No to a Corbyn led government of national disunity and unreliability

The UK has given its word to the international community that we are leaving the EU. We have held numerous discussions with countries around the world based on our new future. Now Mr Corbyn wants to delay our exit and create confusion about what we might do. His own party remains riven between Remain at all costs MPs and accept the verdict of the people MPs. Now the Leader of the Opposition is showing he cannot reach out and attract the support of the Lib Dems or Change UK for a No Confidence vote designed to put him in Downing Street. The Lib Dems were right to pour scorn on the idea. If they change their minds they will be badly damaged by  the reality of “vote Lib Dem get Corbyn” .

Parliament’s choice this September is simple. Does it at last  want to do the right thing, honour the verdict of the referendum and allow us to leave the EU on October 31 as the government plans?  Or does it have a narrow majority of MPs who want to bring on an early election, going back to the people and telling them this Parliament is not fit for purpose, can’t make up its mind and needs to be thrown out? Were it to choose the latter it will be a difficult task for all those Labour MPs who stood on a Manifesto of leaving the EU to explain their about turn. It would mean any Conservative who had helped bring about such an election was unlikely to run again as a Conservative candidate. It means the near certain end to the Parliamentary work of those MPs who defected from their original parties and are now in Change UK in order to try to keep the UK in the EU.

This Parliament would go down in history as the worst ever if it opts to disband this autumn. Only getting us out of the EU as the two main parties promised in 2017 can now improve the reputation of this Parliament. This Parliament may anyway have left it too late to try to hold an election before we leave even if it could call one. Ironically only if the election is held after we have left does Labour have more chance of winning a decent vote share.

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  1. Pominoz
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:09 am | Permalink

    Sir John,

    I am afraid that this Parliament will go down as the worst in history, whether or not it is disbanded this autumn.

    An excellent illustration of the reasons why can been seen in a superb article entitled “Two Serious Strategic Mistakes” on Briefings for Brexit yesterday by Gwythian Prins, which focuses on the inherent dangers of aligning with Europe on defence matters, is well worth the 14 minute read. It highlights, once again, the ineptitude, and potential catastrophe, that was the May Government. I would recommend all to read and the relevant parties within Boris’s cabinet to give serious consideration to the issues it raises.

    The link, with your permission, Sir John, is:

    Thank goodness that Boris seems to be on track to deliver Brexit, which may help mitigate the disastrous reign of Mrs May.

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:17 am | Permalink

      Let hope Boris is not stopped from delivering what the people were promised by the many fake “Conservative” traitors – aided by the appalling Bercow.

      • Lifelogic
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:21 am | Permalink

        Nor to a government led by Ken Clarke or the appalling feminist dope and serial speeder Harriet Harman (as the dire Libdims suggest). More lefty pro EU, big state, lawyers are not what is required at all.

        • Lifelogic
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:09 am | Permalink

          We have surely had enough of pro EU, leftie, feminist dopes for a lifetime with Theresa May.

        • graham1946
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:33 am | Permalink

          I don’t much care for Clarke or Harman, but both have long careers in Parliament, (perhaps too long as they delusionally consider they know better than the electorate). How can two such long serving members be recruited by no-marks like Jo Swinson and Sarah Wollaston? They must be desperate to end their long careers in ignominy.

        • Martin in Cardiff
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:44 am | Permalink

          John, might I correct an implicit assumption of your piece?

          It is that Parliament is attempting to prevent the UK from leaving the European Union.

          If it ever were, it is not now. It is merely trying to prevent the catastrophic consequences of its leaving without sensible arrangements in place, as ALL the Leave campaigns had said there would be, incidentally.

          It is, as Dominic Cummings suggests, the ERG who have in fact prevented that so far, isn’t it?

          ReplyNot so. The Withdrawal Agreement is not leaving and was rejected by the overwhelming majority of people

          • Martin in Cardiff
            Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:56 pm | Permalink

            Thank you John, but there was no question on the ballot paper as to what the post-exit arrangements with our former partners should be.

            There has been no referendum on the Withdrawal Agreement, so I do not see the basis of your claim that “the people” rejected it.

            Since the UK would no longer be a party to the Lisbon Treaty, it is beyond me how anyone can reasonably say that it had not left the European Union too.

            The UK has obligations under many international treaties, notably re NATO.

            Since members of the ERG claim that “simple solutions” exist to the Irish border question, then why not merely implement these, which would promptly end the backstop?

            It is because these “simple solutions” do not exist, isn’t it?

            Reply The simple solution is to leave and have a relationship with the EU like many other independent countries. Mrs Mays Withdrawal Treaty was put to the people in the European election. Only the Conservative candidates supported it and they got 9% of the vote . Looks like a comprehensive rejection to me.

          • Martin in Cardiff
            Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:23 pm | Permalink

            I refer to John’s reply to my earlier comment.

            As you know perfectly well, people had many reasons for voting the way that they did during those EU elections. It was far from a single-issue vote.

            At that time, not many people thought that there would not be a deal of some kind either, but the circumstances are different now.

            John, those other, independent countries were not starting from where WE are, that is, with trying to preserve about twelve percent of their GDP, which stems from present financial ties with the European Union. Nor are they generally so close physically as to require uninterrupted access to its infrastructure.

            But you know all that too, don’t you?

          • NickC
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 11:36 am | Permalink

            Martin, The Referendum was a single issue vote: Remain or Leave. No conditions were attached to the Leave option, and all possibilities – including WTO trading – were debated.

            A withdrawal agreement is not a requirement of the TEU Art50 process, and the EU has refused to negotiate a trade deal. So the only option left, which complies with the Referendum Leave decision, is to trade with the EU under WTO rules.

          • tim
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 3:29 pm | Permalink

            It is very important to note that Parliament’s legal intention for the UK to leave the EU is not conditional upon a withdrawal agreement. No deal allows the UK government to scrap thousands of import tariffs on non-EU imports, which will reduce prices; to save £39billion; to regain control of fishing and to increase the level of democracy in the country.”

        • Hope
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:40 pm | Permalink

          I am mystified why MPs think the public will tolerate them making up a Govt. we did not vote for and comprised of Remain MPs who lost the vote to leave the EU and will not accept democracy!

          I would be happy to join civil disobedience protest to oust all those from parliament to prevent this taking place. This rotten core of MP twerps failing our democracy are taking advantage of our good nature- our patience will not last forever despite what they might think.

          Time for Wollaston types to be ousted from parliament. They serve no public purpose or mandate to hold office.
          Trump fulfils promises made!

          • Martin in Cardiff
            Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:55 pm | Permalink

            The people of this country never vote for a government.

            It is at the discretion of the Prime Minister, which ministers to appoint, and the people did not even get to vote for the party with Alexander Johnson as its leader, never mind for him personally as PM.

            And yet some people complain about the European Union as being “undemocratic”, where every senior official at least has to meet the approval of its parliament.

          • NickC
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 11:43 am | Permalink

            Martin, No system exists which satisfies everybody. But your notion that the EU is democratic is risible. The demos in the UK elects each government. There is no EU demos, and no mechanism in the EU for even a possible EU demos to elect the EU government.

            If a UK government removes any of your rights then you, as part of the UK demos, can hold the UK government to account. That is not possible in the EU. If the EU takes away your rights (like your right to help decide how many immigrants come to the UK), you cannot do a darned thing about it.

          • libertarian
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 12:41 pm | Permalink


            It would help if you knew what you were voting for

            The leader of a UK party has to meet the approval of our parliament too. Why do you think the deranged despots of remain are trying to drag together enough numbers to vote against Johnson

            I love people like you that have never said a peep about our party system before until it produces something you hate

            Get back to me when the citizens of EU countries are asked about being members because so far everyone that has been asked has rejected the EU

      • Bob
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:40 am | Permalink

        If Boris really wanted Brexit he could instruct govt lawyers to declare “no contest” to Robin Tilbrook’s case before the High Court asserting that the extension to our membership of the EU was illegal.

        Invocation of Article 50 requires that membership cease with immediate effect or if a withdrawal agreement is to be negotiated the leaving date could be extended up to two years maximum. The Withdrawal Act never granted the PM authority to extend membership beyond 11 p.m. on 29th March 2019.

        The MSM are not reporting news about the case.

      • Simeon
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:48 am | Permalink

        We might think of them as traitors, but I suspect that BJ sees them as valued colleagues and representative of a section of the electorate that are true blue Conservative. I think BJ wishes to sort out Brexit (whatever exactly that means) and then re-unify the party around a One Nation agenda. People like Grieve are, I’m sure, seen as being part of the future of the Conservative party, post Brexit (whenever that might be, because Brexit doesn’t simply go away, whether the UK leaves with no deal or revokes Article 50). The Conservative party is a centrist party, has been for many years, and I think is likely to continue to be so for the forseeable future.

    • Fred H
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:41 am | Permalink

      Pom . . .your first statement says it all.

    • Chris
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 1:54 pm | Permalink

      Thanks Pominoz.

    • ukretired123
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 2:52 pm | Permalink

      Pominoz thanks – the link was profound, timely and the philosophy of Theodore Roosevelt’s foreign policy: “speak softly and carry a big stick.”
      The same applies to Brexit leverage:
      The EU fear the big stick of no-deal far more since their very survival is now seriously at risk – all without any shot being fired or war.
      The silver bullet is leave.
      All May’s magic wands have dismayed like sticking plasters inefficient and ineffective.

    • Anonymous
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 4:01 pm | Permalink

      You think they were ‘mistakes’ ???

  2. Ken Smith
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:19 am | Permalink

    There is a large majority of MPs against no deal (because Leavers ruled it out in 2016). So it’s pass Mrs May’s deal or give Corbyn a chance. Your choice

    • Mike Stallard
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:14 am | Permalink

      Mrs May’s “deal” is a Diktat.
      Give Corbyn a chance is a serious error and let’s not pretend otherwise.
      Me, I wanted to stay in Efta/EEA and go from there.
      Now it is out or in.
      So I’m out.
      And the EU is going to decide, not you or me, anyway.

      • Martin in Cardiff
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:50 am | Permalink

        It’s always been in or out Mike.

        The debate is now about what kind of “out” it might be.

        The absolutists will just keep moving the goalposts, however. Only the most hostile relationship with the European Union would please them, ideally carpet-bombing all twenty-seven countries, it seems in some cases.

        They are clearly mad, and should therefore be ignored.

        • Edward2
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:14 am | Permalink

          Ridiculous nonsense Martin.
          Unsubstantiated slurs on people who feel no deal is better than a bad deal.

        • NickC
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 11:49 am | Permalink

          Martin said: “It’s always been in or out …“. Indeed it has. Perhaps you should remind that other Martin in Cardiff above, who seems to think the Leave vote means being only partly out, entirely at the whim of the EU, because he won’t accept that the WTO trading arrangement is valid.

        • libertarian
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 12:49 pm | Permalink


          Get back to me when you actually run a business employing many people and trade internationally

          So far every post you’ve made has been factually incorrect

          Both the EU & UK parliament rules state that we leave within a specified time frame whether we have a trade deal or not. The default position is to trade as do the other 100 odd countries in the world , including the worlds two biggest markets USA and China .

          The EU to which you refer is a politburo made up of few self appointed oligarchs . Europe is a continent of 54 countries with whom we will have very cordial relationships and continue to trade , visit and enjoy . NO MATTER WHAT the sad old stale, failed , corrupt geriatrics at the EU think or do

      • David Maples
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:52 am | Permalink

        Decide what Mike?

    • Dominic
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:32 am | Permalink

      Germany, Jan 1933. Learn from history.

      Sit back, assess your own advice in a calm and thoughtful manner and then you’ll conclude that what you’re suggesting is indeed the end of the UK as we know it though I suspect you’re a Sockpuppet

    • Pominoz
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:35 am | Permalink

      Leavers voted to leave. It is first necessary to leave before any deal can be considered.

      So what you have written is utter rot

    • Denis Cooper
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:39 am | Permalink

      So they should not have passed the European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Act 2017 without any safeguard against withdrawal on a no deal basis.

      “The fact that the Bill, completely lacking any kind of safeguard against a “no deal” exit as it did, passed its Third Reading by 494 to 122 … must call into question what on earth 176 MPs out of the 298 who voted against leaving the EU without a deal yesterday thought they were doing, apart from demonstrating their own incompetence and/or duplicity.”

    • matthu
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:51 am | Permalink

      Cameron, Osborne, grieve all warned of the dangers of No deal. Their fear mongering was ignored. Get over it.

    • Peter
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:04 am | Permalink

      There is a determined band of Continuity Remain who wish to thwart the result of the 2016 referendum. No Deal was never ‘ruled out’ . It was not on the ballot paper.

      May’s Surrender Agreement is dead in the water and has been for some considerable time.

      The question now is whether Boris Johnson’s government can deliver on leaving at the end of October, or whether Continuity Remain have any effective tricks up their sleeves to stop him.

      Splits among the rebels and an inability to band together (so far) suggest they have a difficult task, but it is still early days. So we can only wait and see.

      • Henry Jailer
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 5:26 am | Permalink

        Peter, you are right that leaving with no deal was not on the ballot paper, but nor was leaving under Mrs May’s terms. Both are leaving and both are plausible interpretations of the result in 2016. Anyone blocking Mrs May’s deal (like John Redwood) is not thwarting the result of the referendum, they are instead pressing for their preferred version of leaving. Equally anyone blocking no deal (like Hammond, Grieve, Wollaston etc) is not thwarting the result of the referendum, they are instead pressing for their preferred version of leaving. Of course we should have decided what leave really means in 2016, but we didn’t, and that is why we are having the debate now. And it looks increasingly clear that no single version of leaving can command a majority

        • Jiminyjim
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:15 am | Permalink

          Nonsense. Hammond, Grieve etc’s preferred method of leaving is either a) not leaving or b) leaving in a way that looks like leaving and is dressed up as leaving, but is in fact remaining.

        • NickC
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 11:59 am | Permalink

          Henry Jailer, Rubbish. Theresa May’s dWA was simply an alternative treaty to keep us locked under the control of the EU. Her dWA kept the UK subservient to the EU’s CAP, CFP, SM, CU, CCP, CJEU, Defence union, and paying money, without even an exit clause.

    • Simeon
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:29 am | Permalink

      Not a difficult choice to make given the WA leaves the UK in an even worse position than if we remained, whilst Corbyn is simply proposing to legislate for an election.

      • graham1946
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:38 am | Permalink

        My fear is that if he gets in, even just ‘temporarily’ his hard line crowd behind the scenes will just use the situation for their own ends. We may never seen another General Election if that happens. As Dominic says above, its been done before.

        • Simeon
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:32 pm | Permalink

          I can’t see how Corbyn could enact an actual coup. He has no popular mandate and he certainly cannot enlist the military. He would have only Parliamentary power, and this dependent on the support of remain MPs, the vast majority of whom are as opposed to his policies as you and I are.

          I don’t think he will become PM anyway. Instead it will be some compromise candidate acting purely as a figurehead, and with strictly limited power to enable specific legislation. The identity of this PM should not be relevant. They are simply a representative of the remain faction.

          • graham1946
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:51 am | Permalink

            ‘Only Parliamentary Power’

            That’s all that is needed. An armed coup like some nations have is not necessary. A Bill in Parliament to ban elections is all that is required. Far fetched, of course, but possible. They managed to change electoral law to enable the Fixed Term Parliament Act in order that the Tories and LibDems had a five year go in power, rather than risk being chucked out earlier. It does not pay to put head in sand where certain people are concerned.

          • Simeon
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:22 pm | Permalink

            Corbyn couldn’t get a majority of his party to vote for that, let alone a majority in the House. Amongst the MPs most concerned about a Corbyn government are MPs in his own party. And besides, Corbyn is almost certainly not going to be the figurehead because in a cross party effort that job will fall to a compromise candidate. Corbyn presents no imminent danger to the country.

      • Martin in Cardiff
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:58 am | Permalink

        Of course it does Simeon.

        Every possible version of ceasing European Union membership is worse than the optimal, privileged arrangements that the UK presently enjoys within it.

        It was one of The Big Three with France and Germany, with enormous influence, and a share of sovereignty over twenty-seven countries of half-a-billion people.

        • Simeon
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:39 pm | Permalink

          That’s your view which you have expressed already. For those that value self-determination and desire to see real political change (undoubtedly a majority in the country) that membership of the EU profoundly inhibits, remaining is clearly sub-optimal. I would guess that you personally do rather well with existing arrangements. Most either do not, or desire the ability to make their own laws and truly hold their politicians to account.

        • Jiminyjim
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:18 am | Permalink

          ‘Enormous influence’? You gain the prize for the funniest comment on this website in the last week!

        • NickC
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 12:06 pm | Permalink

          Martin, We don’t want “a share of sovereignty over twenty-seven countries“. We don’t want them sharing sovereignty over us. What we want is self-determination – you obviously haven’t heard of it, even though it is a UN designated human right.

          Every possible version of leaving the EU (provided the EU no longer controls any aspect of the UK) is better than remaining in as a mere province of your corrupt, dirigiste EU empire.

    • Ian Wragg
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:32 am | Permalink

      Rubbish. Mays deal is vassal status in perpetuity.

      • Martin in Cardiff
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:01 am | Permalink

        Incorrect. However, No Deal is grovelling lackey status to the US and to other major powers, including the European Union, in perpetuity.

        • cornishstu
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:25 pm | Permalink

          First off any WA is not a deal. Secondly, how are we US lackeys? The so called no deal aka leaving on WTO terms gives us sovereignty, so we are in control of our own destiny i.e we can accept or reject what we like or do not like without having to fall in with the consensus of currently 27 other nations. What will you lose if we leave on WTO terms?

        • NickC
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 12:19 pm | Permalink

          Martin, You are the one who doesn’t want independence. So why are you so frightened of the USA controlling the UK? Since you have given up the principle of independence already, it makes sense to look around for the best available overlord, rather than just blindly subjugating ourselves to the EU.

        • libertarian
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 12:53 pm | Permalink


          With each of your posts you reinforce your complete ignorance of international trade .

      • Chris
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 2:41 pm | Permalink

        Quite right, IW. This needs saying again and again as it is obvious that many have still not digested its contents nor understood its consequences for this country.

    • Pud
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:33 am | Permalink

      Ken, your ballot paper must have been different to mine. On mine, I ticked the box marked “Leave the European Union”. It didn’t have an option “Pretend to leave the European Union on a treaty that puts the UK in a worse position than staying in”.

      Remain supporting politicians told us leaving the EU would mean leaving the Single Market and Customs Union and in 2016 Philip Hammond said “For anyone who wants to ensure a clean break with the EU, the WTO is the only honest model.”

      • Chris
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:51 pm | Permalink

        Pud, Cameron also said that if we voted Leave it meant that if no agreement were reached after 2 years we would be out, trading on WTO rules. “The clock would be ticking…”

        • Henry Jailer
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 5:28 am | Permalink

          But Cameron lost. It is irrelevant what he said or says. The winners – Gove, Johnson, Davis, Paterson – all said clearly we would do a deal and keep the same trade benefits

          • Edward2
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:18 am | Permalink

            Benefits like a £90 billion trading deficit, huge numbers of regulations, andirectives,
            Damaging protectionist tariffs on poorer nations and having to pay tens of billions a year to the EU every year just to be a member.

          • NickC
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 12:30 pm | Permalink

            Henry Jailer, Do you know what “lose” means? It certainly doesn’t mean that the statements made by Cameron, Hammond, Grieve and Osborne can be white-washed out of existence. That would be rather Soviet of you. Especially now that two of them are lying about what they themselves said before the Referendum as they try to prevent Leave being implemented.

    • A.Sedgwick
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:51 am | Permalink

      Leavers did not rule it out in 2016.

      The TV and printed evidence is endless with Remain/Government/BoE/EU propaganda confirming we Leave the Customs Union and Single Market, which is the EU, by voting Leave. What you and other democracy deniers do not realise is that you cannot be a little bit pregnant.

    • Robert mcdonald
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:58 am | Permalink

      We all know this no to “no deal” is the latest remoan scam .. no “no deal” means any deal will do and that means remain with even less influence in the eurocracy than we had before. There is a proven majority of the people in favour of leaving and EVERY conservative and EVERY labour MP was elected on the basis of their promise to implement the referendum result and leave. If the majority of MPs now want to be proven liars then watch this space at the next election, No choice.

    • Roy Grainger
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:28 am | Permalink

      You must have had a different referendum ballot paper to me, mine didn’t say anything at all about ruling out leaving without a new international treaty. Your memory is faulty.

      • Andy
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:17 am | Permalink

        Your ballot paper at the 2017 general election did not mention the word Brexit either – just a candidate and a party. You picked the candidate based not just on their name and their party but on what they told you their beliefs and polices were. The same applied in the referendum. The country voted narrowly to leave on the terms promised by Vote Leave. If you think otherwise then your memory is faulty.

        • Edward2
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:03 pm | Permalink

          Your first point on the 22017 election
          Read the manifestos
          Your second point on the referendum
          Read the Leaflet.

        • NickC
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:04 pm | Permalink

          Andy, As determined by Parliament and the government, no terms or conditions were on the ballot paper or in the 2015 Referendum Act. Remain was subject to the terms negotiated by David Cameron. The government promoted Remain in a taxpayer funded booklet and therefore its promises are binding.

          The main VoteLeave leaflet (“5 Positive Reasons …”) did not even mention a trade deal, never mind advocating one, merely saying the UK would continue to trade with the EU. VoteLeave did not, and could not, offer terms or promises because it was not, and did not become, the government; it was not standing at a general election, and did not offer a manifesto.

    • Stephen Priest
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:36 am | Permalink

      The Government of Headless Chickens

    • Original Richard
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:43 am | Permalink

      Mrs. May’s “deal” was not leaving but a treaty where we would have accepted EU laws, budgets, taxes, fines and policies (trade, energy, environment, foreign, immigration etc) but without representation or veto and with no lawful means of exit – a Treaty described by Mr. Verhofstadt’s staff as reducing the UK to EU colony status.

      Even many clauses applying to the UK which did not apply to the EU.

      A treaty where Mr. Macron described the UK position thus :

      “The UK will be trapped in a customs union after Brexit unless Downing Street offers European fishermen full access to British waters during the coming trade negotiations.”

    • Lorna
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 12:36 pm | Permalink

      Leavers ruled it out? Ridiculous .
      Cameron ,Hammond and Osbourne made it clear that WTO was inevitable if a deal was not agreed with the EU.
      Renaming it No Deal,does not change the Act of Parliament making WTO the default

    • Woody
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 12:52 pm | Permalink

      And the remain cabal keep saying the leave campaign was won on a lie ? And then I read that utter tripe from you. The leave vote was about leaving and it was the project fear remain side that “warned” of a no deal option.

  3. Ian Wragg
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:21 am | Permalink

    Hold on Boris. Be a hero.

    • jerry
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:30 am | Permalink

      @Ian Wragg; Don’t you mean;

      Hold on Boris. Pry like there’s no tomorrow, there might not be! 🙁

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:33 am | Permalink

      Indeed Boris must see off (and expunge) the many appalling traitors from his own party and then he must win a majority for a real small government Conservative government. Rather than the appalling pro EU, tax to death LibDim they have been for very many years (while just pretending to be real Conservatives before elections and reverting the day after).

      Not an easy task but I think he can do it, the country is crying out for it after all.

    • Chris
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 2:49 pm | Permalink

      It is within Boris’s grasp, but like most our politicians he has been so used to taking orders from the EU that he seems to have lacked the vision, enterprising spirit, and confidence necessary for taking the UK forward out into the wide world, back in charge of its own affairs again. For too long we have hidden behind the skirts of the EU, fearful of venturing out, lulled into an inertia , and robbed of our self belief. Boris, seize the chance. This will be the only opportunity to free this country, and you could also make a name for yourself in history, if you make a success of it. It is entirely within your grasp. If you fail, it will be due to a lack of courage, conviction and principles.

  4. Mark B
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:24 am | Permalink

    Good morning

    The plan is very simple. To kick the Leaving can further down the road. If a no confidence vote is held and the government falls the PM may well seek to have our Leaving date further put back. I say may as there is nothing in law to compel him to do so.

    Jeremy Corbyn MP is trying to engineer a coup. He wants to replace this PM and government without the need to ask the people. Not surprising given his political roots.

    A GE is what I want and have called for for most of this year. It is the only way that we can rid ourselves of the Vichy Remainer MP’s and their parties. Finally our kind host now sees that and this needs to be said fat and wide.

    • Ken Smith
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:16 am | Permalink

      Mr Corbyn’s plan is simply to follow the procedures set out in the Fixed Trrm Parliament Act. It is ignorant to call it a coup, it is fully authorised by statute

      • Fred H
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:44 am | Permalink

        he’s a lame duck doing a lot of quacking.

      • 'None of the above'.
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:44 am | Permalink

        In that case, I hope you accept that the PM may call a GE on a date of his own choosing. Authorised by statute namely “The Fixed Term Parliament Act”.

      • L Jones
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 2:45 pm | Permalink

        I think most of us have got your measure now, Mr Smith.
        Your weasel words about our referendum result shows us exactly where you’re coming from. You’re not being clever or persuasive, but only typical of a remoaner.
        You don’t tell us why we should wish to remain under the heel of your EU masters (as per the WA), but feebly attempt to insinuate that we shall be punished (by them or Corbyn) if we don’t wish to.
        You remoaners don’t do yourselves any favours.

        • Mark B
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 5:05 am | Permalink



    • Alan Jutson
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:23 am | Permalink

      Mark B

      It can only rid it selves of Remain Mp’s if they are not allowed to stand by the Party concerned, the only other alternative is to vote for a Brexit Party candidate.

      Surprise JR only indicated they would be only be, unlikely to run again.

      People like Grieve et al should simply not be allowed to run under a Conservative banner at all at any forthcoming election, that is if they are not deselected by the local association before then.

      Given the number of Conservative Mp’s who are now openly saying they will support Remain at all costs, and possibly vote against Boris, the Government does not have a majority at all, and will need to rely upon Labour Leave supporting Mp’s.

      What a bloody mess Mrs May created with her absolutely pathetic form of leadership.

      • Mark B
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 5:11 am | Permalink

        This is why I proposed revoking Art.50 but making it a government 3 line whip against, plus a confidence vote. If the government falls then there has to be a GE. And who gets to choose the date ? 😉

        If the Conservative Vichy Remaniers vote against, their out ! And a Conservative manifesto which ALL candidates must sign up to with a commitment to Leave the EU without signing the WA, would see a Conservative majority especially if a deal with the BP was done. It just takes a brave PM to do it.

        • Simeon
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:35 am | Permalink

          Good morning.

          Although there is a majority against no deal in the Commons, there is definitely not a majority in favour of revoking Article 50. Even the Lib Dems’ policy is to seek a second referendum in the hopes of securing a mandate to revoke Article 50. Unfortunately, the vote you propose wouldn’t solve anything. Revocation of Article 50 would be rejected, but this would not result in acceptance of the no deal Brexit. The government would still face a vote of no confidence and lose.

          (I should note that my thinking on how this all plays out rests on the assumption that those against no deal can produce a figurehead to unite around. This should be straightforward, because an emergency PM doesn’t actually wield any power other than that to perform the small task agreed. It would be hilarious if remainers couldn’t unite sufficiently to simply put Brexit on hold for a brief moment, given the accusations of disunity amongst leavers from remainers. I think if I were a remainer and those politicians representing my interests failed so spectacularly to defend them, I’d be furious, but then I think I might simply be resigned to accepting that Brexit is inevitable.)

        • BillM
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 10:11 am | Permalink

          Surely Art 50 cannot be revoked unless by new Act of Parliament?

    • Shirley
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:42 am | Permalink

      Who can we trust? Both main parties promised to respect the result of the referendum. Why should we trust their manifestos? I’ll bet there is a video of clip of almost every Remainer saying they would respect the result of the referendum in the run up to the 2017 GE. They lied and obtained their seats through fraud. What makes you think they will be honest now?

    • Narrow Shoulders
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:09 am | Permalink

      I dispute your use of the word coup.

      UK legislation allows the party commanding a majority in the House to rule. The fixed Parliament act requires a two thirds majority to call an election. MPs wishing to remain sitting in leave constituencies are unlikely to vote for dissolution.

      Not a coup, the product of unintended consequences.

      It is up to our new Prime Minister to command a majority.

      • Mark B
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 3:58 pm | Permalink

        Thank you for your polite and informative reply.


    • Simeon
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:24 am | Permalink

      Good morning.

      To be fair to Corbyn, he is proposing to lead a government with the most limited of mandates; to call a GE to resolve the Parliamentary deadlock and therefore the Brexit mess.

      This mess has been entirely created by the Conservative party – it’s leadership that only ever wanted to limit the damage of leaving the EU, its EU-philes who wanted to reverse the referendum, and, thankfully, its ‘spartans’ who insisted on a genuine Brexit. There is no escaping the reality that a mess there is, and because the politicians have so spectacularly failed, the people must provide clarity.

      Many (and hopefully most, by a big margin) are rightly furious with the politicians. Naturally, remainers will be delighted to have a second bite at the cherry. I think it is imperative that a GE or referendum delivers a decisive mandate to leave the EU, with a trade deal to follow afterwards, if agreement can be reached. Regardless of the economic considerations, it is vital that first democracy is seen to be respected.

      Corbyn would be an awful PM under normal circumstances, but were he to be the one that returns power to the people, he would go down in history as a statesman of the first rank. Perhaps this illustrates just how absurd the present situation is.

      To emphasise, in an ideal world the referendum result would have been respected and the UK would now be an independent nation. That this has not happened is shameful. Now, in the absence of political leadership, the people must speak again. If the people are ignored again, then perhaps we’ll see an inglorious revolution.

      • Simeon
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:00 am | Permalink

        I think the important question is not who would be the emergency PM, but what exactly they would do. The best course might be this:

        1) Seek a limited extension from the EU (note, if the EU refused, we simply leave on October 31st).

        2a) Legislate for a referendum to be held ASAP, with the options of leave immediately, in accordance with the limited extension secured with the EU, or remain, revoking Article 50.

        2b) Legislate for a GE immediately following on from the referendum, so the people can further decide who they wish to implement the referendum result (note, this would not be an opportunity to undermine the result, never mind reverse it, because the two options, remain or leave immediately, are crystal clear).

        The drawback to this plan is that leaving is delayed further than it would be if a GE preceded a referendum, as per Labour’s proposal. However, the great advantage to the plan is that there is no scope for politicians to wriggle off the hook if the referendum happens first. To attempt to overturn it would be an outrage to democracy, and would require a prospective government to lie about their intentions – and for enough people to swallow their lies.

        I understand the frustration and anger of fellow leavers at the prospect of Brexit being delayed AGAIN. But the reality of our democratically elected Parliament is such that the UK will not simply leave on October 31st. In light of this, the best must be made of an awful mess.

      • NickC
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:15 pm | Permalink

        Simeon, I do not accept your view that the people must give another mandate to leave the EU, simply because some politicians have failed to deliver on the first (2016) mandate. That is a slippery slope which would only encourage those duplicitous MPs, and ruin our democracy.

        • Simeon
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:37 pm | Permalink

          Nick, I’m no happier than you are about this. But the MPs have already demonstrated they didn’t need encouragement. The MPs are also the ones with the power, having been elected (however unsatisfactorily) in 2017. The nature of our democracy is that we only get to kick out rogue MPs once every five years. Until then, they have been leant our authority.

          In normal circumstances, MPs would be careful not to alienate their electorate. But Brexit is not normal, but a matter of high principle. The remainers are evidently willing to put their principles (as utterly wrong-headed and anti-democratic as they might be) ahead of their political careers.

          This democratically elected (if not democratic) Parliament can do whatever it likes provided there is a majority for it. The facts on the ground are what they are. The electorate, you and I, can only respond to their actions. And it would be best if the electorate responds to its political servants in a manner akin to a parent who’s patience has been sorely tested by their disobedient toddler.

    • jerry
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:36 am | Permalink

      @Mark B; All well within the law, as laid out by the Cameron era FTPA, given that on the last GE the people returned a NOC parliament – so not a coup at all, what is more, if the boot was on the other foot and it was a Corbyn govt. in trouble the right would be doing the self same thing…

      • Mark B
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 3:59 pm | Permalink


  5. agricola
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:26 am | Permalink

    As you say, this Parliament is not fit for purpoe. They have displayed all those characteristics which in a war situation gets people killed. They are in such a situation but do not realise it. Too busy playing their own selfish silly games. Why do I feel like throwing up every time the likes of Grieve and Swinton appear on screen with a new angle on self interest.

    • oldtimer
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:19 am | Permalink

      It is my misfortune to be represented by Mt Grieve. Whenever the next GE is held, whether sooner or later, it is almost certain he will not be adopted as the Conservative candidate. If he decides to stand under other colours (the pro-Corbyn candidate?) I have no doubt he would’ve soundly defeated.

      • oldtimer
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:21 am | Permalink

        Mr not Mt and “would be”.

      • Fred H
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:47 am | Permalink

        oldtimer – you do realise Central Office refuses the No Confidence vote? An indication of how far the Conservatives have slipped down the electability scale is precisely that!

    • Turboterrier
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:15 am | Permalink


      Brilliant observation and comment. So very true.

  6. Shirley
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:27 am | Permalink

    I am utterly disgusted at the way many in Parliament disrespect democracy and the electorate. All the excuses the remainers are using could be applied to any election or referendum. Does that make every election and referendum invalid?

    Does the fact that many Remainers deliberately lied to their voters count for anything? They obtained their seats via fraud. The majority were voted in on a manifesto that promised to respect the result of the referendum.

    Fortunately, the Brexit Party are waiting in the wings. It is time we had a full house of politicians who put the UK and it’s people first.

    • Turboterrier
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:17 am | Permalink



      • bigneil
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:07 am | Permalink

        Shirley – thirded – this govt has clearly not bothered about running the country for the people – only for themselves. Why don’t they just change all our names to Jack – as the leaders are alright Jack – **** you. With the money wasted here and thrown abroad – there should be NO homeless soldiers, NO freeloaders from abroad – and definitely NO “Heat or eat” English pensioners struggling in winter, while thousands of never contributed foreigners sit here and laugh their ( taxpayer funded ) socks off.

    • Fred H
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:50 am | Permalink

      Shirley….try to be patient. Whenever the GE comes, Brexit Party will be deluged with millions of votes. The Project Fear parties will look what they are – a rabble of idiotic wannabees.

    • 'None of the above'.
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:47 am | Permalink

      Well Said!

    • agricola
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 12:06 pm | Permalink

      100% correct Shirley. Even were I Corbyn, I would be very reluctant to offer political shelter for these disparate fifth columnists,other than as lobby fodder.

    • forthurst
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 12:51 pm | Permalink

      Don’t delude yourself; the Brexit Party is in the same position as UKIP was in 2015 with the same leader and it will have the same effect at a GE. The problem is that the overwhelming proportion of electors are totally disenfranchised by the FPTP system of which JR approves. Most MPs are seditious trash; they love the EU. They love neocon mass murdering where no British interest exists. The FPTP system will destroy this country because it is allowing our country to be invaded and occupied by stealth by politicians who are too treacherous or too cowardly to act.

  7. David J
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:27 am | Permalink

    Good summary as ever.
    It will be so good to honour the result of the referendum and plan our positive future from the 1st November

  8. Andy
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:31 am | Permalink

    There will be an election and I suspect it will throw up some very odd results.

    You are correct that some Tory ‘Remainers’ are likely to be punished at the ballot box if they represent Leave areas – if, indeed, they are allowed to stand in this new look UKIP/Tory.

    But I suspect many Tory ‘Leavers’ in heavily remain areas are also likely to get a kick in. I suspect the Lib Dems will overturn some hefty majorities in swathes of the south which are repelled by Brexit. Some very well known Leave Tories will be leaving Parliament – much to my amusement.

    Goodness knows who will vote for Labour. And election they should walk by a country mile they can only possibly win as part of a coalition.

    What we will see is vast numbers of young people turn away from the main parties. We do not want your Brexit. Our votes may be split this time – maybe next time too – but we have decades to overturn Brexit. And you have already screwed up your only chance of ever making it work.

    • Dave Andrews
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:25 am | Permalink

      Where were those vast numbers of young people at the European Elections?
      They simply aren’t there.
      Labour and Conservative aren’t going to burn their fingers on EU membership after we’ve left; it’s toxic to both. The will resume campaigning on those issues that people care about. As the European Project unravels, as I expect it will, there will be even less incentive to re-join.

    • Richard1
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:46 am | Permalink

      What your posts ignore is the vast number of remain voters who respect the Democratic result of the referendum, and who are also repelled but the ideological intransigence and belligerent posturing of the EU and it’s leading functionaries. Such people will back Boris.

      • margaret howard
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 3:59 pm | Permalink


        “belligerent posturing of the EU?”

        Have I missed something?

        • Jiminyjim
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:37 pm | Permalink

          Yes, clearly. Do try to keep up, MH

        • NickC
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:28 pm | Permalink

          Margaret Howard, Yes, you missed the EU refusing to negotiate a trade deal, re-imposing control over us via the dWA, continuing to steal our fish, forcing us to pay a £39bn+ bribe, and jeering that the EU has finally made the UK a “colony”. Those are your “nice” friends.

      • Henry Jailer
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 5:31 am | Permalink

        By “belligerent posturing” I suppose you mean that the EU has decided to treat a country that has chosen to leave less well than countries that remain as members. Tell me, if you cancelled your Netflix subscription, do you think Netflix would carry on supplying you in the same way as before?

        • Edward2
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:22 am | Permalink

          That is very poor analogy Henry.
          But good to see you remain fans have given up on the equally poor golf club analogy.

        • libertarian
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 12:59 pm | Permalink

          Henry Jailer

          If I chose to end my netflix subscription I wouldn’t spend 3 years debating How to end my subscription, trying to only half end my subscription or paying for my subscription but not using the service

          I’d just stop paying and walk away .

          However Netflix offer 3 types of membership and I can dip in and out by buying reduced membership on a month by month basis so your analogy is total pants

        • NickC
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:23 pm | Permalink

          Henry Jailer, No, we mean the EU has treated us very much worse than it treats other third countries. You think jeering that the EU has finally made the UK a “colony” is anything other than nasty and vindictive?

    • Anonymous
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:01 am | Permalink

      I wouldn’t worry about Corbyn.

      Only 15% of the electorate voted for people who were for saving membership of the EU and then even that was diluted by other issues. He’s mistaken if he thinks he’s on to a vote winner. He’s angling for only a fraction of 15% of the vote.

      63% abstained despite 3 years of Remain/BBC hysteria.

      CHUK went *pop !*

      Boris’s popularity soars the harder he talks and leading Remainers ‘collaborate’ with the EU – with less than 15% on their side.

      You’re OLD Andy. Stop trying to be down with the kids, it’s embarrassing, this shtick is more oldest swinger in town rather than Simon Cowell, who is looking like bad taxidermy these days anyway.

      Never a good look. Grow up !

    • Robert mcdonald
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:04 am | Permalink

      You do assume that firstly that the youth are naive enough to vote for parties that have denied democratic decisions, I don’t, and secondly that there will be an EU to return to in “decades” ahead. The modern business world requires innovation and flexibility .. not skills seen within the sclerotic eurocracy.

      • margaret howard
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 4:02 pm | Permalink


        ” not skills seen within the sclerotic eurocracy.”

        Makes you wonder how this ‘sclerotic eurocracy’ has managed to create the world’s most successful trading bloc ever which we begged to join all those decades ago.

        • Jiminyjim
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:40 pm | Permalink

          You’re repeating yourself again, MH. Do please try to say something new, you’ve been corrected on these silly points many times before

          • bill brown
            Posted August 19, 2019 at 12:40 pm | Permalink


            just like you

        • L Jones
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:58 pm | Permalink

          ”…Makes you wonder how…” does it, Ms Howard?
          Well – for a start, by taking loads of dosh from those silly enough to join their corrupt organisation. As we did ”all those decades ago”.
          And now we’re trying to escape. Perhaps you’d like to explain why they don’t want to let us go?

        • BillM
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 10:26 am | Permalink

          MH, it is not the worlds most successful trading bloc. The USMCA with a population of 500 Millions represents a much bigger FTA. How would you define “Successful? 30% Youth unemployment in the Med States? Or collapsing EU Exports and diminishing manufacturing output?
          The growth rate of the EU GDP has fallen behind that of other Continents. At the last count it was second from bottom only to Antarctica. The Commonwealth was growing faster. Regardless, the whole world now trades with each other mainly on WTO terms so blocs no longer have the powerful role they once held.

        • libertarian
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:00 pm | Permalink

          Margaret Howard

          Germany the sick man of Europe

          • margaret howard
            Posted August 18, 2019 at 10:59 am | Permalink


            I suppose they can live with your epithet seeing that in a few decades they managed to raise themselves from what was once called 1948 Year Zero into Europe’s most successful economy.

            How sad that so many Brexiteers seem to live by the dictum:

            “It Is Not Enough to Succeed; Others must Fail”

    • Roy Grainger
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:33 am | Permalink

      By “young people” you mean the few white middle-class university-educated young people you know in your part of the English South East I assume ?

      • Fred H
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:52 am | Permalink

        Ha Ha – LOVE IT.

    • J Bush
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:00 am | Permalink

      You have placed yourself within the ‘young’ group, who according to you “do not want your Brexit”. Interesting. As this rather contradicts your previous assertions of being a more mature well travelled knowledgable and experienced successful businessman.

      That aside, 2 points:
      Despite your claim, vast numbers of young people do not want to remain in the EU.
      It would appear the only type of ‘democracy’ that suits you, is the type where the only votes that matter are those of young people who want to remain in the EU.

    • Kevin Lohse
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 12:46 pm | Permalink

      I never realised you were young, but your post highlights the absence of life experience which I had previously put down merely to Left- wing ideology. In future years, you’ll be thankful for the experienced older generation that prevented you from making such a precipitous misjudgement as to throw away national sovereignty and self- determination in favour of a mirage of material comfort as part of an authoritative technocracy.

      • Andy
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:34 pm | Permalink

        I am not young. And I am not left wing.

        The centre just looks a long way to the left when, like you, you stand very far to the right.

        I despise Corbyn as much as I despise the Tory Brexiteers.

        The difference is that a PM Corbyn would be a short term disaster for my country and Tory hard Brexit is a long term disaster.

        It’s a Sophie’s choice.

    • L Jones
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 2:58 pm | Permalink

      Regarding your final paragraph, Andy – tell us why you believe young people do not want Brexit. The only ‘young people’ of my acquaintance who are luke-warm about it – nobody rabid like you – vaguely think leaving the EU might stop them working abroad. But then they’re the less well-educated ones, I admit. The rest are all for looking forward and outward – not flat-earthlings like most remoaners.

      Spend a couple of minutes to give us a short list of reasons why they (and you) should not want independence from this failing and expensive ‘organisation’. We’ve asked you many times. You don’t seem to have an answer. Hearts and minds, Andy?

      (Don’t consider it in terms of your pocket money – Mum will always find that from somewhere, even though you won’t respect her for it.)

    • NickC
      Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:32 pm | Permalink

      Andy, Since you assure us you are in your mid forties (still?) with two (oddly non-aging) kids, and a business that makes you richer than anyone on here, how come you self-identify as “young”? Or is that a slip up from your script? You are (?) middle aged; young is under 25.

  9. Mick
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:31 am | Permalink
    This article says it all, and would the voter really really really believe that Corbyn would only have been a in number 10 for a short period of time he and his cronies would find some excuse to stay and overturn us leaving the dreaded Eu by lies which they would con the gullible young to vote for them in a GE , Mr Johnson should deliver the goods at the end of October or the Tory’s will be toast come a GE , and he must have a meeting with the Brexit party to secure a majority at the next GE no matter how much it erks your party to do so

    • Original Richard
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:32 am | Permalink

      If a GE is to take place before Brexit, then the Brexit Party, who currently intend to contest all possible constituencies, may like to offer the electorate that any Brexit candidate who is voted to become an MP will resign as an MP once Brexit has been achieved to allow a by-election to take place in which they may or may not stand for re-election.

  10. jerry
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:31 am | Permalink

    Don’t panic….oh hang on DO panic! There might not be anything Brexiteers can do to stop it if there are enough Remainers on the govt benches to press the ‘nuclear button’ in respects stopping a WTO exit.

    Now if only UKIP have not caused the 2010 coalition, something undeniable as Farage boasted about doing so at the time, there would have been no FTPA either…

    • libertarian
      Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:03 pm | Permalink


      So you predict/think that a remain based party would win a GE?

      • jerry
        Posted August 20, 2019 at 8:06 am | Permalink

        @libertarian; Do keep up Walter, I was talking about the FTPA.

    • NickC
      Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:35 pm | Permalink

      Jerry, It is a bit of a stretch to blame UKIP for the FTP Act.

      • jerry
        Posted August 18, 2019 at 9:03 am | Permalink

        @libertarian; I have no idea, nor do you either! The most likely is NOC in the current situation, as has been the case in two of the last three GEs. Coalitions and packs are very dangerous given the probable need to keep minor (europhile) parties on board.

        @NickC; Not it is not, the morning after the 2010 GE Farage boasted on live TV that ‘it was UKIP that caused the hung parliament’ or words to that effect -his intent was to show UKIP had, for once, become a force in UK politics.

        Had there been a majority Lab or Tory govt there would have been little incentive to bring in a FTPA, after all being able to call an GE at the existing govts advantage is a well used process, used by both Thatcher and Blair in more recent times. The FTPA protected the LDs from having a popular PM & Chancellor pulling the rug from under the junior coalition partner, by calling a snap GE.

  11. Denis Cooper
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:33 am | Permalink

    I am confused.

    I’m pretty sure that only days ago Jeremy Corbyn was saying that if he lost a confidence vote Boris Johnson could only stay on as a caretaker Prime Minister and would not be entitled to make any major policy changes. It is of course existing government policy that the UK will leave the EU on October 31st, with or without a withdrawal agreement, and that policy has been enshrined in the law of the land, which means Boris Johnson would not be entitled to change the policy and prevent the law taking its course.

    But now apparently if Jeremy Corbyn was the caretaker Prime Minister then he would be entitled to make a major change to government policy by deciding that we shall not leave the EU on October 31st, and introduce legislation for Parliament to change the existing law under which we would leave on that date.

    I know that it is August and the silly season but how can anyone take any of this nonsense seriously, so why is the new government not mercilessly exposing it for the nonsense that it is? I come back to my last comment yesterday:

    “Off topic, JR, do you know if/when Michael Gove’s rapid rebuttal unit is actually going to start rebutting anything? Anti-Brexit propaganda is being churned out day after day and I still don’t hear any rebuttals from the government in defence of its central policy … “

    • jerry
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:38 am | Permalink

      @Denis Cooper; You are indeed very confused, after a lost NC vote the FTPA actual mandates a period of 14 days for a different govt to be formed that does have the confidence of the House, it was this 14 day period that Corbyn was referring to and indeed Boris would be a caretaker Prime Minister during that time.

      • graham1946
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:45 pm | Permalink

        No, Jerry, you are confused. The 14 day period is to see if a new government can be formed, with all that that entails with full legislative powers etc. otherwise a GE must be called. What Corbyn is proposing is a short term one issue ‘Govt. of National Unity’ (without any Brexiteers of course, so hardly what it says on the tin), to stop Brexit. Quite a different state altogether.

        • jerry
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 6:07 am | Permalink

          @graham1946; Not confused one bit, thanks for repeating more of less what I said!

          The fact that you and others do not like the thought of a majority grand coalition of MPs who do not back your preferred choice of Brexit is irrelevance to the FTPA…

          I think you’ll find that the Corbyn letter mentioned blocking a ‘No Deal’ (WTO) Brexit, not blocking Brexit, I think the latter suggestion and thus confusion has come via the always ever unhelpful LDs.

          • graham1946
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:39 am | Permalink

            You are confused. The Act says 14 days for a GOVERNMENT to be formed, not a glorified committee of Remainers with only one issue. A government has full legislative powers and programme. And if you believe they really don’t want to stop Brexit, you are deluded. It is all they care about. Labour is now a part of Remain. Corbyn said so, so what do you think he would do if he became PM?

          • NickC
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:46 pm | Permalink

            Jerry, Which “preferred” choices do you imagine exist? Leave (not #fakeLeave) could only take place in two circumstances: with a trade deal or without a trade deal. The EU has refused to negotiate a trade deal until we have left. Theresa May’s dWA was not leaving the EU, being just a different treaty to keep us locked into the SM, CU, CAP, CFP, CCP, etc, etc. So WTO trade is the only option left which complies with our vote to Leave.

          • jerry
            Posted August 18, 2019 at 9:15 am | Permalink

            @ graham1946; @NickC; What in the definition of the phrase “Parliamentary Democracy” are both so confused about?!

            We do not elect parties nor govts in the UK, we elect individual MPs, those of a majority thinking (usual from the same party) then from a govt – if that is not so how come we currently have a Tory-DUP pact, how come we had a Con-Dem coalition between 2010-15, how come we had the Lib-Lab pack in the 1970s.

        • Denis Cooper
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 6:24 am | Permalink


    • Sir Joe Soap
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:57 am | Permalink

      The Rapid Rebuttal Unit is presently on Annual Leave, having been asleep since its last Annual Leave a year go.

    • Iain Moore
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:05 am | Permalink

      I have noticed that as well, the established law is for us to leave the EU on 31sr Oct, and any caretaker PM would have to abide by that . Odd that this glaring error in their strategy hasn’t been spotted by the media, may be being cheerleaders for the remainers is making them incapable of spotting some pretty basic errors.

      • Bob
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:59 am | Permalink

        @Iain Moore

        “the established law is for us to leave the EU on 31st Oct”

        We left on 29th March. See

        • Bob
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:44 pm | Permalink

          Mr Redwood,

          The link you deleted from my comment was a link to my comment above, which already passed your stringent moderation checks.

    • Anonymous
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:06 am | Permalink

      True about rebuttals.

      I hear the BBC daily reporting anti Brexit news articles and then having a pro Remain expert at the end of it to confirm it’s all true. I wait for the Leave person to reply but they are rarely there.

      • graham1946
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:50 pm | Permalink

        I don’t like the BBC, but to be fair, whenever they ask for a Government Minister or official to go on, one is never available. It happened only today. I thought Boris would be different, but it seems he will not allow his Ministers to argue their Brexit case any more than May did.Seems like a one man band where Brexit is concerned, maybe he doesn’t trust the people who swore allegiance to him and Brexit.

    • Fred H
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:55 am | Permalink

      Denis…..I think Corbyn has spent too long in the sun, as usual he contradicts himself every 5 minutes.

    • acorn
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:30 pm | Permalink

      Denis, exactly what ammunition do you think the Gove rebuttal unit would have to fire against remainers?

      The “leave”campaign deliberately did not come up with any numbers because it didn’t have any; and, it had no idea how to get any, Dominic Cummings said so. It had no idea what would happen if/when it led 66 million UK Lemmings over the Brexit cliff edge.

      What’s more, it still doesn’t give a toss, a no-deal Brexit won’t affect the 1% in the Westminster bubble, including the “dark money” sponsors of this elite political poker game.

      • Denis Cooper
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 6:22 am | Permalink

        You need to be careful what you say, acorn, because if you pretend that even one tenth of what the Remoaners say makes any sense then that will start to affect your own credibility.

      • NickC
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 1:52 pm | Permalink

        Acorn, Why do you think that New Zealand can be successful out of the EU, but the UK can’t?

  12. Peter Wood
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:35 am | Permalink

    Sir John,

    At last you now see, what many contributors to your blog have long been saying, that the majority of your so called honourable colleagues in the HoC are no such thing, but are totally untrustworthy, arrogant, self-entitled, incompetents. Their local associations are crying out to have the right to remove them but Central Office declines that level of democratic accountability – for why?
    You faithful Brexiteers had better tool-up for a bare-knuckle fight come the return of parliament, and use EVERY tool, fair or foul, to deliver on the promise of LEAVE.

    • jerry
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:43 am | Permalink

      @Peter Wood; The WA is leaving, BRINO is leaving, Flexcit is leaving, becoming a ‘Greater Switzerland’ (as one person wants the UK to become) is still leaving, just not how the many “totally untrustworthy, arrogant, self-entitled, incompetent” never mind self-centred commentators on this wish!

      • NickC
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 2:00 pm | Permalink

        Jerry, None of your list is leaving. Every one means the EU is still in control of the UK: either more than now (May’s dWA); or slightly less (BINO, Flexcit, Norway, Switzerland). Leave means leaving the EU treaties, and not returning. If the EU still determines UK policy or laws, we haven’t left.

        • jerry
          Posted August 18, 2019 at 9:26 am | Permalink

          @NickC; Thank you for your opinion, but the fact is all those are leaving, just not how you want the UK to “leave the European Union”.

          Otherwise best you tell the people of Norway and Switzerland that their countries are members of the political European Union, despite their own explicit instructions. The 2016 UK referendum did not explicitly ask about the Customs Union (go re-read the question printed on the ballot paper…), and many campaigning to “leave the European Union” wanted the UK to remain in a/the CU.

    • Sharon Jagger
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:18 am | Permalink

      Peter Wood

      I totally agree with all you say in your post. And come September, it will be a battle that the Leavers MUST win or this country will be finished as we know it!

      I too have wondered why Conservative Central are still supporting the likes of Grieves and are blocking his de-selection….even since Boris took over!

      • AlmostDead
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:54 pm | Permalink

        “or this country will be finished as we know it!”….you say this as if its a bad thing!!!

    • Turboterrier
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:39 am | Permalink

      Peter Wood.

      Honourable colleagues? Apart from about 150mage up from across the house the rest are completely two faced and gutless. Kippers every one of them.
      With what is going on it is a massive wake up call to every parties central offices. The night of the long knives is decades overdue. They are totally out of step with the electorate and their constituency officers. The 500 odd who have all lied and deceived their constituents are the real swamp and the sludge valves need to be opened. No more golden handshakes for them they haven’t earned it. They by their actions have signed up for being a federal state of Europe and losing our armed forces to the new European Army and that will be just the start and controlled by the unelected cartel.

  13. Pete S
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:39 am | Permalink

    Sir John

    I keep reading about TARGET2 and it’s problems. But I cannot understand what exactly is going on. Can you explain this EU issue??

    Reply I have done so many times. Its the way the German surplus is lent at zero interest to the southern deficit countries via the ECB. Will Germany get her 920 bn Euros back?

    • Pete S
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:36 am | Permalink

      Thanks, but yet another question. What is this ‘commencement order’, Barclay has be told to issue ??

      • The Prangwizard
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:55 am | Permalink

        Something which traitor May did not sign and thus did not bring into effect an Act overturning EU law.

      • steve
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:40 am | Permalink

        Pete S

        It’s an order that repeals EU law and firmly obliges us to leave the EU on Oct 31st no matter what.

        If you google it there’s plenty of info.

        And the good thing is; there is no legal mechanism to stop it being signed.

      • acorn
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:53 am | Permalink

        Most Acts of Parliament that have multiple effects that require a logical order of starting up. Parts of the EU Withdrawal Act 2018 are dependent on leaving the EU law and UK law taking over seamlessly.

        The EU would probably respond by declaring the UK as leaving the EU at the same time as the commencement order becomes effective, thus revoking the 31st October. Difficult to imagine what sort of chaos at Banks and Ports that would cause.

        Still, as the US and the UK have put the lunatics in charge of their governing asylums, we should get used to this sort of nonsense.

        • NickC
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 2:05 pm | Permalink

          Acorn, Why is being as independent of the EU as New Zealand is, equivalent to putting “the lunatics in charge of their governing asylums”?

      • SecretPeople
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 12:57 pm | Permalink

        As reported in The Times today:

        “The Commons voted through the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018, which repeals the European Communities Act of 1972, in September with a majority of 36 votes.

        However, for the law to come into effect ministers have to sign a “commencement order”. Mr Barclay is expected to do that in coming days.”

  14. Dominic
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:49 am | Permalink

    I care not about the reputation of this Parliament. I care only for the deliverance of the EU referendum result and the eventual diminution of Marxist Labour

    The Tory government is being far too compliant. Johnson must understand the danger we’re facing. With Tory MPs proffering support to a Marxist party then we are now able to see the fundamental nature of these Remain zealots. That they will support a man and a party that will destroy the UK if they can get into power

    A centre right alliance if we do end up with a GE is essential to protecting our nation from the dregs that is the British left

    And those Tory MPs that have revealed their true nature should be purged Cromwellian style from the party

    Johnson should do whatever it takes to save the Tories and this nation from the ‘enemy within’

    • jerry
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:51 am | Permalink

      @Domonic; “Marxist Labour”

      Still living in the late 1970s… There hasn’t been any “Marxists” in Labour since the mid 1980s and the expulsion of the Militant Tendency, but then perhaps you believe anything left of the “Wets” within the Tory party are raving Marxists simply because your own politics are so far to the right?

      • Fred H
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:58 am | Permalink

        using various names for their views merely a label. The same people are still there but operating at different levels with similar targets in mind.

        • jerry
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 6:13 am | Permalink

          @Fred H; Careful, after all what is good the Goose (Labour) is also good the Gander, (UKIP/TBP), after all I’m sure you and others would not like someone to suggest that UKIP/TBP are full of far right extremists would ,you?

          On the other hand, the FACTS are somewhat different though, if you choose to take a non partisan view….

          • Fred H
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:39 am | Permalink

            jerry….I beg to differ. Define far-right first, then I may agree with them! You say FACTS without listing even one.

          • jerry
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:54 am | Permalink

            @Fred H; What are Manifestos if not a published, and a blindingly obvious, “fact”…

            Some hot-headed Momentum member over heard talking Marxism, some hot-headed UKIP/TBP member over heard talking about Mein Kampf proves nothing about the wider organisation/party and perhaps not much about the said person if the context has been miss understood or perhaps -more likely- miss reported by the MSM and political opponents.

      • graham1946
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:55 am | Permalink

        Never heard of Momentum then? Militant Tendency on steroids. Corbyn is probably the least left wing of all of them and will be ditched soon enough.

        • jerry
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 6:19 am | Permalink

          @graham1946; Thanks for proving my point about some believing that anyone to the left of a Tory ‘wet”; must be a Marxist!

          Momentum is a group with a Socialist manifesto, not a Marxist (Communist) manifesto.

      • Jiminyjim
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 1:31 pm | Permalink

        Jerry, that’s hysterical! You mean that even the Marxists who voluntarily describe themselves as Marxists, aren’t? Explain!

        • jerry
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 6:37 am | Permalink

          @Jiminyjim; Explain you say, not that you actually want an explanation, but here goes anyway.

          Are you seriously suggesting that there is no one who self identifies as a moderate right-winger but in reality would feel far more at home in 1930s Germany?

          There will always be the ‘rouge’ element in any political party membership or campaign group – but should we measure such groups on that rouge element or the official manifesto. If we do the former what does that make UKIP and indeed TBP, (even the Conservative party, certainly in the past) considering some of the views that have been expressed in their name…

          Stop throwing brickbats against the wall, they tend bounce back!

          • Jiminyjim
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:32 am | Permalink

            No, not bounce back! You have simply avoided my question by trying to divert the subject onto a discussion about TBP/UKIP!

          • Jiminyjim
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 5:47 pm | Permalink

            Your second paragraph, Jerry, is staggering in its offensiveness. Do you have the remotest idea what you are claiming? Have you ever studied the 1930s? I must challenge you, Jerry, to withdraw this comment, which is the most offensive and disgraceful that I’ve ever seen on this or any other site. And can I please beg our good, honest, intelligent and thoughtful host never to allow such a posting again?

          • Edward2
            Posted August 18, 2019 at 12:16 am | Permalink

            You need to realise that Jerry loves arguing.
            He doesn’t seem to hold any actual opinions he just likes taking a contrary opinion to whatever anyone else says.
            In short he is a wind up merchant.
            Best ignored.

          • jerry
            Posted August 18, 2019 at 9:46 am | Permalink

            @Jiminyjim; You make my case for me, about people not understanding context when a knee-jerk fits their agenda better, in this instance by (deliberately?) miss understanding why I mentioned 1930s Germany. Etc ed

            Oh and yes I have studied Nazi Germany, the whys and wherefores. Why, because my father almost gave his life to help defeat it -many of his regimental mates were not so lucky when they dropped at Arnhem…

            As it was my father lived with his wounds until he died, was he bitter and anti German like so many on this site are, no, he understood the difference between a German and a Nazi. I do not need any lectures from you thanks, it is you who owes the apology.

          • jerry
            Posted August 18, 2019 at 9:51 am | Permalink

            @Edward2; I note that you still have not grasped the meaning of the word “debate”.

            If you want a right-wing love-in feast best find a different site, better get yourself a Twitter feed, as even our host appears to likes to read contrary opinion…

          • margaret howard
            Posted August 18, 2019 at 11:11 am | Permalink


            “Your second paragraph, Jerry, is staggering in its offensiveness.
            I must challenge you, Jerry, to withdraw this comment, which is the most offensive and disgraceful that I’ve ever seen on this or any other site”

            Spare us your puffed up outrage.

          • Edward2
            Posted August 18, 2019 at 4:23 pm | Permalink

            A bit of self reflection would do you good Jerry
            It is very poor to just be contrary for the fun of it.

    • Sir Joe Soap
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:59 am | Permalink

      Hopefully Cummings has this issue in his sights. He alone seems bright enough.

      • Know-Dice
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:11 am | Permalink

        And hopefully both Cummings and Boris are “keeping their power dry” until the right time to reveal their “cunning plan”…

    • jane4brexit
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 12:51 pm | Permalink

      I thought the same but then thought if Boris sacks sitting MPs now, surely he risks losing his majority forcing a GE or the possibility of other parties getting together to form a majority before Brexit has happened? However backing local associations to deselect any MPs actively pursuing Remain and set in motion the choosing of replacements for after Brexit, would be a positive step ready for a GE after the 31st October.

      I am not sure if he can agree the selection new candidates alone as Grieve was deselected and stayed, the media said because of Head Office and May. I have been reading articles about this and one on Politics Home “Explained: how to deselect a Tory MP” was informative, but did not explain how such decisions can be ignored.

  15. Cheshire Girl
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:58 am | Permalink

    A Corbyn led government would be a total nightmare. All Labour is interested in is getting into power. They have no other agenda.

    • Bryan Harris
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:08 am | Permalink

      Yes – the unions would be given an office at Westminster and effectively run/ruin the country….

      Electing corbyn would be suicide…

      • L Jones
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 3:33 pm | Permalink

        The Sun, 14 August:

        ”HARD-LEFT Union boss Len McCluskey last night told Remainer rebels to finally accept “we lost the referendum” and give up trying to stop Brexit.”
        ”…And he urged Labour to commit to delivering Brexit if there is a snap general election before Britain’s departure on October 31.”
        ”….“The platform they fought on is that we will take Britain out of the EU. They seem to have forgotten about all that.”

        Isn’t he one of Corvid’s string-pullers?

        • Bryan Harris
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 5:47 am | Permalink

          Interesting – disunity in the labour arena – sounds like corbyn’s days are numbered

          • jerry
            Posted August 18, 2019 at 9:55 am | Permalink

            @Bryan Harris; Far from it, the biggest block of Union votes is backing Corbyn, not calling for his sacking, or the grubbing of Corbyn’s long held personal eurosceptic views!

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:23 am | Permalink

      Indeed and after Blair, Brown, Cameron & worst of all the totally dishonest May we have had more than enough of nightmare governments.

    • BrahmS
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:32 am | Permalink

      Yeah- just the same as Boris, or Michael Gove if he got half a chance- they are all tarred with the same brush.

    • jerry
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:54 am | Permalink

      @Cheshire Girl; But Labour supporters said the same about the Tories in 2010, 2015 & 2017, and by god they have been proved right, as hard as it pains me to agree with them.

    • Roy Grainger
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:35 am | Permalink

      To be fair to them that seems reasonable objective for an opposition.

      • Terry
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:37 am | Permalink

        Yes. I wonder what Cheshire girl thinks is the objective of an opposition.

  16. Lifelogic
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:03 am | Permalink

    Exactly what on earth are these Conservative MP traitors up to?

    Tory arch-Remainers will soon find they have no place left in their party said Allister Heath yesterday in the Telegraph.

    Let us hope he is right. These leftie Libdims have done massive damage to the Country and the Conservative Party. From Heath through to Major, Cameron, May, Hammond and Osborne onwards. Now many of them threaten us with the appalling prospect of Corbyn and a UK version of Venezuela.

    The Conservative party is a party of leaving the EU, real UK democracy, small government and low taxation or it is nothing. These dreadful people have been a disaster. If only Cameron had been the EUsceptic, low tax at heart, Conservative that he lied he was.

    • jerry
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:03 am | Permalink

      @LL; If such people are forced out is that not simply advancing the day the current govt will fall, with only a two seat working majority it really isn’t for the hard line Boris or Brexit supporting MSM or their readers to demand anything – heads Remainers win, tails Brexiteers loose…

      “The Conservative party is a party of leaving the EU, real UK democracy, small government and low taxation or it is nothing.”

      Nonsense, go read some of the old (post WW2) manifestos, even well into Mrs Thatcher’s era, what you say above is what YOU want the party to be, but then you are not a “real Conservative”.

    • Sir Joe Soap
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:05 am | Permalink

      Look at MP Wollaston, elected instead of a proper Conservative, then wandered off into some odd Libdem version of oblivion. What’s the point of voting for this type of Conservative who then doesn’t really know what they want or are doing?

      Perhaps her constituents preferred her being a relatively harmless MP compared to giving wandering diagnoses while she was a GP?

      • Sir Joe Soap
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:09 am | Permalink

        Or this MP Gutto Bebb, who says he’d prefer a Marxist to a Tory PM? How do these people come to be put in place? Why can’t they be removed when they say such daft and disloyal things against the will of their constituents?

        • Sea Warrior
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:10 am | Permalink

          His political history is worth a look-up on Wiki. He came to the Conservatives when his Plaid Cymru career ran into the buffers. We really are too welcoming to those who have never been life-long Conservatives.

      • old salt
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

        Wasn’t she elected on a Leave ticket?
        Says it all!

    • Turboterrier
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:46 am | Permalink


      Re DC. Typical of most of a large majority of our MPs.

      Ovfer promise and under deliver. If this madcap scheme of Corbyn is allowed to happen it will be all about “you ain’t seen nothing yet’

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:21 am | Permalink

      The wind farm involved in last week’s blackout was awarded nearly £100,000 compensation after being told to reduce its output the day after the power cut, in the Daily Telegraph today.

      Let us hope that Kwai Kwartang can sort out the ludicrous mess that the green dopes have made of the UK energy systems.

      Kwasi seems a sound chap let’s hope he delivers, but what an insane mess has been left for him by May’s appalling government.

    • David Maples
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:16 pm | Permalink

      Grieve is jesuitical in his belief that the EU is a sacred construct, essentially a benign progression of western development. No one else can grasp his peculiar insight into the golden prospect of peace and prosperity that is the glorious future for coming generations. It’s complete tosh of course; he probably needs to take vitamin supplements as he’s not firing on all 4 cylinders, and looks to me to be under a lot of stress, evident in his public appearances.
      His intention to pow wow with Corbyn though is appalling. Being anywhere near that etc ed, is bad news!

  17. Bryan Harris
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:06 am | Permalink

    Let’s face it, as a party, labour lost their moral compass many decades ago – So we should only expect the worst from them They are so incompetent they can’t even manage their own finances without a bail out from their big brother, the unions, on a regular basis, and the unions are just aching to run / ruin the country again as they did in Wilson’s time. So we should only expect the worst of labour to avoid disappointment.
    If Boris gets us out in October then he will likely win the next election and reduce the Brexit party to history, because the voters will come back and he will have saved the party. There is one thing he must do however, and that is to eliminate from the Tory party those on the left, those that deny democracy, and those that worked against us all.

  18. John Sheridan
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:32 am | Permalink

    The idea that a group of Remainer MPs should band together to thwart Brexit under the banner of ‘National Unity’ is incredible. It may well have MPs from multiple parties, but in no way is it unifying the country.

    The EU offered, and Mrs May accepted, a dreadful Withdrawal Agreement and Political Declaration. It would have made a mockery of Brexit and been worse for the UK than staying in the EU. For various reasons Parliament refused to pass the Withdrawal Treaty.

    No deal is still better than a bad deal (one which does not represent a clean Brexit) and the government is right to prepare to leave on the 31st of October 2019, with or without a fair deal.

    Any Conservative MP who votes against the government in a vote of no confidence must be expelled from the party.

  19. Julie Williams
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:38 am | Permalink

    To be fair to the Libdem’s, at least they have stuck together with a clear message through this period and I suspect that they refuse to deal with Corbyn for that reason.
    They are right to do so, the Labour leaders have been shown to be complete opportunists who only care for power.They are beginning to realise the pitfalls of relying on the youth vote:youth is fickle, vegetarianism and Corbyn has been replaced by veganism and Greta.
    As for the Tories?
    Creators of their own doom.Simple question? What the hell was someone like Guto Bebb doing in the Tory party in the first place?
    The thing I find most dispiriting about this particular blog,however, is that through all the half-truths and hysteria, I would hope that a senior Mp could enlighten us on the procedures and timetable .Sir John seems to be as bewildered as the rest of us, please help us out here: what can Bercow do in reality? has Corbyn left a Vonc too late?
    If the answer is that “no-one knows”, then a massive overhaul of parliamentary procedure is needed and I don’t think voting Tory will get it done.
    Brexit or no Brexit on 31 October, the Brexit Party are going to be needed a lot longer and I’ll be thinking much harder about which party gets my support in future.

  20. Narrow Shoulders
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:48 am | Permalink

    The party which commands a majority in the House of Commons gets to select a leader who is invited by the Queen to form a government.

    If Mr Corbyn as leader of a party is able to command a majority in the House of Commons then just as Mr Johnson was installed as PM then so can Mr Corbyn be installed.

    Such is our democracy.

    The prospect is scary and the damage that can be done to our institutions by his ultra left wing and pacifist placemen is truly scary but he would be legitimately in place, as much as Prime Ministers Major, Brown, Cameron (as head of a coalition no one asked for) and now Johnson.

    Your dissenting Conservative colleagues seem to believe that he is less threatening than leaving the EU on WTO terms so I suggest that you need to win the popular opinion over for leaving without a formal deal. That way your colleagues might be pressured into line.

    I have noticed that the occasional story showing how some of the no deal stories are untrue have emerged recently but the broadcast media persist in playing chicken little and we are likely to all be eaten by the fox.

    • Narrow Shoulders
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:33 pm | Permalink

      I have thought about this further and now consider Doniinic Grieve to be Chicken Little, Anna Soubry to be Goosey Lucy and Chukka Ummuna to be Turkey Lurkey.

      Jeremy Corbyn is of course the fox stringing them along until he can eat them.

  21. Denis Cooper
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:51 am | Permalink

    Off topic, alas, neither the Irish Times nor the Irish Independent want me to inform their readers that if anybody is going to do anything stupid and unnecessary at the Irish land border then under existing UK law, already put in place, that could only be the EU and the Irish government on their side, not the UK government on our side.

    Not for the first time I ask myself why it should fall to a private UK citizen to attempt to enlighten the Irish public on these matters when the UK government has huge resources at its disposal and could do the job much more easily and effectively.

  22. Newmania
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:52 am | Permalink

    The idea that there is a mandate for No Deal hard Brexit is a nauseating lie and deserves to be spat on; not debated.
    The Referendum was an electoral device that suited the Conservative Party, who assumed it would be won by the government ( for remain). The popular call a new referendum was non-existent , it is many times as insistent now.
    The only people to whom it means leave at any cost, and written in blood, are the 20/25% Brexit/UKIP/BNP/ERG extremists to who wish to impose their agenda, on the 75% who support positions ranging soft Brexit to none. ( There is a significant lead for Remain across all polls)
    The Leave side have guaranteed no disruption to trade a fiscal boost to the country whilst ending FOM. This is not possible .Theresa May sought a mandate to make the best arrangements, she could. She failed to get it
    The only resolution to this is to put the realities back to the people .

    No Deal v Remain.
    We know which would win.

    Corbyn has no intention of doing this , Labour are a Brexit Party but what remainers should do is appallingly difficult .My own instinct is to ignore Corbyn ( who I detest as much as I loathe the Brexit /Conservative hard right )

    • Richard1
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:38 pm | Permalink

      The best strategy for remainers is to cut all this sophistry about not wanting no deal and just say they are against Brexit and want it reversed, stuff the referendum. The remainer MPs should then vote to withdraw article 50. If this goes through by some parliamentary wheeze fixed by bercow we will then be back where we were, in the EU.

      What would then happen? Well sterling might pop 10%, the BBC would ensure blanket coverage by ‘business’ voices saying how great the new sitn is. There would be outrage of course, probably mass demos and riots even, but – assuming the markets reacted positively – would the Conservative Party actually say no we need to go back, Re-trigger article 50 and start the whole thing again? Or might it decide to pivot to remain? It would be a v uncertain sitn.

      In my view there would inevitably come a new crunch in a very few years as there is a fundamental incompatibility between the way EU membership has been presented to the UK’s voters and the reality of its federal superstate ambitions. But we’d be in for 5-10 years most likely.

      But I don’t think Remain MPs will have the balls.

    • NickC
      Posted August 17, 2019 at 11:56 pm | Permalink

      Newmania, It is amusing to see you spitting and hating. But you would do better using facts and reasoning. The fact is we had a national poll – the 2016 Referendum. We chose to Leave – without conditions.

      Many apparently thought we could negotiate a trade deal, but the EU has refused this for over 2 years. So don’t whinge now that you weren’t warned about “no trade deal”. Obviously what you really hoped for is that we would give up Leave altogether, in the face of EU intransigence. But that hasn’t happened.

      You and the EU have overplayed your hand. You could probably have got a “softer” Brexit but you chose to take the chance of no Brexit. You’ve just lost. Again.

  23. DaveM
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:03 am | Permalink

    I find it incredible that the Conservative party retains so many members who are squatting in seats which were won on a manifesto they are now trying to overturn.

    I also find it strange that the MSM is now ignoring Boris whereas before he became PM he was reported on obsessively. The best thing he could do now is call a GE and collaborate with Farage to get the dissenters out of the PP and crack on with his agenda. I’m sure Cummings has the plans in place. On the plus side, the strange collection of conspirators in Westminster are probably incapable of getting out of bed without someone to help them.

    • graham1946
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:04 pm | Permalink

      If they bring down Boris, they will be out of the Tory Party anyway and will either have to step down or fund their own election or join Labour or the LibDems. A lot of Labour MP’s sit in seats who voted Leave so if they vote to stop Brexit they have an electoral problem. I can’t see them voting for it when push comes to shove, except for Grieve who will get the sack anyway and Clark who wants to retire. It is likely that Brexit will happen by default and they will have lost their lucrative seats for nothing. Not a very appetising prospect surely.

  24. Everhopeful
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:06 am | Permalink

    If Corbyn and the treacherous Remoaners are allowed to run riot. And let’s face it no one managed to restrain Mrs M….then we will descend into total chaos like France (the true horror very under reported I believe).
    It is probably true to say that Corbyn is nowhere near far left enough for many of his followers and they will not be docile if he gets into power.
    Do the true blues actually understand that there are some very nasty forces on theLeft ( who have been allowed to get away with violence and destruction )? They will erupt if Corbyn is permitted to take control.
    Flirting with the Left is a very dangerous game.

  25. Ian Wilson
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:13 am | Permalink

    An excellent analysis,as usual. As Pominoz says, this Parliament has already booked its place in history as one of the worst ever. Its infantile declaration of a ‘climate emergency’ contrary to any proper science will alone ensure that. Reinforcing this stupidity with the equally preposterous and economically suicidal zero carbon policy after a derisory 90 minutes debate drives home the same message.

    Regrettably Boris, on whom some of us pinned hopes for some common sense, is perpetuating the same policy as Mrs May.

    • Bob
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:09 am | Permalink

      @Ian Wilson

      “preposterous and economically suicidal zero carbon policy after a derisory 90 minutes debate”

      They believe the BBC line that the “science is settled”.

      “Regrettably Boris, on whom some of us pinned hopes for some common sense, is perpetuating the same policy as Mrs May.”

      Agreed. I get the feeling that Tory leaders are nothing more that marionettes.

  26. Ian!
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:17 am | Permalink

    The teachings of Corbyn are seek power at any cost. Tear down the structures of society so as to be able build them in your own image.

    If these people that lied to their constituents to get elected think that Corbyn will relinquish power before he has achieved his objectives they are seriously mistaken.

    It is clear that the ‘Remainers’ are not going to seek re-election and are personally classed as well off so don’t care. But, to punish the people because you don’t believe in democracy is a bit childish.

    This is Parliament against the People and obviously ‘project fear’ now believes they have frightened those that don’t believe in themselves to submit to rule by a foreign power.

  27. Fedupsoutherner
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:18 am | Permalink

    Sorry John but parliament is a shambles now. It can sink no further. Everyone I speak to says the Tory party is finished unless they deliver Brexit and even then they may not get voted in again for a long time. Their policies are not compliant with those of a Tory party and I don’t think I have been able to vote for a real Tory party since Thatcher left. I think the country needs change if only to send out a real message to the arrogant idiots sitting in parliament now. I cannot even bring myself to watch any programme debating Brexit as nearly every MP is smug, scheming and wants to bathe in glory while the country goes to the dogs. Get over yourselves and get Brexit done for the sake of business and the good name of the UK. God alone knows what other democracies think of our abysmal lot.

    • Fred H
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:26 pm | Permalink

      I would imagine dozens of countries are watching with interest, as the world’s best example of developed democracy plunges into ridicule. They must be waiting for the long line of ambulances taking MPs away strapped in the famous white coats. They will be laughing amongst themselves as ‘the English fools are taken to the asylums’.

  28. Fedupsoutherner
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:20 am | Permalink

    I’m not a clairvoyant but I think you may have a busy day today John.

  29. Everhopeful
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:21 am | Permalink

    I wonder exactly what sort of EU the Remoaners wish to Remain in?
    The globalists have destroyed France.
    Germany ditto and on the slide economically.
    The two pillars of the EU not doing at all what on earth is the point?
    Some berserk dream of returning Europe to how they believe it was during the Roman Empire?
    Or are they still hoping for order out of chaos?
    Their order that is!

  30. margaret
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:24 am | Permalink

    It is no good relying on what solicitors, politicians say, opinions of this and that from those who keep trying to make their opinions official. One doesn’t need a high IQ to say how long is a piece of string. The magnitude and direction is still towards Brexit with the added variable of fear and uncertainty which stops a positive > a-b.

  31. Alec
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:31 am | Permalink

    Whilst this parliament will certainly be seen as the worst ever that is only because it has allowed itself to come out into the open with it’s machinations against the interests of the British people. Most previous governments since WW2 have also been dreadful and have been just as anti British but circumstance has prevented it being so obvious. Now the main stream media is widely seen as the gang of liars it really is and MP’s simply couldn’t make the contempt they feel for the voters and their own lack of morality more clear.
    Were there any justice in this world (and there isn’t) simply leaving should not be nearly enough to repair the damage done by parliament. Every single MP that attempted to prevent Brexit or voted for that disgusting surreder agreement should be voted out never to return to public life. Also every bureaucrat that worked against Brexit should be sacked without compensation. But it won’t happen of course. The establishment will prevent any form of real justice as it always does.

  32. Ian!
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:36 am | Permalink

    I am reminded that 498 MP’s voted for a clean break option when they triggered Article 50.

    Just as to get elected these same MP’s promised their electorates that vote for them and the UK would become an independent self-governing country. Are the now all saying they are liars?

    We all permitted to change our minds, but when you made it a condition of your employment to do one thing, you need to go back to your employers for approval on any change.

    • Terry
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:39 am | Permalink

      Untrue. Most voted for a break with a deal. That, after all, is what Leave promised in 2016. Boris himself said we will not prepare for no deal because we will get a great deal. Where is it?

      • Fred H
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:35 am | Permalink

        oh do keep up Terry. Have you not been aware of May’s shenanigans and duplicity? The ‘deal’ was a more expensive lock-in to the EU, even the foolish, sleepy MPs voted against 3 times. The EU and May refuse to discuss any other sort of deal. Who seriously imagined directly after the Ref in 2016 that our PM would crumble so disgracefully, quit and let the horror of May & EU determine things.

      • NickC
        Posted August 18, 2019 at 12:00 am | Permalink

        Terry, The EU has refused to negotiate a trade deal until we have left. Don’t you pay any attention to the news?

  33. Newmania
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:38 am | Permalink

    and annuver fing …

    Why not have the general election that seems inevitable but also have a leave / remain option. That way people could vote Labour remain (or leave) , Conservative Remain (or leave) and so on, or just leave or remain or just Conservative /Labour Lib etc
    I think at this stage people know what the options really are so you would end up with a Parliament and a direction for Europe to take how ever it was constituted
    What we rwally need is an ongoing element of PR but god forbid any of these supposed democrats should actually have to impress anyone bar a few old ladies

    • graham1946
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:09 pm | Permalink

      You won’t like PR. The referendum was direct democracy and because the vote didn’t suit your ideas you have been bitching about it ever since. The Lib Dems even said last week that should there be a new referendum which confirmed Leave, they wouldn’t accept that either. They’ve been EU fans too long and are infected with the EU way of doing politics.

    • NickC
      Posted August 18, 2019 at 12:03 am | Permalink

      Newmania, We already had a Remain/Leave vote. What’s the point of another one if politicians won’t accept the first? Swinson won’t even accept the second if the result is Leave again!

  34. Sir Joe Soap
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:41 am | Permalink

    Today prog now having a go at Johnson for not appearing on their programme. How often did we hear from May when she was actively evading her responsibilities ?????

    • Andy
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:36 am | Permalink

      El Presidente Boris does not speak to the media because, if he did, he would quickly get found out.

      So the unelected clown prances on pretending he has a mandate from anyone other than a small group of mostly old white men.

    • Beecee
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:38 am | Permalink

      The Media persist in thinking that the PM, and therefore the Government, reports to them!

      This is particularly true of the BBC.

      Time to make non payment of the Licence Fee a civil offence.

      • steve
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:47 am | Permalink


        “Time to make non payment of the Licence Fee a civil offence”

        Agreed. That is probably the best way to sort the damn thing out. Decriminalise non payment of the licence fee.

    • steve
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:26 am | Permalink

      Sir Joe Soap

      Well I say good luck to Boris. These media interviews are nothing more than remain attempts to pull him down. Nothing whatsoever to do with unbiased journalism.

      I don’t think he should compromise his dignity by taking part in that kind of biased garbage. Good on him.

      • margaret howard
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:04 pm | Permalink


        “I don’t think he should compromise his dignity ….”

        You can’t compromise something you haven’t got. He has made us a laughing stock throughout the world.

        • Jiminyjim
          Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:51 pm | Permalink

          No, MH, that would be you. Every time you open your mouth

          • steve
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:43 am | Permalink


            “No, MH, that would be you. Every time you open your mouth”

            Well said.

    • agricola
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 2:31 pm | Permalink

      They are merely stacking up evidence in favour of the root and branch reform of the BBC and those that work for them.

    • rose
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 3:14 pm | Permalink

      There is no point in a statesman appearing on the programme. The interviewer will work her way down a hit list of defamatory statements and bite off each answer before the first sentence is complete. We won’t learn anything other than that she has a very loud voice.

      If it is a luvvie on the other hand….

  35. Peter Miller
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:44 am | Permalink

    One positive thing you can say about Jeremy Corbyn, he has learned one lesson from history – as a Marxist, he will know all about how to use ‘Useful Idiots’ for his own purpose.

    In this instance, the ‘Useful Idiots’ are not the fanatic supporters of the Soviet Union, but rather the remain supporting Tory MP EU fanatics.

    • Fred H
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:04 am | Permalink

      I think the marxists are using Corbyn as a useful idiot. Except they misjudge how often he changes his stated view. Can he command a majority after a GE? Surely not.

  36. Richard1
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:48 am | Permalink

    It is odd that the are reportedly three Conservative MPs (Mrs spelman has corrected herself) who would prefer to see (Corbyn ed) as PM rather than leave the EU in accordance with the referendum, which they voted to hold, and voted to respect.

  37. Iain Moore
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:13 am | Permalink

    The media have bought into Remainer spin yet again, they bought into it when they called their losers referendum a ‘Peoples vote’ , and now they happily parroting the Remainers spin on calling this planned Remainer coup a ‘government of national unity’. In what way is this a government of national unity when it excludes the majority of the population?

    If Brexit is ever done there has to be a reckoning with the MSM, they are so politically corrupt it just cannot be allowed to continue. They prattle on about ‘diversity’ but in the area where it matters, opinion, they are totalitarian in their narrow beliefs.

  38. William Long
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:18 am | Permalink

    Well, Dr Wollaston has now come out in her true colour: Yellow. Why she ever stood as a Conservative will always be a mystery.
    I should have thought this Parliament was already way out in front in the ‘Worst in History’ stakes. However, a positive outcome of Corbyn’s proposal has been to demonstrate that there is unlikely to be a majority for him; the Lib Dems seem to prefer Kenneth Clark, who presumably has not read the Withdrawal Agreement any more closely than he read the Maastricht Treaty, that is to say, not at all.
    I note that for all that Corbyn is saying, Labour continue to hedge their bets about the timing of a No Confidence vote which will only happen when ‘they are confident they can win it’.
    Boris must hold his nerve.

  39. A.Sedgwick
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:25 am | Permalink

    Are Jo Swinson and the other three Scottish Libdem MPs distinguishable from SNP? Any English supporter of the Libdems must be totally confused, especially with Chuka and Sarah arriving. Who’s next?

    • steve
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:20 am | Permalink

      A. Sedgwick

      It just goes to show the true colours of the traitors…..they’d sell their granny for sixpence as well as their backsides.

    • JoolsB
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:57 am | Permalink

      Exactly – no difference at all – they all want to thwart Brexit and the will of the English people. If it’s not Brexit it’s matters that don’t affect them or their constituents because they only apply to England and yet 550 UK MPs squatting in English seats in the UK Parliament don’t want us English to have our own Parliament the same as the Scots enjoy which means all those meddling Scottish MPs can carry on interfering and voting in English only matters. Because of their refusal to treat us English as equals, we could still end up with a Corby/SNP Government foist on us by the rest of the UK.

  40. Original Richard
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:27 am | Permalink

    The world is watching to see if we are still a democracy or whether those in power (Parliament) will overturn the decision they gave the people to make via a referendum.

    There will be many dictators or potential dictators who will delight in seeing our referendum result overturned by Parliament so they can use it as an example the next time a referendum does not produce the answer they wanted. This includes the EU itself.

    • Andy
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:40 am | Permalink

      Um – it is not Parliament trying to overturn the referendum result. MPs want the Vote Leave liars to deliver on their promises of getting a better DEAL than the one we have. This is what Vote Leave promised in 2016. They could have promised no deal. They didn’t because they would have lost.

      So MPs want El Presidente Boris, Herr Cummings and Brexit clowns like Raab, Patel, Gove and co to do what they promised in 2016 – and to leave the EU with a deal that is better than membership.

      The world is watching these Vote Leave liars and is struggling to understand how you can still not realise you were had.

      • graham1946
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:14 pm | Permalink

        I thought you said you are a businessman. Every post proves you have no idea how business works. Boris has stated he wants to negotiate a deal but the EU say no. Pray tell us from your vast business experience how you negotiate a deal on your own.

        • Henry Jailer
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 5:35 am | Permalink

          The deal has been negiotiated.

          • Edward2
            Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:30 am | Permalink

            And it has failed to gain approval of Parliament three times.
            And it isn’t a deal.
            It is just heads of terms to start negotiations towards a trade deal.

        • margaret howard
          Posted August 17, 2019 at 11:26 am | Permalink


          “Boris has stated he wants to negotiate a deal but the EU say no”

          When you leave a club you begged to join decades ago you don’t dictate the terms but have to follow the conditions you signed up to when you joined and which are acceptable to the other members of the club. To imagine otherwise is pure arrogance and folly.

          The Germans backed our application all those years ago against De Gaulle’s repeated ‘Nons’. I bet they bitterly regret it now.

          • Edward2
            Posted August 18, 2019 at 12:19 am | Permalink

            It’s a very odd club.
            28 members
            9 pay membership fees.
            17 just take money out.
            But all members have a vote.
            And it a club where Margaret says the UK should just be good and do as we are told.

      • NickC
        Posted August 18, 2019 at 12:08 am | Permalink

        Andy, WTO is a better deal than the one we have. Why? Because we will no longer be a mere province of your corrupt dirigiste EU empire.

    • Gordon
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:03 am | Permalink

      Indeed Richard.
      All of the ‘Remainer’ type MP’s of whatever colour by trying to overturn the largest democratic decision in UK history do not fully realise or maybe even care what damage they are doing to the UK. If the referendum result is ignored and Brexit doesn’t happen then democracy is finished.
      So just who will ever bother voting again, for what purpose would it ever serve ? It would be a complete waste of time.

    • agricola
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 2:25 pm | Permalink

      The EU have previous in regard to ignoring referendum results. They do not require further encouragement.

    • Martin in Cardiff
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 6:11 pm | Permalink

      What do you mean “the world”?

      Different countries and cultures take very varying views. The Japanese, for instance, thought that this country was insane even to hold such a crude device on such a complex and crucial matter.

      In others, referendums are illegal, for the simple and logical reason, that with unrestricted freedom to spread lies in the media, the most easily led i.e. the dimmest fifty percent plus one will always win, and that is not the best way to steer a country.

      • Fred H
        Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:18 pm | Permalink

        in this latest example the dimmest 48% lost.

      • Edward2
        Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:35 am | Permalink

        Lovely to see the snobby elite openly stating here that only they, with their self declared superior views, must have their way over the majority of the people.
        They know best what is good for us.
        Most illuminating but no surprise.
        After all, it is how the EU operates.
        Thanks martin

  41. Mick
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:22 am | Permalink

    Three Tory-ex ministers, Dominic Grieve, Sir Oliver Letwin and Dame Caroline Spelman have agreed to meet Mr Corbyn to plot to stop Britain leaving the Brussels bloc without a deal.
    How much longer do we have to put up with these traitors to democracy, and yes they are traitors no matter how you try to camouflage it, these people would have been rounded up at the last world war and put away into a dark dinghy cell fed and watered and left to reflect on who’s side were they on because they most certainly aren’t on the British side

    • Jiminyjim
      Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:57 am | Permalink

      Boris has to be extremely careful. One of Theresa May’s multitude of problems was that she lost control of her cabinet and party and discipline evaporated. In the last week we have had Amber Rudd criticise a WTO departure, presumably against the assurances that she had to give to the PM before being confirmed in her position. She has not been disciplined in any visible way. And now we have a Conservative MP who has said that he will lead a government after he’s helped to pull down his own Conservative PM, again with no visible discipline. We all know that Boris has effectively no majority, but he needs to confront indiscipline before it all gets out of hand and he loses control like TM. Why is he sitting on his hands on this absolutely crucial matter?

  42. BCL
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:36 am | Permalink

    A good point made by Ian Dale. This so called government of national “unity” will be staffed solely by those representing the views of the 48% who lost. How that is democratic or will promote unity escapes me.
    If BJ is thwarted in his attempt to deliver on the referendum, there will be civil unrest, in my view.
    I cannot see how a second referendum will solve anything. It will result either in a leave vote again which gets us nowhere or in a remain vote in which case I suppose it’s best of three.

  43. ukretired123
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:50 am | Permalink

    The only thing that Jeremy Corbyn would unite is a worldwide sell-off and run on the pound.

    He was the default Labour leader candidate and spark a Sterling default instead.

  44. Dominic
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:02 am | Permalink

    Dear Mr Redwood

    I resent you publishing an accusation made against me suggesting that I am ‘far right’. It is a slander. It is preposterous. It is without foundation.

    I am a democrat. I believe in freedom, liberty and the fundamental values that underpin a free society

    I despise political extremism. Indeed, I despise politicians that reject the right of voters to assert accountability

    It’s your site. You publish what you like.

    Just remember this. As a Tory politician the left will have you and your colleagues in their cross-hairs and they will try and demonise and slander you without mercy

    Reply I have not accused you of anything. If I deleted every post with such comments there would not be many left. I do delete any that are offensive.

  45. Sea Warrior
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:06 am | Permalink

    She might not want to, but I feel that the Queen needs to be prepared to act – on the side of the people against Parliament. A Second Glorious Revolution?

    • Fred H
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:16 pm | Permalink

      HM is likely to demand of the new proposed PM ‘Are you able to form a Government?’ I would like to hear a required explanation of how the person thinks they can. I wonder if she will say, maybe as an aside ‘ good luck with that, I’ll see your replacement within a month’.

  46. Sea Warrior
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:12 am | Permalink

    I hope, shortly, to be moving into the lovely constituency of Tugendhat. When I di, I will be making full use of my party membership to agitate for his de-selection.

  47. rose
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:23 am | Permalink

    Corbyn seems to me to be playing a bad hand well: he wants the Conservatives to get us out by 31 October, preferably without any obligations, but he has to humour his remain party. So he makes absurd suggestions every so often, for example that he will tell the Queen what to do, that he will become PM, courtesy of the losing minority, knowing none of it will happen. Following exit, he hopes for short term turbulence which may bring him to power. He will then be the Socialist PM of an independent country and able to do what he likes.

    • Chris
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:05 pm | Permalink

      I think you could be right, rose. He is probably relying on the Remainer Tory MPs to sabotage Boris Johnson.

      As Boris is “supported” by Dominic Cummings, Corbyn may well have miscalculated. Boris has been known to waver, but Cummings, once he has decided a course of action, is laser focused, and, I believe, will be merciless with those who get in his way.

      I am now beginning to believe that Cummings will ensure that Boris delivers Brexit, and he is expecting and preparing for a No Deal, and actually relishing the challenge. I suspect he has no patience with, or respect for, those europhile civil servants and the Remainer Tory MPs. I think he has effectively declared war on them and is utterly determined to win, with some help from “The Art of War”. There are many lessons our politicians seem to be learning, belatedly, from over the pond.

  48. Lynn Atkinson
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:43 am | Permalink

    Boris MUST change the ‘exit date’ by SI and repeal the 1972 EC Act! We cannot have any standing in the world if we are more muddle headed and less democratic than Zimbabwe!

    Once we assert our Sovereignty our law is superior to EU law which can take a leap!

  49. Denis Cooper
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 10:49 am | Permalink

    It beggars belief, but according to this:

    Dominic Grieve would try to RESTORE the supremacy of EU law even after it had been ended by Steve Barclay finally signing the commencement order for the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018.

    It’s one thing to advise your party leader that while we are in the EU it would “create a constitutional contradiction” to vote for an amendment to affirm and defend the legal supremacy of Parliament, which is what Shadow Attorney General Dominic Grieve told David Cameron on March 5 2008 with respect to Bill Cash’s New Clause 9 to counter Declaration 17 attached to the Lisbon Treaty, Division No 120 here:

    ‘Notwithstanding any provision of the European Communities Act 1972, nothing in this Act shall affect or be construed by any court in the United Kingdom as affecting the supremacy of the United Kingdom Parliament.’.— [Mr. Cash.]

    … Ayes 48, Noes 380.”

    But it’s of another order altogether to say that even when the supremacy of EU law over this country had been ended you would want to reinstate it.

    • Chris
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:09 pm | Permalink

      Grieve is losing it, Denis. Does he actually realise that many people view his behaviour as not only treacherous, but as unhinged? He is making an exhibition of himself and really does not seem fit to hold office.

  50. Shirley
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:59 am | Permalink

    I would like an explanation from remainer MP’s as to the outcome if ‘no deal’ is rejected. To my mind, it removes any incentive for the EU to offer a fair deal, so what is it they REALLY want? A bad deal for the UK, or Remain. I wish someone in the media would ask them and then they can try and answer honestly how they wish to either destroy the UK through a bad deal, or destroy trust and democracy in the UK by overturning the biggest electoral mandate in UK history.

  51. Gareth Warren
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 1:30 pm | Permalink

    I see the polls have been falling for the brexit party since Boris got into power, they will likely be single digits if brexit is delivered.

    I am concerned we still will get some absurd treaty with the EU afterwards, I will only feel we are free of the EU if we get enough FTA’s signed, ideally including the US.

    An election then next year would be good.

  52. BJC
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 2:08 pm | Permalink

    When mooting the idea of a referendum, Cameron did so without appreciation of the discontent bubbling up within the country. He underestimated the rage that would drive people to grasp a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to have their voices heard, and he was oblivious to the dangers of a proposal destined to diminish Parliament’s power over the country’s future.

    MPs were no better. They were being asked to vote on a potential game changer which would affect the country for generations to come, so they should have felt a strong obligation to research both sides of the argument prior to their vote on holding a referendum. Even a cursory glance of the EU’s treaties would have informed them of the limited discretion available to the EU in the event of a Leave vote. This meant that the EU was never in a position to offer the sort of terms that could satisfy our needs on becoming an independent nation, unless they were prepared to ignore or change their treaties.

    Whether they care to admit it, or not, this means that MPs tacitly approved what they now allege to be a “catastrophic no deal” the minute they endorsed Cameron’s decision to hold the referendum, because there was nothing else on offer from the EU.

    At this strategic point, however, MPs’ inherent prejudices came to the fore when they blithely agreed to a referendum assuming the electorate would simply do as they were told. This presumption blinded them to the fact that they were actually being asked to surrender their control at the same time as inviting the prospect of a sea change over how our country would be run.

    However, they ploughed on regardless and their “we know best” attitude now began to work against them. The electorate were assured that their representatives could be trusted to deliver the outcome, and from this the electorate could confidently surmised that either option would be good for the country in its own way; otherwise, why would “those who know best” have offered a referendum in the first place, and why would Leave have been one of the choices?

    The rest, as they say, is history, but of course, Parliament then compounded the situation by quickly voting in favour of Art50, enshrining in law a leaving date whether a deal had been agreed, or not.

    This was a defining moment, but it also woke pro-EU MPs from their slumber and they have remorselessly plotted to overturn our democratic vote ever since, ignoring the fact that it’s a situation entirely of their own making. To justify their actions, they disingenuously transfer blame to us because we dared to choose options that MPs; our lawmakers, willingly and without coercion, placed on the table. Worryingly, they’re now so blindly obsessed with winning at any cost that they can’t see anything wrong or dangerous in siding with those gleefully exploiting the situation to install a Marxist government. They are being played like a fiddle.

  53. Lindsay McDougall
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 3:15 pm | Permalink

    The Prime Minister needs to drop this advocacy of a deal with the EU and go Hell for leather to get so called No Deal over the line. He will need to exercise the utmost brutality to be successful.

    Firstly, he needs it to be known that any attempt by the Commons to take No Deal off the table will be resisted by a three line whip. Any Conservative MP voting against the Whip – or even abstaining – will be deselected. If such an MP’s local Conservative Association refuses to deselect him or her, then CCHQ will let it be known that the Brexit Party candidate will be supported.

    Secondly, he needs to get brutal with the European Commission. There will be no transition period and we will begin to IMPLEMENT our own trade, immigration, agriculture and fisheries policies from 1st November. That will automatically reduce the size of our exit fee. It will be further reduced (unilaterally) if our exporters incur unnecessary delays because of bloody minded EU bureaucracy. And if we are throw off the Galileo Project, we will deduct our past contributions plus interest.

    He needs to ridicule the absurd idea, held by the European Commission and its predecessors ever since the 1940s, that you can’t have free trade without political union. It is an idiotic doctrine. The USSR was politically integrated but you could hardly call its centrally controlled economic system free trade. And there are lots of examples of free trade without any political union.

    He needs to get brutal with the Republic of Ireland. We won’t create a hard border; we will admit Irish goods exported to Northern Ireland tariff free and we will ensure that our regulations are less onerous than those imposed by 25 years of dirigiste crap from the European Commission. As regards our exports from Northern Ireland and trade in the border area, if the Republic wants to impose tariffs and checks on these, it is up to them to make it work. If the Republic imposes a hard border, we will give them a frontier and implement Enoch Powell’s version of Unionism.

    After we have left, he should withdraw recognition of the European Union and deal only with individual Member States.

  54. margaret howard
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 4:04 pm | Permalink

    Ken Clarke – the best prime minister Britain never had. There is hope yet that sanity will return and Brexit consigned to the dustbin of history.

    • Fred H
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 7:12 pm | Permalink

      might have guessed you would see his failure to ever get to the top job as a shame. Most of us think ‘thank god for that’.
      We have to contend with numerous ‘yesterdays men ( and women)’ who can’t get over the fact they were passed over. Look at Heseltine, Major, Brown, Blair, Cameron, Osborne, and soon May, Hammond. All washed up but clinging on for any chance of having a prestige, glory moment once again.

    • Chris
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:11 pm | Permalink

      margaret, K C is from a bygone era. You have to move with the times.

    • Jiminyjim
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 9:58 pm | Permalink

      If only KC could stay awake long enough……

  55. Fred H
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 4:44 pm | Permalink

    Conservative MP Ken Clarke has said he would not reject an offer to become caretaker prime minister if it was “the only way” to stop a no-deal Brexit.

    What world does the old fool live in? I think if I had to choose even the mad dog Corbyn, or the Swinson ‘change my politics like May did her shoes’ would seem more reasonable.

    • rose
      Posted August 16, 2019 at 8:04 pm | Permalink

      He has always wanted to be PM and won’t turn down the opportunity of trying.

  56. Iain Gill
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:10 pm | Permalink

    If you think thats bad…

    The Scottish government have nationalised a shipyard…

    What a blomming disgrace

    Boris really should take the mickey on that one

  57. Wokingham Mum
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

    Ken Clarke PM – please – have they all MP’s gone mad

  58. Stephen Reay
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 5:59 pm | Permalink

    It would be an awful end to Ken Clarks career if he were to stand in as interim PM. He could take his chance as he’s always wanted to be PM interim or otherwise. He’s likely to stand down at the next election or before so he’s at the last chance saloon.

    History would look back at him and others as the great democracy deniers of Great Britain, but it would make a great book read.

    • Fred H
      Posted August 17, 2019 at 7:29 am | Permalink

      reading a book about Ken Clark?— great cure for insomnia.

  59. rose
    Posted August 16, 2019 at 11:11 pm | Permalink

    We don’t know the details yet but so far the idea of charging stamp duty on house sales seems a bad idea. It will also discourage people from downsizing, to everyone’s disadvantage.

    • Fred H
      Posted August 17, 2019 at 9:28 am | Permalink

      its crazy, we should reduce stamp duty on the current level for buying!

  60. Grahame ASH
    Posted August 17, 2019 at 3:10 pm | Permalink

    Sir John you say “It would mean any Conservative who had helped bring about such an election was unlikely to run again as a Conservative candidate.” How do you reconcile this with the Beaconsfield constituency that deselected Dominic Grieve, only for the decision to be overturned by your Central Office.?
    I hope you don’t mind me referring to and quoting a link to an interesting article by a constituency member.
    It does make me wonder if there are many Remainers in the Establishment at CCO.
    I welcome your reply.

  61. Peter
    Posted August 19, 2019 at 1:24 pm | Permalink

    “His own party remains riven between Remain at all costs MPs and accept the verdict of the people MPs.”

    I challenge your claim that there are only two points of view here, and I encourage everyone else to challenge it too. You suggest that everyone in this country is an extremist, one way or the other, when it comes to Brexit, and I don’t believe that that’s true.

One Trackback

  • […] “Parliament’s choice this September is simple. Does it at last  want to do the right thing, honour the verdict of the referendum and allow us to leave the EU on October 31 as the government plans?  Or does it have a narrow majority of MPs who want to bring on an early election, going back to the people and telling them this Parliament is not fit for purpose, can’t make up its mind and needs to be thrown out? Were it to choose the latter it will be a difficult task for all those Labour MPs who stood on a Manifesto of leaving the EU to explain their about turn. It would mean any Conservative who had helped bring about such an election was unlikely to run again as a Conservative candidate. It means the near certain end to the Parliamentary work of those MPs who defected from their original parties and are now in Change UK in order to try to keep the UK in the EU.” (link) […]

  • About John Redwood

    John Redwood won a free place at Kent College, Canterbury, and graduated from Magdalen College Oxford. He is a Distinguished fellow of All Souls, Oxford. A businessman by background, he has set up an investment management business, was both executive and non executive chairman of a quoted industrial PLC, and chaired a manufacturing company with factories in Birmingham, Chicago, India and China. He is the MP for Wokingham, first elected in 1987.

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