tory gimmicks of three strikes and imprisonment guff all watered down and now non existent.

      Reply
      1. Hope
        May 15, 2024

        Bill Bratton police chief

        Reply
      2. Lifelogic
        May 15, 2024

        +1

        Reply
  5. Javelin
    May 15, 2024

    First rule of fighting is to know when you are in a fight.

    The civil service are your enemy. Treat them as such.

    Reply
    1. Sharon
      May 15, 2024

      @Javelin +1

      Reply
    2. Paula
      May 15, 2024

      Too late. The CS have killed the Tory Party.

      I doubt it will even exist the general election after next.

      Reply
      1. Hope
        May 15, 2024

        Jav,

        Not really accurate. Blaire politicised the civil service. This could have been reversed along with judiciary and all public sector appointments and promotions. Unfortunately the other socialist party in office for over 14 years gold plated the damage he did! Cameron boasting to be the heir to Blaire and preferred to hire former Labour ministers than conservative ones. What was really telling was when Portillo could not say he would vote for them and Widdecombe left the party she loved! On the other side Clarke, Boles Soubry, all former Cameron ministers, all currently supporting Labour! Cameron of course being Foreign Secretary tells you all you need to know about the Uni Party.

        Reply
    3. Original Richard
      May 15, 2024

      Javelin :

      Correct. I would also say the Civil Service are an enemy of the country.

      Reply
      1. Lifelogic
        May 15, 2024

        +1

        Reply
  6. Bill B.
    May 15, 2024

    I’d like to see more Tory MPs agreeing with you, Sir John, as well as this Labour MP.

    Reply
  7. BOF
    May 15, 2024

    Poor quality steel from electric arc furnaces using scrap metal will not make much defence equipment.

    Reply
    1. miami.mode
      May 15, 2024

      Agree. Usual rubbish from ministers that they totally agree with our host on almost everything and then do the opposite.

      Reply
  8. Old Albion
    May 15, 2024

    If you accept the madness of ‘net zero’ you will destroy all industry in Britain and you’re well on the way. Well done ………

    Reply
    1. Lifelogic
      May 15, 2024

      +1

      Reply
  9. Michelle
    May 15, 2024

    An excellent summary of why and how we have sunk so low.
    Perhaps it is why the EU were so keen to hang on to us, not just for the money, but they could rely on the British government of the day to stab their own people in the back, which seems much more honourable to them than to give some EU mandarin the English Archer salute!! We must follow the rules, while all others do what’s best for them. We play the rules of cricket on a field of rugby and wonder why we are so bloodied.

    Perhaps those former industrial towns should be told that the civil service does not rate industry. Seeing as how the civil service seems to be made up of liberal/left leaning types (or at least they seem to have the power) they ought to think carefully about who they vote for.

    Reply
  10. Roy Grainger
    May 15, 2024

    Steel is an interesting example though, who would choose to produce steel in UK with our Net Zero regulations and penalties ?

    Reply
    1. a-tracy
      May 15, 2024

      Someone willing to invest in windmills and solar nearby perhaps 🙂

      Reply
    2. Ian B
      May 15, 2024

      @Roy Grainger – there is no fear of that happening because BoJo’s collective cabinet is still controlling the UK’s destructions with laws they have made against the UK surviving. While the World marches on without this nose around their necks. France the home of the ‘Paris Accord’ can supply all the steel, the speciality steel, needed dependant on who has the political reigns at any moment in time, without affecting this Conservative Governments NutZero plans. How they can do it and we cant no one knows! Also apparently without effecting or upsetting the Worlds, the whole Worlds emissions outputs.
      We have the PPE Blob and Conservative Government at the fore front of the UK’s commercial survival – what could possibly go wrong?

      Reply
    3. Timaction
      May 15, 2024

      Not just net zero but all the ESG, DEI, s172 Companies Act. Drowning in taxes, regulations and wokery!! The Tory’s are bankrupting us.

      Reply
  11. Sir Joe Soap
    May 15, 2024

    Arts graduates aren’t drawn to science and industry.
    Arts graduates by and large run the civil service and government.
    That in a nutshell is why we’re here.

    The cardinal moment of the era was Brown opening the shiny new London Lehman HQ and giving honours to an RBS bloke while British manufacturing was being crippled on a high £ and punitive interest rates and business rates.

    Reply
    1. Ian B
      May 15, 2024

      @Sir Joe Soap – he and his mate TB, have a lot to answer for in the UK’s destruction. That has since been taken up with increase vigour and zeal by so-called leaders of the Conservative Government – we have Blair/Brown disciples continuing their destruction – even more Socialist, greater spenders, greater taxers.

      Reply
    2. a-tracy
      May 15, 2024

      I would like to know what the statistics are for that, how many STEM grads are employed in the civil service.

      How many female -v- male lawyers are working in The Crown Prosecution service compared to private practice and how does that balance up at the highest levels Management/Senior Management?

      Reply
      1. Lifelogic
        May 15, 2024

        If you are female if probably makes more sense for you to apply for a cushy state sector job!

        Reply
    3. Lifelogic
      May 15, 2024

      Indeed he also sold the countries gold at about 1/8 of its current value at a low in the market (25 years back). Even announcing it in advance to drive down the price first for good measure! For some reason I thought Gordon had read Economics but it seems he read history (at Edinburgh) did a PHD and then became a lecturer.

      “Some ideas are so stupid that only intellectuals believe them.”
      ― George Orwell
      A book I enjoyed is “The Definitive and Objective Analysis of Gordon Brown’s Decade as Chancellor of the Exchequer” by Vernon Coleman.

      Reply
  12. Hat man
    May 15, 2024

    I hope John Spellar MP continues to see the importance of ‘joining the real world’. He may then realise the absurdity of his claim that Ukraine is ‘on the frontline for freedom’. Corruption there is off the scale, journalists are in prison, as are political opponents of the regime, and elections have been cancelled. They were however held on the Russian side of the frontline. Project Ukraine has turned too many otherwise sensible people delusional, rather like Project Covid did.

    Reply
  13. Ian B
    May 15, 2024

    “That is exactly right. One of the arguments for buying steel from, mainly, Sweden—and possibly from France—was “We do not produce steel of that quality here”
    So, it is exactly right that this Conservative Government in paying with Taxpayer money for the closure of UK Steel Production this Conservative Government has deliberately and maliciously put the UK’s security at risk.
    Isn’t that what every one has been telling this Conservative Government all along? Isn’t that why everyone has been saying this UK Conservative Governments prescribed personal (they are not anyone else’s Laws, World or otherwise) laws of NetZero and off-shoring has put the UK’s existence in jeopardy. Are this Conservative Government suggesting that Sweden and France do not exist on this Planet and their pollution doesn’t does not affect this World?
    This Conservative Government and their personal made up Laws are designed to destroy the UK, as they have been destroying the UK for the last 14 years, now they are canvassing to get us to sign up for another lengthy 5 years of this malicious destruction

    Reply
    1. BOF
      May 15, 2024

      Ian B Nailed it.

      Reply
  14. Nigl,
    May 15, 2024

    Little Englander nonsense. Innovate, develop etc on an already stretched budget when we can buy ‘off the shelf’ from the likes of the US at a far cheaper unit price.

    As ever with politicians, other people’s money, so who cares?

    Reply
    1. Ian wragg
      May 15, 2024

      Buying from the USA means following their rules of engagement
      Did you know they won’t supply the codes or drawings with said purchases so we have to offshore maintenance
      Not a very good look when we should be producing our own equipment.

      Reply
    2. Ian B
      May 15, 2024

      @Nigl – can you define the price when your safety and security is totally with the whims of what ever political power is in charge of the Country that you don’t just really on but become dependant on for your very existence.

      Reply
  15. Richard1
    May 15, 2024

    If we had a firm rule that all defence equipment was to be purchased from UK suppliers wouldn’t that rather make a less competitive defence market, with a likelihood of even more cost overruns, white elephants, poor equipment?

    Reply
    1. Dave Andrews
      May 15, 2024

      High tax, high cost of living and expensive energy are already doing their bit for a less competitive UK defence market.

      Reply
  16. Original Richard
    May 15, 2024

    John Spellar :

    “Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah……and I fully support, and will continue with, should we win the next GE, the current administration’s policies of destroying the economy and wealth of the nation with Net Zero and our social cohesion, harmony and culture through mass immigration….until the country becomes totally unrecognisable….and…”

    Reply
  17. Bloke
    May 15, 2024

    Britain should defend its trade to defend itself.

    Reply
  18. Bert+Young
    May 15, 2024

    Larger companies do have the edge over smaller ones in bidding for business ; their systems enable them to use devices and methods at the expense of manual labour . On the other hand manual labour is more flexible and astute employers can exploit this particularly when smaller volumes of demand exist . Maintaining a consistency of employment during the past 3 years due to the reduction of economies has been difficult – hence the volume of people out of work ; this condition should influence Government action to stimulate and encourage and not to over tax .

    Reply
  19. a-tracy
    May 15, 2024

    We’ve accepted millions more young men into this Country, and we are going to give them the right to work here. It would have been done by now had Boris been in charge, so we need heavy industry and manufacturing for them to work in. Otherwise, what will they do? Deliveroo won’t pay for their accommodation, so you rarely see British nationals doing those types of deliveries. Keeping people idle is causing significant problems on our streets now: women being attacked out shopping by young men, rising bike snatches, vandelism, and intimidation. Ringing hands has got to stop and faster decisions and action need taking, if the home office workers won’t do their job you should have replaced them, all these big words and nasty regular comments in the press about Priti Patel (I read she removed targets!) and Braverman (Did she actually achieve anything at all for all of the reputational attacks on her personally?) and what did they do?

    Reply
  20. Ian B
    May 15, 2024

    Sir John
    “but we cannot be the universal donor.” That is clearly correct.
    “But they have still not broken the psychological grip inside the civil service”. So, is that
    Without mutual reciprocity UK wealth is being exported as a net loss. The Chancellor and his department the Treasury should be factoring in not the price but ‘the cost’ of all procurement.
    The Royal Navy’s much heralded new front-line ships, main structures being built in Poland and or Spain. Just photo opportunity at a UK yard for the assembly – not the manufacture. The Propulsion is to come from Germany. Electronics, sensor’s weapons controls has its ownership as the French Government. i.e.- the bulk of the taxpayer money is heading abroad. The price we as taxpayers are paying has precluded the loses of the trickle down or recirculation back into the UK’s own wealth creation, its economy, as would have happen if the end product was produced from UK Enterprise. In this case the price should have include taxes lost –therefore the real cost to the UK. As it stands the cost is far, far greater than the Chancellor or the Treasury would like us to believe.
    All that is without considering the loss of expertise, experience and the placing of the UK’s security at the whims of what ever foreign government has control of these much-needed elements at any moment in time – the UK, this Conservative Government will not be in control of UK defence.

    Reply
    1. Ian B
      May 15, 2024

      The media today is reporting that the £200 million ‘Promised’ and ‘Approved’ to support UK Royal Naval shipbuilding by Jeremy Hunt in December has been pulled. The money wasn’t really to build the ships just assemble the components being brought in from Spain -this is now not to happen with Spain now set to do all the work. The Conservative Government under Sunak & Hunt keeping you safe and secure. Who is the real threat to UK Security?

      Same report – ” a blow to Grant Shapps, the Defence Secretary, who just days ago hailed a “golden age of shipbuilding” in Britain.”

      Reply
  21. forthurst
    May 15, 2024

    The General Electric Company whose electrical engineering component is now owned by the Germans and others retained its military component which became British Aerospace. However, the GEC company was designed to maximise income for a minimum of delivery under the auspices of accountants parachuted into the constituent units replacing the English engineers that used to run them. Some of these managers are still in place. British Aerospace needs to be broken up into into its constituent parts with new management committed to serving its customers.
    The Civil Service likes the one-stop-shop for defence; it also likes foreign suppliers who can’t be monitored for either price or delivery. The egregious performance of our defence procurement is represented by the Ajax armoured personnel carrier which is an example of such a foreign procurement. Then there are the two aircraft carriers, larger than we have ever had before which are incapable of launching or trapping aircraft designed for marine deployment. The USA has many aircraft carriers as it lays claim to the Pacific and anywhere else where there is deep water; we have only a patch of the North Eastern Atlantic to defend which doesn’t require aircraft carriers and nor are we any longer a global power.

    Reply
  22. Dave Andrews
    May 15, 2024

    My experience of UK defence procurement is that when dealing with British companies they ask the impossible and get no bids.
    Their next step is to buy off the shelf American, which comes nowhere near achieving their fairy-land wish list.

    Reply
  23. The Prangwizard
    May 15, 2024

    News out that a Czech businessman wants buy the Post Office.

    If the gov even considers a sale will be an outrage. Proof that the Tories are happy to sell everything we have, and us too. Will be proof they are betraying our identity and security.

    Where are you on this Mr Redwood? I hope you don’t dodge it. You must not compromise. It is not a debating issue.

    Mr Sellars Labour MP made a good speech yesterday that doing this sort of thing ruins us in all manner of ways, and gave many clear examples. Short termism must be ended.

    Reply
  24. G
    May 15, 2024

    The loss of national steel production is a threat to national security at the least. The assumption of uniformity of present and future foreign supply chains is a very bad one.

    Crippling carbon penalties are the culprit. Again. As pointed out repeatedly on this site, outsourcing energy intensive industry to foreign countries as a method for improving carbon credentials is simply fraudulent.

    Reply
  25. hefner
    May 15, 2024

    28 new ships? to add to the 40 new hospitals?

    Reply

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