Reply to a letter from the Prime Minister

Along with the rest of the Conservative party I have received a letter from the Prime Minister about  her Chequers proposal for a  deal between  the UK with the EU.

I agree with much of the content of her letter. In it she assured me “We will take back control of our money, our laws, and  borders, and begin an exciting new chapter in our nation’s history”…”We will leave the EU on 29 March next year”  “I remain clear that no deal is  better than a bad deal – and we are stepping up our no deal preparation” “The two options on offer from the EU (for a future partnership) at the moment are  not acceptable to me, or to the UK”.

So far so good. Unfortunately the letter then seeks to persuade me that those fine principles and aims as stated often by the PM are reflected in the draft Chequers proposal and in the detailed clauses of the draft EU Withdrawal Agreement that the government has said it is happy with if all else is agreed. It appears the PM has been misled by her advisers, as the Withdrawal Agreement as so far drafted, the transitional period and the Chequers ideas for the future relationship do not in any way reflect those aims and principles.

The transitional period so called means we do not leave the EU on 29 March 2019 as promised. Instead she will ask Parliament to amend the Withdrawal Act we have just passed to give many powers back to the EU.

The proposed settlement on people means we live with a new version of freedom of movement.

It delays taking back control of our fishing grounds and agriculture.

It leaves us accepting large swathes of EU law in perpetuity, in return for the privilege of being able to import their goods and food!

It enslaves us to making  payments to the EU for many years distant, not just for the final two years of our departure, when there is no legal requirement for us to pay anything after March 29 next year when we leave.

The draft Agreement and the proposed future relationship does not achieve the PM’s aims as stated in the second paragraph of the  letter, aims I agree with wholeheartedly. She needs to press on with the WTO option so we can get all our money back from March 2019 onwards,

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235 Comments

  1. Ian wragg
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:26 am | Permalink

    For our benefit please publish a precis of the Withdrawal Agreement and the ramifications of it.
    Lawyers for Britain are scathing about it.

    • Ian wragg
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:51 am | Permalink

      I think you’re being very disingenuous about the PM.
      She knows full well it’s a sellout.

      • Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:38 am | Permalink

        I agree. ‘Misled by her advisers’ is a very charitable interpretation of her behaviour.

        • Bob
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:19 am | Permalink

          Is there something in the Party’s Code of Conduct about telling blatant lies? If so, can I make a complaint and trigger an inquiry panel led by a high court judge?

          • Lifelogic
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:28 pm | Permalink

            No blatant lies are most politicians stock in trade. Cheating the Brexit voters or promising them £1M IHT thresholds, making cast iron promises, promising Brexit means Brexit and then ratting …. all that is just fine it seems.

            But comment on some religious garb in a mild joke or offend some group (clearly one desperate to be offended), that it seems is really serious!

        • Denis Cooper
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:33 am | Permalink

          Traditionally it was a way to give a king or queen another chance: create a fiction that the monarch had been misled by evil counsellors, and so it was those counsellors who should be executed not the sovereign.

          But I think we are now well beyond the stage where the removal of Olly Robbins would have been enough. Clearly Theresa May loves both him, and the EU, so well that she is prepared to die for them.

          • Turboterrier.
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:12 pm | Permalink

            Denis Cooper

            Die she will on the alter of public opinion.

            Her total incompetence knows no bounds and she has begun the total destruction of the Tory party for about the next ten years.

            You get what you sow and sadly the majority of the members in Westminster have allowed her to do it.

            A plague on all their houses

        • Oxiana321
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:39 am | Permalink

          I have no doubt those who are promoting the Chequers proposal are intelligent people and know full well they are saying one thing and doing another. I can’t be alone in thinking that the adage popular of some of history’s most notorious propagandists “if you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it” is being attempted here. We are all being bamboozled.

          • Hope
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 3:26 pm | Permalink

            JR, I think it has come to the point where you have to explain to us mere mortals why you will not oust this perfidious PM? If it means a general election so be it. May has betrayed the nation her treachery knows no bounds and she should be no where near the controls of power.

            It is clear she will keep on lying, to change now will make her position worse. She will have to admit getting permission from Merkel to put her Capitualtion White paper before cabinet, parliament and the UK at large.

            I think you all need to trust the public. There were 73 percent Remain MPs so parliament was always against the public. Parliament is a swamp of dishonesty not changed from 2009, it has become worse by making secret all MP investigations.

            The people will want to rid Westminster of those who seek to betray electoral democracy. Most are alreadymouted.

        • Rien Huizer
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:49 am | Permalink

          You disagree with “her”. Maybe you are in agreement with the No-deal crowd (in which case you have been wasting your time watching Mr May and het team trying to achieve some other result . No deal requires no negotiations whatsoever). Maybe you expect to have your cake and eat it. In both cases it is irraytional to blame the PM. She is not disappointing, not deceiving you..

          • graham1946
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:57 pm | Permalink

            No,not cake and eat it, we just want to leave. We are offering an FTA to keep things going well between us and which is much more beneficial to the EU than us, but the EU wants a pound of flesh as well. You did an FTA with Canada, (how much are they paying and are they having their laws made in Brussels?) so why not the UK who have bankrolled you for 40 odd years? Are you afraid of the competition? That seems the most likely.

          • margaret howard
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:53 pm | Permalink

            “we just want to leave”

            And we – 48.1% – don’t!

          • fedupsoutherner
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:32 pm | Permalink

            Reply to Margaret. Don’t you understand what a democratic vote is? If the percentage had been the other way then you wouldn’t want it overturned. For goodness sake get over yourself.

          • Dennis Zoff
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:52 pm | Permalink

            Margaret Howard

            Why do you wish to remain in the EU? I am curious as to which benefits you believe we receive being a member?

        • Andy
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:55 am | Permalink

          Anyone who behaves as she did at Chequers is dishonest to the core, dishonourable and not fit to hold the office she does. The woman is a disgrace. John knows what he has to do. He like all the other Conservative MPs should get on and do it. How they ever thought this useless woman was suitable to be their leader God alone knows.

          • Lifelogic
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:30 pm | Permalink

            Indeed but Tory MPs even re-elected John Major even after his ERM fiasco and no apology. Perhaps they like being on opposition for many terms under Corbyn!

          • Mitchel
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:54 pm | Permalink

            Useful to some,clearly!

      • fedupsoutherner
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:09 am | Permalink

        Ian, I agree with your sentiments too. Of course she knows this agreement does not even come near to leaving the EU. If she doesn’t realise then there is no way she should be PM. Give the job to someone who does like John or Boris. I don’t care which one decides to take the job on but they have got to do a better job than May. Of course it will get voted through in parliament and the Lords because it is in effect, staying in. The public have been lied to by the Tory party big time. First Cameron and now May. It will be unforgiveable at the polls and they can expect to be out of office for a very long time. This is not just about Brexit. It’s about the future of the UK. If we get a Labour government because of May’s actions over Brexit then it will surely be the end of the UK as we know it. Is there really nobody in the Tory party with the guts to stand up to May and get rid of her, go to the country, explain that we are to just leave and then negotiate afterwards? If they truly believe in democracy and the future of the UK then it will happen. I have a feeling though that we will be sold down the river and the EU will be lord and master for ever more. It will be a disaster. For all of those like Andy who blame the Brexiteers for the mess I say no. It’s not us. We wanted a clean break and a decisive break. It’s the likes of him, Gina Miller and all the back stabbing politicians that have ballsed this up big time. Thank a lot, or should I say, thanks for nothing.

        • Woody
          Posted August 12, 2018 at 7:07 am | Permalink

          I’m not convinced that she does know this paper is a betrayal of her promises .. she has been told otherwise by her trusted advisors so it cant be surely. The sign of a good leader is the ability to pick able and supportive people to guide and advise. May is a terrible lightweight leader on that count alone.

    • Helen Smith
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 3:15 pm | Permalink

      I hope that all those attending the Con party conference will express their dissatisfaction with May by slow hand clapping throughout her speech, or getting up and walking out, either will do but she needs to be publicly humiliated so we can be rid of her.

    • acorn
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:45 pm | Permalink

      You can do your own precis https://ec.europa.eu/commission/sites/beta-political/files/draft_agreement_coloured.pdf

      Notice in Part Five: Financial Provisions, everything has been agreed. This part can stand alone, regardless of the Art 50 outcome in Downing Street. Art 50 does not have an automatic reference to Art 70 of the Vienna Convention or, to a Court of Justice at the Hague. It will be up to the EU, if they wish to press it.

      We don’t want to get to the point where foreigners we need to import from (agri-food), want paying upfront in US Dollars.

  2. Yvybybgh
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:31 am | Permalink

    We all know that May is a liar and that she intends to use Brexit as an excuse to negotiate a closer relationship with Europe. Is it true that the Chequers agreement was based on a proposal to join the EU by the Ukraine?

    The only question remaining is ‘what are the Conservatives going to after May has betrayed us’?

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:57 am | Permalink

      She need to be prevented from her betrayal and to be removed. She is after all also a huge electoral and economic liability who will probably lead to a Corbyn/SNP disaster if she is allowed to. She is wrong on almost every single issue. She now even want to kill free speech for Boris and others.

      • Richard1
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:32 pm | Permalink

        The only question is when. The obvious option is to remove her now, and perhaps there’s a chance a new PM can pull a rabbit out of the hat and get a decent Brexit deal at the last minute. More likely not in which case she should go on or v shortly after March 30 2019,which will give leadership contenders in the cabinet a bit more time to prove their worth. But it might also mean we are burdened with a terrible Brexit deal which can’t easily be changed.

        • Alison
          Posted August 13, 2018 at 9:13 am | Permalink

          The parliamentary arithmetic is tricky, I think. So it is critical that a true leader is appointed, who can carry a Commons which has been allowed to become a very naughty classroom by a very weak teacher, over more than a year, so the trouble in the classroom has got worse and worse.

          Firm leadership and good communication are desperately needed.

    • Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:14 am | Permalink

      ‘After May has betrayed us’ it will not really matter what Conservatives do.

      We keep being told that Leave are keeping their powder dry and will move at an opportune moment. After the Summer break and October are currently being touted as such moments. We shall see. I think ERG can throw a spanner in the works but defenestration is beyond them.

      Both sides have many weeks to plot their next moves.

  3. Peter D Gardner
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:34 am | Permalink

    Dr Redwood, it is all very well being an honest and decent man but there is too much at stake.
    You write: ” It appears the PM has been misled by her advisers, as the Withdrawal Agreement as so far drafted, the transitional period and the Chequers ideas for the future relationship do not in any way reflect those aims and principles.”
    I have to point out that the PM is neither unintelligent nor without her own opinions and aims.
    She knows the truth of what you state subsequently.
    There is only one possible conclusion.
    I am surprised that her repeating the same untruths in Parliament while her audience had the document in front of them has not led to appropriate charges of misconduct. Perhaps it is the case nowadays in British politics that if the lie is big enough, nobody takes it seriously. Only fools would believe it and more fool them. That seems to be the view of Mrs May’s and her Remainer colleagues’ view of the electorate.
    She must know her days as leader of the Conservatives will end soon. You know what you have to do to make the end as swift and as painless as possible for the rest of us.

    • Hope
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:57 am | Permalink

      I think it is misconduct in a public office. I think Raab has committed this as well by his comments in parliament. They knew what they was untrue, it is at least a breach of ministerial code.

  4. Steve
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:34 am | Permalink

    The signature of a deceiver is self contradiction.

    As for leaving the eu, well, there is only one way this can conclude; ‘no deal’. With the current PM and most MP’s being treacherous europhiles, any deal at all with the eu is going to shaft us big time. This lot cannot be trusted.

  5. Nig l
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:34 am | Permalink

    They are taking us for and treating us as fools. Back in the day a trusting electorate lacking the necessary knowledge and understanding would have been taken in but the transparency afforded by the Internet has made that history plus the prime ministers deceit re the negotiations has totally eroded the trust.

    I thank one of your contributors yesterday for reminding me about the Lawyers for Great Britain website. A dissertation on how the ECJ judgements are always in the direction of what the ‘treaty of Rome ‘intended’ ie more federalism subsuming the nation state, on its own, is enough to put a lie to the statement made in her letter let alone the other issues.

    It is as much a lie as Cameron’s Project Fear missive and equally should go in the trash.

    P.S. Hammond this morning is quoted as saying he wants to save the High Street by taxing in line retailers. Presumably he has forgotten it us nit just the behemoths that trade this way.

    Please tell him the internet offers me a vast choice that the high street never could or will and whatever he does will not make me go back. If he gives ahead with his in line tax I will presume he wants me to pay more and have less choice.

    • Timaction
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:28 am | Permalink

      Just a sham to scrounge more taxes from the internet giants. It wont put the cork back into the internet Genie. Just like the internet shines a big light of truth on our current politicos and their actions. We are no longer fooled by the lies of Ms May, Robbins or the remainer cohort. Carry out the will of the people and get us out of the EU or get out of Parliament. You’ve had your instructions from the people!

      • Tad Davison
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:08 am | Permalink

        Could be that he’s making sure the Treasury has enough revenue coming in, to feed the EU monster in future. Take from that Hammond already knows what is likely to happen in any EU – UK Brexit negotiations. They just need to be sold to Tory MPs, most of which will meekly fall into line, telling May what a fantastic job she is doing.

        They make my skin crawl, they really do!

        Tad

        • libertarian
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:38 pm | Permalink

          Hammond is an EU stooge

          This Internet tax to “save the high st retailer” is a crock

          The Internet providers do not compete on price they compete on availability ( its called a long tail)

          Amazon and other Internet platforms have been the force behind the creation of more than 1 million new UK businesses , that is also the driver for our huge increase in new jobs.

          Imposing a new tax will be passed directly on to consumers pushing up prices and inflation and it wont save one single high street retailer from their own failure to invest and innovate

          The whole thing is part of the EU’s war against the Internet and the digital ecosphere , i.e. the future

          Our mate Andy asked us to name things that caused us to vote to leave the EU add this to the list

          In the digital sphere alone

          VAT Moss

          GDPR

          Article 13

          & now this

          https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/business/company-tax/fair-taxation-digital-economy_en

          If the god awful Tories are allowed to continue destroying our economy we will pay the price for generations. Backbench MP’s need to urgently find the bottle , back Boris ( he’s the only viable one now) and do the deed.

          Anything else and I will gladly vote Corbyn for the Lol’s

          • Peter D Gardner
            Posted August 12, 2018 at 8:26 am | Permalink

            Thanks for the link. The draft Withdrawal Agreement is unbelievably one-sided. Hard to believe that any of its advocates actually understand it – unless they’re on the side of the EU, which is, in some cases, more than likely.

        • Hope
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 3:30 pm | Permalink

          Taxing Amazon will do nothing. However taxing Hammond could force local authorities to reduce business rates to give them a chance. Tories could keep thher or promise not to allow council tax rises above inflation, Javid broke that promise for no good reason.

          Despite Brexit Tories simply cannot and will not be trusted on economy and taxation ever again.

  6. Peter Wood
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:37 am | Permalink

    Good Morning,

    There are two possibilities here:
    1. Mrs. May doesn’t comprehend the terms described in the proposed agreement and/or Bill,
    or
    2. Mrs. May is simply lying and hopes you’ll not question her.

    In either case, she is proven to be not competent to be PM.

    To save the nation from years of strife with the EU and to keep the Conservative Party in existence you must remove her.

    • Timaction
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:29 am | Permalink

      Indeed. I think we all know the answer!

  7. jack Snell
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:39 am | Permalink

    Don’t know what you’re complaining about, MPs have it in their power to collect the necessary signatures to have her dumped?

    Also going to WTO rules without concluding a withdrawal agreement successfully will not do anything much for us unfortunately as very likely all trade and movement with them will cease until the withdrawal account is settled..then we have to consider our good standing in the world with regard to deals for the future- this has nothing to do with legal requirements

    • JoolsB
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:05 am | Permalink

      “Don’t know what you’re complaining about, MPs have it in their power to collect the necessary signatures to have her dumped?”

      They may have the power but they obviously lack the courage.

      • Hope
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:03 am | Permalink

        Jack, there should have been parallel talks not sequential, the Withdrawal agreemnt should never have been discussed in isolation or all matters. May sanctioned this aspect knowing it would help her keep the U.K. in the EU by including her sham Irish border problem.

        • acorn
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:32 pm | Permalink

          Mrs May had no option as an EU member state. The EU Rules say the two agreements will be sequential not parallel. The “Rules” are agreed to when a Sovereign State becomes a member of any Supra-National entity, like the EU.

          The phrase “Rules Based Organisation”is not understood on this site. The EU is not yet considered to be a “Sovereign State” under the UN definition of such. Its current 28 member States ARE considered by the rest of the world, to be “Sovereign”.

          If you are not considered by the rest of the world to be “Sovereign”, you can be a Supra-National (SN) collection of Sovereign States. Hence, all Sovereign States that join an SN, have to agree a set of RULES that they will abide by.

          The UK is demanding that the EU changes its Supra-National Rule Book, for the convenience of the leaving UK: regardless of all its other members.

          The EU and other Supra-National organisations on this planet, might well tell the UK to stick it where the Sun don’t shine.

          • Hope
            Posted August 12, 2018 at 10:13 am | Permalink

            Utter tosh. Cameron warns us of Lisbon! We read Davis was arguing for parallel talks but overridden, he was overridden by the Irish border as well when she scuttled off at night to mak unilateral deal. Treacherous May has a lot to account for.

            The Lisbon Treaty was just about this. Hence we see the likes of Drunker at G7 meetings. Who do you think represents, Macron, Mercow and May already there. No need of them if your point is correct.

          • Denis Cooper
            Posted August 12, 2018 at 10:27 am | Permalink

            “The EU Rules say the two agreements will be sequential not parallel.”

            Really, so specifically what rules, secondary legislation, are they then, cite chapter and verse, and how can that supposed restriction be compatible with the requirement in Article 50 of the Treaty on European Union, primary legislation, that:

            “… the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the framework for its future relationship with the Union.”

            According to your putative “EU Rules” there could not even be any such framework, could there.

            Just like Theresa May, another EU loyalist supporting the EU against your own country.

    • Dave Andrews
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:22 am | Permalink

      Our decades of net contributions settles our account with the EU, with no more being due.
      If an exit fee was due, it should have been clearly set out in the treaties. Of course it wasn’t, in order to sweeten the path for new countries to join.

      • Andy
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:57 am | Permalink

        No ‘exit fee’ is due because that is not how the EU is financed – they have made it up as they have gone along. Stupid May should have said NO from the beginning and demanded a proper legal basis for any payment. But of course there isn’t a legal basis. It is a corrupt payment, bribery if you like, seeking to buy good relations. It wont do that of course.

      • JoolsB
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 3:57 pm | Permalink

        Exactly Dave. 40 years x £10 billion net contributions means they owe us if anything. We should not pay them a penny but it seems May and Hammond have other ideas. What’s the betting they will hand over 39 billions of our hard earned money even if there is no deal?

    • Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:32 am | Permalink

      Brexit was never all about trade though, was it?
      By ”withdrawal account” do you refer to that bribe they want us to pay them?

      • Jack snell
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:07 pm | Permalink

        L Jones..whatever it is we owe it should be laid out there with the breakdown. There is no question of it being a fee or a bribe so it must reflect something like pensions for MEP’ and commitments made by us for projects already underway..am sure tjat the breakdown will have to be published

    • Know-Dice
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:21 am | Permalink

      “very likely all trade and movement with them will cease until the withdrawal account is settled..”

      Really !!!

      Just not going to happen…

      • Jack snell
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:10 pm | Permalink

        Yes am afraid that there will be huge disruption to people and trade in the ports. No need for me to spell it out

    • Denis Cooper
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:38 am | Permalink

      If you’re interested in WTO rules, there are strong arguments that the Chequers plan would contravene them:

      http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2018/08/09/tax-rises-do-economic-and-political-damage/#comment-953490

  8. Alan Jutson
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:44 am | Permalink

    Whilst I have not seen the letter, it seems you suggest that the content contradicts itself on so many points, its hardly worth the paper it is written on.

    You suggest Mrs May has said the two EU proposals so far do not meet her requirements, but one assumes she must think her own Chequers proposals do, otherwise what is the point of her trying to sell it to everyone !

    If Mrs May cannot see what she has put on the table, is very, very different from her Lancaster House speech, then there is not a lot of hope that she will ever get a deal that will suit the UK.

    I simply do not believe that she would have the courage to leave on WTO terms (no matter how much she threatens it) because her advisors simply do not want that solution.
    Indeed has she ever said to the EU we will leave on WTO terms, if they cannot agree sensible terms.
    I doubt it !

    We simply cannot tie our so called Independent future to the EU, with ECJ rules that take precedence over our own, as that is absolute nonsense and farcical.

    Sad to say more delay, and more capitulation is in the pipeline I am afraid.

    The so called transitional period is no more than an extension of our membership, with now no say on the rules, truly shocking.

    • Sir Joe Soap
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:37 am | Permalink

      Dear Mrs May

      Thank you for your letter of 3 August.

      I reject your plans for your withdrawal proposal as I don’t believe they constitute taking back control of either our laws, money or borders.

      Laws-you refer to a “common rulebook” but then state that “any changes to our rules will be subject to a Parliamentary lock”. If these were truly our rules, they would be made and changed solely by our Parliament, and would not therefore require a Parliamentary “lock”, whatever that is. Therefore your proposal doesn’t fulfill the requirement of us taking back our laws.

      Money-your proposal not to pay “vast sums” to Brussels doesn’t limit or state the amount you are willing to pay in any way, so isn’t worth placing in any proposal, as it can’t be judged for what it is or isn’t, except to say that it implies you will be paying sums albeit short of “vast”of our taxes to Brussels without any quantifiable benefit for us.

      Borders-there is nothing in your proposal about how we take back control of our borders.

      • Sir Joe Soap
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:40 am | Permalink

        Additionally, you say that signing up to a common rulebook on goods means that we could not drop regulatory standards. In this you are confusing dropping standards with changing them, and we wouldn’t be able even to change standards for the better ourselves. If a British inventor
        makes a completely new and provenly better (in British regulators’ eyes) drug, means of transport, building material, or other significant innovation, we want to be able to introduce that to our market and to world markets. Your proposal would deny us that possibility and thereby deny our creative industries the very reason they voted Leave – to free them up from overbearing EU rules and regulations. Industry will always modify its standards to meet
        demands of its global customers, but for goodness’ sake, don’t just tie it to the standards written by its EU competitors!

        • Know-Dice
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:24 am | Permalink

          Agreed, for example we might want to consider restricting the sale of vacuum cleaners, lawn mowers etc based on efficiency rather than the irrelevant power consumption…

        • fedupsoutherner
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:14 am | Permalink

          Sir Joe. Agree with your last points about better inventions etc. Just how many times do the British come up with fantastic innovation? Loads of times!! This is just the EU’s way of holding us back because they are scared sh***tless that we will do better than them in the real world.

          • Steve
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 2:27 pm | Permalink

            fedupsoutherner

            “they are scared sh***tless that we will do better than them in the real world.”

            I think it goes further than that. They probably know the game is up if they fail to make an example of us, as we will not be the only country to leave, others will follow.

            They might also have considered that without us their corrupt union will fragment, potentially making their position very uneasy in terms of defence, energy etc.

            Not doing the fighting for Europe and the french for a third time can only be a good thing in my opinion, the way they view this nation and the English just shows how ungrateful they are.

            We owe them nothing.

        • Ian wragg
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:36 am | Permalink

          100% correct.

        • Sir Joe Soap
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:11 pm | Permalink

          Your proposals in the recent White Paper add to the panoply of weasel words and half-truths in your letter. You clearly aren’t meeting the needs of the electorate and the mandate given to you in the 2016 referendum and the 2017 election. Your belated initial negotiating position gives too much away. Given your position in the referendum campaign and your lack of business experience, it is understandable that you don’t comprehend how to regain freedom for UK business to trade seamlessly with worldwide customers and suppliers. Your letter and your whole attitude lacks imagination or positivity.

          It would be supremely preferable, even at this late stage, if you kindly resigned and handed the mantle over to somebody who understands the changes needed to make the UK successful outside the EU, and is positive about our future.

          Regards

  9. Iain Gill
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:46 am | Permalink

    Well said John

    Keep saying it

    If anything was worth dying in a ditch over, this is it.

  10. oldtimer
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:11 am | Permalink

    It is clear from the letter that May says one thing but intends to do something else. She has form. For how much longer will the Conservative party put up with this behaviour?

    • Iain Gill
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:41 am | Permalink

      Rather like her saying one thing but doing another on immigration in all her time as home secretary and PM. She clearly thinks thats the way to do politics.

  11. agricola
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:33 am | Permalink

    Is the PM myopic, stupid or duplicitous. I would like to read the letter to MPs so that I can come to a conclusion. If my conclusion is the same as yours she must go, not being a fit person to dictate the future of the UK. I would add that it is the 17.4 million who voted leave she should be addressing, not 650 MPs most of whom wish to remain with their own careers taking precedence over the future of the nation.

  12. Gary C
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:35 am | Permalink

    This perfidious PM need removing.

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:02 am | Permalink

      “perfidious”

      deceitful and untrustworthy, treacherous, duplicitous, deceitful, disloyal, faithless, unfaithful, traitorous, treasonous, false, untrue, double-dealing, dishonest, two-faced, Janus-faced, untrustworthy; rarefalse-hearted, double-faced, truthless …..

  13. eeyore
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:39 am | Permalink

    Parliament resumes after the conferences on October 9. A key EU summit takes place in October 19. Thereafter come the great votes on the PM’s final proposals. Our host’s position on them is abundantly clear.

    “I reside at Table Mountain and my name is Truthful James.
    I am not up to small deceit nor any sinful games” (Bret Harte).

    Mrs May would do very well to emulate Truthful James this autumn.

  14. Mick
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:40 am | Permalink

    https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1001788/Brexit-news-UK-EU-Theresa-May-Conservative-Party-London-European-Union-Hornchurch
    So with what grass roots and your good self are saying is effectively we will still be in the dreaded Eu, this needs laying out in plain to understand language so the ordinary person on the street who have no understanding of politics are informed that the 17.4 million are being stitched up, Mrs May is playing with fire and unless she does exactly what we voted for and LEAVE the Eu with no hidden clauses to keep us tied to it then I’m sure as the sun will rise in the east tomorrow your party will be sent packing at the next GE, but then you are already aware of that

  15. Kenneth
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:42 am | Permalink

    It seems to me that the Prime Minister is the main obstacle to our ambitions of realising the benefits to our economy and our People that leaving the eu will bring.

    I believe that those pinning their hopes on eu intransigence will be disappointment.

    If Mrs May is allowed to stay in office, the negotiators will perform a pretty dance, swapping fudge and we will end up effectively staying in the eu on onerous terms.

    The lame duck pm has nothing to lose. However, the UK has plenty to lose if she gets her way.

    The only way now is to replace the PM (and the Chancellor) and honour the referendum to leave the eu in its entirety.

  16. DUNCAN
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:48 am | Permalink

    Is this meant to be a serious and sincere expression of your concerns regarding the scurrilous behaviour of this PM?

    You state that the PM’s been ‘misled by her advisers’. I nearly fell out of my high-chair on reading this. I admire your loyalty to this leader though in truth I suspect you’re being diplomatic.

    It is obvious to those who wish to see the truth that May knows exactly what she’s doing. If you’re suggesting that she’s the victim of misinformation and manipulation by her advisers then your reputation as a serious politician will become untenable

    This PM is a grotesque. She’s been one all her political life. She’s unprincipled and a pure political animal in the same style of Blair.

    We understand that as a May supporter yourself you can’t be seen to be withdrawing support for her but I fail to understand how a vehement Eurosceptic you can in anyway countenance her duplicitous actions and then try to construct the idea that she’s a victim herself. It is pathetic but then in many ways this is what the Tories have become.

    Maybe you should write an article on your blog accusing May of betraying YOU, the UK, its people and democracy itself?

    This PM is guilty of deception. How’s that for the truth Mr Redwood?

    • Glenn Vaughan
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:46 am | Permalink

      “This PM is a grotesque. She’s been one all her political life. She’s unprincipled and a pure political animal in the same style of Blair.” Duncan

      Yet knowing all that you have quoted you still voted for her in the 2017 General Election – a mere 14 months ago!

      Furthermore, I find your persistent accusation that John Redwood supported Theresa May for the leadership nauseating. You have been told frequently that he actually supported Andrea Leadsom so your insistence to the contrary is either malevolence or thick-headedness – perhaps both.

      Instead of scapegoating John, it’s time you faced up to your responsibility for your support of this useless PM just last year. You are responsible for this current fiasco and those who voted like you. Stop your daily bleating like a sulking child and either grow a pair or shut up and start your own political party!

      • Bob
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:28 am | Permalink

        “start your own political party!”

        No need to reinvent the wheel, ukip membership is only £30.
        Get involved with a genuinely conservative party with UK independence as their founding principle.

        • JoolsB
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:35 pm | Permalink

          UKIP membership has gone up by the thousands since May’s Chequers sell out. UKIP ARE the only true Conservative party now. With the exception of a handful of true blue Tory MPs, John being one them, the rest are anything but. We were duped when we thought we were voting for a Tory Government, that we do not have.

          • fedupsoutherner
            Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:38 pm | Permalink

            Jools B. Agree. UKIP policies are very similar to what Conservative policies used to be. I feel that if people vote for Labour or the Libdims just to spite the Conservatives then it will just look like we are endorsing their policy on the EU. None of them believe in Brexit and will not take us out which is what we all want. We need to vote for a party that really wants us out and that’s UKIP. Any other party will not deliver so what is the point of voting for them? You may as well stick with May and her useless lot.

      • Yvybybgh
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:47 pm | Permalink

        How can electors be responsible for May when she has ignored her own manifesto on Brexit?

      • JoolsB
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:30 pm | Permalink

        “Furthermore, I find your persistent accusation that John Redwood supported Theresa May for the leadership nauseating. You have been told frequently that he actually supported Andrea Leadsom”

        Are you sure about that? I was also under the impression that John supported May for leader. I could never understand why so many Brexit MPs voted for remainer May. Maybe John can clarify.

        Reply I voted for Leadsom in the leadership context.

    • graham1946
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:20 am | Permalink

      Duncan,

      What you want is coming, albeit slowly. The tectonic plates are shifting at last under May – she is on her way now.

      For two years we have had slavish support for her, but at last that is changing slowly and MP’s like Moggy and JR now feel emboldened to criticise her and more will follow. Presumably the numbers in Parliament are now mounting up.

      Boris laid a bear trap which she and the hapless Brandon Lewis have fallen into. In management you should always leave a way out for the boss to override any decisions made by underlings if necessary but she has jumped on a very rickety bandwagon which is going in the wrong direction. The Tories now either have to punish Johnson for what they have said is wrong or back off, either course will make them look silly. Boris will not accept ‘diversity training’ and they don’t have the bottle to dismiss him from the party.Once a PM becomes a laughing stock, the game is up. Once the ball gets rolling, the May sycophants will have a sudden change of heart and I predict that by the end of the year, maybe even by Conference no-one will even admit to knowing her.

    • Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:52 am | Permalink

      You speak for many of us here, Duncan.
      Sad, as well as scandalous, isn’t it?

      • Timaction
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:38 pm | Permalink

        Indeed it is. Almost pitchfork time and a march on Parliament by the millions to take back control from the 650.

  17. Lifelogic
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:51 am | Permalink

    Indeed her deal (which the EU have not even agreed to yet) is totally unacceptable.

    Meanwhile as Mogg puts it today in the Telegraph:- The Tories’ war on Boris is political, not moral.

    May and Brandon Lewis have clearly behaved appallingly and both should resign.

    The whole idea that people should not be allowed to comment on religious garb would be an appalling attack on free speech and profoundly un-Conservative.

    • mickc
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:50 am | Permalink

      But, of course, the EU has already agreed what May is proposing; May had the proposal approved by Merkel even before it was put before the Cabinet.
      The EU is the creature of Germany; it is in reality the Fourth German Empire. In due course the Ukraine will join and then Germany will have achieved what its previous rulers sought by military might.
      Nick Ridley spoke the truth all those years ago.

      • Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:58 am | Permalink

        That’s true, Micke. A German hegemony, and that’s what was always sought by Germany.
        We’re not supposed to say that, are we – we’re supposed to be ”friends” again – but who can feel amicably towards a country that has made such obvious attempts at dominance – ie two world wars, and now this?

        • margaret howard
          Posted August 12, 2018 at 10:55 pm | Permalink

          Until the 20th century Germany was the ONLY European country Britain had never been at war with. Indeed the German Hanovers have sat on the British throne for over 300 years.

          And Germany’s attempts at dominance were modest compared to Britain’s attempts to rule the globe.

          As Blackadder put it so well:

          “George, the British Empire at present covers a quarter of the globe, while the German Empire consists of a small sausage factory in Tanganiki.”

          • Dennis Zoff
            Posted August 13, 2018 at 9:34 am | Permalink

            Margaret Howard

            True, but which one has done more damage to the people’s of this planet?

      • Tad Davison
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:02 pm | Permalink

        Yes, but Heath didn’t and neither did Heseltine and Clarke. We who lived through those dark days know fully the depths of the remain depravity not to mention the extent of the treachery. This is history repeating itself, yet still they will not be held to account. They get away with deception in the name of the EU every single time.

        Tad

      • Steve
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 2:42 pm | Permalink

        mickc

        Firstly that would be why May sneaked off to Merkel immediately before Chequers.

        Quote: “The EU is the creature of Germany; it is in reality the Fourth German Empire.”

        Yes that would appear so. However the original concept was doomed to failure when it included the french, who are largely responsible for the current scenario because of decades of using our country as a dumping ground for what they don’t want.

        Historically any trouble in Europe has always been caused by the french.

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:59 am | Permalink

      But May is profoundly un-Conservative in almost every single way.

    • Andy
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:25 am | Permalink

      Nobody is saying that Boris can’t discuss the merits of the burka.

      They are simply saying if he is going to discuss it he should do so without being a completely abusive twit.

      There is a difference.

      • Lifelogic
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:39 pm | Permalink

        There was nothing remotely abusive or twit like about the Boris comments. It was all perfectly reasonable, fair comment and indeed true.

      • libertarian
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:43 pm | Permalink

        Andy

        Go and read what Polly Tonibee wrote about the Burka in the Guardian, go and read what Ken Clarke and Anna Sourby wrote about it, go and tell the 7 EU countries that have banned it. Then get back to me about Bojo

      • Anonymous
        Posted August 12, 2018 at 10:58 am | Permalink

        Pot calling kettle.

        Andy says “But I’m not in a position of responsibility.”

        Oh. We all know that, Andy !

      • rose
        Posted August 13, 2018 at 10:57 am | Permalink

        “Completely abusive twit”

        Do you know what abuse of women and girls is? Complete abuse? It mostly takes place behind closed doors and I can’t describe it here.

        You really cannot complain about two pairs of innocuous words from different parts of someone else’s thousand word article and then come out with a phrase like that!

  18. Man of Kent
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:51 am | Permalink

    Sadly our PM has proven herself to be an inveterate liar .
    She signed the letter .
    She has not ‘been misled by her advisers ‘
    If she felt that there had been a misrepresentation in balance it should be easy to have the letter redrafted .

    I think we can take it that the initial impression given is what she intended.

    You are quite right , as with any contract drawn up by someone dubious, to hold it up to the light and carefully examine what is not said .

    She is a disgrace !

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:03 am | Permalink

      Exactly.

  19. R.O'Connor
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:55 am | Permalink

    Don’t pull your punches John. She is not being misled by her advisers,it’s just the sort of no-brexit arrangement SHE is more than happy to endorse.

    • rose
      Posted August 13, 2018 at 10:02 am | Permalink

      I disagree. I think she is being manipualted by advisers, just as she was by the Brexiteer Nick Timothy. If he had not decided to try and do a whole lot more though her, we would not be in this mess. If only power had not gone to his head. If only he had just stuck to Brexit and seen it through. But he was tempted to over reach himself and got defenestrated.

  20. Paul Cohen
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:00 am | Permalink

    Says one thing , means another – whats a matter with the woman?

    For goodness sake dump these proposals into the bin.

    The UK need a new pm and quick!

  21. John Miller
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:05 am | Permalink

    This has been the PM’s modus operandi from the beginning.

    To say one thing, but do another. Thus the second paragraph’s noble aims are not reflected in the proposed actions.

    In Westminster, no doubt this is called “political persuasion” or some such euphemism.

    We common folk call this lying.

    • Oxiana321
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:20 pm | Permalink

      We are not where we are today by mere happenchance. The Establishment have been steering towards such an outcome since the result of the referendum. This has been an ever so carefully choreographed process and the hoped-for denouement will be Brussels caving and agreeing to the Chequers proposal, or a slight variant of it. It is now the duty of the British public to make sure that that day can never arrive.

      • Lifelogic
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:41 pm | Permalink

        Indeed and the rather few sound MPs we have.

      • getahead
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:12 pm | Permalink

        Oxiana321, hard to see how the British public can prevent what’s going on except by encouraging loyal conservative members of parliament to start a movement to kick her out. And to prevent a similar Europhile from moving in.
        Is that possible? We need an Oliver Cromwell it seems.

  22. Alan Jutson
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:18 am | Permalink

    I wonder how many other Party members and MP’s will recognise the contradictions you outline.

    Just as the EU are showing signs of being under pressure from their own Industries, which many of us said would come in time.
    A winning hand played by a novice with no commercial experience, and advised and guided by the same.

    The only real solution now is to simply walk away and say its WTO terms.
    Guarantee that will not happen with Present Prime Minister in Charge.

    Thus in order to win back control, you first have to remove the present leader.

    • getahead
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

      Alan, Mrs May is guided by Tory elites and companies with connections in Brussels who benefit from EU membership. They are controlling this, not those with “no commercial experience”.

      • Dennis Zoff
        Posted August 12, 2018 at 12:42 am | Permalink

        Getahead

        QED exactly!…..it’s what we business people do….drive politicians to endorse our business objectives. Everything else is superfluous!

        “Money makes the world go round”

  23. Woody
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:21 am | Permalink

    It is increasingly clear that May is too lightweight to lead our nation out of the EU effectively. She has a history of employing bad advisors, as was only too evident in the dogmatically used “strong and stable” theme she and her entourage foolishly promoted in the General Election, and now she as a similarly narrow minded bureaucrat advisor guiding / pulling her strings to take us in a direction that we did not vote for and would not benefit from as a free nation. Its time she was moved on and the Tory party employed one of their party who has leadership skills …. Boris does come to mind.

    • Tad Davison
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:32 pm | Permalink

      I want May removed at the earliest opportunity, like in five minutes time, but who within the Tory party so far has the balls to put themselves forward and challenge her?

      The Tories have never faced up to the fact that half of the parliamentary party have no right to be thought of as true Conservatives in the first place, and thus the schism continues. The remainers wring their hands in despair, but it is they who are causing the log jam. The remainers support others of their ilk who do see themselves as prime ministerial material, so the constant pulling in either direction goes on.

      The Tiries have had plenty of opportunities to grow the party from the grassroots upwards and rid themselves of all who are not ‘true blue patriots’ by natural wastage, but instead, local parties keep selecting yet more EU stooges so the rift continues. Ultimately, something has to give.

      The answer lies in Brexiteers having enough courage to finally put up a true pro-Brexit candidate to take on the remainer May. The country will undoubtedly unite behind a strong articulate leader because they are heartily sick of what we presently have. Afterwards, the Tories can deal with the all-pervasive patriotic deficit that now persists.

      Bring it on!!

      Tad

  24. Ian wragg
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:24 am | Permalink

    Read Juliet Samuel in todays Telegraph .
    She lays bare the government’s total capitulation to Brussels.
    This article should be sent to every house in Britain.

    • rose
      Posted August 13, 2018 at 10:04 am | Permalink

      Yes, her best so far.

  25. Paul Cohen
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:28 am | Permalink

    Someone must be doing a cut and paste job here and not checking the result? How could such a contradictory letter be circulated without considering the fury it would generate with the electorate.

    I’m afraid this administration is losing the plot fast!

  26. Richard1
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:37 am | Permalink

    I do not think we will get to an acceptable deal with Mrs May as PM. The Chequers proposal is not workable, even for the EU. What we will end up with by the time the EU have finished with it is something close to customs union + single market + ECJ in perpetuity. Ie a worse arrangement than eg Switzerland or even Norway have. Mrs May is likely to urge acceptance of this and call it ‘brexit’.

    We know we can’t fight the next election with Mrs May as leader so the best thing is bite the bullet now and change her, and perhaps with a more robust and clear sighted PM, even at this late stage, there is a chance to get a sensible deal.

  27. Anonymous
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:38 am | Permalink

    The people would respect “We cannot leave the EU. We’re not leaving the EU. This is the best you’re going to get. It’s the very best we can do.”

    We can take it so just say it.

    Just stop trying to force a situation where Remain becomes The People’s idea. Project Fear should be renamed Operation Make the People think that Remain was Their Idea.

    Defy the referendum. Declare openly what the EU is.

    Note to Andy. The politician you should be the most aquainted with is your MEP. You should know what EU party he is a member of and what it’s policies are. You should know the mechanisms of the EU Commission better than you do those of Westminster.

    • Andy
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:21 am | Permalink

      I do know my MEPs thanks. If I have a query I’ll deal with Catherine Bearder.

      I understand perfectly well how the EU works – and how Westminster works – and the awkward reality is that Brussels is at least as democratic as Westminster.

      But don’t let actual facts trouble you when you’re in the middle of a perfectly good rant.

      • libertarian
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:47 pm | Permalink

        Andy

        Lol you have 10 MEPs, the Lib Dem one you chose came 8th in the vote. Farage is your lead MEP. Lol

        • Andy
          Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:00 pm | Permalink

          And?

          It’s how the system works and it means we are all represented. I choose to deal with the MEP who is most suitable for me – someone competent, hard-working and pleasant.

          If that’s not your cup of tea there are plenty of incompetent, lazy and unpleasant UKIP MEPs you can deal with. Of course the you could deal with your UKIP MP instead – except Westminster is so undemocratic theree are none.

      • Anonymous
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:58 pm | Permalink

        Then when UKIP won the European election in 2014 you should have been in a state of total apoplexy.

        That you weren’t is a sign of the fact that your MEP is actually insignificant.

    • hefner
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:30 am | Permalink

      Strictly speaking, Andy is likely to have several MEPs. Here in the South East, I have 10 including Mr Farage and Mr Hannan. So maybe you might want to learn a bit more about MEPs before commenting?

      • Anonymous
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:00 pm | Permalink

        I’m not the one trying to sell the EU.

    • Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:06 pm | Permalink

      No – the people would not and SHOULD not ”respect” this, were it ever actually to be said. We certainly shouldn’t ”take it”.
      That is to let this deceitful and increasingly despised PM and her so-called ”advisors” off the hook – which is exactly what they’d like, and could even be what they’re working towards.

      • Anonymous
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:02 pm | Permalink

        Defiance of the referendum is a very close second best, can you not see that ? A service to both to the people of Britain and of the EU.

        It tells everyone where we really are.

  28. Caterpillar
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:47 am | Permalink

    What does. “stepping up our no deal preparations” mean? Surely this should have been the starting point of any negotiation e.g. How will UK and EU recognise each other’s product standards under no agreement, putting everything in place for no deal is surely the starting point?

    • getahead
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:42 pm | Permalink

      This fixation on a “deal” is sheer obfuscation. The EU is a political entity. The Europhiles all want to be part of the United States of Europe even though it is beginning to seem that the states of Europe are far from united.
      We should not have been talking (wisdom of hindsight) about deals before we had left the EU. We should have left the EU completely and cleanly as the ballot sheet indicated. Once out we could have offered the EU a trade deal. But sadly May and her leaders and the CBI, want to be part of the political union.
      If she remains as PM God help us.

  29. Denis Cooper
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 7:49 am | Permalink

    On another site I see a Tory MP who was elected on the Tory manifesto writing:

    “On Brexit, let’s do what is right and sensible and extend, suspend or revoke Article 50, offer a people a final say on Brexit, and avoid crashing out without a deal as some Brextremists seem to want.”

    And I see that one of the few sympathetic comments on the article deplores the fact that Brexit seems to have caused polarisation and a coarsening of political debate …

    Well of course it is not Brexit which has done that, the steadily mounting anger has arisen mainly from the disgusting attempts by EU loyalists – such as that Tory MP, but not only that Tory MP also my own local Tory MP the Prime Minister – to thwart Brexit.

    Without mentioning the name of that site I will I say that when I was banned from it some years ago it was specifically for repeatedly posing the question whether various people who were being put forward as potential parliamentary candidates were actually committed to the sovereignty of the Parliament of which they aspired to become members.

    It has since become clear that my concern was justified because for some of them their primary loyalty is to the EU, not to the UK, and they should perhaps leave and start up their own party called the League of European Empire Loyalists.

    Oh, hang on, that was tried before with the Pro-Euro Conservative Party:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro-Euro_Conservative_Party

    and many of its leading lights ended up with the self-styled “Liberal Democrats”.

    However the question is, what can we do to defeat these traitors?

    • Andy
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:12 am | Permalink

      Brexit has polarised debate and coarseness debate. This is what happens when swathes of the hard-right and hard-left start denying facts and accusing everyone else of being traitors.

      You lot are the problem.

      • Anonymous
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:04 pm | Permalink

        No. You don’t like debate. That is the problem.

        Insult insult insult.

        It’s all that Fact Free Andy does.

      • Denis Cooper
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:01 pm | Permalink

        Nope, the problem is that EU loyalists like you are incapable of accepting that despite all your advantages you lost a democratic vote. It took just hours for your lot, a small minority, to decide that you would do everything you could to overturn the result and keep us in your beloved EU.

    • fedupsoutherner
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:21 am | Permalink

      @Denis. Of course there is a lot of bad feeling now between Politicians and the public because this fiasco has been allowed to play out for too long. If we had just left, as Cameron told us we would do, then negotiations would have been on our terms, just like JR said they would be. Instead of that, we have gone in really weak and fussed about like a load of old ladies and this is what we have left now. One big bloody mess. Cameron told us we would leave the next day and instead of that we find two years down the track of boring and pointless negotiations that we are no further forward and are in effect still in the EU. What a waste of money!! What a waste of time!! Still, that’s what governments are good at.

    • hefner
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:50 am | Permalink

      Don’t you think it would help if we didn’t have FPTP and the resulting two big parties with multiple subgroups within them?
      Despite the recurring comments on this site about the Conservative Party being wiped out at the next GE, I think it will not happen simply because most of first-rate candidates will want to stick with either the CP or Labour to have any chance of being elected in a UK-wide GE under FPTP, leaving only second (or third, or fourth or …)-rate candidates populating the ranks of UKIP?
      But I would agree it is a nice dream for old gits to have during their afternoon siesta.

      • Denis Cooper
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:07 pm | Permalink

        Your last sentence says a lot about your attitude. Perhaps you would like to have an upper age limit for being allowed to voting, or maybe even for being allowed to live? I don’t suppose it occurs to you that some of those who voted to leave the EU in 2016 had voted to stay in the EEC in 1975, but had learned better over the intervening years despite all the attempts to dupe them?

        • Anonymous
          Posted August 12, 2018 at 9:36 pm | Permalink

          Some who just missed voting in 1975 because they were too young are deemed to have been too old to have voted in 2016.

          Very specific about where to demark voting age groups, are these Remainers.

    • Tad Davison
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:09 pm | Permalink

      Denis,

      By banning you, the other website was just burying its head in the sand and denying the glaringly obvious.

      Maybe de-selection could be the answer.

      Local party chairmen and the selection panels must surely know by now the strength of the public’s antithesis towards these pro-EU toadies and that the Tories face yet another 1997 style wipe-out if they persist with such garbage.

      I would venture the almost nailed-on certainty that a seat will be lost due to self-induced unpopularity is sufficient incentive to reconsider any MP’s suitability.

      Tad

  30. Sakara Gold
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:01 am | Permalink

    If what you describe in the PM’s letter is accurate, then it is the “bad deal” everyone has been fearing. Unfortunately, there is insufficient support in the party to depose the PM and personally, I would not support Boris Johnson (who cannnot engage his expensively-educated brain before he puts his mouth in gear) as her replacement.

    As I feared, sterling is suffering with all the uncertainty. We must resolve this issue as soon as possible for the good of the country – however yesterday’s UK growth figures were encouraging. The markets will react which ever way we go.

    • hefner
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:52 am | Permalink

      Do what a number of people do, move your business to Dublin, your wealth to Monaco, or short the pound.

      • Denis Cooper
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:12 pm | Permalink

        Or alternatively look at the facts with a dispassionate eye rather than simply believing whatever exaggerated version of reality journalists may present in order to fill their column inches and attract readers.

    • Denis Cooper
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:54 am | Permalink

      Sterling is not suffering to a notable degree.

      http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2018/08/09/tax-rises-do-economic-and-political-damage/#comment-953456

      Sterling had fluctuated up by some percent since the beginning of the year, but then it peaked in late April and now it is back to roughly where it had started the year, which some people choose to describe as sterling being at its lowest for the year …

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:44 pm | Permalink

      Sterling is suffering because we have a visionless, socialist, PC, greencrap, remainer idiot as PM and an economic illiterate as chancellor! Plus Carney and the BoE!

  31. percy openshaw
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:04 am | Permalink

    Well, Mr Redwood – I’ve just read your piece and many of the following comments. The consensus would appear to be that trust can no longer be reposed in the PM. It is an opinion I share. Of course it is difficult for you to be as blunt as the rest of us, but I think you must be aware that loss of trust is the worst form that reputational damage can take. To be called weak or incompetent are bad enough, but a person can strengthen and improve. From a well founded accusation of dishonesty, however, there is no return. Whilst Mrs May remains at the head of the Conservative party, many of us will withhold our support – depending on the stance of our local MP. I am planning to talk to mine very soon.

  32. Brian Tomkinson
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:05 am | Permalink

    When are you and your colleagues going to act and remove Mrs May? She has no intention of taking us out of the EU in anything but name only. That has been her aim from day one. She has been deliberately disingenuous, one thing she seems to excel at.
    The furore encouraged by the arch Remainers and Brandon Lewis’s needless early intervention into discussions about Boris Johnson’s Telegraph article makes your party seem utterly shambolic, authoritarian and anti-free speech. I can remember no time when the calibre of MPs seemed so low in all the political parties in Westminster.

  33. Adam
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:06 am | Permalink

    JR could cut & paste his ‘So far so good’ reply to the PM’s letter, with an amendment shown here in capital letters:

    “We will take back control of our money, our laws, and borders, and begin an exciting new chapter in our nation’s history”…”We will leave the EU on 29 March next year” “I remain clear that no deal is better than a bad deal – and we are stepping up our no deal preparation” “The two options on offer from the EU (MAY & HAMMOND) are not acceptable to me, or to the UK”.

  34. A.Sedgwick
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:10 am | Permalink

    In my opinion she has become as big a danger to the future of the UK as Corbyn if he were to become PM, which is very possible. The majority of Conservative MPs appear deluded about her and what democracy is. It is incomprehensible that there are constituencies that voted to Leave but they have staunch Remainer MPs, who blatantly defy the will of the people. Then there is the appalling HoL. As previously written if Corbyn manifested to abolish he would win a clear majority, my vote included.

  35. APL
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:17 am | Permalink

    Theresa May: “We will take back control of our money, ”

    But …… I thought the Tories had ‘saved the pound’?

  36. Steve
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:19 am | Permalink

    No deal, WTO, all european fishing vessels out of our waters, no more BMW or PSA imports. Simple, just do it.

    We don’t need to negotiate anything with the EU, and why should we? Having sacrificed millions of lives liberating them from tyranny only to be treated with contempt shows the northern EU states to be a despicable ungrateful lot.

    Common defence treaty…PAH !

    As far as I’m concerned; never again. The next time some dictator wants to occupy Europe he can have it.

    However, interesting comments on May. I cannot believe the woman is unaware of what people are saying.

    It must be pure arrogance that keeps the liar in office. Any normal person would take heed and do the decent thing.

    I actually think she’s a dangerous (politician ed).

    • fedupsoutherner
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:24 am | Permalink

      Agreed Steve. It is not only the PM that is arrogant and disingenuous. It’s also the whole Tory party and other politicians too. None can be trusted.

      • Timaction
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:57 pm | Permalink

        The majority in the Commons support the EU. The majority of the Tory Party in the Commons support the traitor May. They do not represent the people and are knowingly defying our express instruction to leave the EU!
        Anger will soon change to ugly action and it is the Commons who are responsible.
        Robbins and Mays scheming and lies will never be forgotten or their conspiring with foreigners against the British people!

    • Rien Huizer
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:29 pm | Permalink

      I think you are exaggerating The UK’s role in (I assume) WWII. Germany and its allies were beaten by Russia (with essential American help) and the US. Without the US there would not have been victory. And without Montgomery’s folly (Market Garden) there would not have been a famine in Holland in the winter of 44/45. NW Europe was liberated AFTER the Russians had broken the back of the German (plus allies from Finland to Romania) war effort. UK strategic bombing was largely ineffective militarily. And the UK didnot ose millions in Northwestern Europe ( WWII , 400K dead in all theaters) Even adding WWI, which was not a conflict with a despotic regime of course, just a tragedy, <900K, but a similar number of Imperial troops and lots Irish of course). Reading too many propaganda novels? You may be including Imperial troops in WWI and the war against Japan in the 40s. Furthermore only a small minority of those troops in WWII died in NW Europe. Quite a few in Normandy plus another large contigent in Market garden. But "millions" Nonsense. 150K max.

      • Sir Joe Soap
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:15 pm | Permalink

        That’s ok then. Next time we won’t bother. Neither will the US.

      • Richard1
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:21 pm | Permalink

        It is a silly post above you are responding to.

        However it is clearly the case that significant contributions to the defeat of Hitler included: his inability to conquer the U.K., which enabled the eventual invasion of Europe: the supply of the Soviet Union, without which it would have collapsed; the defeat of the Axis powers in North Africa; the ability (mainly) of the Royal Navy to keep transatlantic supply lines open, without which Hitler would also have triumphed. Other efforts such as market garden can be debated – there were successes as well as failures. But apparent current (EU-inspired?) attempts to cast WW2 as some kind of European civil war in which all were victims, downplaying the essential liberating role of Anglo-American power, is clearly nonsense – and rather dangerous nonsense, as its denial of history.

      • David Price
        Posted August 12, 2018 at 4:31 am | Permalink

        Only 400,000? I’m sure your words will be a comfort to many but doesn’t change the fact that so many people from this country, the Commonwealth and the US were lost standing up to the last bunch that wanted to dominate Europe and liberate so many countries.

        It is notable that the EUphilic attitude you display so well is so negative to the same UK and US yet so positive towards the same attitudes and establishments that wish to dominate the continent.

        PS: you might also have pointed out that Russia was an Axis ally at the start and did not act as a friendly neighbour after the last global conflict but I guess that would spoil your narrative.

      • Dennis Zoff
        Posted August 12, 2018 at 11:21 pm | Permalink

        Rien Huizer

        My word, you really have descended to a new low with your contempt for the British people’s effort in both world war theatres. My uncle died at 18 in Europe fighting the Nazis and you disgrace yourself with your total disrespect for those that died on your country’s behalf.

        Thankfully, most knowledgeable Dutch people, that are not so arrogant as you, do not share your hostility towards us and are generally most grateful to the ordinary British soldiers that sacrificed their lives in a bid to rid the Netherlands of a most despicable tyranny. Deride the Generals if you must, but not the rank and file who gave their lives so generously.

        I suggest you eruditly reacquaint yourself with both the WW1 and WW2, for as it stands, your ignorance is simply breathtaking.

        Incidentally, it is well known the Netherlands is still historically embarrassed and shamed at its swift WW2 capitulation during the German onslaught in May 1940. The defence of the Netherlands lasted just 4 days!

        The Dutch cannot teach the British how to defend its own citizens in times of war. Best you reflect on your appalling comment and apologise to the British people.

    • Reno Fardner
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:47 pm | Permalink

      You really think the UK sacrificed millions of lives? I think that was Russia

  37. majorfrustration
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:26 am | Permalink

    Have you formally replied to the letter pointing the concerns mentioned above?

    Reply I have put in my concerns about the Withdrawal Agreement and Chequers on many occasions. I suggest others in receipt of the letter should reply formally

    • Tad Davison
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:28 pm | Permalink

      Reply to reply:

      For what it’s worth John, I am actively engaged in that process. But as when I lobbied Lib Dem lords at the behest of The Bruges Group, I won’t hold out much hope trying to convince blinkered brainwashed people who cannot tell chalk from cheese how strong your case is.

      Tad

  38. Edwardm
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:41 am | Permalink

    Mrs May has demonstrated she has too many odd ideas and personal failings to be the PM of our nation. Only the oddest of minds could think that the Chequers proposals are a suitable post-Brexit arrangement.

    Unfortunately there has not been a rush of Conservative MPs to demand a leadership election, disregarding future electoral consequences, again very odd.

    From numerous comments one can say that Conservatives and Brexiteers in the country are becoming angry – they are being disregarded and conned – and there is no majority (of true positive Brexiteers) representing them in the HoC. Mrs May and the remainer HoC are making this gulf worse by muddling towards the worst BRINO possible.

  39. BOF
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:49 am | Permalink

    The letter from the PM invites us to reply which I will be doing and I hope many others will.

    I do not think there will be a majority supporting her Chequers Betrayal document but I have no doubt that this will not deter this shamelessly Europhile Prime Minister. She will press on regardless, using support from Labour, Libdem and SNP with little regard to the damage it will cause to the country and ultimately the Conservative Party.

    It is her dishonesty that enrages me more than anything, and it started the day she took office.

    • Tad Davison
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:38 pm | Permalink

      By which time, she had already demonstrated her uselessness. She was a nonsense as Home Secretary, and we are now seeing the consequences of her lack of understanding writ large upon our streets. Every stabbing, moped robbery, assault, mugging, burglary or firearms incident is rightly being laid at her door because we have gone backwards not forwards. A good Home Secretary would have dealt with that, not cut numbers of police.

      This just shows we DO NOT HAVE politicians at Westminster who are wholly in tune with the general public. May is one of the worst.

      Tad

    • Steve
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:29 pm | Permalink

      @BOF

      We will have to wait and see what develops in October. I think May will be at the centre of some major outrage, and will be ousted. Or, she and her cohorts will somehow manipulate the media to focus on something else, and while we’re not watching……the knife is twisted.

      The woman has a track record of sneakiness and deceit at opportune moments i.e. Chequers; ‘Just got to pop in here (Merkel’s) on my way to Chequers’
      and; ‘Oh while I’m on holiday I’ll nip across and see Macron’

      Next thing you know she’ll have a holiday in Portugal, ‘coincidentally’ at the same time as a Bilderberg gathering.

      Too damn sneaky for my liking and up to no good.

      Considering this woman has left a stink in every office she has held, I find it truly staggering that she was even allowed a shot at No 10.

  40. Mark B
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:53 am | Permalink

    Good morning

    In other words, EU-LITE.

  41. Qubus
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:56 am | Permalink

    I glanced at my Daily Telegraph this moment and I had to ask myself,what sort of country am I living in? We are in the middle of a disastrously-negotiated Brexit and our PM is supposed to be arranging a censure of Boris. Has the woman finally completely lost the plot? Is she really so unsure of her position? Boris is the only Conservative politician with any charisma. Mrs May has zero win apparently no common sense either. In the name of god woman, go.

  42. BOF
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:57 am | Permalink

    As things stand, I am certain there will soon be a move to depose our despotic PM. MP’s will have no option unless they are prepared to roll over and allow this capitulation to the EU. Should there be any control remaining, The EU will use it to cause us economic damage and further degrade our democracy and legal system.

  43. Andy
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:08 am | Permalink

    Chequers is Brexit. It is what you voted for. It is not the fault of anyone who voted Remain that it is so ridiculously naff.

    We told you it would be. We told you any Brexit would be inferior to what we had. We told you it was really rather dumb.

    But you knew best. (Only it turns out you didn’t). Chortle.

    The angry pensioners are getting angrier. It’s fun to watch. Carry on – we’re amused.

    • Cook
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:14 pm | Permalink

      I’m sure we are all glad you are on the Remoaner side. If we did have kitchen leftovers we can carry it ourselves to the compost heap.

    • libertarian
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:51 pm | Permalink

      Andy go back and read your last post on this thread. Then be ashamed of yourself

      • hans christian ivers
        Posted August 12, 2018 at 7:58 am | Permalink

        Libertarian

        Unnecessary

        • David Price
          Posted August 12, 2018 at 9:02 am | Permalink

          Hans, you really should seek counseling at the earliest opportunity otherwise this unhealthy obsession you have with stalking Libby and NickC will get the better of you.

          • hans christian ivers
            Posted August 14, 2018 at 10:01 am | Permalink

            I believe it is mutual

    • graham1946
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 2:08 pm | Permalink

      The negotiations are being done by Remainers, that’s why it’s a mess. You cannot deny that. If you’d accepted the democratic decision instead of undermining your own country we would not be in this mess, but you of course are a ‘European’ not British. Are you speaking to your Mum yet, or is he still subject to your childish reaction?

      • Andy
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:09 pm | Permalink

        David Davis. Liam Fox. Boris Johnson. Steve Baker. Suella Braverman. David Jones. Dominic Raab. Over the last two years these have been the people tasked with coming up with a sensible Brexit plan. They are all vehement quittlings.

        Mrs May wanted them to come up with a sensible plan. She begged them to. She gave them two years to do it. Now I apprecaite that even by Brexiteers standards that bunch are staggeringly incompetent. But they came up with nothing.

        Brexit is failing because it is a lousy incoherent idea pursued mainly by economically illiterate, politically ineffectual, ideologues. But if it makes you sleep better you blame Mrs May. When the inquiry is done and the perpetrators are brought to justice it will not be Mrs May who’ll be locked up.

      • Jagman84
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 8:08 pm | Permalink

        He comes over an a more immature version of Owen Jones, if that is humanly possible. It is not too late for him to move to another EU nation, before next March. However, I doubt that he will, as I believe that ‘facts’ are incidental to his rants and he simply enjoys abusing others, albeit with some degree of anonymity.

    • Den
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 3:28 pm | Permalink

      And you would pref to be ruled by the Unelected and unaccountable cabal in Brussel? Why? They are are a dying Dystopia.

    • Anonymous
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:02 pm | Permalink

      Andy

      I’m not a pensioner.

      I’m not getting angrier.

      We have archives of proof (from you) that foul political language predates the Boris furore.

  44. Roy Grainger
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:09 am | Permalink

    Isn’t the simplest explantation that May hasn’t been misled by anyone ? Well, I know you have to pretend you support her personally until you can be sure of winning a confidence vote against her, but it does begin to grate a bit, all this elaborate respect you and JRM express for her personally when she is demonstrably a liar.

  45. MickN
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:12 am | Permalink

    This is relevant so please bear with me. I was in London on the day of the Countryside March . Watching the coverage when I returned home a BBC reporter said “Lets talk to this lady here on the March”. Now that march was against a hunting ban. I doubt I could have found one in 10,000 there that were in favour of the ban. Hey Ho! the BBC reporter found this one in 10,000 that was marching but was against hunting. Obviously a complete set up to try and slant the public’s view of the reasons we were there.
    I remember a while back Ken Clarke was “secretly recorded” in conversation with I can’t remember who saying effectively what a strong and bloody minded woman Mrs May is. I remember thinking at the time that this had the same smell of set up about it. Did I say smell? I mean stink !! When can we be rid of this awful woman and be led by a conservative again?

  46. Prigger
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:12 am | Permalink

    A fait accompli. We all expected it.

    Mrs May will expect and allow through her Remoaner MPs and others in marginals, adjustments that camouflage for non-politicos that WE WILL STAY in the EU.

    The Fake News will bolster her Centre positioning as ” The best possible negotiable deal”
    and everyone else as risking No Deal.

    MRS MAY’S GAMBLE That Brexiteers will not scuttle her remoaner ship and fearfully send the country to Election.

    When the options are complete defeat… then by all means ….ram the U-Boat!!!!!

  47. MickN
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:14 am | Permalink

    I see Boris is to be offered “diversity training”
    Patronising b*st*rds !!
    I sincerely hope he tell them where they can shove it !

    • hans christian ivers
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:15 pm | Permalink

      or them him, please

    • Lifelogic
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:52 pm | Permalink

      Perhaps he just go and then write a funny article and on the lunacy of a “diversity” course. Where do they get these “diversity” experts from to run these courses?

      I would never dream of taking any job where I might have to go on such a pathetic indoctrination course! Almost as insulting as forcing new undergraduates to attend sexual consent courses! If they cannot work that out they should not be at university at all!

      • Alan Jutson
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:41 pm | Permalink

        Lifelogic

        The diversity experts should perhaps need to go on a course for common-sense, before they start lecturing others.

  48. mancunius
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:38 am | Permalink

    John – you know very well what you have to do.

    Do it!

  49. Prigger
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:41 am | Permalink

    I do hope Brexiteers consider seriously

    1/ Triggering a leadership election ( which may trigger a General Election. and may not )

    2/ A new Party

    3/ Getting Farage to be a major member and Boris, Rees-Mogg, JR, and other famous names. ( yes I guess it will be a each-on-each squabbling few. ). But needs must.

    4/ There are Brexiteer MPs who have fought all their political lives against the EU. Surely to a number of them they would not wish to continue being MPs anyway in EUland to the end of their lives despite their historic loyalty to the Conservative Party NAME?

    5/ Boris and Farage, in voters eyes, whatever their merits or no, are the best chance in voters eyes for success. Each would take Tory and importantly Labour voters with them.

    6/ Do make a deal with the persons mentioned. Our Country is at stake.
    The in-fighting can take place afterwards as is the bread and butter of politics.
    29th March 2019 cannot be lost.

  50. IwasGnarth
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:07 am | Permalink

    I wonder if Mrs May genuinely believes the angry, articulate comments on these websites are just the ranting of Conservative Party members plus their assorted hangers on. Perhaps she is advised that the general plebs, preoccupied with their own miniscule issues, will humbly do as they are told and believe what is shown to them. They always have before, haven’t they? Once more I am reminded of Browning’s Burghers of Hamelin.

    • graham1946
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 2:14 pm | Permalink

      She probably doesn’t see it. I expect her newspapers are just cuttings her hangers on want her to see. Otherwise she is totally thick.

  51. Dauber
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:09 am | Permalink

    Hammond looks cheery these last couple of days on TV.
    That must be a sign we are being pushed to Dunkirk if ever there was one!
    Statues don’t smile!

  52. Anonymous
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:21 am | Permalink

    As usual Theresa May is out of touch with public opinion.

  53. Tad Davison
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:21 am | Permalink

    It surprises me that you sound surprised. Most of us saw it coming and have continually warmed about it. Perhaps you needed to give May enough rope to hang herself?

    How do we get across the message that May is a worthless EU sop, and the longer she stays in post, the wise it gets?

    I can’t wait to listen to Nigel Farage’s show on LBC tomorrow morning!

    Tad Davison

    Cambridge

    • Tad Davison
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:26 am | Permalink

      Worse not wise* (that’ll teach me not to post using a mobile phone)

  54. bigneil
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:30 am | Permalink

    ” a new version of freedom of movement. ” – -Either we have Freedom of Movement – which we all know means a complete tsunami of 3rd worlders wanting totally free lives on the taxpayer, while flooding and destroying the country and the NHS. . . .Or we don’t have it. We cannot have “A new version”.

  55. Oggy
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:32 am | Permalink

    What can I/we say further that we haven’t said already many times about this deceitful, duplicitous PM.
    She has made it abundantly clear she has NO intention of getting us out of the EU.

    IF the Tory party wants to stay in existence then the choice for Tory MP’s is simple, get rid of May and get us out of the EU or we will get rid of the Tory party.

  56. Major Minus
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:36 am | Permalink

    Mrs May is not a traitor to the EU

  57. Journo
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:44 am | Permalink

    It appears the PM has been misled by her advisers…” who we take it are a throb journalists from The Guardian

    • Anonymous
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:07 pm | Permalink

      A niche magazine that one. Poor sales but one to be seen with in public in these heavily censored times.

  58. Horatio McSherry
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:47 am | Permalink

    I have yet to hear an interviewer call Mrs. May on her slight of hand with regards to leaving the EU. She’s very good at boldly stating we will leave the EUon 29th March, but never gets pushed on what happens after that. I believe her when she says we will leave on that date, but I also believe she’s trying to sign us up to the status quo immediately after.

  59. hans christian ivers
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:02 am | Permalink

    JR,

    The WTO option is not a real and sustainable option, which I have tried to explain many times, just lately earlier in the week.

    • libertarian
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:54 pm | Permalink

      hans

      Just because its what you think doesn’t make it real

      Currently the head of the WTO thinks its workable, 98% of trade globally is conducted via WTO, 60% of UK exports are done under WTO and the EU’s biggest single customer the USA is traded with under WTO

      Of course its real and sustainable its how most trade is conducted

      • hans christian ivers
        Posted August 12, 2018 at 8:02 am | Permalink

        Libertarian,

        If, 44% of UK goods exports ae done with the EU, how can it be 60% done under WTO?

        There are many separate agreements between the EU and the US in addition to the WTO framework.

        Merkel is on vacation and seems to be doing just fine

    • mancunius
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:21 pm | Permalink

      Of course it is – not merely an option, but *the* only current viable option.

  60. Denis Cooper
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:03 am | Permalink

    “She needs to press on with the WTO option”

    But she and her pro-EU allies have been allowed to prove beyond reasonable doubt that the WTO option is no option at all because it would be an “utter catastrophe” for the UK, as the expert Lewis Goodall of the Sky Campaign Against Brexit put it on Sunday:

    http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2018/08/05/how-more-eu-damages-political-parties/#comment-952585

    The gross, one-off, economic benefit we have ever got from membership of the EU and its Single Market seems to be about 1% to 2% of our GDP, and the costs have so far exceeded the gross benefits that the net effects have almost certainly been negative, but in any case these marginal factors have to be viewed in the perspective of the long term trend rate of natural growth of the UK economy being 2.5% a year; but these facts are all deemed to be irrelevant, the claim is that unless we can somehow maintain the “exact same benefits” as now the result will be catastrophe for us, but not of course for them.

    However I once again caution against presenting a “no deal” scenario as meaning no deal on anything at all, rather than just no special or preferential trade deal:

    http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2018/08/07/spending-the-39-bn-cutting-vat/#comment-953091

    “Why the no-deal Brexit scaremongering is wildly overblown”

    “Hysterical scaremongering about no deal assumes that talks about everything break down — a bitter dispute, with the EU refusing to agree anything about trade or governmental co-operation. Administrative arrangements won’t work because they refer to EU institutions and we won’t be members. Planes will be grounded, medicines won’t get licensed, nuclear waste piles up wherever it happens to be when we leave.

    Michel Barnier has begun to encourage this apocalyptic view in an attempt to scare Britain into the total capitulation he sees almost within reach. May too has worked hard on discrediting no deal to leave her version of Brexit as the only viable option.”

  61. Raymond
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:06 am | Permalink

    I agree with with JR’s Reply.

  62. Geoffrey Berg
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:24 am | Permalink

    It is no good trying to persuade Theresa May to change her spots. The Conservative Party, and more important the country, needs a different Prime Minister now, a competent Prime Minister who really believes in a fully sovereign Britain. My preference would actually be for John Redwood but I’d settle for Boris Johnson.

    • Tad Davison
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:55 pm | Permalink

      I’d settle for either, and Jacob Rees-Mogg too, but alas the latter two would take one hell of a lot of persuading, even if convinced beyond all reasonable doubt that it was in the national interest, as in, Winston Churchill in 1940.

      We need zip, zeal, and dynamism. But we also need someone in whom we can have absolute faith and trust. That is a rare commodity in a Westminster politician.

      Tad

    • Arthur Wrightiss
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 2:31 pm | Permalink

      If Boris becomes PM Dominic Grieve has said he will immediately leave the Conservative Party …… what a shocking loss to the democratic process that will be.
      At least 17.4 million voters will be so sad……

      • Andy
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:15 pm | Permalink

        Mr Grieve is my MP. Despite the fact that he’s a Conservative I really rather like him. He has behaved impeccably throughout. Though I was disappointed that he voted to trigger A50 when the majority of his constituents voted Remain.

  63. whatsinaname
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:29 am | Permalink

    The PM in her chequers paper talks about a partnership which implies an equal partnership with them but this is only further delusion on our part which is not helping the matter. There is no way the EU side is collectively going to give Barnier instruction to proceed along these lines- so because we are leaving 29 march we are therefore looking for a new deal with them not as equals but as a third party- remember there will be no cherry picking allowed ..they have said it over and over

    What a preposterous thing to say that the PM was misled by her advisers..no she wasn’t misled.. she was right there alongside them all the way and fully in tune with what is going on. I fear you are the one who is being misled or else being mischievous in all of this to save her blushes and now as a part of operation ‘damage limitation control’ already starting to operate..anything now to save the party and save your seats and save your necks

  64. stred
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:31 am | Permalink

    Having looked up the psychology of lying, Mrs Mays ability to say one thing while writing something entirely different is pathological rather than compulsive. Pathological lying is done to achieve desired aims in the belief that these are essential. If a person believes in something strongly and thinks they have been able to get away with it in the past, then they will continue to tell bigger lies. Some politicians believe that the bigger the lie, the more likely it is to be accepted. They usually come to an unpleasant end, but this may take some time.

    • Tad Davison
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:57 pm | Permalink

      Excellent! That needed to be said!

      Tad

    • Alan Jutson
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:49 pm | Permalink

      Stred

      A compulsive liar, actually believe in their own lies after a while, and simply do not recognise them as such.

      They are actually deluding themselves, but they are happy with that arrangement.

      The problem for us out here is that rather too many politicians of late seem to have this trait in order to try to gain themselves a position of power, and also to retain it, thus they put themselves and their position above anything else.

      I exclude our host from the above comment.

  65. Anna K.
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:57 am | Permalink

    It beggars belief that a Prime Minister of this country should undermine the ministers she herself appointed to plan our exit from the EU by conducting her own secret and alternative plan which appears to amount to total surrender. How can anyone trust her again? She is duplicitous, arrogant, disloyal and incompetent. How can any Conservative MP with a grain of self-respect support this treacherous woman?

    • graham1946
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 2:21 pm | Permalink

      The manager who has no confidence in her appointees has no confidence in herself.

      Micro managing is the sign of poor management.

  66. Trevor Butler
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:58 am | Permalink

    Dear Dr. Redwood
    I have a very high regard for you so please do not take this personally.
    My wife and I were born in the UK but grew up in Africa only coming to the UK to live in 2006 – We are natural conservative voters having experienced the ‘glories’ of socialism at first hand.
    We moved to the Wokingham constituency in 2008 and resided there until 2014 when we were offered an opportunity to move to Hong Kong – We are still registered to vote in Wokingham as is our legal right.
    We have voted Conservative at every opportunity including the last election.
    Mrs May has gone too far…Today we paid our £30 each and joined UKIP….To say we are outraged at her duplicity is an understatement…The future she is trying to commit our children and grandchildren (who still live in the UK) to is horrendous….Who is she trying to please? the CBI? She is certainly not pleasing the voters but then she probably does not read the article comments in some of the dailies – As an aside maybe she should put less effort into persecuting Boris and maybe focus some attention on the erosion of democracy in Hong Kong which is sliding into a one party state very fast…..

  67. Rien Huizer
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:04 pm | Permalink

    Mr Redwood,

    You are right as far as I can see (not having seen the letter you are replying to). It would have been useful to not only list your objections to the proposal from a “brexit” point of view (they are well known and could have been expressed in a simple sentence, rather than reapeating the same rhetoric everyone has heard before.

    Instead of elaborating on the implications of the features of the withdrawal agreement that represent more or less the maximum the EU can offer (for both practical and political reasons) you might have mentioned that this exercise is pointless because it cannot be accepted by the EU and hence, barring some change in the EU’s framework for these negotiations (imo impossible and undesirable for most member states) there is no basis for continued negotiations.

    That implies a no deal of course and should satisfy (though not cheer up) the EU side, since this is a result implied by all of the exchanges since roughly, december 2017 and already envisaged as the likely outcome by a.o., The Netherlands (incidentally home to the UK’s most important port for goods arriving from Asia,) which is preparing its business community and government services for a “no deal” and all of that can be seen on government website. Netherlands is not negotiating, just being practical.

    • mancunius
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:28 pm | Permalink

      The Netherlands has no power to negotiate anything: it has granted that power to the Brussels Commission.

      • Rien Huizer
        Posted August 14, 2018 at 1:10 am | Permalink

        Did I say TN was negotiating? Preparing -as well as intra EU activity.

  68. Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:32 pm | Permalink

    For so long I was hoping that Mrs M was ”playing the long game”.
    What arrogance there must be to know that people are looking to you to stand up for them and the country, to have the power to do such good – and yet to come to the point of showing these people that you hold them and their aspirations for our country in contempt.
    She has shown nothing but scorn and disdain for the majority of the British people – and she MUST know with what low regard she is now held.

    Yet she could have had so much going for her – I wonder if she is so arrogant she really doesn’t care that most of us know she’s letting us down?

  69. iain
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 12:34 pm | Permalink

    When the 39 billion figure ( which was not required under EU rules) was first aired early in the negotiations it was obvious then that we would always be on the back foot. The negotiations have been a shambles culminating in David Davis walking away. I cannot see a good deal for the UK ever coming to pass. We MUST now leave with no deal and if Mrs May has to be removed to achieve it then so be it.

  70. hefner
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:15 pm | Permalink

    A very interesting paper by Matthew Goodwin on quillette.com dated 08/08/2018 “Britain’s Populist Revolt”, and another interesting take on the Brexit vote in chapter 4 of “WTF” by Robert Peston discussing how a “physics-based approach” by Dom Cummings did it for Vote.Leave despite the rather tepid ideas of the involved politicians.

  71. John Dodds
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 1:53 pm | Permalink

    There seems to be little point in criticizing our lying Prime Minister on this site as neither the writer nor his so called “Brexiteer” compatriots have the guts to take corrective action.

  72. Den
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 2:05 pm | Permalink

    “It appears the PM has been misled by her advisers” -to put it diplomatically.

    John, should your opinions and the similar opinions of your fellow Back Benchers now be forcefully placed in the hands of Mrs May by Graham Brady Chairman of the 1922 Committee for her immediate consideration?
    Or has that approach already been made?

    Sadly, Mrs May has made herself as unpopular as D Cameron, another Europhile who did the right thing by resigning from office.
    I cannot make up my mind whether Mrs May is simply not competent or that she really is a Remainer at heart.
    I am bewildered as to why ANY British citizen would prefer to be ruled by an Unelected and Unaccountable, undemocratic Oligarchy based in a Foreign Land, rather than by their own Elected MPs, who are responsible to the Electorate in OUR democratic Country.

    Reply Many Conservative MPs who disagree strongly with Chequers have used all known routes to get the message through and will continue to do so.

    • Den
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 3:38 pm | Permalink

      Glad to hear it. And please persuade more to join you – your country needs you.

    • Alan Jutson
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:56 pm | Permalink

      Reply – Reply

      John, that was not a reply I wanted to hear, as it suggests there are not enough Conservative Mp’s at the moment, with enough influence to change the present disastrous course on which we are heading.

      Can only ask all those who are trying, to keep up as much pressure as possible, no matter how frustrating it must be for you and your like minded colleagues.

      Our Countries future is at stake here as well as our so called Democracy.

      • fedupsoutherner
        Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:56 pm | Permalink

        @Alan

        Our Countries future is at stake here as well as our so called Democracy.

        Democracy? We dictate to other countries about their lack of democracy but do we really know what it is here? We were the founders of democracy and May and co have decimated it completely.

        • Mitchel
          Posted August 13, 2018 at 10:29 am | Permalink

          The Greeks might challenge you on that!

          • Dennis Zoff
            Posted August 13, 2018 at 11:25 pm | Permalink

            Mitchell

            Fedupsoutherner is referring to modern democracy, I would surmise?

    • Chris
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 10:51 pm | Permalink

      There are apparently not nearly enough. This makes a mockery of earlier claims that the Tory Party was eurosceptic. I am sure you are disappointed with some of your colleagues and your Party, but it seems that is as far as it goes. What a tragedy for this country.

  73. majorfrustration
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 3:26 pm | Permalink

    We have a rubbish PM and what appears to be a rubbish band of Conservative MPs who do not appear to have the guts to do anything about it notwithstanding the feelings of the voters/Country. When the history of this period is written stand by for all the Tory MPs to hide behind the “not me Guv” or ” I was on holiday” but of course they all “made it clear”

  74. Stephen Reay
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 3:45 pm | Permalink

    It’s quite simple, we need a leadership challenge now , but we need someone with balls of steel to get on with it.

  75. VotedOut
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:05 pm | Permalink

    The people we are dealing with in the EU are not going to follow international law. Why would they? It takes years and years to settle international disputes all the while the UK will be suffering.

    This is going to be a bar fight and we need someone who is going to be able to swing punches for the UK.

    We need someone who can communicate a clear vision of the opportunities Brexit provides and can hold together the nation through what will be a very bumpy ride. Someone to say that £40billion and more will be spent on OUR people to cushion them from the EU’s semi-religious power grab.

    Who could that person be?

  76. Dennis
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:12 pm | Permalink

    I have just discovered that in the US government past and present there are many in high positions which have dual citizenship so having allegiance to two countries. Most if not all are ISRAELIS!!! Richard Perle, Kissinger, Paul Wolfowitz, John Bolton etc., etc.

    Now how many in the UK government, civil servants, advisors etc. have such a status – do any have a citizenship of any of the EU 27?

    I think we should be told.

  77. Brian Tomkinson
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:12 pm | Permalink

    I’m sure you will agree that the message strongly coming through here from your readers is that Mrs May must go. Don’t leave it until it is too late.

  78. Chris
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:24 pm | Permalink

    Why this charade, Mr Redwood, about Mrs May being misled by her advisors? That is nonsense, and to expect your readers to swallow that demonstrates a contempt for them, in my view. When will politicians learn that we are not unintelligent beings who lack common sense, and who will believe anything? Please, Mr Redwood, we deserve much better from you.

  79. Posted August 11, 2018 at 4:29 pm | Permalink

    I am sorry Mr Redwood, I do not agree that TMs` Chequers Agreement is acceptable is any form. Furthermore I do NOT trust this PM your party has lumbered the country with. She has a reputation for being a deliberate , recidivist liar. I used to be a Tory voter, but I promise you, never again.

    • Ken Moore
      Posted August 11, 2018 at 11:50 pm | Permalink

      Will the Conservatives never learn…they lose when they move to the left.
      Brexit is a total mess, there is a trade war between the US and China, NHS services are on there knees, so what does the Maybot obsess over?. Boris accurately describing an oppressive medieval women’s dress as a letterbox.
      Changing this hopeless ‘leader’ cannot make this situation any worse please get on with it!’

  80. Alan Rogers
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

    I too have thought that the WTO option was our best bet, but Ambrose Evans-Pritchard in the Telegraph makes the point that the Government has done very little to prepare for this, and the EU will almost certainly ignore WTO rules anyway. We could be in for a bumpy ride.

    • Denis Cooper
      Posted August 12, 2018 at 10:47 am | Permalink

      If the EU did ignore WTO rules Theresa May would make excuses for them.

  81. Chris
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 6:11 pm | Permalink

    This comment about Theresa May on The Conservative Woman website should be compulsory reading for all Tory MPs, but in particular those wanting to effect Brexit, thereby upholding democracy, and to save this country:
    https://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/readers-comment-this-woeful-woman/
    “I am having a problem understanding which country Theresa is actually working for – it certainly is not the UK….”

  82. fedupsoutherner
    Posted August 11, 2018 at 9:58 pm | Permalink

    Well, well. Anyone reading these comments would think we were fed up with May and the Tory party!!! They would be right.

  83. Posted August 12, 2018 at 10:11 am | Permalink

    I’ve not received this letter, probably as I’ve only recently joined the party.
    Where can I get hold of a copy please?

    • Ken Moore
      Posted August 12, 2018 at 9:52 pm | Permalink

      These Conservative people are looking more and more like the modern equivalent of Nero……

  • About John Redwood


    John Redwood won a free place at Kent College, Canterbury, He graduated from Magdalen College Oxford, has a DPhil and is a fellow of All Souls College. A businessman by background, he has been a director of NM Rothschild merchant bank and chairman of a quoted industrial PLC.

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