The Biden Administration will be haunted by those sad scenes of Afghans clinging to the outside of a US plane wanting to take off from Kabul. They did so in the vain hope that they might be able to go with the passengers approved for the journey inside the aircraft. That picture tells us powerfully that many Afghans see the Taliban takeover of their country as a disaster. It reminds us that the might of the USA, visibly present in the form of a large military aircraft, was bent on getting out and leaving behind the chaos that is Afghanistan under Taliban takeover.
The USA was always the initiator and senior NATO partner in the Afghan operation. For some twenty years US and allied troops fought to evict the Taliban from the towns and villages of Afghanistan, and then helped the Afghan forces recruit, train and equip to gradually take over the tasks of policing to prevent a further insurgency. Many brave UK soldiers gave their lives or suffered bad injuries in the cause of preventing the barbarism of a Taliban regime to assist the US led mission. Good advances were made in reducing the numbers of murders and exchanges of fire, allowing girls and women education and better lives, and beginning to develop a more diverse democratic system of government. These were achievements the West could be proud of, and can explain the sacrifices made by our military personnel.
President Obama tried to bring the Taliban into a peace process to see if politics and diplomacy could take over from vigilance and fighting, without success. President Trump did get into talks with the Taliban about how they could play a role within a democratic and peace loving Afghanistan. His Agreement promised US troop withdrawal in return for security guarantees from the Taliban and the intent for the Taliban to hold talks with the Afghan government to establish agreed ways of working with them for the future. President Biden by removing US forces too speedily without the agreement of his Afghan or NATO allies left open an opportunity for the Taliban to abandon the idea of talks and to press home the advantage to take control of the whole country instead. It turned out the Afghan forces were not ready to track and withstand Taliban armed insurgents despite all the training and military equipment the US and its allies had helped provide. If President Biden had listened to allies he would have left more support in place to prevent such an easy capture of the state. His claim that he was following President Trump’s policy is not borne out by reading the Doha Declaration or Agreement with the Taliban which made clear the Taliban had to negotiate a role with the Afghan government, not usurp it at the point of a gun.
What should happen now? The first thing is to ask President Biden to make sure he does not repeat the experience in Iraq by vacating there too soon and before the host nation is ready to run its own security without help. The second is to get President Biden to spell out what alliance structure he now wishes to establish, as he has damaged and undermined the Trump idea of relying on Saudi, Israel and the Gulf states as his main allies, bringing them together in an anti Iran coalition with peace treaties between the Arab states and Israel. As President Biden tilts a bit towards Iran, how will that work out with old Trump allies who see Iran as a threat to regional peace? Will Taliban Afghanistan now ally with Iran, strengthening the forces traditionally hostile to the West? What will President Biden do if China becomes a best friend and ally of Afghanistan and offers large sums of aid, loans and investment to gain control of important economic resources? Will the US be able to rely on bases in Pakistan if Pakistan emerges as major influence on Taliban Afghanistan and another ally of Mr Biden’s nemesis? Whilst it is said that even China, Pakistan and Russia have their reservations about some Taliban stances and the way they overthrew an established government, they will all most likely exploit the damage it has done to the West and will seek to lever their links to the Taliban.
We were told the world would be a better place when a new President promised grown up foreign policies from the White House. Eight months on and the Middle East is a less stable place, the US has suffered a major military defeat without firing a shot in anger to stop the Taliban that they had evicted previously, and we await some idea of how the President thinks he can pursue diplomatic avenues to defend western interests and help support more stable and prosperous societies in the Middle East.
August 18, 2021
You have to wonder how many taliban fighters were smuggled in across the channel to start small cells around the U.K.!!!
August 18, 2021
Indeed, nothing at all to stop or even deter this is coming from Patel and this government. According to the Telegraph the other day – Priti Patel plans network of centres across the country to hold 8,000 asylum seekers. North East tops list for bespoke sites, which would replace the housing of migrants in hotels, but they could be built in any English region.
August 18, 2021
Why not house them in Witney and in Maidenhead ?
August 18, 2021
No. I think you can be assured that none of them will be housed anywhere near the leafy places where Politicians live. Thats the hypocrisy of it.
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
Mick, well, if they are not here yet, they soon will be. Our government will have to start getting smarter and dealing with illegals and indeed legal entries with more proof of who they are dealing with. Watch this space because that ain’t going to happen. They will just keep pouring in with their stories of who they are and still claiming to be children when obviously many are not.
August 18, 2021
Would you welcome anyone from Afghanistan to this country? Imagine being a young woman there. Would you allow her to come here and live a free life?
August 18, 2021
How many do you suggest Mike? Will they all be vetted carefully or just let in? Why didn’t their husbands, brothers and fathers fight for their freedom? They had the weaponry? No fight at all. They just let the Taliband walk right in. Next time you moan that this government isn’t doing enough to help the disadvantaged in this country or isn’t helping pensioners etc enough just think of the cost of all of this when we already have a housing crisis. God help us. Anyone would think we were a large country and able to take them all in. After all our young servicemen did the least they could do is fight for themselves and their country.
August 18, 2021
FUS, 10 men with guns can probably control a crowd of 100 đ
It’s not easy unless you are put in that situation…
August 18, 2021
If she were a Christian, or willing to give up Islam, then yes, Mike. Otherwise, no. The problem of lack of rights (as we understand human rights from a Christian heritage) is embedded in Islam – they have a different set of values. This isn’t an issue of which is better or right, it’s an issue of incompatible differences. Therefore muslims cannot have it both ways – either Islam has a Reformation, or muslims must live by Islam.
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
No, i suggest she calls her sisters back there!
August 18, 2021
Fedupsoutherner : “They will just keep pouring in with their stories of who they are and still claiming to be children when obviously many are not.”
The Home Office define a child as anyone up to the age of 25.
August 18, 2021
The UK is run by a ship of fools, and has been for quite some time. They have allowed themselves to be out-manoeuvred and their values compromised by the liberal left at every turn. Our laws and freedoms are used against us. I expect the UK to be an Islamic state within 40 years, and the indigenous culture to be obliterated.
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
They don’t have to be smuggled anymore Mick – govt has said no passports needed, The world will turm up on our beaches, all claiming to be from Afghanistan – and waved in. Wasn’t it Merkel who demanded we have “Open Borders” – We’ve got them now. A govt approved invasion of the UK. A sarcasic round of applause for the govt.
August 18, 2021
No, Mrs. Merkel never did any such thing.
She was amongst the foremost trying to stem the influx to European Union countries.
She did state the numbers with which Germany could cope – to save Greece and Italy from being overwhelmed – however, and the UK right-wing media duly traduced that as an invitation, and one which they transmitted to the world at large, increasing the problem..
August 18, 2021
Yet a million came to Germany.
August 19, 2021
Yes, they were already here, in Greece and in Italy, by the time that she made her estimate as to Germany’s capacity.
August 18, 2021
“She was amongst the foremost trying to stem the influx to European Union countries.”
A breathtaking lie. Merkel did nothing to close the borders in the summer of 2015, and when confronted with the dire numbers who had already poured into Germany, airily pretended ‘Das schaffen wir!’
August 19, 2021
Border security is a sovereign matter for member countries of the European Union.
What did you expect her to do? Send German tanks into Greece?
August 19, 2021
So yes you agree Merkel encourage a million to enter Germany.
August 18, 2021
I would suggest none, as the Taliban have no intention of doing other than maintaining influence in Afghanistan. As Sir General Nick Carter quite sensibly said on TV yesterday, you have to understand what the Taliban is. It is not a terrorist organisation with any international reach unlike AQ or ISIS. Let us see how the weeks and months unfold but I think that, overall, we might feel less worried in time.
The previous regime was hopelessly corrupt with a president who legged it with a helicopter full of cash. Nobody is going to fight for that, and we have no right going around the world setting up mini âdemocraticâ statelets at taxpayerâs expense.
Zorro
August 18, 2021
That is a false assurance. The last time the Taliban was in power they also had no declared foreign goals, but they enabled Afghanistan to become a nursery for Al Qaeda’s extreme islamist 9/11 terrorists, whom they were content to harbour – which was why they were invaded. They have this week repeatedly announced that they will enforce sharia law throughout the country. They have not announced that they will refrain from harbouring jihadist attacks on the west. Sharia law (as in Iran) is a strong factor in encouraging islamist terrorism. All the new generation of Taliban have learnt is more plausible dissembling.
August 18, 2021
Are we sure that an agreement would have stopped their obsession with changing the world to a total hard Islamic regime ? What is going to happen to those recently educated women now . Will the barbarians demand the women who are standing up to the Taliban get down into their slave like lives. Many people from Pakistan will stay quiet but when they feel the time is right jump on to the band waggon of their religion . I look at the religious prayer beads and to me they become worry beads.
August 18, 2021
Canât remember the name but there is ( HE Bates I think) a short story about an upper middle class woman who encourages a young working class girl to embrace âfreedomâ and run through the fields naked. The girlâs father finds out, is humiliated and punishes her dreadfully (âuntil the blood runsâ). The posh woman hears the hullabaloo and shrugs! And goes back to her comfortable, safe life.
âFreedomâfor women in Afghanistan = death.
If you encourage people to defy their culture you must be prepared to defend them forever!
August 18, 2021
It’s a sad day for women. The problem is this religion sees women as lesser human beings and many men like it this way. Even in this country, we allow religious beliefs to overrule our laws and turn a blind eye to polygamous marriage, sharia law, and honour killings. If it isn’t stamped out these people with their barbaric beliefs will become emboldened. Our politicians just aren’t brave enough to tackle it.
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
The Taliban have no obsession with changing the world into a total hard Islamic regime. It is us who have the obsession with exporting our PC type government.
Zorro
August 18, 2021
@Zorro – yes you could easily rationalise that Boris and his follows are the same religious extremists that they label the Taliban to be
August 18, 2021
I beg to differ.It is part of their religion to globally spread without boundaries and ensure Allah is worshipped.
August 18, 2021
All the Labour and Liberal supporters who for decades have denounced the USA for imperialist and colonial neocon foreign policy decisions made by George W Bush should be happy that one has been finally reversed. But they donât seem to be. Odd.
The EU are strangely silent too.
August 18, 2021
Apparently the Chinese have been engaged in extensive talks with the Taliban.
We’ll have to see what effect that has had – which will be “interesting” at least.
August 18, 2021
Indeed, MiC. It should have been obvious for some years now that that was always going to be the main issue – did the Afghans want to turn to the Chinese Belt & Road initiative as the future for their country, rather than endless war? And if they did, should the Western powers be trying to stop them?
August 18, 2021
Relations between the Chinese and Taliban will be prickly to say the least.
China is very wary of contagion to the Uyghurs and they don’t like Afghanistan’s opium trade. Remember they fought wars over this with Britain in the 19th century, when we tried to maintain our lucrative trade in drugs.
August 18, 2021
The Taliban have told Russia’s envoy that,not only will they not host terrorist organizations,but will “continue aggressively attacking ISIS.”
August 18, 2021
The Taliban and former President Karzai have both made a number of visits to Moscow and Beijing over the past couple of years.The Taliban met with the Russian ambassador to Kabul yesterday.
Someone has been teaching the Taliban modern media techniques and which “buttons” to press with regard to the west..
August 18, 2021
It was Labour who sent the troops into Afghanistan and Iraq. Lots of Tories opposed the war in Afghanistan and Iraq.
True Conservastism is only about supporting war when absolutely necessary. I don’t just speak for many if not most Tories but for army too.
Bush and socialist buddies in the UK Labour Party were pipsqueaks PRETENDING to act like real men.
August 18, 2021
I’d love to see some of the neo-cons and socialist Labour who sent the army to these places. They wouldn’t last a minute, crying for mummy to bring them home. Real men are prepared to fight but only when absolutely necessary.
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
We are to take 20,000 Afghan refugees, R5L reports. This makes we wonder why this policy is not being announced first in a recalled House of Commons. And the number is far too big anyway. We owe the Afghan population nothing – and most of the interpreters (and similar) are in the process of being settled here already.
I want to see some meaningful action taken against Pakistan. For the past twenty years the country has acted as our enemy, aiding a Taliban that has been killing my comrades. It is time to end all foreign aid to Pakistan, to stop British girls being sent there for suspicious ‘family holidays’, and to prevent that country’s citizens from entering this country with anything like ease.
And what of those anti-Taliban Afghanis who are rallying in the Panshir Valley? (See Mail Online.) Will they be given any support? Or will they just be abandoned? I suspect it will be the latter.
And finally, it’s time the Conservative government stopped fawning over the worst president in American history – a man who ‘demarched’ the UK in the run-up to a visit here. It’s unseemly. We should start treating him as the Brit-hating lame-duck that he will be from the end of next year.
August 18, 2021
We notice that Johnson has no such nicety of feeling towards his own ( what are we? Captives? Subjects? Slaves? Guinea pigs?).
I suppose he may want to just keep on collecting more and more folk to jab?
August 18, 2021
@Everhopeful – all of the above, administered with the same religious zeal
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
The prisoners in the German concentration camps called those who were the guinea pigs the Rabbits. That seems to me to have been a better name for their horrifying, hopeless and helpless situation, and for us now, because rabbits are aware of their peril. The government obviously does not give a fig for the population of this country. Some of us know this, the question is what shall we do about it. We owe them nothing.
August 18, 2021
Spot on!
August 18, 2021
Where will we house them? 20,000 is a town the size of Faversham or Reigate plus all of the infrastructure, medical, education and social care etc. required.
Do our politicians actually think things through before making these grandiose statements?
August 18, 2021
We already have 9,000,000 people here who were born elsewhere. We have a proposed 3,000,000 Hong Kong Nationals invited here, plus a Tory policy of allowing a further 720,000 here every year. Is that controlling our borders? So what’s their real agenda? Supporting the English or allowing an unrestricted immigration free for all. How does this sit with their CO2 targets baloney or their so called housing (immigration obsession) crisis? It’s total nonsense and anyone with an ounce of sense can see through these liberal absurdities.
August 18, 2021
Timaction : Agreed.
August 18, 2021
Absolutely. So why do people keep voting for them. Immigration has been a huge issue with the public for decades, and all promises broken. Are people really so stupid. It’s like the battered wife syndrome where they keep going back to their abusers.
This past year alone should leave people in no doubt that we no longer have a Parliament that puts our wishes or welfare first.
August 18, 2021
I suspect the Taliban will leave the Panshir Valley alone. If they are strong in that region why suffer casualties when they (the Taliban) have the rest of the country? The Panshir Valley aren’t going to be the champions to liberate Afghanistan; they are just content with their own patch.
Our support just means more proxy war and the wrong people will die.
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
20k far too many? 20k is nowhere near the number who will arrive. Bump it up into six figures and you’ll be nearer. Where will they go? – nowhere near the people who are waving them in to live on our taxes THAT is certain.
The line of “There’ll always be an England” – forget it – it is history.
August 18, 2021
Sea_Warrior: So ‘we’ will take 20,000 refugees. That’s a town the size of e.g. Sandhurst, or Witham (Priti Patel’s constituency). Where will the houses be built, I wonder?
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
The first thing they did in their news conference is complain about Facebook censorship, so maybe they are out natural allies against the Left and globalists? I mean they can actually win.
August 18, 2021
John, the Taliban did not have anything to do with 911 and they may now actually stop the poppy fields, we never did.
August 18, 2021
As the produce of the poppy fields are destined for the decadent west, the Taliban will be quite relaxed about it. The industry brings in cash and if the Taliban have their cut they will be happy for it to continue.
The Taliban’s strict religious stance is just a cover for their hatred, barbarism and inhumanity. I expect they will enjoy the same corruption as the regime they replace, seeing as they can cut off the finger of accusation.
August 18, 2021
Andrew Neill shreds Biden this morning in the DM. An informed report in the DT sets out precisely why the Taliban were so successful so quickly yet our wonderful politicians claimed to be surprised. Instant knee jerk from Patel letâs have even more people into our over crowded island.
It stinks and your government is not the main guilty player but guilty nevertheless. Cue hand wringing all round in the Commons from the Tories happy to be led by the nose and the whole House who up to this moment havenât shown a scintilla of interest in the Region.
I guess drug dealers and terrorist groups will be delighted, if I was Taiwan I would be very afraid. China and Russia laughing their socks off.
August 18, 2021
+1, it is a disaster for the west and Bidenâs speech yesterday was pathetic like the man himself.
August 18, 2021
@lifelogic – Biden (I am 100% not a fan) has been accused of putting the USA first by the talking heads outside of his Country. I wonder what it would be like to have a leader that puts his Country first
August 18, 2021
Well we’ll never know will we under our mainstream parties.
August 18, 2021
+1 but what Biden did will damage the USA hugely.
August 18, 2021
There’s a pressing need for a major ‘government’ re-shuffle. Patel is completely incompetent. She needs to be one the casualties.
August 18, 2021
But is she actually doing what they want?
Basically enforcing âopen bordersâ?
August 18, 2021
There’s a pressing need for a new Government, LibLabCon none fit for office.
August 18, 2021
Addanc. I second that wholeheartedly. We are being led by idiots.
August 18, 2021
Indeed .
August 18, 2021
Absolutely and spread the word far and wide, or give up and lay down and wait for the very uncertain future for us as a distinct people and nation.
August 18, 2021
@Sea_Warrior – sort of disagree to the extent is the team or their leader that cant cut the mustard
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
As Afghanistan has already cornered 80% of the world’s opium trade, and that under the occupation, it will be business as usual for the drug dealers.
August 18, 2021
Why were we in there in the first place. The 9/11 people were from Saudi Arabia!!
August 18, 2021
You answered your own question.
Because it is not Saudi Arabia.
August 18, 2021
From the Japanese business magazine,President, at the weekend :
“The Americans will someday abandon Japan as they abandoned Iraq and Afghanistan.It’s time for us to learn how to protect ourselves and look for foreign policy deals that would keep us safe.”
I would expect Japan to continue moving closer to Russia strategically.I read last week that the Japanese government is encouraging Japanese exporters to trial the rail route to Europe through Russia(and Russia is in the middle of a major investment programme to increase freight handling capacity substantially in it’s Far East).That suggests to me that Japan considers China to have more or less undisputed control of the S China seas and is looking for alternative trade routes to spread risk.I would expect Japan to also utilize the Russian Arctic route as the infrastructure goes in.
The UK’s idea of doing something with Japan and S Korea is deluded fantasy-we have nothing to offer.
The Russians are also opening up the S Kuril Islands to foreign investment which the Japanese would very much like to participate in.The Japanese have not yet formally ceded these islands to Russia(occupied at the end of WWII)and so have not formally ended WWII with a peace treaty with Russia.
However,China,in what is described as a move which has stunned those in Asian diplomatic circles, said last week that “Outcomes of the victorious anti-fascist war should be earnestly respected and upheld……..China will take an even bigger step in lockstep with Russia….China will join in the development of the South Kurils in due time.”Since the Sino-Soviet split and until now China has not recognised these islands as legitimately Russian.That will concentrate the minds of the Japanese!
August 18, 2021
Good morning.
20 Years, and for what ?
Who are the Taliban ? Well, to me they are the people that live in that part of the world. They are the natural government of that region. Not by the ballot box, but by the gun, which is how things are done in those parts. Hopefully we can now leave them alone to get on with it.
Well some pigeons are coming home to roost. When President Trump came into office he was derided , ridiculed and treated very badly, especially by our government and the Establishment. We had, for a short while, an American President that almost loved this country as much as his own. Who sought peace, non-intervention and demanded that other nations, especially those in NATO do more. Now, to much joy of those who were against him, he is gone and replaced by a President that some referred to as, “One of our own.” Yeah, such a great President that he basically dumped all over them and showed that when the chips are down he will leave you hanging. Some ally ?!?!
Perhaps this is the wake up call we need. We do not have a US Administration that can be trusted and will have to start to work on being more self reliant. Other smaller nations manage it so why can’t we ?
August 18, 2021
Well said. Yes smaller nations do survive by being more self reliant, but it’s not what the globalist running the show here want so that’s a none starter for us I’m afraid.
August 18, 2021
Trump promised to Make America Great Again and – despite massive opposition from the American Establishment/Media, he was doing a pretty good job.
In less than a year the Senile Old Duffer they replaced him with has delivered a defeat worse than Vietnam; humiliated America; demonstrated to the world that the USA is an untrustworthy friend and an unreliable ally.
And STILL they blame Trump.
August 22, 2021
Also, it’s very American – and unbritish – to over-focus on a President. America is a new country compared to the UK. We have a rich heritage and civilisation that took centuries to build up. USA had to catch up much quicker. But with that comes the danger of a certain brash kind of nouveau-riche thinking about what exactly marks ‘greatness’. For some nouveau riche it’s all about money and earning it quickly in anyway you can. This is NOT the British way. This is not the thinking of a civilised Churchill say, but of a brash, vulgar kind of Americanism.
This is England not USA.
Reply We donât have a President to focus on!
August 18, 2021
Afghanistan has never been successfully invaded in several centuries. Warring factions and corruption are always an issue.
Military over stretch has led to the decline of all the great powers.
The only winners have been the arms manufacturers who are not subject to competition and charge whatever they want. The taxpayer picks up the tab. Senior politicians and military personnel also find lucrative employment with these companies in later life.
Damage limitation to the West is my primary concern now. No influx of Afghans to the UK. Let them go to one of the neighbouring âstansâ where they will find a similar culture.
August 18, 2021
Damage limitation to the West is my primary concern now. No influx of Afghans to the UK. Let them go to one of the neighbouring âstansâ where they will find a similar culture.
Quite – no doubt the left will criticise the West for policing the world, well we need not provide safe haven for the world either. Let them fight for their own safety in their own country. This country and the West is what it is because the population stood up to tyranny over time
August 18, 2021
NS,
Agreed.
August 18, 2021
A very true statement.
Zorro
August 18, 2021
Itâs surely clear that radical islamists will infiltrate the flow of refugees from Afghanistan into the UK, as well as the ever increasing flow of young men across the channel. The inevitable terrorist atrocities will be met with the usual âthis is despicable, the British people stand together in the face of these attacks on our freedoms and way of lifeâ type weak response from our politicians.
August 18, 2021
How long before these 10’s of thousands of Afghan asylum seekers turn around and start lecturing us on our racism and White supremacy and claim parts of our history culture offend them and need to be torn down?
There is no end to the obligations the British establishment will pile on our sinking little island. 6 million Europeans, no problem. 5 million Hong Kong citizens , come on over. 1 million immigrants every couple of years, yeah the more the merrier. And don’t forget Priti Patel’s channel taxi service which is going full bore and growing at a rate to make Uber envious. At no point do the British establishment do anything to lighten the obligations on our poor country. They don’t go to the UN and tell them we have to suspend our obligations to the Refugee Convention or remove our selves from May’s migration compact, they are always piling up the obligations.
Of course there are obligations the British establishment couldn’t care a fig about , a soldier came on Farage’s news programme and pointed out there were thousands of wounded and damaged ex soldiers who the MOD have failed to compensate.
August 18, 2021
A regular Brexitist moan is that âtheyâ are all coming over here to rape, murder and kill people in acts of terrorism. It is complete and utter nonsense.
The reality, which is worse, is that nearly all of the deadly terror attacks we have experienced here have been carried out by people born and bred in the U.K.
August 18, 2021
Andy you may be partially right, but who indoctrinated them initially ?
Similar situation with the ISIS Brides.
Better to ask yourself why do they all want to come here, and then turn us into a similar Society that they left as a so called refugee ?
We will be going down the pan fast if we do not have secure borders, and check all arrivals carefully.
August 18, 2021
Tell that to the victims of the Manchester arena bombing.
August 18, 2021
The Manchester Arena bombing was shocking. The perpetrator was born in Manchester and grew up in Manchester.
As I said nearly all of the deadly attacks have been carried out by people who were born in the U.K. and who grew up here.
August 18, 2021
As he said, nearly all, not all.
August 18, 2021
I’m sure that will make it much easier for the bereaved families Andy and martin.
Just a generation away….
August 18, 2021
As the emboldened Taliban, with their new military might, expand into neighbouring countries, will we take refugees from all these places until the indigenous British people become a minority in their own country? How many terrorists will be amongst these refugees? Where will we house them? The Conservatives were elected to control immigration yet they have made things worse than ever. Turning the boats back to France would be a start but they donât even have the courage to do this one simple thing and continue to waste our money paying the French. This illegal immigration could be stopped overnight if the French agreed to take these people back but they just want rid of them. Where will this end?
August 18, 2021
Whilst they have expended much energy last week determined to make out terrorism in the UK is an equal opportunity employer (a white lone nutter in Plymouth being classed as a ‘terrorist’.)
This so they can justify the coming restrictions on all of us rather than use racial profiling.
August 18, 2021
MPC,
On past form that seems likely. All talk. No action.
August 18, 2021
The speed of the Taliban takeover just demonstrates how paper thin were the achievements of the past 20 years.
The religious mind of Afghans has not warmed to Western ideas. The West has tried imposing secular government on the country and the Afghans have been able to see what that means – opulent palaces and riches for the corrupt Presidency whilst security forces remain unpaid.
The Afghans look at the West and see decadence and immorality, whilst the West celebrates woke culture. The two don’t fit, separating like oil and water.
What use the continued occupation of Afghanistan? Girls could go to school and have the option of taking up a career which was good, but the lack of gay rights will continue to offend liberalists in the West.
Questions in the media about whether all the loss of life and serious injury of British soldiers was worth it. Well, they suffered as pawns in Tony Blair’s vain war; personally I never saw that as a worthy cause.
August 18, 2021
The western political class ‘celebrates’ woke culture not its people. Most people despise woke fascism for they know it is political control of language and identity to destroy free debate for those outside of the Neo-Marxist system of control
Johnson said himself he sees no harm in woke politics. The man is a danger to himself and to us all. A most vulgar politician who used to believe in free speech for all and now has adopted the anti-thesis of such a position
I want to talk in person and online about ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING. The fact that laws have been passed to stop this from happening should incite fear in us all. We are no longer free
August 18, 2021
It was embarrassing. We tried to teach them whokeness and showed them Attenborough films to try to make them convert to the mother earth religion. While we should have been teaching them the Words of Jesus.
August 18, 2021
It’s my understanding that part of Afghanistan’s problem (quite a large part indeed) is down to allegedly ethnic divisions between three major tribes, and to the religious conflict between the Sunni and Shia Islam sects.
Despite reading national and international news every day, I can find no mention of a) attempts at religious reconciliation between the two major players in the Islamic faith, nor b) any condemnation of the inherent racism manifested through violence against different tribes by the folk who are usually so vocal about those whose lives ‘matter’. Let’s see some footballers ‘take the knee’ for the Hezera Afghanis!
August 18, 2021
The West is Persianate-the Herat region has been part of Persia at various times in history.The Shia Hazaras have been fighting for Iran in the Syrian war.The north is Turkic-Tartar and closely linked to Tajikstan and Uzbekistan(historically part of the empires of the Mongols and Tamerlane).The South/East is ethnically linked to Pakistan.
August 18, 2021
Yes, but they are united in religion, which succeeded where all else failed.
The opposition to the Taliban are still divided along the lines that you describe however, and that is their great weakness.
August 18, 2021
They are Islamic, MiC, but there is still the Sunni/Shia divide, leading to actions which make Bloody Mary Tudor’s attempt to overturn the Reformation in England look quite benign.
August 19, 2021
Those who have suffered most are the Sufi and Ahmadiyya .
They believe in non-violence and in tolerance.
That seems to upset some people, a bit like the European Union does others.
August 18, 2021
Everybody was amazed at how fast the Talibs managed to take over the country. However there are multiple reports in the foreign press that instructions “came down from the top” to the Pushtun Afghan National Army (ANA) not to fight and resist. Late on Monday President Ghani was reported to have left Kabul in a helicopter loaded with so much cash, he couldn’t fit it all in.
Apparently as each regional capital was approached, the Talibs negotiated with the ANA defenders, a truck load of cash changed hands, the ANA went home rich and in exchange the Talibs seized huge amounts of prime American weaponry and ammunition.
This is how business is traditionally done in Afghan. The only thing that I have been unable to estabish is exactly where these tremendous amounts of cash came from. One day someone will work out how much it cost the Taliban the buy the country.
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
Very good assessment in the The Conversation. “Afghanistan: Taliban victory inevitable despite the trillions the US poured in August 13, 2021 3.28pm BST” (Google “”)
August 18, 2021
BTW. Could someone please tell me what the point was of recalling parliament; at great expense, to debate Afghanistan? What exactly did our narcissistic parliament think it could possibly influence? Certainly not Downing Street for a start.
August 18, 2021
To make them feel important!
August 19, 2021
Yes, I wondered that too, Acorn.
August 18, 2021
Good question, Sakara. A lot less than it cost the Americans and us to lose the country, would be my guess.
But surely we know where the Taliban’s money came from – selling opium to the ‘degenerate’ West.
Perhaps now they won’t need to. After all, they stopped the opium trade in the 1990s when they came to power the first time. Though it restarted after Afghanistan was ‘liberated’ in 2001.
August 18, 2021
A very sensible and efficient way of doing business.
Zorro
August 18, 2021
The Afghan people and security forces laid down their resistance against the Taliban advance. The West poured money and lives into setting up systems for future government – Afghans gave it up so easily.
If they can’t be bothered to resist why should be help them? No aid, no resettlement, leave them to it and their medieval practices.
If the Taliban does indeed live up to their early pronouncements allowing (some) freedoms for women and not taking revenge against government officials then channels can be opened in due course.
August 18, 2021
As much as the situation impacts on the world order, what about the impact on the taxpayers here?
20 thousand refugees assume some are families will cost in or around 12 thousand a year to provide accomodation, food,health,education etc,etc. Minimum cost to the taxpayer
120 million a year. What about all our homeless and socially deprived in society?
What budget is all this coming from?
Foreign Aid. We are a small island albeit with a good social security system , but there is no bottomless pit for money.
Yet another commitment by our leader with no thought of the consequences. All very noble and moral but let’s get real all the people we are taking in whether they be legal or illegal will have a big impact on our society never mind the insane Net Zero dream of Carrie and Boris. When is this madness going to stop? Government has a 80 majority.
START USING IT for the important matters to us the voter and taxpayer.
August 18, 2021
It is all very worrying, indeed!
Biden has effectively lit the fuse of WW3, and this time, it may well not be the West who wins!
And with so many woke appeasers around in the west who judge everyone by their own petty standards⊠Lord help us!
August 18, 2021
Most likely to be biological and without any declaration of it.
August 18, 2021
NLA.. The Chinese have already had a bloody good go with Covid.
August 18, 2021
@Sharon
I am not worried about it. What will wording about it achieve. Here we have another day of our short sojourn on this earth. I am not going to waste it worrying about something I have no control over.
August 18, 2021
‘woke appeasers’
– WW2 was clearly a just war. Churchill was right. But Churchill was no fool. He knew well the futility of war too. Look at those the stupid, gung-ho decisions of politicians before WW1 that led to the disastrous WW1 – for all.
‘Woke’ is a stupid word unless it is defined very carefully. Otherwise it just becomes meaningless and dangerous. Cyrus the Great was a great leader precisely because he thought everything through. But shadows kings or shadow leaders just follow the crowd like sheep, nothing thinking things through properly, but subjectively following others.
August 18, 2021
Also, let’s start up a Dad’s Army and send off all the old men – led by Tony Blair – who support Afghanistan and Iraq War to these places themselves, instead of sending our fine young men (and women). Let’s see how long these old men would last before crying, ‘Mummy, take me home.’
Real men are prepared for fight and die – but in a good war. Politicians are all to easy to send troops out because they don’t have to fight the war themselves, but from the comfort of their armchairs. Which is why most politicians are useless at foreign affairs. Power goes to their heads. They are out of touch with reality.
August 18, 2021
Biden is hopeless, his uselessness has confirmed the lowest expectations. It had been thought there were some quasi-sensible people around him like Blinken, but the main influence seems to be a bunch of radical woke leftists obsessed with gender pronouns, global warming and de-funding the US police. Business people and entrepreneurs especially are leaving the Democrat controlled states with their rising crime levels, high taxes and inane anti-covid gesture policies (like wearing masks outside, pointlessly) for the relative sanctuary of more rational states like Texas and Florida.
Still, we should try to shore up Biden in the interest of the West as Margaret Thatcher did with Jimmy Carter, who was also dangerously useless. Then letâs hope someone sound like Pompeo or de Santis succeeds Biden. (And China doesnât attack Taiwan in the meantime.)
August 18, 2021
What a god awful mess this has turned out to be, very costly in terms of finance and lives destroyed, and which has actually ended up strengthening the Taliban’s hold and fighting reputation.
The can now only hope that the more moderate Taliban supporters will have some influence on the way they eventually choose to govern and interact with the rest of the World.
I wonder if any of the WOKE brigade, so vocal here and in some other western Countries, will now turn their thoughts to Afghanistan, and start preaching to the Taliban about allowing gender identity, etc etc. ?
As for us taking in refugees, what is going to be the criteria for selection, consideration and approval.
I wonder will lessons be learn’t, no chance.
August 18, 2021
‘I wonder if any of the WOKE brigade, so vocal here and in some other western Countries, will now turn their thoughts to Afghanistan, and start preaching to the Taliban about allowing gender identity, etc etc. ?’
– Let’s start closer to home. It was the Conservative Party that introduced gay marriage (makes me sick, thinking about it – I’m not anti gay – that’s a personal choice – but I am anti gay marriage).
August 18, 2021
‘I wonder if any of the WOKE brigade, so vocal here and in some other western Countries, will now turn their thoughts to Afghanistan, and start preaching to the Taliban about allowing gender identity, etc etc. ?’
– Also, let’s re-introduce National Service (which I strongly support). That would be a great test to see how really non-woke this Conservative government is or not.
August 18, 2021
Ed M
“National service”.
Now that is where immigrants and refugees should start their life when they come here, Not in a free hotel, let us see if they are prepared to fight for their new Country.
August 19, 2021
What has immigration got to do with national service?!
Yes, obviously all should have to do national service – legal requirement. Unless medically unfit. But then they can do volunteer work instead.
August 18, 2021
The endless trouble and heartache caused by MEDDLING.
It is only ever done out of vile self interestâŠalthough of course as per usual the useful idiots who do all the work have to be convinced that it is being done out of the very best motives.
Why should the West be proud that it has upended OTHER PEOPLEâS CULTURES?
It is not up to us to say what is right or wrong!
Look around at the mess Western leaders have made of their own countries.
They should get their own houses in order.
But of that, obviously, they are not capable!
August 18, 2021
Seem to remember MPs rushing to congratulate Biden on his election ‘victory’. Hard to see why with his declining mental capacities so evident. Ministers now claiming that everyone was surprised at the rapidity of the Taliban takeover is disingenuous or a sign of their incompetence as it was obvious. In either case this is the worst government I can remember and should be removed from office before they wreak further damage on those they were elected to serve but now choose to dominate.
August 18, 2021
What worries me most is the prospect of thousands of Afghan migrants being allowed to come here. We have absurd and idiotic Conservative MPs claiming that because we fought to help them gain freedom we now have a responsibility towards them. The OPPOSITE is the case!! The fact that we fought to help them (suffering 457 dead and thousands of amputees) means that we have MORE than done ‘our bit’ already! It is the countries that did less in the past that should do more now!
Then we are told that we must take 20,000 refugees, like Canada. But Canada is 41 times bigger than the UK, with a population just over half the size!!! When will these cretinous Tory MPs understand that the UK is GROSSLY OVERCROWDED. We have already taken 20,000 migrants from Syria, which was a digraceful decision: a betrayal of Britain and the British people. I will not vote for this government that is filling our crountry to overflowing, making all our lives a misery. We are SUFFOCATING like in the ‘Black Hole of Calcutta’. We are desperately trying to build new homes on beautiful green land, and shoehorning new housing in every spare corner of our cities. Our roads cannot cope, nor our GP surgeries, nor our hospitals, nor our schools, nor our utility supplies. BRITAIN IS FULL.
And finally, no Sir John. I do NOT think that girls’ education or developing a “democratic system of government” in Afghanistan are “achievements the West could be proud of, and can explain the sacrifices made by our military personnel”. I have NO wish to interfere in the internal affairs of other countries. Each country has a diferent culture, a different set of values and a different path to follow. I vehemently object if foreigners (like the EU, or the UN) tell us what to do and so, being a fair and consistent man, do not tell foreigners how to live their lives. British soldiers should ONLY be used to advance BRITISH NATIONAL INTERESTS. The lives of the Afghans do NOT concern us. It is tragic but the sacrifices our fighting men made were quite pointless, and every MP who supported the war is to blame.
August 18, 2021
X TORY. What a fantastic post. We’ll done for saying what most sensible people would like to say.
August 18, 2021
A Taliban victory is worrying for western elites because it shows how bankrupt of morality and common sense they are. The better part of two decades of illegal invasion and occupation of a country that never threatened them. That by the laws set up by those very same western elites after WW2 is a war crime.
Countless billions of pounds/ dollars and hundreds of thousands of lives wasted in a futile war to dominate an area of land that was never a proper country until Britain imposed artificial borders on it. Nothing achieved except a carbon copy of the Vietnam evacuation and an even larger influx of entirely alien refugees into our country that is already over run by illegals.
Every single person that supported this illegal catastrophe should be put on trial in a people’s court and suffer due punishment but instead we’ll have whining politicians spouting the same drivel about terrorism that they used to remove our liberties for the last 20 years.
Our appalling ruling class are the problem Mr Redwood not some Afghan lunatic running around the Hindu Kush with an AK47.
August 18, 2021
All we will get from ‘Boris’ is blather and weakness. The pre-WW2 view held by Lord Halifax is still considered by him and others in government to be the best attitude to have in relation to all our enemies – appeasement. Priti Useless is following Former PM May’s ideal of encouraging more people who have nothing in common with our history and beliefs to come and set up their own enclaves which are perfect for infiltration. We should not be surprised.
The idea that Islamic leaders are not determined to continue with a policy of undermining and dominating the West and that they are open to negotiate a view of living in peace is dangerously foolish for us and naive, and it is about time someone at high level in government had the courage to speak out on it and tell the truth and keep repeating it until someone listened.
All we will get is the opposite, we too will be betrayed and our end will come nearer and faster.
August 18, 2021
And in other news we read the government failed to act months ago when it was told the test and trace app was wrongly identifying contacts up to five days when only two were needed resulting in hundreds of thousands of unnecessary isolation days, no wonder people are now ignoring it and we learn the PCR programme is in chaos with again many thousands not feeding into government data which is the reason we are told for its existence.
With rip off fees that should have been dealt with months ago can this government get any more incompetent?
August 18, 2021
The world Sir John, would be a better place if the British Government stopped trying to ‘punch above its weight’ for their own glory on the world stage and personal preferences. If they stopped involving themselves, or more to the point involving us the people who ultimately pay in every way for their meddling, in everything America decides we should help them out in, then that might make a difference.
So all those soldiers lives lost for what? All those soldiers who came back crippled and have had to fight for any help from the British Government ( same old story through the years) who are far more concerned with people in far off places (and how they can bring as many as possible here) can rest assured it was all worth it can they?
So how long would it have taken and how much money in manpower and equipment would be needed to make the Afghan people and army ready to keep the Taliban out? Either the army is full of very slow learners in tactics and weaponry or many of them were/are not particularly concerned by the Taliban. It has to be said, would some areas in this Country now, see a Taliban style movement as a particular problem?
It is said the corruption throughout Government was of Biblical proportions and many in the army hadn’t been paid which led to problems of moral. That may well be the case, but is it a good enough reason? Surely if these people having experienced the Taliban were desperate to keep them out, they’d have fought to the death, pay or no pay.
Some sources are claiming many put up no opposition at all.
We come back to the point of British Government and Western politicians believing they can export their ‘values’ and that all people’s cultures are interchangeable. This alongside having that same view here by continually bringing in people from other cultures is the cause of much strife and not harmony.
That is likely to become more apparent as time goes on, and the British Government should now turn their attention to home.
Secure our borders, increase our self-sufficiency, stop selling off everything to ‘investors’ ( they’re selling England by the pound) let other people sort their own problems out and then we may stand a better chance of weathering any problems.
August 18, 2021
The globalists think they have armies to support them, blow on them and they will fall over.
August 18, 2021
Biden has demonstrated incompetence and poor judgment in making his decision. He also sought to rewrite history by declaring the continued presence of US forces after Al Quaeda had been defeated (the reason for being there in the first place) was not about nation building and the import of “western values”. It clearly was about that. The Taliban were ready to die in opposing it’s imposition by foreign powers whereas the Afghan army was not prepared to defend those “western values”. A negotiated outcome was the right way to end an unwinnable war – for both parties – and Biden has screwed it up big time. It will surely have a huge impact on US influence around the world, especially in central Asia and the Middle East, hasten and make more obvious the decline in US power and influence and further weaken the US dollar as the world’s reserve currency.
August 18, 2021
Ah yes the western powers were there to impose western values and western style democracy but they were never going to be able to stay there forever so as soon as the word was out that the US and allies were withdrawing the Taliban just swarmed in again to fill the void.. so again what do the Afghan locals say?
the westerners have the watches but Taliban has the time
August 19, 2021
Other than Afghanistan,the US has no influence in central Asia.It was significant that the US could not persuade/cajole the central asian states to allow them to establish a base there in recent months.
August 18, 2021
I hear too many people saying that the American and British withdrawal left the Afghans in the lurch…
How long does it take for the people of Afghanistan to take ownership of their own situation?
There is a limit to what external forces and help can be given especially to a country that has an embedded distrust for the West and a religion that has no tolerance to other ideas and ideals.
What next?
The leadership of the Taliban may say one thing today and another tomorrow and clearly cannot be trusted in any way, but for sure the Taliban on the ground will do what they want regardless.
Would Chinese influence in Afghanistan be a bad thing?, surely the Russian’s would not want to actually enter the area after their bad experiences in the past?
August 18, 2021
What next?
Wait and see. The Taliban may be making a moderate pitch, not I suspect to appease the West, but to settle the people in their recent territorial acquisitions. Afghanistan is a place with a lot of guns, and the Kabul population of 4.4million would overwhelm them if they revolted.
Next few days and perhaps a looming humanitarian disaster will unfold in the major cities as the economy collapses. The Taliban will need deep pockets to pay for supplies, else the people will riot.
If I were the PM, I would be planning a Berlin Airlift style relief programme, and get Biden on the blower to tell him how to recover his shattered reputation. Tell the people of Afghanistan to topple the Taliban and reinstate the Afghan government so supplies can be safely moved in.
August 19, 2021
Afghanistan is landlocked,who is going to give you permission to overfly-Iran,Pakistan,China,the Russian protectorates to the North?
Once we are out,we are probably out for good because the neighbours won’t want us back.
August 18, 2021
Has anyone actually sat down and thought about the cost of taking in 20,000 refugees and where exactly they are going to live? We already have a housing shortage and our own people living on the streets without inviting in a load more. These people were trained by our armed forces and given ample equipment to fight for their freedom and yet they chose to stand back and let the Taliban come in and take over. If they had held off, they could then have tackled the corruption of their government and tried to find a way through whereby life for them would have been better. They were quite happy to let our soldiers die in the process. Now that they are all trying to leave we see it is mainly the men yet again just as it is with those crossing the channel. Do they not care about their women, wives , mothers or sisters? It would seem not. Well sorry John, but I don’ think we should open our doors to yet more problems especially at a time when things are financially hard here, young people can’t afford homes and jobs could soon be lost as we come out of the pandemic. By the way, does Afghanistan have a Covid problem because I’ve heard nothing about it or is it a virus that misses out some countries?
August 18, 2021
FuS
“Has anyone actually sat down and thought about the cost of taking in 20,000 refugees and where exactly they are going to live?”
No need. They won’t be coming here as Patel and Johnson promised us they would reduce immigration.
August 18, 2021
from Biden??????????????
That’s like asking the labour party to come up ways to improve the education system — Both are contrary to their inept nature.
Let’s not cloak Biden’s actions in diplomatic terms – He’s a disaster, and this latest stunt in Afghanistan prove that he is not fit, as a president, nor as a human being.
August 18, 2021
The Taliban actually âwonâ many years ago – the west has just been too gutless to admit it.
Mr Biden stood for election on a pledge he would swiftly end Americaâs involvement in Afghanistan. And he has.
His duty is to the people of the United States – who voted for him – and not to the people of Afghanistan. His duty is also not to the Republican Party which started the war and has been in power for most of its duration.
A politician keeps his promise and the Brexitists are outraged. I genuinely do not see the problem here.
August 18, 2021
It is all about the speed of withdrawal.
A too fast withdrawal by Biden is now condemning millions of people and especially children and women to a dreadful future.
August 18, 2021
It is not what he did – it is the way that he did it.
As a businessman you will understand the difference.
August 18, 2021
The USA has blown its credibility worldwide. The Americans know it and cannot hide and realise being the world leader is a serious responsibility like it or not.
For them to promote a second rate President reflects badly on them sadly and he needs replacing for credibility, seriously before he trips yet again. Not impressed, just embarrassed for the club and the West.
August 19, 2021
America’s power has long been overestimated.There is a simple geopolitical truth;you can’t be global hegemon without control of Eurasia,the core of which is Russia.
August 18, 2021
The USA has blown its credibility worldwide. The Americans know it and cannot hide and realise being the world leader is a serious responsibility like it or not.
For them to promote a second rate President reflects badly on them sadly and he needs replacing for credibility, seriously before he trips yet again. Not impressed, just embarrassed for the country and the West.
August 18, 2021
How many refugees will be accepted by Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Egypt, every other Middle Eastern country ? Have these countries announced their willingness to help their fellow neighbours ? I canât understand why so many haters of the West suddenly all want to come to the West. Why is that ?
August 18, 2021
The UNHCR helpfully publishes statistics about refugees. There are 82.5m refugees and displaced people worldwide – more than 40% of them are children.
Turkey is home to the most displaced people – 4m of them, mainly from neighbouring Syria.
Second is Colombia which has 1.7m displaced people mostly from neighbouring Venezuela.
Pakistan is third with 1.4m displaced people, mostly from neighbouring Afghanistan.
Then comes Uganda with 1.4m displaced people from neighbouring South Sudan.
Bangladesh hosts close to a million people from neighbouring Myanmar. Lebanon hosts closed to 1m people neighbouring Syria.
Germany hosts 1.4m displaced people mainly from Syria. The US hosts 1.3m displaced people mainly from the Americas.
We host 0.13m people. Less than a tenth of what Germany does, a third of what France does, half of what Sweden does, fewer people than Austria helps.
We are significantly less generous than you think we are. And countries you accuse of doing nothing actually help much more than we do.
Facts are awkward, arenât they?
August 18, 2021
Not really Andy.
The vast majority of refugees move to the next safe area.
As they ought to do under the UN rules.
After the situation in their home country is resolved they can return to their homeland.
August 18, 2021
Not really- How many EU passport holders aka “economic refugees” do we host? Then we have the millions of undocumented unofficial ones.
August 19, 2021
You are conflating clandestine economic immigration with government-authorised, regulated help for refugees and for asylum seekers.
Apparently you hate both equally, and since the only thing that they have is common is that they are comprised of foreigners, I can only assume that it is because of that fact alone.
August 19, 2021
Sadly resorting to playing your race card at the earliest opportunity MiC
August 18, 2021
Is it too much to hope that our leaders will now stop posturing and meddling in faraway countries about which we know nothing? You never hear of Norway trying to impose ‘diverse democratic’ government on peoples who are not ready for it, why do we have to? Is it possible to introduce a Parliamentary veto over the capability of the executive to get involved in foreign wars?
August 19, 2021
P2, there is a word you might want to learn: xenophobic, fear of foreigners. You show how limited your vocabulary is by âplaying the race cardâ. But am I surprised?
August 18, 2021
Apparently the victory was helped by social media.
You know, that thing our police/77th trawl through looking for âwrongspeakâ!
The thing that we are scarcely allowed to use.
August 18, 2021
Trump an over optimistic orderly departure. Biden a cut and run. Consequences, many Afghans male and female have been left high and dry. The terrorists have a morale boost and a new base alongside Iran from which to operate. The democracies are seen to be unreliable bedfellows and can enjoy an increased refugee problem peppered with more terrorists. The EU in their silence confirm themselves as utterly useless. Confirmation that Biden is unfit for power, but the military both US and UK confirm their capability of coping with the most dire of political leadership.
August 18, 2021
Foreign policy is a sovereign matter for European Union countries – except for specific treaty-defined matters – and it has no military.
What would you expect it to say?
August 18, 2021
So why does the EU want Ambassadors and Embassies of it’s own?
August 19, 2021
To mediate in those treaty-defined areas, why else?
August 19, 2021
Good excuse MiC
But wrong
The EU will soon be called the United States of Europe.
It already has an anthem a flag Presidents, ambassadors and embassies.
Soon it will have its own armed forces.
August 18, 2021
The UK is no place for all those Afghan refugees. We are already densely populated and have lost control over the countless illegal immigrants who are arriving here daily. Our health service is scarcely fit for purpose. Why can’t we say No?
August 18, 2021
A) Send refugees 4,000 miles to a country where that donât know the language, the culture, the religion and where the temperature is some 20 degree colder
B) Send refugees less than 1,000 mile to a country where the language, the culture, the religion and the temperature is the same
Today I only hear our politicians talking about option A
August 18, 2021
Chipping Norton would be a nice spot to resettle the taliban migrants
August 19, 2021
The failure of the government to operate eBorders correctly – to count people in and out – and to maintain a residency register are not reasons for it to abandon its responsibilities under UN agreements etc.
August 22, 2021
No Trump was not doing a great job. That’s magical thinking. A country can only become great when its citizens are initiated into greatness (in a good, modest, healthy way), by how they are brought up by their Mum and Dad and extended family, they get the right healthy all-rounded education, national service, are influenced by a strongly and healthy media, arts and if they are religious, church.
Politicians can help create a great nation – in the long-term, but far more is needed.
Trump had no real interest in any of these things to do with culture / civilisation. The only reason we know about Trump is because he is a rich property investor – investing money largely made by his father and grandmother.
August 18, 2021
The virus is copying the US and waving a little white flag.
Full Parliament.
About time too!
August 18, 2021
@Everhopeful – “Full Parliament” and what purpose did it serve? A powerless talking shop that is cause the destruction of the UK
August 18, 2021
Yes.
Actually you make a very good point.
My thinking was that with the MPs kept out of parliament the Johnson cabal reigns supreme.
But of course you are right!
August 18, 2021
Is the Chinese State providing the Taliban with military assistance or have this grubby Democrat POTUS (and his ‘advisers’. We all know who they are) cut a deal with the Chinese to allow this dreadful, barbaric event to occur?
We need an American leader whose instincts are libertarian that asserts free world values once more not the authoritarian woke slime that now rules over the west like we are rats to be coerced
August 18, 2021
@DOM – The deal with the Chinese is for the mining rights to the massive rare earth deposits in Afghanistan – controlling the future, our future.
August 19, 2021
The American leader is a choice for the American people.
They have wisely chosen Biden over the last alternative offered.
August 18, 2021
Tell this to the BBC.
John Sopel (in a four year rant mode under Trump) has gone missing in action.
The BBC are failing to scrutinise Biden. He is Woke and they are Woke so it won’t be happening.
Please ask Boris for us. Can he assure us that none of the refugees he plans to settle into this country will be fake and will harm us ?
The BBC didn’t ask this question this morning. All it said was “People and organisations are concerned that not enough is being done for refugees.” Nothing at all from them about the genuine concern among British people that terrorists are being smuggled into this country.
—–
A full-on cultural/regime change of Afghanistan by the West was foolish in the extreme. Punishment strikes and continual special forces activity and black ops was all that should have been done in support of moderates. Instead of ISAF troops being sitting duck targets it would have been the Taliban and Al Qaeda suffering so.
August 18, 2021
For once, I suspect you of being totally wrong in the opening line of your post: I do not think the Biden administration cares twopence for what happens in Afghanistan beyond removing the risk of any more body bags being repatriated to the USA. And as so often with the Americans, I think Biden lacks the strategic nous to comprehend the effect his precipitate action will have on his country’s enemies, just as Bush, cheered on by Blair, did not pause to consider how removing Sadaam Hussein, a nasty man, but with his heart in the right place as far as Iran was concerned, might open the field wide to the benefit of the latter.
At least Mr Trump had a cohesive plan, even if it suffered the weakness of depending on the probity of the Taliban and the wish of the non-Taliban for a State of their own, which now seems very unlikely ever to have existed, given the absence of any real armed opposition to the Taliban invasion. And the reassurances Mr Mujahid gave yesterday to women and girls were so hedge with qualifications of being within the confines of Sharia law as to render them meaningless.
One thing this episode has made very clear is that we can talk up the abilities of our armed forces all we like, but the truth is that successive Governments of all parties have rendered them ineffective and clearly incapable of defending this country if the need arose. We must remember that the Conservatives have been in charge since 2010, and could therefor have changed things if they had wanted, and that is a terrible indictment.
August 18, 2021
Sir John,
Anyone waiting for Joe Biden to do anything is going to be sadly disappointed. He was meant to be the puppet of Obama, but the democrats have seriously underestimated the rate of his cognitive decline. Meanwhile Kamala Harris, who is always at Joe’s side during press briefings, has been noticeable by her absence.
At least the dems can take comfort that Donald Trump is still suspended from Twitter, unlike the Taliban.
August 18, 2021
Your âWhat should happen now?â questions are surely germane and call for good and sufficient answers. If provided, they might show us that neither the Taliban re-takeover or Bidenâs abandonment of Afghanistan is disastrous for the world.
Recall when the Taliban were in power twenty years ago they did not bother anyone much outside their borders but their giving a home to Al Queda prompted heavy attacks from the USA (that then foolishly escalated into the long occupation just ended) after Bush the second went mad following the 9/11 attacks. (As we know, for some reason based upon his daft âwar on terrorâ notions, Bush then attacked Iraq, uninvolved as it was then with either Al Queda or 9/11.)
Bidenâs decision to abandon surely recognized the hopelessness and pointlessness of the NATO presence. It was a distraction from strategic issues and an unwise diversion of resources. I commend the President for his courage and good sense as well as his willingness to bear the predictable slings and arrows. If Biden can now focus on your questions and provide the leadership many expect, his decision on Afghanistan may look astute in time.
August 18, 2021
I’m just watching the hypocritical politicians in the HoC demanding that the number of Afghans ‘welcomed’ to the UK be increased. In the full knowledge that none of the newcomers will be housed anywhere near them, cause detrimental change to their communities, or form a substantial part of the classrooms attended by their children. I believe we are still waiting for Yvette Cooper to fulfil her promise to take ‘refugees’ into her own home.
August 18, 2021
Beresford. I fear you’ve got a bloody long wait for Cooper to fulfull her promis. All words just like nearly all our MP’s.
August 18, 2021
Biden has demonstrated that the USA is an unreliable and untrustworthy sponsor of stability and democracy and an unreliable and untrustworthy ally.
Thanks to Blair and Cameron, we supported the USA in Afghanistan; Iraq and Syria. In every one of these unfortunate countries the Americans have demonstrated their inability to understand the lessons of history; how to build “hearts and minds” in countries/cultures so very different from their own and their lack of staying power.
The definition of madness is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. Yet Mr Redwood says he thinks the first thing we should do is ASK Biden not to repeat these errors in Iraq.
I would suggest the lesson to be learnt is not to involve ourselves in any American-led foreign adventures ever again. Adopt the “Wilson strategy” and JUST SAY NO.
August 18, 2021
âThe westâ – and by that I mean mostly us and the Americans – really have not learned the very evident lessons which are stood right before us about how to bring about change in another country.
In Afghanistan trying to bring about change by force hasnât worked. Force hasnât worked in Iraq. It didnât work in Libya. Or Syria. The threat of force hasnât worked against Iran or North Korea or Russia or China or Cuba. Notice a theme here? You canât bomb or threaten a country into submission.
So what has worked? Where has effective change happened in the last 50 years? Change has happened in Southern Europe – Greece and Spain were unpleasant dictatorships until the 1970s.
Change has happened in Eastern Europe – where Communism collapsed in the 1990s and was replaced by capitalism and democracy.
Change has happened in the Balkans where, after a brutal war in the mid 1990s there is now peace, prosperity and democracy.
Change has happened in the Baltic states where years of Soviet oppression was thrown off.
Wherever the EU has expanded it has been a success – bringing peace, prosperity and democracy. Most of the time NATO or military action has been involved it has been a disaster.
Turns out only one Brussels based organisation is useless – NATO. You left the wrong one.
Reply All those countries established democracies before joining the Eu
August 18, 2021
Also Andy, THE EU IS NOT DEMOCRATIC. It is intent on abolishing Nation States and replacing them with an undemocratic super state.
August 18, 2021
Hmmmm…. …seems likely that the realistic prospect of accession to the EU was a factor in whatever process led to the displacement of the prior regimes, so I don’t think you can brush off Andy’s argument quite so glibly.
August 21, 2021
WiH, +1, SJR is again showing off his lack of historical understanding, quite a strange thing to witness given his DPhil in history.
August 18, 2021
So we are to import 20K+ people (or families?) from Afghanistan?
Has the Government obtained consent for this from the country or at least from Parliament?
We werenât consulted when Caribbeans came after WW2 and we werenât consulted when Mr. Blair opened us up to hundreds of thousands of Eastern Europeans.
Are we now going to be continually open to different groups of Middle Eastern tribes whose extreme religious beliefs and 7th century ways of living are not at all consistent with ours?
Just because these people are fleeing from the Taliban does not mean they are supportive of Western culture so they can easily become another community in our midst for growing and harbouring terrorists.
If our government feels it must help Afghan refugees then it should support them to go to an Islamic country which is closer to their culture.
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
+
August 18, 2021
Wokinghamite,
“Why can’t we say No?”
Probably because the real powers that be don’t want that.
Boris, once elected, now looks to them for approval and further advancement along the Tony Blair template.
August 18, 2021
I am confused. A recall of Parliament â Why?
Maybe our inept Government just wanted to âGrandstandâ and indulge in âGesture Politicsâ. Then we get the rest of the HoC lining up to join in. Of course it is easy to criticize, hindsight is also wonderful but not one utterance of how, why and when, or who will pay.
Why it was a pointless exercise was writ large for the World to see, the UK does not have any capabilities in these situations. The UK has a local defense force and with the intention of cutting back the Army still further to just 65,000 combatants, means there wouldnât be the depth of expertise to train new recruits should the need arise. As we have seen it couldnât even defend our own borders. The HoC and all its members are not in a position to criticize Biden, the US is not there for the UKâs convenience. The UK Government has made sure it can never be a proportionally equal partner.
Then you get to the point of what exist of a capability can only be exercised at the Political Discretion of foreign powers. The UK Government has sold all the facilities to arm and equip the nation to foreign powers so is powerless. Now we have foreign powers that the UK Citizen cant vote for getting to decide how we can act.
From that its possible to extrapolate why have a HoC at all, they are after all just playing a being a Local Council not part of a free sovereign democracy â maybe that’s why Boris has refused to deliver Brexit he has the need and requires the comfort of the EU and their dictates
August 18, 2021
I am not worried by the Taliban, but I am worried we have a Government that is not interested in keeping the UK safe and secure â those situations are not even close to having any similarities.
August 18, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
Totally ! NOTA# , we must remember all this when at the ballot box, no more tactical voting
August 18, 2021
‘We were told the world would be a better place when a new President promised grown up foreign policies from the White House’
– Blair, Bush and Trump were all pretty immature, to say the least, when it came to foreign policies.
Being properly grown up in foreign affairs is rare in politics.
August 18, 2021
Blair and Bush orchestrated invasion and disruption in the Middle East.
Trump did not and sought instead to establish a degree of stability and agreement.
Whereas Biden has just left everyone dangling in the wind.
And yet you only ever have bad words for Trump … and he isn’t a politician like the rest who caused so much damage and disruption to so many people
August 18, 2021
You are right. Trump was definitely not as bad as Bush and Blair on foreign affairs.
And you’re right, also. I don’t like Trump (as a political leader – not talking about the man – no man has the right to judge another here), representing a vulgar form of nouveau riche (I am NOT a snob – I am not against new money – but I am against a type of new money that is vulgar and showy-off and not built on building up culture / civilisation).
August 18, 2021
Before the US election, Sir Christopher Meyer said on Talk Radio that it was important that Trump was not elected because he ignored the international order. No doubt the Foreign Office, the rest of the civil service and the Conservative Party with the others agreed. Johnson was eager to be the first to congratulate Biden. The BBC and other media never reported the questionable dealings of the Biden family or his mental condition.
How’s the international order now with thousands of US and European citizens trapped in enemy territory and having to make their own way to the airport with brutal fanatics searching for foreigners and their assistants?
August 18, 2021
John, you must surely be glad you are near the end of your political career looking at the mess your party has made of the country. Farage was right when he said on GB News that he spend much of his time going around the country talking to real people. He has realised just how out of touch politicians are with the public. The majority of us despair at what is going on and wonder just what kind of country we will have to hand over to our children and grandchildren. Seriously, will there be an England for much longer?
August 18, 2021
“Near the end”!!! ? Tell us it is not so Sir John.
August 18, 2021
I believe the destabilisation of largely peaceful western societies by mass immigration has been a deliberate strategy of the Globalists. We no longer have a peaceful, cohesive society. We are separate tribes, living together. It’s a classic case of “divide and rule” by those who want global power .
August 18, 2021
Indeed the EU was a fig leaf for Westminster now partially removed. Its amazing really how they are getting the west to pay for its own long term imported problems leading to rule by divide and conquer.
So which benefits to UK taxpayers and citizens is the government going to reduce to pay for the the multi-billion immigration ponzi? Whats the total cost of the typical refugee fully loaded?
Include all medical & health, all education,all living costs at full market cost not subsidized government rent schemes. All security costs, vetting, immigration and paperwork formalities at full market cost e.g. the cost that Joe the “non benefit funded”.
Still staffers get increases. Gravy train roles on.
Lets have a 50% reduction in the HOL/HOC to mitigate some of this long term damage.
Taking back control was to reduce immigration! To become a self reliant nation and perhaps move toward democracy.
Well it seems like the 5th column is again in control. I wonder if Biden/US will accuse the UK of not fighting for democracy when the population balance shifts to a Taliban style UK government.
August 18, 2021
The Tory party won’t exist in 50 years time though neither will England
August 19, 2021
With events seemingly showing the Johnson Government for what it is on a monthly basis, the Party doesn’t deserve to survive beyond the next election.
August 18, 2021
OFF TOPIC.
Scotland’s public spending deficit more than doubled to ÂŁ36.3bn last year as spending increased and revenues fell due to the Covid-19 pandemic. Total spending by the Scottish and UK governments and other public bodies rose to ÂŁ99.2bn as Scotland went into lockdown. Income from taxes fell to ÂŁ62.8bn, leaving a gap between spending and revenue equating to 22.4% of GDP.
The deficit for the UK as a whole over the same period was 14.2% of GDP. (lower without high Scottish figures). Scotland’s figure for the previous year – before the onset of the pandemic – was ÂŁ15.1bn, or 8.6% of GDP.
The figures were calculated by Scottish government statisticians as part of the annual Government Expenditure and Revenue Scotland (Gers) report.
Who ultimately pays? Answer on a postage stamp!
August 19, 2021
Yet Sir John thinks that having an English Parliament would be too expensive yet does not call for an abolition of the highly expensive devolved governments and city mayors.
Reply I lost those arguments when the devolved governments were set up.
August 19, 2021
Sir John loses an argument so gives up. The truth is he does not believe in a true parliament for England at all, in the slightest, even if it were set up at no cost. He knows it will weaken the Union which is far more important than England currently to him which was the whole basis of his previous positions on devolution.
August 18, 2021
Maybe now we might decide to stay more at home and mind our own business instead of forever poking it into countries in the Middle East and further afield. It is not the 19th century and our days of empire have long past and gone
August 18, 2021
Well said Jamie, I agree. While we should remain engaged with the world generally, in my view we should engage more by means of trade and commerce than by means of aid and military effort. Thinking about which countries should be able to get access to Britain’s best universities, financial institutions and technology companies might be an interesting place to start. That feels like a more realistic way to use leverage than putting young men and women in uniform onto cargo planes headed to dangerous places.
August 18, 2021
Still no sign of my comments made this morning but maybe I will get through sometime.
In the meantime I have say that the signs at the airport of people, exclusively men it seemed, climbing up gantries, or chasing along close to a moving plane, or climbing on it and holding while it took off and then falling to their deaths after it had left the ground are according to Sir John merely ‘sad’. The feeling I and thousands of others experienced was probably rather more than sadness.
Even in circumstances where people are risking and losing their lives sadness is the only feeling Sir John dare express. There is something wrong here.
August 18, 2021
Actually Mr Wizard , I thought â Greatâ when i saw them falling, thats two that will not be standing in the line with their begging bowl!!
August 18, 2021
I don’t really care about your politics, that’s a gratuitous and inhuman remark.
August 19, 2021
+1
August 18, 2021
The plan is to use the Afghan migrants as an excuse for more globalist oppression.
August 18, 2021
It might be worrying time for some but personally speaking I feel that what has happened might be a time of renewal for Afghanistan and its people.. for instance after the fall of Saigon some thought it was the end of the world but it wasn’t and things picked up again – in fact all almost back to normal. We cannot just go around the world trying to impose our values on others and expect no consequences
August 18, 2021
Does anyone else see the irony. It is easy for the HoC to blame Boris as time and time he demonstrates he is all about the âGrandstanding Political Gestureâ not actual doing or caring about anything. Other than bring poverty on the UK with his own version emission control.
Then all those saying this that should have happened are are also the same ones that have brought the UK to its knees, we have no Armed Forces capable to be able to respond to anything more than Local Council flood protection. All the equipment necessary to maintain a credible Army has been sold to foreign powers, the numbers of men capable to respond on the ground have been reduced below rock bottom on some pretense that we will face an enemy similar to the Taliban by using the internet and technology we no longer own.
About time some brought about an economy revolution and let us get back to be credible.
August 18, 2021
Why did the US invade Afghanistan? We know why the UK followed because under the liblabcon we do not have an independent foreign policy.
The US fracks countries in Eurasia and Africa to release a flow of refugees into Western Europe. Those who control the US have a pathological hatred of people of European stock and their strategy is to fill up our countries with unassimilable aliens so that we cease to be monocultures. Which country have they got lined up next? Iran? It’s bound to be Islamic because they make the ‘best’ migrants.
August 18, 2021
Afghanistan was invaded because it harboured terrorists involved in the 9/11 atrocity in New York. It was right for us to support our allies, additionally the attack killed some of our people. What was wrong was taking our eye off the ball for Blair’s illegal invasion of Iraq and mission creep. It was not our task to determine the future governance of Afghanistan, we should have destroyed the Al Qaeda bases and then left.
August 19, 2021
There was is no evidence whatsoever linking Osama bin laden or anyone else in Afghanistan with 9/11. A suitcase containing passports, a flight manual and a Koran
and another passport found at ‘Ground Zero’ which miraculously survived the alleged impact of a plane piloted by an alleged terrorist revealed no evidence of Afghanistan involvement. When only stage props link ‘Islamists’ with the event, perhaps its time to question what really happened, n’est-ce pas?
August 18, 2021
Lastly, let’s not forget, Socialist Tony Blair’s Afghan and Iraq Wars were stupid wars:
1) Without a strong Iraq, you get a much stronger Iran. Iran, building a nuclear weapon, is now very dangerous
2) The Iraq War was directly related to the tragedy in Syria
3) Terrorists can train anywhere. Trying to conquer and control a vast country such as Afghanistan is stupid. The terrorists have got loads of other places in the world they can train. And we know that the Afghan are tough fighters as well. Instead of sending in large armies, to where terrorists might be, the West should be sending in very highly-trained, small groups of soldiers in very specialised work.
August 18, 2021
(And anyone who fell for the 45 minute thing was being completely naive as Hans Blix hadn’t finished his search for Weapons of Mass Destruction. As it turned out, of course, there weren’t any).
August 19, 2021
I believe you are wrong;Iran and the territory now know as Iraq have frequently been united in a single polity during history-the Persian,Alexandrian,Seleucid and Parthian Empires,the Ummayad and Abbasid Caliphates,the Turkic Seljuk Sultanate and the Mongol Il-Khanate.
The post WWI period from the partition of the Ottoman Empire to the Iran-Iraq war is something of an aberration.
August 19, 2021
That’s interesting history but has nothing to do with the realpolitik in that area today (when I bang on about Cyrus the Great, I’m banging on about the qualities of a leader- not realpolitik which are two quite separate things).
The realpolitik today is 1) Iraq kept on an eye on Iran 2) Iraq was directly responsible for the tragedy in Syria
August 19, 2021
And it’s only the UK’s job to get into war when it has a clear goal of what victory means and a reasonable time-frame of achieving that etc – or else get into war when our country is directly attacked.
Iraq was neither. A waste of UK life – and money – billions, as well as opening all kinds of cans of worms. A stupid war.
August 20, 2021
The realpolitik of today is that when the US leaves Iraq,the Iranians will reestablish an arc of influence from the eastern med to central Asia.Cyrus would know all about that.
Iran has just been elevated to full membership of the Shanghai Co-operation Organization.It is marching in lockstep with China,Russia,Pakistan and India(yes,India)and other smaller states to remove western influence from Eurasia.
August 21, 2021
‘The realpolitik of today is that when the US leaves Iraq,the Iranians will reestablish an arc of influence from the eastern med to central Asia’
– Except I never said the US troops should leave Iraq. I was talking about Afghanistan which is nearly 1,500 miles away from Afghanistan. Iraq and Afghanistan are similar in that we should have never gone into these places in the first place. But different in that how we pull out is quite different for each region.
Please focus your argument on DETAIL! You’ve missed the detail of the realpolitik of the difference between these two regions (Iraq and Afghanistan) whilst making sweeping statements about realpolitik from ancient history (as opposed to the nature of nature of leadership which I was going on about with Cyrus – quite a different thing).
If arguments had been clearer and more robust in the House of Commons 20 years ago, the majority of MPs wouldn’t have been fooled by Tony Blair’s mesmeric rhetoric (I admit, it is fairly mesmeric – but empty – certainly on Iraq / Afghanistan) and we would never have entered these stupid wars – stupid with terrible consquences.
August 21, 2021
‘to remove western influence from Eurasia’
– They probably want to get rid of McDonalds and tacky shopping-mall culture, things like that – not Western Culture / Civilisation in general that so many people in Asia and The Middle East Love.
(And they’ll be very happy to keep brands from the West such as Apple, BMW, Hermes etc – it’s Western tack / dumbed-down culture and values that those in the East are saying ‘no’ to – not our economy / culture in general).
August 21, 2021
‘to remove western influence from Eurasia’
– Also, it’s this kind of neuroticism that gave us the Vietnam War.
Yes, there are some nutters who are anti the West. And some nutters who are anti the East. But generally, most people in the East love what’s best about the West (and vice-versa). It’s only neurotic politicians who see these kind of conspiracy theories.
If politicians had been less neurotic in the 70’s, they might have seen that Communism in Europe was on its last legs. As it happened, Communism was soon to collapse in Europe. Not because of neurotic politicians, but because Communism was inherently weak – and it was thanks to the heroism (from one degree to another) of certain people such as Pope John Paul, Lech Walesa, Gorbachev, Havel, and others, that helped Communism finally collapse – NOT the work of neurotic politicians in the West opposing Communism ..
August 18, 2021
Can homeless people in the UK look forward to their bespoke resettlement scheme ?
Is Boris Johnson even remotely concerned about the Gurkhas (who DID help the British Army) on hunger strike outside Downing Street ?
What is Boris Johnson’s government doing to honour his pledge to cut immigration ?
August 18, 2021
Todays HoC debate shouldâve been renamed âThe number of Taliban refugees the UK will takeâ nobody talked about the how the Taliban received tactical & logistical support from Pakistan and strategic & funding support from Saudi Arabia
August 18, 2021
I have wondered why the allies, the USA in particular, could not have maintained a permanent military presence in Afghanistan in much the same way as they have in the Philippines, Japan and Europe.
No American forces personnel had died in Afghanistan in the past 18 months, strongly suggesting that the situation was under control.
The Afghan army would have been strongly supported by those troops and allowed them to gain more confident on policing their own country over time.
Alas, it seems Mr Biden and his staff thought more of gaining political points rather than securing a lasting peace out there and much to the dismay of the Afghan people who had placed their trust in America to protect them.
It certainly has been deja vu Saigon, all over again and a serious error of judgment that will not be forgotten on both sides of the pond..
August 18, 2021
China in, Obama out. First deal struck between China and the Taliban, lithium I believe
August 20, 2021
The only major deal struck between the two states (to-date) that I am aware of is a large copper project which the Chinese so far have been unable to start on because of the instability.
August 18, 2021
In what way are Afghanis who have co-operated with western forces distinguishable from civilians or Taliban?
Have we tattooed them or implanted microchips or something?
So why do they now have to flee from the Taliban?
It’s a load of nonsense. Like all other ‘refugees’ they simply prefer a cushy life. Not that I blame them but we can not afford to let them in.
Why did we ever go into Afghanistan anyway? More fool us. Others have tried it and failed.
Your Diary today really doesn’t ask any sensible questions or answer them.
I thought the point about NATO was that we were NOT OBLIGED to join in with their policies unless an allies homeland was invaded.
August 18, 2021
The text in Article 5 of the North Atlantic Treaty uses the word “attacked”, not “invaded”, and there’s no reference to a “homeland”. In response to the 11th September attacks in 2001 the United States chose to invoke Article 5 of the treaty and hence the Allies were compelled to act in respect of their obligation.
August 19, 2021
Pauline
The boast that we will take 20,000 Afghan refugees is a trick. It will be all those across the Channel in France waiting to come in and it will be more than 20,000 and will be mostly men. I mean, cast your mind back when Theresa May MP was PM and she allowed all those children in, some sporting beards.
Never let a crisis go to waste, as one MP once said.
August 18, 2021
Feeling just a little sarcastic, we can now see why the Government is worried about raising the UK Basic State pension after our older generation whom have spent 30 years or more contributing to it from the ÂŁ137.65 per week it is today.
They now need the money to keep the inflow of migrates whom have never contributed in luxury.
August 18, 2021
Not saying Biden was right or wrong to pull the troops out in way he did etc but in big picture of Bush / Blair sending in the troops, it’s small fry. And because the Taliban have so quickly taken over Afghanistan goes to show how tentative the allies hold over Afghanistan really was (which isn’t a big surprise anyway as the Afghans, in their own territory, have been formidable fighters throughout history).
August 18, 2021
In military terms you should never pick a fight that you do not have the overwhelming odds on your side to win. In recent years that has meant superior equipment and out numbering the protagonists 10 to 1.
Every single British Army general would have told Government that – but they (the UK Government) still decided to get entangled, made a political decision to ‘grandstand’ The end result is the UK looks inept and a push over which will make things all the harder when the next time comes around.
The is no reason why the UK cant be more self sufficient and work from the strength not weakness. The big drawback is the economy has been trashed and has been planned to be trashed going forward by Government. The Government has depleted the UK’s armed forces to less than a local defence force that cant even contain its local territorial borders. The Government ‘no one else’ has sold our ability to equip and take care of the UK’s security to foreign powers – we can no longer make planes, equip ships, even the basics of tanks are in the hands of foreign powers. As it stands now it can’t be reversed because there is no interest in the economy – we are heading to the ‘stone age’
So the handwringing about Afghanistan never had a point. After all the talk today it was just that talk. There is no interest to arrest the decline – just speed it up.
August 18, 2021
@Nota# – which ever way you want to shake it the blood of many a young life has pointlessly been taken for a grandstanding gesture of the Political Class. Snatch Land Rovers in the World of IAD’s and so on. Defying military logic, shortage of manpower and the right equipment
August 18, 2021
You say that the US was the initiator as if the whole American people were responsible – not true – George Wubya Bush started this war that lasted twenty years- with Tony Blair at his side – this despite the fact that more than one million marched in London protesting against the Iraq invasion and what followed in Afghanistan- the great saviours Bush and Blair who prayed together and now we know
You reap what you sow.
So now we have a situation where there are large swathes of regions in the Middle East and further afield where British or American passport holders cannot go for safety- confined to barracks-