How should the UK change its foreign policy once out of the EU?

Once we are out of the EU the UK regains its vote and voice in world bodies. The UK is ready to take a global perspective and will be able to pursue our national interests and our global values more successfully once we no longer have to broker an agreed line with 27 other EU states.

Some fear the UK will be isolated or is in some way too small to survive in the turbulent waters of world diplomacy once independent. This is an absurd notion. The UK will proceed with shifting coalitions of interests issue by issue, based on long term alliances and community of interests with various friendly countries. The US/Canada/New Zealand/UK/Australia Intelligence  group will remain important to our intelligence and security. NATO will continue to be our central defence alliance. In the WTO we will emerge as one of the leaders of the free trade group pushing for fewer barriers and lower tariffs worldwide. We can form our own view on environmental issues and form alliances as needed. There will be times when we do wish to make a common front with France and Germany as we do today.

One of the dangers of being in the EU is the way the UK is drawn into rows and conflicts in Eastern Europe where EU intervention may not be helpful and where UK interests may diverge from apparent EU interests. The UK increasingly has split loyalties with the divergence in approach to the Middle East and elsewhere between the USA and the EU. Where these two fall out the UK needs to be able to make its own judgement about which side to belong to, or to offer a third way which could reconstruct a wider alliance between the democracies on the two sides of the Atlantic. The EU has not been helpful to the UK over Gibraltar, and has also been negative over aspects of the Channel islands independence.

The pull of the world is towards the east with the rise of China and India. The UK will need to look increasingly to Asia for growth in trade. Japan is keen to encourage stronger links with the UK, two island nations that value their independence, both offshore from large power blocs. The USA is increasingly pulled towards China as it seeks to manage a complex relationship with an emerging super power. The UK needs its independence and flexibility to handle its own interests as this development advances. The UK is rightly seen as a crucial financial marketplace and services innovator. China wishes to develop more joint working in these areas, where EU regulation and approaches might impede progress.

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245 Comments

  1. Mark B
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:41 am | Permalink

    Good morning.

    The UK is very well placed in the world. In terms of our diplomacy I think we will be OK. We were OK before the creation of the then EEC, and will be OK long after the EU has descended into obscurity.

    Our kind host is right to point to the future direction of where trade is going – The Far East ! Here we must not forget that we have strong links in this part of the world and not just with Japan. The Antipodes, our former colonies such as Malaya and Singapore are all countries that we can build strong relations based on our past.

    The UK, as intimated by Sir Winston Churchill, should always look to the sea and the distant horizon, for it is there that we are happiest and our nations future prosperity lay.

    • RAF
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:15 am | Permalink

      …long after the EU has descended into obscurity.

      Mark B, the EU, along with Nazi Germany and the USSR, must never be allowed to fall into obscurity. It must be held up as another failed 20th century European example of how not to politically, socially, culturally and industrially conquer disparate countries and people. The EU must be remembered always as a mistake of monumental proportions. The very idea of the EU has to be declared a pariah such that no group will ever again try to emulate its gross endgame i.e. the eventual enslavement of the people of Europe via similar methods to those contained in the ‘deal’ they presented to ex-PM Theresa May to foist on the British people.

      • Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:50 pm | Permalink

        Powerfully put, RAF – and spot on.

      • John Hatfield
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:20 pm | Permalink

        Well said RAF.

      • Pominoz
        Posted July 28, 2019 at 1:04 am | Permalink

        RAF,

        Very much agree with all you say.

      • Fed up with the bull
        Posted July 28, 2019 at 7:21 am | Permalink

        RAF You speak for many of us.

    • James1
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:27 am | Permalink

      Early days, but could it be the case that at long last we have a government that is doing and saying the right and sensible things. Almost too much to hope, but their early announcements look promising.

      • Doug Powell
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:40 pm | Permalink

        As you say, ‘early days’ and it could end in tears. But it is refreshing to have a PM who is seeking to LEAD people with optimism and vision, as opposed to ‘She who must be obeyed’ who sought to CORRAL people into accepting her ideas! Three long wasted years! How ever did such a person rise above selling jumble for the Tory Party?
        Yet, she will doubtless be granted some hugely undeserved honour and end up on the red benches of the palatial retirement home – all expenses paid!

      • Lindsay McDougall
        Posted July 28, 2019 at 11:05 am | Permalink

        I would be happier if the new PM said that he preferred ‘No Deal’ to any Withdrawal Agreement. The WHOLE of Mrs May’s draft WA should be thrown in the bin.

    • Hope
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:39 am | Permalink

      If Johnson is not going to call an election does your previous manifesto stand? At the moment he is being selective which parts matter. Is he going to announce policy on who or what minority group shouts loudest?

      Where is the mandate for zero carbon emissions, forgetting immigration targets and amnesty for record high illegal immigration hundreds of thousands lost to Mayhab and Rudds system?

      All of these matter to foreign policy. Where is our energy coming from to help manufacturing and business? How will ultra expensive energy help the poor or just managing in the country? How many jobs will be lost through expensive energy? China, India and Brazil are not stopping coal fired power stations. Trade and business area all part of influencing foreign policy.

      Is Johnson going to scrap overseas aid or at least cut it drastically to pay for public services he wants to build at home rather than more tax rises and borrowing? Tax still at fifty year high under your Tory govt, much higher than two previous Labour govts! Despite Osborne telling otherwise in two general elections. The chief secretary to Treasury already building himself problems by claiming debt to GDP will continue to fall. This was never the promise made by Tories. We were to,d balanced structural deficit by 2015 and then to cut debt, not as a percentage of GDP. Growth is occurring through mass immigration which we were told would be cut. Stinks of dishonesty through these fake claims and policies.

      • steve
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:46 pm | Permalink

        Hope

        For heaven’s sake give the man a chance, he’s only been in the job a few days.

        • Hope
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 6:56 am | Permalink

          The Tories have been in power nine years! Johnson was part of it. He announces major policies and should be held to account. Democracy.

          • steve
            Posted July 28, 2019 at 2:37 pm | Permalink

            Hope

            Perhaps you think you could do a better job than Boris ? and that you’d have the courage to try.

            The pressure of Boris’s job is absolutely immense right now.

            The decent thing to do is support him and show some respect.

    • barrz
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:50 am | Permalink

      Mark B, Don’t think so – you guys can hardly bear to look across the channel never mind distant horizons – it’s called xenophobia – dislike or distrust of foreigners – don’t know how this happened or if it was always there – could be you just didn’t notice in that time of Empire when you were at the top table – so anyway think you’ll find the world has changed a lot since the 1800’s

      • Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:54 pm | Permalink

        We’re not all born and raised in the UK, we of the ‘leave’ camp, and to label us all as xenophobes is outrageous. I’m sure that other commenters here who are, or who have family members who are, from other parts of the world will be equally insulted by your bigoted remarks.
        Disgusting.

      • DaveM
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:11 pm | Permalink

        That sums up the misunderstanding perfectly. Most of us are incredibly internationalist and outward looking. The main objection is to self-imposed supranational government. I for one don’t want that for any country in the world.

      • NickC
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:02 pm | Permalink

        Barrz, How could the UK have had a world wide empire if we “can hardly bear to look across the channel never mind distant horizons”. Surely the fact that you feel you have to tell us what we think demonstrates that you can hardly bear to look across the channel?

      • Edward2
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:20 pm | Permalink

        Very silly comment Barrz.
        It is quite the opposite.
        We want to open our eyes to the rest of the world.
        Having spent decades focussing just on Europe.
        Playing the racist card is just a ridiculous indult on millions of people.

      • mancunius
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:54 pm | Permalink

        barrz, you stand in dire need of some lessons in trolling. Yours is of the crudest and most primitive kind, and deserves nothing more than a pitying smile.

      • steve
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:01 pm | Permalink

        barrz

        “…it’s called xenophobia – dislike or distrust of foreigners”

        Could you be specific on that one ? and without hypocrisy.

        Note that there never will be a law which prevents us from disliking anyone or anything we choose to. Despite best attempts by socialist Europhiles to make disliking illegal, everyone has their likes and dislikes and will continue to exercise that freedom. It’s called democracy.

      • Fed up with the bull
        Posted July 28, 2019 at 7:25 am | Permalink

        Barrz What a stupid comment. I find it very insulting. My son in law is 25% Pakistani and my son is engaged to a girl whose father is Italian. I am certainly not racist. They are both lovely people. I lived in Spain for nearly 5 years where I embraced the culture while there and have friends from many countries in the world. Get over yourself.

    • Pominoz
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:01 am | Permalink

      Mark B,

      I can absolutely guarantee that, here in Oz, they are raring to go. Enjoy all that top quality Aussie wine and beef at great prices.

    • Karlo
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 12:30 pm | Permalink

      Typical Brexiter. Living in the past. You think our former colonies are bothered about a UK which has cut itself loose from the most powerful trading bloc in the world? Utter delusion. Japan? Japan has just concluded a free trade deal with the EU. It has explicitly refused to give the UK the same terms after Brexit, because it knows it can wring a better deal out of the UK once it is not in the EU. Better for Japan, that is, not better for the UK. Korea and Canada, the same – the UK is horribly vulnerable and everyone knows it (even Liam Fox got that in the end)

      • Jiminyjim
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:10 pm | Permalink

        Please do try to be, even slightly, positive. It’s depressing people that have made the last three years do tiresome.

      • Denis Cooper
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:10 pm | Permalink

        Typical Remoaner rubbish. This is from February:

        http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2019/02/01/working-throughout-february/#comment-992756

        “But of course unless Liam Fox can get the Japanese to agree to continue with a similar deal just with the UK then we will not be celebrating with popping of champagne corks, we will be crying into our beer for having foolishly deprived ourselves of the benefits of this trade deal, which may boost EU exports to Japan by €13 billion a year:

        http://trade.ec.europa.eu/doclib/docs/2017/july/tradoc_155723.pdf

        Which €13 billion a year addition to exports would correspond to less than 0.1% of the collective GDP of the EU member states:

        https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/figures/economy_en

        “EU GDP in 2017: €15.3 trillion”

        Plus that does not take into account the countervailing effect of increased imports from Japan potentially replacing EU products in the EU market.”

      • Edward2
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:22 pm | Permalink

        Yes they are bothered.
        If they see an opportunity to improve their trade relationship with the UK then they will move towards that end.
        Negotiations are still to conclude with Japan Canada South Korea and others, so currently all you are hearing is quotes from both sides.

        Although trade goes on with or without formal trade deals.
        You say Japan has just concluded a trade deal with the EU.
        Notice any shortages of Japanese goods in Europe or the UK in the last 40 years?

      • Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:59 pm | Permalink

        It’s been pointed out before that the more hysterical the frothings and foamings of remoaners become, the more obvious it is that the UK is right to be unshackling itself from the EU’s poisonous tentacles.

        If you lot have been so propagandized that you can’t see the wood for the trees, or even develop a measured argument, then it’s a good job we shall soon be free of the evil influence.

      • Richard1
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:02 pm | Permalink

        I thought Japan had invited the UK to join TPP, a more extensive FTA than the EU-japan deal

      • APL
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:35 pm | Permalink

        Karlo ” the most powerful trading bloc in the world?”

        That would be the United Federal States of America.

        We the UK is actively engaged with the USA.

      • steve
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:31 pm | Permalink

        Karlo

        “the UK is horribly vulnerable and everyone knows it”

        So ?

        Where’s your sense of British dogged determination to overcome despite all odds ? Or perhaps the prospects of sacrifice and doing hard graft for our country are what frightens you. Typical remainer attitude.

        Most of us know what hardship and hard graft are. We’ve done it before and we’ll do it again.

        We’re unique, we’re British, we’re Churchill’s Island Race, and we’re like no other nation when we look to the seas.

        Believe in yourself and your country.

    • margaret howard
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:06 pm | Permalink

      Edward2

      “Here we must not forget that we have strong links in this part of the world and not just with Japan. The Antipodes, our former colonies such as Malaya and Singapore are all countries that we can build strong relations based on our past”

      They might not share your optimism:

      https://www.telegraph.co.uk/history/9653497/British-have-invaded-nine-out-of-ten-countries-so-look-out-Luxembourg.html

      • Edward2
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:39 pm | Permalink

        What a strange post margaret.
        You have a quote there and I never said those words.
        Are you getting a bit confused?

        • libertarian
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 6:32 pm | Permalink

          Lets hope Margaret never finds out about the countries invaded by Spain and France

          Her head will melt

  2. Mick
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:42 am | Permalink

    Off topic but not by much
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/26/jacob-rees-mogg-dares-remainer-rebels-revoke-article-50-way/#comments
    If these backbenchers try to thwart Brexit then a General Election should be called, then watch the squeaky bum time by these remoaners in Westminster, the people will have there say and Parliament would be wiped of all these or most of the Eu loving muppets and Parliament would be filled with true patriots who believe in Great Britain and not Europe luvvies,

    • Garland
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:30 am | Permalink

      No backbencher is trying to thwart Brexit. Plenty, however, will thwart no deal Brexit – because in 2016 we were explicitly told by the official Leave campaign that there was no possibility of leaving without a deal and that the Art 50 letter would not even be sent until a deal was mapped out. Anyone pushing for a no deal Brexit is defying the popular vote of 2016.

      • Denis Cooper
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:15 pm | Permalink

        “No backbencher is trying to thwart Brexit.”

        I don’t know how you can say that when it’s perfectly obvious some are.

        “that the Art 50 letter would not even be sent until a deal was mapped out”

        Where do you get that idea from? Your own fertile imagination?

      • NickC
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:20 pm | Permalink

        Garland said: “Anyone pushing for a no deal Brexit is defying the popular vote of 2016“.

        No, we’re not. Leaving on WTO terms was always a possibility. And nowhere in the 2015 EU Referendum Act, nor on the ballot paper, does it preclude an exit on WTO terms. Nor was Leave ever conditional upon a trade deal. If you think you know better, provide the evidence.

        VoteLeave may have campaigned for a trade “deal” but they never said that there was “no possibility of leaving without a deal”.

    • Gary C
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:00 am | Permalink

      I’m looking forward to the next GE when the EU luvvies will be ejected and we get what we voted for a proper Brexit.

      • Doug Powell
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:42 pm | Permalink

        The Islington and Camden Luvvies probably won’t be ejected, but they will receive a salutary lesson in reality! They seem to think that their constituents in the North East, North West and the Midlands – all good Brexiteers – are ignorant and bloody stupid!
        They believe that by making the Labour Party Islington and Camden centric – and REMAIN, their ‘ignorant’ supporters will continue to honour them with their loyalty!
        O ye of misplaced self importance and contempt for decent people! Goodbye the Peoples party – hello Undemocratic and Illiberal Party mark 2.0! – Not wanted beyond Islington and Camden!

    • Kevin
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:10 am | Permalink

      This is never off-topic, Mick. While it is one thing to entertain dreams
      of repainting the globe pink, it is quite another to secure victory in a
      much-needed by-election in Brecon and Radnorshire. Plaid Cymru are
      making way for the Lib Dem candidate, but the Conservative Party have
      yet to respond to a poll which indicates that they need Brexit Party votes to win.

    • Hope
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:42 am | Permalink

      I note Tory MPs already (after two days) getting nervous by their public comments that the servitude plan in its entirety must go not just the backstop or they will not vote for a tweaked Mayhab servitude plan.

    • A.Sedgwick
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:44 am | Permalink

      The Boris team strategy appears to be both to out bluff the EU politburo, the remoaners and labour MPs, who detest Corbyn and his Marxism.

      Ann Widdecombe on LBC last night was her usual breath of fresh air, her comments on the EU Parliament whilst obvious to the outsider are good to hear from a new recruit. In short she said it cannot propose laws, reject them just endorse instructions from the Commission. The whole set up is bureaucratic and dictatorial.

  3. /IKH
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:51 am | Permalink

    Hi Sir John,

    There is nothing that I disagree with in your post. It is more what you don’t mention.

    India, as a Commonwealth country should also be a target for close relations. Also the rest of the Commonwealth in Africa and Asia. We cannot expect to gain their trust immediately. We must rebuild our relationship over time. After all, we abandoned them when we joined the E.U.

    Boris likes bold fast moves and there is undoubtedly a place for these and they are very welcome given the stagnation of Government under Mrs May. But, there is also a place for the steady rebuilding of relationships with old friends and the rebuilding of trust.

    /ikh

    • Fed up with the bull
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:28 am | Permalink

      IKHBut, there is also a place for the steady rebuilding of relationships with old friends and the rebuilding of trust.

      Yes, not least with the electorate of the UK! ‘

    • agricola
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:12 am | Permalink

      We the UK are in a uniqe position having as head of the Commonwealth her majesty the Queen. The Commonwealth is special in that all members are there because they choose to be. Many members are relatively wealthy, possibly the majority are not. With some leadership it could become the greatest free trade area in the World while at the same time lifting many members out of relative poverty via trade.

      Those that worry about the UK being flooded with cheap goods should remember that any customer nation only buys what it wants. Almost all food we import from the EU and are not allowed at present to import from outside the EU free of duty, and cannot produce ourselves, could be supplied by the Commonwealth. I am sure that there is much we could supply them with.

      Perhaps our host should sow such thoughts in the mind of our PM. He in turn could discuss it with the Queen whose knowledge of the Commonwealth is second to none.

      • Sharon Jagger
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:57 pm | Permalink

        Agricola

        What a great post! The Commonwealth is a close knit group of countries – by choice, and though not all equal in size or wealth are equal in membership, unlike the EU.

        There are one or two on this stream today, that might want to look up more about the Commonwealth, to realise how wrong their impression is, of the relationship between the Commonwealth and the U.K.

        • Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:11 pm | Permalink

          Thanks, both. Excellent sentiments.

        • margaret howard
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 11:27 pm | Permalink

          Sharon

          “relationship between the Commonwealth and the U.K”

          So close that we dropped them overnight in order to join the EU. We were co-founders of both EFTA and the commonwealth trading bloc but left when the EU became the world’s largest, wealthiest trading bloc.

      • Pominoz
        Posted July 28, 2019 at 1:15 am | Permalink

        Agricola,

        Very good post. The Commonwealth was the greatest trading club on the planet until Heath trashed it by kow towing to the EU conditions for entry into that, even back then, very questionable project.

    • acorn
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 1:13 pm | Permalink

      India wants the UK seat on the UN Security Council. Remember that the UK lost its Judge position on the UN ICJ to India. The General Assembly, the G77 group particularly, recently failed to support a UK reference to the ICJ of a territory dispute with Mauritius. The G77 doesn’t see the UK as a premier league player anymore, particularly outside of the EU.

      • NickC
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:23 pm | Permalink

        Acorn, The UK could not be a “premier league player” from inside the EU, precisely because it is the EU that makes the decisions, not us.

        • acorn
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 6:38 am | Permalink

          Any one member state can veto any proposed armed action under the EU Foreign and Security Policy. The EU External Action Service acts as the EU Diplomatic Service, where the deals are initiated.

  4. Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:04 am | Permalink

    Am I alone in sensing a shift in the tectonic plates?
    At the start of this year, it was all hopelessness, grumbling and gloom.
    Now it is all the future, hope and opportunity.
    Good.

    • Ian Wragg
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:27 am | Permalink

      Rule Britannia. Thank the Lord for a dose of optimism.
      Nigel the best politician we never had.
      It makes me laugh to hear EU leaders calling Boris for statiing it in plain language. After 3years of supplication by May it’s a breath of fresh air.

    • Lifelogic
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:40 am | Permalink

      One can hardly accuse Theresa May of being ‘uplifting’ or a ‘visionary’ or even of being honest. Let us hope we hear no more from her. I see that Cabinet Office figures show that Nick Clegg claimed £112,882 over the year for not being PM, while David Cameron took £110,413, Tony Blair £115,000, Gordon Brown £114,057, and Sir John Major £114,935 for their public duties all very close the the maximum allowed. Perhaps this money should conditional on them saying nothing in public given the dire quality of these failed, misguided and tedious PMs. Cameron sensibly has said rather little T May and the rest (Major especially) should take his lead.

      • sm
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:11 pm | Permalink

        Isn’t it strange, these very wealthy former politicians who are always so ready to give away our money cannot perceive what good it would do to their reputations to make it clear that they will not claim these ‘public duties’ payments?

      • Denis Cooper
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:23 pm | Permalink

        She is determined to cling on to the Maidenhead seat, so no doubt I will still be hearing a lot about her – school visits, boundary walk, carol services, old folks homes, oh look at me am I not an excellent constituency MP. If you like I could keep you posted on her local activities, or you could take out a subscription to the Maidenhead Advertiser. Which, incidentally, has just turned 150.

        • Richard1
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:05 pm | Permalink

          I applaud her for staying as MP for the full term for which she was elected. I do not like the modern trend – started, as so many bad modern trends were, by tony Blair – for PMs to swan off after they leave office, deeming being a mere MP beneath them.

        • Mark B
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:50 pm | Permalink

          She use to be the head of my local council. I feel your pain.

        • Lifelogic
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:59 pm | Permalink

          I never wish to see or hear from the women every again. This also applies to John Major, Gordon Brown, Tony Bliar and Cast Iron EUskeptic, low tax at heart Conservative & thin gruel call me Dave.

          • Fed up with the bull
            Posted July 28, 2019 at 7:33 am | Permalink

            L/L Add Ken Clarke and Nick Clegg to that list.

        • Kevin Lohse
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:19 pm | Permalink

          “or you could take out a subscription to the Maidenhead Advertiser. Which, incidentally, has just turned 150.”
          Copies?

    • agricola
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:16 am | Permalink

      No you are not alone.”Who dares wins.” can be applied to the next few months and beyond.

  5. Denis Cooper
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:07 am | Permalink

    Well, JR, it seems that you are in a minority in the Commons on the question of whether the UK should have an independent foreign policy, as on similar questions about whether the UK should have an independent trade policy, or an independent economic policy, or even – if the truth be told – an independent monetary policy.

    It is important to ask:

    a) How it has come about that both chambers of our national representative body are now dominated by people whose primary loyalty is to the EU, with its overt federal ambitions, in direct contradiction of the overwhelming majority view of the electorate:

    http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2019/07/25/the-composition-of-the-new-cabinet/#comment-1039951

    b) How this situation could be rectified, even for the elected chamber, by a fresh general election effectively run by the same political parties which created it.

    It would need something more like Pride’s Purge, but without the swords.

    • agricola
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:27 am | Permalink

      Yes, but choosing the time is all important. We must be out of the EU. Our new sovereign UK needs to be seen to be working. The momentum that was seen outside No 10 and in parliament this week should be seen as action on our streets, schools, infrastructure, and everywhere else it was promised. Once this is a reality we can then drive the nay sayers from power with confidence.

    • Anonymous
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:59 am | Permalink

      The answer to a) is very simple. Remainers hid behind party brand and were recruited for their EU bias. The subject of the EU was kept away from electioneering when in fact pro EU candidates should have been wearing EU badges (or at least have had it displayed on their leaflets) and have been proud to do so – and if not then why not ?

    • Original Richard
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:42 pm | Permalink

      DC,

      The answer to a) is “entryism”.

  6. agricola
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:13 am | Permalink

    Yes, a greater reliance on well established relationships. An emphasis on our interests not those of a disparate collection varied interests within the EU. For instance where are their navies when shipping in the Staits of Hormuz needs protection.

    Facing the realities of climate change and ensuring our infrastructure is fit for purpose. Unbelievable shambles in transport this week for instance. Cease believing we can do anything about it, it’s the Sun, yurt dwellers. What we can clean up is our disgusting environment, all of it for sure man made.

    Largely confine our foreign policy to UK interests and those of our close allies. Our principal aim should be to sell to the World to the power of ten.

    Boris has started well, may his momentum long continue. Think positive and act positive should be the new criteria for the UK. Dump the negativity that even infects this diary at times. The EU is already confused. When we are ready invite them to London to clear that confusion. Leave them in no doubt as to our direction, with their agreement or without. Barnier and May screwed up big time with their worse than Versailles WA. If we leave on a no deal WTO outcome it will be entirely of the EU’s making.

    • AlmostDead
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:22 am | Permalink

      It will not be entirely the EU’s fault if the UK leaves on WTO. They have a part to play, but ultimately its our choice.

      • Andy
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:22 pm | Permalink

        It is not our choice. In 2016 a small majority of those who voted voted to leave with a deal. Nobody voted to leave with no deal.

        No deal will be the choice only of a handful of Conservative extremists in Parliament. There are plenty of cells for all of them.

        • agricola
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:57 pm | Permalink

          Wrong again Andy. In 2016 a majority voted to leave for reasons best known to themselves. No specific deal or no deal was on the ballot paper.

          Deal or no deal will be the choice of the EU, as explained elsewhere.

        • Longinus
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:00 pm | Permalink

          Wrong again, the Brexit Party won the Euro election with a stated policy of leaving on WTO-terms.

        • Richard1
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:08 pm | Permalink

          Well it was certainly never stated that if the Country votes to leave we would only do so in the event that the govt agreed a deal which meets with the EUs approval, otherwise we’d be staying whichever way the referendum went. This now appears to be the Continuity Remain position.

        • Anonymous
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:12 pm | Permalink

          There aren’t any cells.

          We can’t put away the organised gangs which infest this country – which is what caused Brexit.

        • Original Richard
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

          The leaving with “no deal” came about because the EU insisted that we could only negotiate a (trade) deal once we had left the EU and, together with Mrs. May, they concocted a Withdrawal Treaty that had we signed meant we remained in the EU with no say or veto and with no lawful exit.

          There was nothing in the Lisbon Treaty Article 50 that said we had to accept such a Withdrawal Treaty before negotiating a trade or final relationship deal.

          Only a traitor could accept such a Withdrawal Treaty and I believe that the way it intended to bind all our future Parliaments for ever is against our constitution.

        • cornishstu
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:45 pm | Permalink

          HOGWASH! I voted to leave and did not expect the EU to do us any favours as it would encourage others and that WTO would probably be the default although an FTA was always desirable and I know many leavers of the same outlook. The one thing I did not expect was that our own government aided and abetted by various parties would try to stitch us up and sell out to the EU. It is they who should be as you like to say behind bars.

        • Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:45 pm | Permalink

          Do you recall, Andy, what many people here have tried to remind you, the wording on the ballot paper?

          Remain a member of the European Union
          Leave the European Union

          Where did it say anything about ”a deal”? Did you write it in on your own ballot paper?

        • Edward2
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:23 pm | Permalink

          You have asked all 17.4 million voters have you Andy?
          No mention of deals on the ballot paper.
          What is the future if we remained?
          Was that on the ballot paper?
          You do come out with some nonsense.

        • NickC
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:30 pm | Permalink

          Andy, There were no conditions attached to Leave either on the ballot paper, or in the 2015 EU Referendum Act. So “no trade deal” was always an option.

          And the possibility of no withdrawal agreement is specifically written into the EU’s TEU Art50. And without a WA, a trade deal would always have been unlikely.

        • steve
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 8:26 am | Permalink

          Andy

          Hypocrite.

      • Denis Cooper
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:34 pm | Permalink

        Agreed, it’s partly the fault of the Therolly combo. That reminds me, what has been done with the Olly part, Olly Robbins?

        Has Boris Johnson followed my suggestion published in the Daily Telegraph last summer, and sent him off to St Helena?

        http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2019/06/23/the-eu-confirms-it-is-ready-for-uk-exit-in-october-without-the-withdrawal-treaty/#comment-1032014

      • agricola
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:51 pm | Permalink

        Well moribund, our choice was made in June 2016. It is only the duplicity of May, her civil service, and the complicity of the EU that have brought us to the point we are. Parliament to it’s credit threw out, on three occasions, the result of that duplicity, named the WA.

        The EU are likely to be offered two choices. A WTO departure with a FTA offer and continuity of the current situation if they wish it until the FTA is agreed. A very generous offer to an organisation that sells us more than we sell them. This is leaving with an agreement/deal. Their second choice is we leave on WTO terms with no agreement. Hence my statement that it is the EU’s choice, by my reconning they have about 96 days. I suspect you will be unhappy whatever the EU’s choice.

    • Mitchel
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 12:50 pm | Permalink

      Most of the oil leaving the Gulf is heading for Asia;Asian countries tend to have good relations with Iran-Japan’s Abe was in Tehran when one of those tankers was apparently mined.They probably see no need for protection.

      This is really an issue for Britain and the USA who have wanted control of Iran for the best part of two hundred years to cause mischief for Russia in the Caucasus and Central Asia.Iran is fully backed by China and Russia,so tough luck-another foreign policy flop after Ukraine,Syria,Venezuela,etc!

      Interesting revelation in the past few days that Gibraltar’s rules on sanctions were changed 36 hours ahead of the tanker seizure.

      • NickC
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:32 pm | Permalink

        Mitchel, The Iranian tanker was seized at the behest of the EU, not the USA.

        • Mitchel
          Posted July 29, 2019 at 9:28 am | Permalink

          Not according to the Spanish Foreign Minister,to name but one source.

  7. Tory in Cumbria
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:14 am | Permalink

    Nonsense from top to bottom. Everything on this list can be better achieved as a member of the EU, one of the planet’s three regulatory superpowers. The EU, China and the US are competing for influence globally. The UK outside the EU is not at the table, it’s on the menu. As Trump’s “great trade deal” will show

    • Lifelogic
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:38 am | Permalink

      Rubbish.

    • Sir Joe Soap
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:39 am | Permalink

      The UK inside the EU is on the menu. Why are you so frightened of us being in charge of our destiny?

      • bitterend
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:55 pm | Permalink

        I saw our destiny in the 1950’s- it wasn’t pretty

        • steve
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 8:29 am | Permalink

          bitterend

          Not according to McMillan.

      • steve
        Posted July 28, 2019 at 8:33 am | Permalink

        Sir Joe Soap

        “Why are you so frightened of us being in charge of our destiny?”

        Simple, remainers are terrified at the prospect of grafting for the country, instead preferring to ponce a living of the rest of us because the EU says we have to let them.

    • sm
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:19 am | Permalink

      TinC – you state that the EU is one of the planet’s three regulatory superpowers.

      I am struggling to cope with this assertion, given Ms Howard’s repeated assurance that the EU is just a trading bloc.

      • DaveM
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

        TiC’s comment displays a spectacular lack of knowledge about the dynamics of geopolitics and geostrategy.

    • mickc
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:24 am | Permalink

      Err….we voted to Leave. All parties agreed to abide by the result; that should be what happens.

      • bitterend
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:01 pm | Permalink

        does this mean we have to leave the eurovision song contest as well?

        • Gary C
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:36 pm | Permalink

          bitterend
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:01 pm

          “does this mean we have to leave the eurovision song contest as well?”

          Hopefully!

    • Dave Andrews
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:25 am | Permalink

      The UK in the EU is not at the table either, the Commission is.

    • Anonymous
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:03 am | Permalink

      A realistic idea of our future and influence in the EU is Eurovision scoring. That’s what they really think of us.

      As for being on the menu – how original of you. Never heard that one before.

      Our economy is built on fluff and air – so what’s to eat ? When the 6th/7th largest economy on the planet implodes into a black hole the rest will be stripped of their clothes and their food and their assets because if collapse of any one the PIIGS threatened global contagion what do you think London going *pop* will do ? It will make Lehman’s look like a spa weekend.

      Most of that wealth can’t get pillaged and redistributed – it simply disappears and reveals the falsity of the whole global economy… which is why we have, for example (as discussed yesterday), farming nations trading bits of sheep with each other and adding air miles to its cost when they could all easily provide sheep for themselves locally… it’s all about adding none existent value and debt to create money… of which we will no longer be able to pay.

      Presently we are the most dangerous nation on Earth and need to be treated with respect. And not for the reasons that an unoriginal Leave or Remain voter might think.

      • margaret howard
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:29 pm | Permalink

        Anonymous

        “A realistic idea of our future and influence in the EU is Eurovision scoring. That’s what they really think of us”

        Are you serious? As long as we send old age pensioners like Engelbert Humperdinck to represent us in what is a celebration of youthful, exuberant talent, we deserve to be laughed at.

    • formula57
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:09 am | Permalink

      “Everything on this list can be better achieved as a member of the EU…” – quite! Well, you meant except for: –

      “The US/Canada/New Zealand/UK/Australia Intelligence group will remain important to our intelligence and security.” – where the Evil Empire not only has no role but would be denied one on security grounds.

      “NATO will continue to be our central defence alliance. “ – which pre-dates the Evil Empire and operates satisfactorily without paying it heed even whilst accommodating a good number of its members.

      ” In the WTO we will emerge as one of the leaders of the free trade group pushing for fewer barriers and lower tariffs worldwide.” – where a clear, direct voice can facilitate multiple alliances with those including the Evil Empire who share similar views to the U.K.. (views we can only express by chance at present through the filter of the 27).

      “…the UK is drawn into rows and conflicts in Eastern Europe where EU intervention may not be helpful and where UK interests may diverge from apparent EU interests” – so in future the U.K. will be freed from that dangerous encumbrance that is becoming more typical of Evil Empire adventurism.

      “The UK increasingly has split loyalties with the divergence in approach to the Middle East and elsewhere between the USA and the EU. Where these two fall out the UK needs to be able to make its own judgement about which side to belong to….” – highly desirable but, clearly, only possible outside of Evil Empire membership.

      “The EU has not been helpful to the UK over Gibraltar, and has also been negative over aspects of the Channel islands independence.” – so in future the U.K. can protect its own unconstrained by trade-offs and participation in connected initiatives.

      “The pull of the world is towards the east with the rise of China and India. The UK will need to look increasingly to Asia for growth in trade.” – and is well-placed to do so, not only with historical connections but the inherent advantages like language, rule of law (widespread preference for English law in international commerce), stability and an Anglo-Saxon culture that promotes free trade.

      Perhaps you would do well to stay put in Cumbria rather than embrace the world with confidence and courage?

      (I say, you are not one of the doomsters and gloomsters are you?)

    • J Bush
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:55 am | Permalink

      How much of a ‘superpower’ will the EU be, when the UK (the 6th largest economy in the World) leaves?

      Especially with the loss of all the British taxpayer and tariff bung?

      • margaret howard
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:36 pm | Permalink

        J Bush

        We begged to be allowed to join the EU after our own efforts to create similar trading blocs like EFTA or the commonwealth failed to keep pace with the hugely successful European Union.

        It turned us from the ‘sick man of Europe’ into the world’s 5th largest economy (since Brexit alas already reduced to 7th place).

        We can only hope the EU will have us back again when we knock on its doors a few years down the line. Last time the Germans supported our application against the repeated ‘NONs’ of de Gaulle. I doubt they will be so stupid again a second time around.

        • J Bush
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 5:43 am | Permalink

          Incorrect. We the country didn’t beg. Politicians did. Heath rewarded himself with Morning Cloud.

        • steve
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 8:45 am | Permalink

          Margaret Howard

          “We begged….”

          For heaven’s sake give it a rest.

          How many times do you have to be told; WE didn’t beg. HEATH and the tiny minority who stood to make lots of personal wealth ‘begged’ and assumed a right to shaft the entire UK just so they could line their own pockets.

      • steve
        Posted July 28, 2019 at 8:59 am | Permalink

        J Bush

        “How much of a ‘superpower’ will the EU be, when the UK (the 6th largest economy in the World) leaves?”

        It won’t be a power at all, it’ll collapse. Either because of nationalist uprising and other nations leaving, or like all corrupt regimes terminally corrode from within.

        They might also be stupid enough to have a crack at Russia or provoke Putin a step too far….in which case we’ll be wise to be out of it and won’t be shedding another single drop for the ungrateful French led EU – never again !

    • Pominoz
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:57 am | Permalink

      Utter crap.

      Bet you don’t even live in Cumbria.

      • agricola
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:00 pm | Permalink

        I see a bit of Oz logic and expressivness is working it’s magic on you.

    • William Long
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:11 am | Permalink

      Cleraly you have been taking lessons from the MP for Penrith and the Borders.

    • a-tracy
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:25 am | Permalink

      And many people feel the UK is on the EU menu but you fail to acknowledge that and the fact that a majority don’t feel like you do. You have the right to your opinion, but it was a democratic vote with a large turnout, I was a bit on the fence and could have voted on either side, family and friends are split – but it is what it is, you are fighting an old, lost battle. Concentrate on the future and offer up what you most want to keep because it can’t be the cost, control and constant capitulation.

    • Original Richard
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:32 am | Permalink

      The UK is “on the menu” in the EU – viz, we have been fleeced ever since joining :

      – Giving up our fishing grounds.

      – Paying an annual fee, when most other countries do not, to subsidise large corporates to move their factories out of the UK and into countries where wages are lower (even non-EU countries such as Turkey!)

      – Allowing the large corporates to move workers into the UK from poorer EU countries to compete with UK workers to depress wages.

      – Membership of the SM/CU with non-tariff barriers so designed that we have a £100bn/YEAR trading deficit with the EU.

      • Sharon Jagger
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:08 pm | Permalink

        Original Richard

        Agreed!

        Once we joined, all the benefits we were promised, didn’t happen! The opposite happened….and then gradually our nation was given away – bit by bit, without our permission! And this was done by stealth and lying, because it was known the electorate would never have agreed, if they’d but known!,

    • Longinus
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:10 am | Permalink

      Your post is full of opinion without any facts.

    • NickC
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:40 am | Permalink

      TiC, Nonsense from top to bottom. It is impossible for the UK to have an independent foreign policy as a province of the EU. And the UK was never at the top table in the world as a member of the EU – we weren’t even at the EU’s top table. We’ve been on the menu for 47 years as the EU theft of our fishing rights demonstrates.

    • AlmostDead
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:24 pm | Permalink

      +100

    • Richard1
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:09 pm | Permalink

      A 1950s view of the world (with China replacing the Soviet Union in the analysis). V much the mentality behind the original federal vision of the EU. Sir Johns is much more in tune with the modern world.

    • Fed up with the bull
      Posted July 28, 2019 at 7:37 am | Permalink

      Tory in Cumbria How the hell do you think other countries manage?

  8. Tabulazero
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:17 am | Permalink

    The UK will obviously fully align with the US as it always wanted to be.

    It will swap Brussels (where it had a say) for Washington (where it will do as told).

    • Lifelogic
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:22 am | Permalink

      Rubbish. No one is suggesting taking orders from the US nor some political arrangement giving them power over the UK, just free trade where it is mutually beneficial. The same as we will have with the EU or anywhere else in the world that it is possible to organise it.

      • Tabulazero
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:46 am | Permalink

        That is what you hope for. This is not what you will get.

        Enjoy your war with Iran.

        • steve
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 9:04 am | Permalink

          Tabulazero

          “Enjoy your war with Iran”

          We will, it’s been long overdue and we don’t take kindly to being called cowards.

      • Andy
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:33 am | Permalink

        Selling off the NHS to the highest bidder and flooding our country with Frankenstein foods. You wouldn’t dare put those truths to the electorate so – as usual with Tories – you will lie.

        • Lifelogic
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:07 pm | Permalink

          Countless British people go to the state and eat perfectly happily without coming to any harm at all.

          • Lifelogic
            Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:26 pm | Permalink

            States!

        • Original Richard
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:24 pm | Permalink

          If we remain in the EU we can be certain that the EU will sell off our NHS in return for cheaper tariffs on German cars and French food.

          Trade deals will become settled either by the EU Commission itself or by QMV.

          Ireland is about to find out the hard way over its beef in the Mercursor trade deal.

          The only way to ensure we can negotiate a trade deal which is beneficial for our type of economy and market is to NOT be in the EU’s CU.

        • Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

          Andy – has it ever occurred to you that you don’t have to eat (or buy) anything that you don’t wish to?

          And, of course, the NHS issue won’t bother you – as aren’t you always telling us that you prefer to pay for your schools/health/etc? Why should YOU worry about the plebs? Let them eat Frankenstein cake.

        • NickC
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:39 pm | Permalink

          Andy, The UK government (effectively) owns the NHS. So the NHS can only be sold if the UK government decides to do so. That is just not going to happen.

          As usual with Remains you have taken a half-digested non-fact and pretend it is a policy. The USA trade delegation have merely said that the USA should not be excluded from supplying the NHS.

        • steve
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 9:13 am | Permalink

          Andy

          Then perhaps you could explain to us in what constituencies i.e Tory / socialist, is morbid obesity likely to be most significant .

        • libertarian
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 6:36 pm | Permalink

          Andy

          The NHS is a government department it cant be sold

          If you mean hospitals , nope Labour privatised those under PFI

          Do you mean GP’s ? Nope they are all individual private businesses

          GM foods are responsible for feeding the world and ending starvation and famine

    • Sir Joe Soap
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:42 am | Permalink

      Suggests you’re worried. Yes we are moving out of your orbit and into an independent one where we deal with whosoever we can deal with. Your people aren’t making it easy for us or themselves at the moment, whereas the US is. So where do you expect us to lean first?

    • AlmostDead
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:23 am | Permalink

      +100 Tabulazero
      This is exactly the plan by our good host.

      • NickC
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:46 pm | Permalink

        Almostdead, No, it isn’t. Tabulazero’s imaginings are a strawman. Try arguing against the real Leave plan, rather than setting up a fake plan for you to knock down. The actual plan is independence.

        • Tabulazero
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 8:10 am | Permalink

          The actual plan is to swap from “having a say” to “taking orders”.

          How is independence looking when your PM does not even dare to back-up the UK ambassador in the US for basically doing his job.

          • Edward2
            Posted July 28, 2019 at 5:03 pm | Permalink

            Having said what he said the position of the ambassador was untenable as the White House were so annoyed they would not deal with him again.
            He knew he was finished and had to be resign.
            Nothing to do with Boris.

    • mickc
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:34 am | Permalink

      That is obviously a concern.
      However there is no reason why we cannot be independent of both the EU and USA. Our interests are not the same as either bloc.
      In particular, the “Special Relationship” is a nonsense, the USA having such a relationship only with Israel, Ireland and Saudi Arabia.
      The EU’s (basically Germany’s) interests are in Eatern Europe.

    • Fed up with the bull
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:32 am | Permalink

      Tab, well I was talking to my chiropodist the other day and she has a friend that has the opportunity to vote in the European parliament and she said it is quite frankly a waste of time because whatever the UK tries to veto they find themselves outnumbered by so many other countries. What gets passed into law by the EU parliament is not always good for every country. That’s why we will be better off doing things that suit us without having to think about other countries needs.

    • a-tracy
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:28 am | Permalink

      Tabulazero, so do you think the USA will want 1% of our GDP, 80% of our tariffs on imports, taxes on drugs and prostitution that we don’t collect from the users, open borders, and reciprocal free healthcare?

      • AlmostDead
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:25 pm | Permalink

        Yes and more

        • NickC
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:47 pm | Permalink

          Almostdead, Then it is fortunate that we will be independent.

    • Original Richard
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:45 am | Permalink

      Tabulazero,

      You’re completely deluded if you think we’ve ever had any significant say at all in Brussels.

      We’re one of 28 nations, soon to be one of 35 nations, and it is the EU’s intention for all laws, taxes, and policy decisions (trade, energy, environment, foreign, immigration etc.) to be determined either by unelected and unremovable bureaucrats or through QMV.

      And, if Parliament is stupid enough to pass the EU’s (non-) Withdrawal Treaty, we will have no say or veto at all and no means for a lawful exit.

      Only by being an independent country again, sitting at the top tables, can we influence matters in a direction beneficial to us.

      For instance, if we remain in the CU we can be sure our assets, market and institutions will be traded away for cheaper tariffs on German cars and French food.

      • Sharon Jagger
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:11 pm | Permalink

        Original Richard

        Hear, hear!

      • Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:17 pm | Permalink

        See facts4eu – ”how much of life is now controlled from Brussels, not Westminster”.
        And you believe the US will control us in the same way, do you?

      • Tabulazero
        Posted July 28, 2019 at 8:14 am | Permalink

        Sorry but it is rather at the children table where you will be seated.

    • NickC
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 12:03 pm | Permalink

      Tabulazero, As the “51st state” of the USA we would have our democratic say, unlike in the EU. However, it is completely hypocritical of you to complain about your strawman of us being controlled by the USA, when you want us to continue actually being controlled by the EU. Unlike you, Leaves believe independence is of primary importance – from both the USA and the EU.

      • AlmostDead
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:28 pm | Permalink

        Then I suggest you wait to make a deal with the US. Otherwise your inexperienced negotiators will get taken to the cleaners.

    • Tabulazero
      Posted July 28, 2019 at 8:18 am | Permalink

      The Leave voters are totally demented. I had expected them to be happy at the thought of becoming the 51st state.

      But no. They genuinely believe they can remain independent in a world dominated by the US, China, the EU and very shortly India and Brazil.

      The UK has doomed itself to irrelevance.

  9. Lifelogic
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:19 am | Permalink

    Indeed this all sound like a good sensible way to go.

    Meanwhile Jeremy Corbyn promises a multi billion pound investment in Mersey Tidal Power Project will ‘power up the North’ on a trip to surprise, surprise – Liverpool. The man clearly understands nothing about power engineering, economics, spending money efficiently or indeed about tidal power. He even wants the insane Swansea ‘lagoon’. But he is very good at promising everything to everyone, with money he does not have, to try to gain power. Let us hope the country does not fall for it.

    He is a very dangerous economic idiot. Let us hope he and Mc Donnall never get near to any power. The Conservative’s green crap (chemotherapy to cure a cold as Matt Ridley puts it) is quite damaging enough. Perhaps his sound (0n climate change) brother Piers can enlighten him on this issue.

    • jerry
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:55 am | Permalink

      @LL; “The man clearly understands nothing about power engineering, economics, spending money efficiently or indeed about tidal power.”

      Cough, are you still talking about Mr Corbyn or have you started to talk about yourself again Mr Idealogical, after all tidal power is a well proven technology, closely related as it is to hydro-power (such as used in hydro-electricity generation), its only two drawbacks are initial cost and possible effects on aquatic nature if not properly considered.

      “But he is very good at promising everything to everyone, with money he does not have, to try to gain power. “

      Sounds familiar, a “Garden Bridge” spanning the Thames anyone?…

      • Lifelogic
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:19 pm | Permalink

        As you say the main drawback is the prohibitive cost of enclosing a large area of sea and then maintaining this expensive wall from storms etc. (and stopping it silting up too). Then once again the power is not on demand power (you have to use it all before the next tide comes in). They you have neap tides and spring tides so variable output every few days. Oh and it is not renewable as it slow the earth’s rotation speed (though only slightly I grant you).

        Do some sums and you will see it is a very stupid idea indeed and very environmentally damaging too. Furthermore when all is taken into account construction, maintenance etc. it would not save any significant C02 anyway.

        The prohibitive cost alone is well err “prohibitive”, unless like Corbyn you like to promise to piss other people’s money down the drain – thus destroying net jobs and damaging the economy hugely.

        • Lifelogic
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:07 pm | Permalink

          Life Corbyn or indeed anyone who supports HS2 or all the other daft tax payer subsidies for wind or solar.

        • Fed up with the bull
          Posted July 28, 2019 at 7:42 am | Permalink

          Well said L/L. All these renewables are a drain on public finances. Look at how our energy bills have risen since the crap was introduced. The only people benefitting are developers (mostly foreign) and landowners who are laughing all the way to the bank.

      • Lifelogic
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:22 pm | Permalink

        “A well proven technology” – indeed “well proven” to be far too expensive not on demand and thus pointless. Other than in some exceptional circumstance perhaps.

        • jerry
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

          @LL; “Not on demand” you say, what the tides stop do they? Not around here, two tidal flows out and two tidal flows in each and every 24hrs, and has been for millions of years…

          The tide is as certain as day and night!

          • Lifelogic
            Posted July 28, 2019 at 4:30 am | Permalink

            Jerry please think it through! You have to use all the energy from one tide before the next one arrives or the enclosed area is already full and you waste the energy from the next tide! Plus you get far less energy from the neap tides than the spring tides. Plus they silt up and need dredging. It is “reliable” it produces a certain amount of predictable energy, But it is not energy “on demand” as for example gas, coal or hydro (with a large reservoir) can be.

          • jerry
            Posted July 28, 2019 at 7:43 am | Permalink

            @LL; Oh dear… None so blind as those who choose not to sea (pun intended). 🙁

            “Jerry please think it through!

            If you say so Mr Pot!… 😉

            “You have to use all the energy from one tide before the next one arrives or the enclosed area is already full and you waste the energy from the next tide!”

            You really do not understand how reservoirs works do you, nor do you appear to understand that the tide is free, so if electrical demand has been low and thus the lagoon (reservoir) is still full it has cost nothing.

          • Lifelogic
            Posted July 28, 2019 at 4:03 pm | Permalink

            The tide is free but the huge costs of construction, maintenance, repairs after storms dredging etc. are not. Yet now you are suggesting we even waste some of the energy it could have produced (as the tide is free!). Perhaps making the pay back times for the project 150+ years (or more likely never if you include sensible interest on the capital!)

            You do not seem to understand the difference between energy that can be turned on and off on demand gas, oil, coal, hydro and tidal power that produces a predictable amount controlled by the tides but it cannot be adjusted.

            Other than by throwing some of the “free” power away that is.

          • jerry
            Posted July 28, 2019 at 5:20 pm | Permalink

            @LL; “the huge costs of construction, maintenance, repairs after storms dredging etc.”

            Please tell me how much does a nuclear power station costs over its full life, including decommissioning, compared to a tidal lagoon hydro-electricity scheme, if you could be so helpful, just to give a comparison…

            “tidal power that produces a predictable amount controlled by the tides but it cannot be adjusted.”

            Is it not controllable just as any other hydro scheme, by opening and closing sluice gates, what is more I suspect the turbines could be made to work (or not at all) with either incoming or outgoing tides, something that can not happen with existing dame based hydro schemes.

            “Other than by throwing some of the “free” power away that is.”

            You mean just like nuclear power stations have to do, giving up all that ‘free’ heat from the reactor when not using it to produce steam and thus turn the generating turbines?!

    • Lifelogic
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:31 am | Permalink

      Also in the Spectator Martin Vander Weyer suggests George Osborne as a replacement for Mark Carney. No thanks, he was a dire IHT ratting tax to death Chancellor and he appointed the dire and very expensive Mark Carney.

      JR or Mogg or a Pat Minford type of economist is needed or get Mervin King back he is only 71 after all.

    • Lifelogic
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:59 am | Permalink

      Amber Rudd on Brexit just a few month back in December:- ‘My mind hasn’t changed I will vote for May’s W/A — but if there’s a new referendum, we’re better off in’!

      What on earth is this dope doing as Minister for Women and Equalities? Plus what are we doing with such a pointless and idiotically titled department anyway? Which is it for Women or Equality? Close this pointless and indeed very damaging department down fully and give us all some tax cuts.

  10. Leaver
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:23 am | Permalink

    I think our future lies with America, not the Far East. I think we should put sanctions on the Chinese and stand shoulder to shoulder with America.

    I read today that Boris is already doing a big deal with Trump.

    Things are looking up already.

    • jerry
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:12 am | Permalink

      @Leaver; “I think our future lies with America, not the Far East.”

      I tend to agree, in fact a much closer trading relationships with the USA would have been a far better proposition for Mr Heath back in 1972 rather than that of joining the EEC, and it would have allowed us to retain our (then) very close trading relationship with the Commonwealth too, something we had to row back from as a price for join the EEC.

      Yes there would have been, and still are, (world) political issues in being so close to the USA, but in the last 20 years we have crossed that Rubicon anyway!

    • AlmostDead
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:24 am | Permalink

      Taking back control…only to hand it to the US. The UK is not an equal to the US. I’m afraid your delusional if you think so.

      • NickC
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:54 pm | Permalink

        Almostdead, You have no room to talk – you are insisting our nation continues as a province of the EU empire. You lost the principle of independence already!

    • Peter
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:32 am | Permalink

      Quite. I could hardly believe the 6 am news on BBC radio 4 which led with the US deal story and followed up with the quote from Trump about Boris “He has what it takes. They needed him for a long time.”

      Of course, further on there was a quote from Lady DoubleBarrel-Remayne saying No Deal would be bad for Britain’s scientific research – but it was a half-hearted counterpoint, as if the BBC were just going through the motions.

    • Denis Cooper
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:46 am | Permalink

      As I have repeated ad nauseam the economic importance of international trade itself is overstated, and more especially the economic importance of most free trade arrangements is vastly overstated.

      That applies to the EU Single Market, which according to the EU Commission may have made a one-off addition of about 2% to the collective GDP of the EU member states – but according to another source that is not evenly spread, and it may be only 1% for the UK, and that gross benefit may be exceeded by the regulatory costs so that the net impact on the UK has been slightly negative.

      And it applies just as well to other much-lauded free trade arrangements like the proposed TTIP deal between the EU and the US, where David Cameron’s glowing promise that it would “turbo-charge the transatlantic economy” actually referred to a projected one-off addition of maybe 0.7% to UK GDP:

      http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2013/06/18/g8-a-time-for-a-new-agenda/#comment-202530

      That is from June 2013, and I have seen no reason to change my general view as expressed in the last paragraph of the comment:

      “Bearing in mind the original projection that the EU Single Market could increase the collective GDP of the EU member states by 5%, which probably has not in fact been realised and has come at increased costs largely cancelling the benefits of the freer trade, but which in any case would have been equivalent to just a couple of years of natural growth at the trend rate, and that this trade deal between the world’s two largest trade blocs is projected to increase GDP by only 1% or less, which would be equivalent to just some months of natural growth, doesn’t it appear that the law of diminishing returns is now operating strongly on the benefits of free trade?”

      If you listen to Remoaners you could easily think that the whole of our economy was based on exporting goods and services to other countries, and especially to other EU countries, when in fact the latter involves maybe 6% of UK companies exporting 12% of UK GDP.

      As for our exports of lamb to the rest of the EU, which is now being presented as a huge obstacle to a no deal Brexit, they amount to less than 0.o2% of GDP.

      https://britishmeatindustry.org/industry/imports-exports/sheepmeat/

      “The value of UK sheep meat exports in 2015 was £302 million.”

      “… over 95 per cent of UK sheep meat exports went to other EU countries.”

      https://www.statista.com/statistics/281744/gdp-of-the-united-kingdom-uk-since-2000/

      UK GDP in 2015 = £1.89 trillion = £1,890 billion = £1,890,000 million.

      £302 million divided by £1,890,000 million = 0.00016 = 0.016% of UK GDP.

      So the lamb’s tail which is now being waved around in an effort to stop us leaving the EU without a withdrawal agreement is even smaller than the 0.1% of UK GDP which crosses the Irish land border and which Theresa May allowed to be used as a tail to wag the whole UK dog:

      http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2018/01/14/the-customs-union-and-the-world-trade-organisation/#comment-912717

      “I would like to repeat that in 2016 exports of goods from Northern Ireland to the Republic of Ireland amounted to just £2.4 billion … and that amounted to about 0.1% of UK GDP, £1940 billion in 2016 … it seems that 0.1% tail will be allowed to wag the whole of the UK dog.”

      • Sir Joe Soap
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:26 pm | Permalink

        It also means that if everyone in the UK buys £6 worth of lamb per year more than they do presently, our lamb “problem” is solved.

        • Denis Cooper
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

          Thanks, that’s an excellent way of looking at it, although maybe £11 per household would be even better. If the average UK family was prepared to spend 21p a week more on UK lamb then that would take care of the potential surplus, and they could even get the 21p by taking all southern Irish products including beef off their shopping lists. Why not? From when he was elected Leo Varadkar set out to be obstructive in the hope of keeping the UK under the thumb of the EU for the advantage of the Republic; he has sown the wind, now let him and his deluded people reap the whirlwind.

          • Andy
            Posted July 28, 2019 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

            By chance I was in Asda the other week and picked up some beef only to see it was from Ireland, so I put it back. I now do that with most EU products except for things from Greece.

        • Lifelogic
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:21 pm | Permalink

          Or if a few farmers just switch from lamb to producing other products. I am not a particular fan of lamb.

          Give me some quality beef, chicken, duck, venison, grouse, goose, wild boar, good offal and other game every time please.

          Once a year is about right for lamb (or indeed for Turkey).

          Then again perhaps a some Moussaka, Lamb tikka kebabs or even haggis once in a while. Or some of those tandoori lamb chop tikka.

          • Andy
            Posted July 28, 2019 at 5:39 pm | Permalink

            I love Lamb and Mutton. Much better than beef.

    • Dominic
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:49 am | Permalink

      Downing Street said the two leaders had “expressed their commitment to delivering an ambitious free trade agreement”…this is from today’s DT

      Now if this is the case then our exit neh escape from the German-Franco prison sentence is surely a fait accompli. EU subordinate states are expressly and legally prohibited from entering into FTAs with free, sovereign nations (those nations outside of the sclerotic EU).

      On that basis alone and on the assumption that the DT article is a reflection of the true state of Johnson’s current thinking then our exit is guaranteed

      Trump says a deal could lead to an in trade of about 4-5x. Personally, I think that’s a ramp but even a significant rise in US-UK trade could transform opportunities for UK companies

      It’s a new world the UK will be entering and the certainties of the past will be replaced by a more dynamic and fresh set of challenges which will test our ability to adapt. This isn’t a bad thing. One only has to look at the expensive, wasteful social economies of Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal, France and even Germany to see the effects that embracing the status quo can have upon a nation’s productivity

      You’ve got to pay your way in the world. Looking to the German taxpayer to bail you out can only go on for a limited period without loss of national freedoms

    • bookend
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:52 am | Permalink

      So d’ya think? Trump and his crowd will suck you in and blow you out in bubbles

      Have ya not being listening? ‘it’s America first’ all the way- always was, always will be- they do not stand shoulder to shoulder with anyone – in fact can’t stand anyone else- it’s in the genes

      USA USA!, the Wall and getting at the- ‘fake news’ that’s all that matters

      • NickC
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:59 pm | Permalink

        Bookend, Your hatred is showing. Better look to that.

    • margaret howard
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:42 am | Permalink

      Leaver

      I don’t think sanctions against China are the way to go. We need them and after our appalling behaviour against them in the 19th century it might be better if we sucked up to them rather than America.

      The East is the future with America becoming a spent force relying more and more on living off the rest of the world.

      • Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:28 pm | Permalink

        Ms Howard – re ”appalling behaviour”. Perhaps you might use that expression regarding two world wars, both caused by the nation you obviously admire more than your own. Perhaps it is they and their minions and underlings who should now be ”sucking up” to us for THEIR ”appalling behaviour”.

        Or is our country the only one that should forgive and forget what was done to us, while donning the sackcloth and ashes and moaning ‘mea culpa’ for what our nation did in the dim and distant past?

    • Mitchel
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 1:39 pm | Permalink

      America’s other “allies” don’t agree with you;I see the Philippines and Brazil’s Jair”Trump of the Tropics” Bolsonaro have both decided to go with Huawei this week.

  11. Lifelogic
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:35 am | Permalink

    Radio 4 covering a climate realist meeting in the US needless no one was allowed to saying anything more than a couple of words before being talked through by the BBC interviewers.

    Boris should repeal the appalling climate change act and with draw from all the international climate agreements. Plus tell his ministers not to listen to Greta ‘think’ or BBC ‘think’ types and for the police to treat organisations similar to say Extinction Rebellion for what they surely largely are – misguided, economic vandals and essentially criminals.

  12. Sir Joe Soap
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:44 am | Permalink

    Well it’s a shame you and your colleagues wasted 3 years of our lives backing a loser.

    • Lifelogic
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:03 pm | Permalink

      It is indeed thanks to let’s kill private schools Gove and Leadson dropping out due to a lack of bottle.

      Boris too, he would have won anyway I suspect had he not folded his cards.

  13. steadyeddie
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:54 am | Permalink

    ‘the EU has not been helpful to the UK over Gibraltar…..’ Remind me again how Gibraltar voted in the Referendum. Just one example of the confusion that reigns in the Leave camp.

    • cornishstu
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:51 pm | Permalink

      No confusion, Gibraltar would like to remain in the EU, however their preference is overridden by their greater desire to remain as part of the UK.

    • NickC
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:03 pm | Permalink

      Steadyeddie, Remind me again about the Referendum being a national vote? Just another example of the confusion that reigns in the Remain camp.

  14. Alec
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:05 am | Permalink

    Cease joining US provocations, coups and wars. Remove our ships and soldiers from foreign soil. Base our defence and foreign policy on non intervention and protecting our own sovereign territory. Remove sanctions from all countries except those engaged in wars they started. Offer free trade to any country that will do the same. Halt immigration except for workers required for vital tasks. Any immigrant or temporary visitor should not receive any benefits or free health care unless the same is offered in their country to our citizens. Deport all immigrants involved in crime immediately or in the case of serious offences at the end of their prison term. End the scam of foreign aid. That will do for the first month. After that we can get really busy dismantling the massive public sector bureaucracy.

  15. Everhopeful
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:13 am | Permalink

    No.
    Let’s talk about Boris wanting to give amnesty to illegal immigrants.
    Dropping even lip service to immigration reduction “to tens of thousands.”
    (Even the toothless and constantly hand-wringing Migration Watch has launched a campaign against our new .PM).
    If he is going for an early election this is not a good idea at all.
    But then as the conspiracy goes…liblabcon…just one party working towards the same goal.
    And when is Boris going to pull us out of the developing European army??

    • Everhopeful
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:37 am | Permalink

      Sorry…that No plus being off topic was rude.
      But honestly ..Boris will just lose his small majority and we will have the terrible alternative!
      It will be the dementia tax all over again.

    • Sharon Jagger
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:23 pm | Permalink

      Everhopeful

      There’s a few things we need pulling out of, not just the European ARMY…what about the UN Migration pact?

      If Boris has an amnesty it must be a one off, and for people with no criminal record and are in work. He mentioned 12 years here to qualify…and for all other illegals, they must not be entitled to ANYTHING.

      Being an Illegal is against the law and should be treated firmly and consistently., and not being allowed to stay!

      • Everhopeful
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:12 pm | Permalink

        Sharon Jagger
        Totally agree.
        I’d completely forgotten about that Pact!

        • Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:32 pm | Permalink

          That’s what they count on – people forgetting eventually. It was done sneakily anyway, and many people didn’t (don’t) even know about it.

  16. Sea Warrior
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:15 am | Permalink

    I favour doing more with the Commonwealth. Perhaps we could develop a simple, model FTA for our Commonwealth partners. It wouldn’t be appropriate for the more developed economies – such as Australia – but the smaller states might find it helpful and easier to ‘staff’. And perhaps any disputes could be settled by a Commonwealth Trade Disputes Court?

    • AlmostDead
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:34 pm | Permalink

      You realise that these smaller Commonwealth partners have larger and more experienced trade negotiators than us

      • Sea Warrior
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:56 pm | Permalink

        I gather that NZ’s team is particularly well regarded but that Australia’s was rather out-manoeuvred by America’s in the AUSUS FTA. Whatever the failings of our nascent team, I’m sure that they will get better as they get more experience.

      • NickC
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:06 pm | Permalink

        Almostdead, “Larger … trade negotiators”?? Have you noticed you appear to think almost everything is a pissing contest?

  17. Ian Wragg
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:19 am | Permalink

    I think Germany and France will encourage Russia to join the EU. Then we could call it…..ah umm I know the Soviet Union or EUSSR for short.
    Germany could use its industry to re arm and France could be the admistative centre. Never mind the othet 25 EU members.

    • AlmostDead
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:37 pm | Permalink

      Actually getting Russia to join the EU would be great. We could stop wasting money on NATO

    • Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:46 pm | Permalink

      What a good idea. They could formulate something called a …. now, let’s see… ah yes! ”A non aggression pact”! That might work.
      And they’d have a ready-made army too – I’m sure none of the other EU members would dream of objecting.

  18. Bob
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:10 am | Permalink

    I hope that the UK will desist from using it’s armed forces to impede free trade between Iran and Syria.

    • NickC
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:07 pm | Permalink

      Bob, At the behest of the EU.

  19. Edwardm
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:21 am | Permalink

    Agree.
    The EU has its own world view, its own priorities and own way of doing things, much of which does not coincide with the UK’s outlook.
    Those who fear escaping the dead hand of the EU, are the defeatists in the Remain camp.
    Opportunities are global, and our future and freedom to enterprise is best in our own hands, and in conjunction with like minded countries.
    And the EU can even have an FTA with us if it want one.

  20. margaret
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:33 am | Permalink

    Ideas are always welcome. Plans are needed (whether the true hand is shown or not ,) however it is the doing ,not the saying. For many years we have had people talking on this subject with personalities attacked at every point.I am interested in the people who make binding arrangements for the prosperity of this country and I believe it is business itself and they will lead however easy or difficult politics make it. Of course there lies the danger ,but historically this has been proved to be the case. As other politicians and ex politicians attempt to neutralise anger elsewhere in the world and build up relationships the UK should not latch on to beliefs which are already held and go one way or another . There is a third way which I didn’t like for myself when applied to the UK but inevitable in globalisation

  21. Peter
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:43 am | Permalink

    ‘How should the UK change its foreign policy once out of the EU?’

    There needs to be a lot more self-interest and a big reduction in largesse. That means less overseas aid for countries that are sending rockets to the moon and an Australian-style approach to controlling immigration so that it is in the interests of this country.

    The UK is not the worlds policeman and it is not necessary to have -or rather to declare – an official viewpoint on all aspects of the life and struggles of every country on the globe.

  22. formula57
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:44 am | Permalink

    The two main aims ought to be energy security and food security for we live in an increasingly hostile world where few if any can be relied upon.

    Beyond that, staying out of direct engagement in all foreign wars, eschewing constrictive ties with the Evil Empire, recognizing the USA has become the international bully par excellence, and placing the department of international development within the department for international trade (with consequent adjustment of priorities) would all have much merit.

  23. Original Richard
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:16 am | Permalink

    Leaving the EU and becoming an independent nation will ensure we remain a permanent member of the UN Security Council and not be forced to give it up to the EU.

    Leaving the EU means we can pursue policies which are in our national interest and not driven by the interests of other EU countries, as for instance, Germany’s interest in building the Nordstream 2 gas pipeline from Russia or their wish to increase their working population by allowing into Europe large numbers of ME migrants.

    Mrs. Merkel’s immigration policy as outlined at the Konrad Adenauer Foundation in Berlin 21/11/2018 :

    “Sovereign nation states must not listen to the will of their citizens when it comes to questions of immigration, borders, or even sovereignty.”

    • Dennis
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:53 pm | Permalink

      Mrs. Merkel’s immigration policy as outlined at the Konrad Adenauer Foundation in Berlin 21/11/2018 :

      “Sovereign nation states must not listen to the will of their citizens when it comes to questions of immigration, borders, or even sovereignty.”

      What?!! BBC silent on this as no one seems to mention it these days.

  24. Denis Cooper
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:23 am | Permalink

    Off topic, Richard North has been doing what he’s especially good at doing, tracking down the precise details of legislation and its background:

    http://www.eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=87311

    “Brexit: kippergate revisited”

    And when he writes:

    “But it does leave me wondering whether there is anyone at all in the system who actually understands how it works when we have the European Commission, the leader of the opposition and a representative of a packaging company – to say nothing of a backbench MP – all getting it wrong. And nor can it be said that the Oaf was at all close to reality.”

    that takes me back to June 2008, and a startling admission by the then French Foreign Minister after the Irish people had voted down the Lisbon Treaty:

    https://www.ft.com/content/74d671b2-46c0-11dd-876a-0000779fd2ac

    “Mr Kouchner told reporters that two factors were damaging European citizens’ faith in the EU: the first, economic uncertainty and fears related to globalisation; and the second, an inability to understand the EU’s complex institutions and legal arrangements.

    “No one understands the institutions and no one’s interested. No one understands anything, not even me,” he said. “My feeling is that we need to return to fundamentals, improve transparency and give more confidence to people. A Europe of sincerity and openness will be an effective Europe.””

  25. Prigger
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:39 am | Permalink

    “One of the dangers of being in the EU is the way the UK is drawn into rows and conflicts in Eastern Europe where EU intervention may not be helpful and where UK interests may diverge from apparent EU interests.”
    One of my fears if not the biggest fear about the EU. Unstable regions.
    Baltic, Eastern, and Southern Europe issues . These places are stacked up awaiting perusal in our literature despite new political and new-history verbiage. Kafka, Solshenitsyn, Erich Marie Remarque, Hermann Hesse, Alexander Zinoviev, Milan Kundera , Jaroslav Hašek, Edward Buca, Vladimir Voinovitch, they all explain things, but we British can barely understand through lack of their contexts.
    It’s a pity we don’t have a British writer who has lived and thought in one or two of their contexts and can knock those senses in to us, somehow.

  26. Alan Joyce
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:42 am | Permalink

    Dear Mr. Redwood,

    Following the resignation of Mrs. May and several of her ministers last Wednesday, am I the only one who was surprised to see some of them at Lords for the one-off test match versus Ireland on Thursday?

    There they were, as large as life, sat comfortably in their reserved hospitality seats sipping refreshments – Barwell, Gauke, Clark and May herself – enjoying the cricket.

    It wasn’t a bank holiday. Parliament was in session. Indeed, it was treated to bravura performances from Mr. Rees-Mogg and the new PM, Mr. Johnson.

    What a pity they could not bring themselves to go to work that day. They might have learned something and seen why voters had found them such a turn-off.

    Instead they wagged a day off work at the taxpayer’s expense.

  27. Gareth Warren
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:28 am | Permalink

    The opportunity to forge ahead with our own foreign policy is extremely welcome.

    We no longer need associate ourselves with debacles such as Ukraine where the EU unwisely tried to pull the country into its economic orbit ending with an unjustified response from Russia.

    Nor do we have to enforce their sanctions on other countries where we find only a paper military support and the EU trying to calm things down without even showing support to us.

    First though it is time to show our friendship to Canada, Australia and New Zealand by signing immediate FTA’s, US too should be done. I find it ironic that much hand wringing was performed by remainers worried about the UK abandoning EU when we clearly abandoned so many coiuntries who literally fought alongside us at our darkest hour.

  28. Freeborn John
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:45 am | Permalink

    The most important foreign policy choice we can make in the short term is to have regulatory competition within our domestic market. Goods on sale in the US market must be allowed unfettered access to the Uk market where they can compete with goods compliant to EU regulations. Consumers can then decide whether to buy cheap no-frills cars that Amador cans buy or higher price EU ones and so on. This will drive costs down in the Uk and steadily decouple us from Brussels regulation in a market driven way.

    Longer term we should aim at a defensive alliance, customs union, freedom of movement and security relationship with the Us, Canada, Australia and New Zealand. We should end the security guarantee we currently provide to Europe. We should end the freedom of movement for Irish workers to the GB labour market. Countries that have been acting like hostile states to us should not be getting defence guarantees and free migration to GB.

    • AlmostDead
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:41 pm | Permalink

      Not a chance of any of this happening.

      • Freeborn John
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:51 pm | Permalink

        Not in your lifetime ‘AlmostDead’.

    • Original Richard
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:22 pm | Permalink

      FB,
      “Countries that have been acting like hostile states to us should not be getting defence guarantees and free migration to GB.”

      Agreed.

      I remember back in July last year the Irish Prime Minister, Leo Varadka, warning that British flights could be banned from Irish airspace if a hard border arose as a result of Brexit, despite Ireland relying on the Royal Air Force for high-end air policing!

      I’m certainly not buying any Irish products whilst they continue with their ridiculous intransigence and I am looking forward to the shipping of goods between Ireland and the EU via a direct method and no longer through the UK.

    • NickC
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:21 pm | Permalink

      Freeborn John, Absolutely no customs union or freedom of movement with any other state. Please. We have a chance to escape from the EU, we really do not want to duplicate that subservient relationship with any other state.

  29. Prigger
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:02 am | Permalink

    The media, starting late the live broadcast of Boris ” further north ” turned out to be at a museum in Manchester, Lancashire.
    Yorkshire and Lancashire never got a chance to vote whether they wished Mayors or not. nor regionalism . Such ideas were imposed. In fact, such nonsense was rejected at every point where the electorate was polled, decisively.
    Manchester had a 29% turnout when having a mayor was thrust upon them and Mr Burnham for 60 odd percent of the 29%, won. In South Yorkshire a Mayor and Regionalism were thrust upon the people against their decisive rejection of such in polls. And in an imposed postal vote only 15% of the electorate voted for anyone at all.

    Boris with good intentions, is not as he wishes “speaking to the leaders of ” anywhere at all except those places and people still in the dreams of Osborne of paper fame.

    Boris says a fast rail link will enable a Leeds young person to turn up for work in the separate county of Lancashire and so increase business etc etc. Presumably it will also enable a young person from Manchester to turn up for identical work in Leeds as both are “Great Cities”. All this misses the point of the goal of economics is to concentrate persons and businesses eliminating travelling time and distance. This is foolish economics regarding the rail link as both counties have huge exporting ports and both have very skilled workers and academics. A total waste of time and money!
    The two counties all ready have sufficient transport links but are overburdened with mayors, committees, who will find loads of reasons for requiring more money from central government to waste as they are allied to a whole group of people in their political parties who have a record of wilful and disgusting waste of resources and manpower over decades.

    It is a pity Boris is in favour of this fake, unwanted unnecessary regionalism and “local people” in control. All it amounts to are the same political Annoyances spending even more money irresponsibly and “The People” utterly ignored as usual. Boris will NOT gain extra votes humouring Mayors and their hangers-on.

    • Prigger
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:21 am | Permalink

      correction: there. Sounds the same, you see

  30. margaret howard
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:34 am | Permalink

    JR

    What a lovely future in the wide world you predict for us away from the restrictions of the EU. Seems to have been a mistake that we begged to join it all those years ago as the ‘sick man of Europe’.

    But tell me, why doesn’t our business world share you optimism seeing that the pound it still falling? I would have thought future prosperity depended on a health currency and unfortunately the wider world doesn’t seem to share your optimism.

    Is it just pie in the sky?

    • graham1946
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:04 pm | Permalink

      It’s Big Business that wants to stay in and enforce globalisation. It is they you are talking about via the CBI and the IoD. It suits them to have laws to prevent competition. 95 percent of our firms are SME’s, most of which have no dealings with the EU at all, yet are bound by every jot and tittle of every regulation Brussels passes, mostly to benefit large firms and adds to their costs for no advantage to them.

    • NickC
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:28 pm | Permalink

      Margaret Howard, “We” did not beg to join the EU as the “sick man of Europe” at all. It wasn’t “we”, it was some of our elites. Our establishment was looking for a role for the UK post-empire. We were not the sick man of Europe when we joined, that happened after we were in. It wasn’t the EU empire as it is now, it was sold as the “common market”. You’re not doing very well, are you? Every point wrong, Margaret. As usual.

    • Lindsay McDougall
      Posted July 28, 2019 at 11:00 am | Permalink

      You seem incapable of absorbing a few simple facts. The decline in trade with EU will predate the benefits of increased trade
      with non-EU countries, so we might have a couple of bad years before a marked upturn. This is entirely the fault of the bloody minded EU, who won’t let us implement other trade deals until we have left the EU. Such are the joys of a Customs Union. This is why we need to leave on 31st October, with NO transition period, so that we can IMPLEMENT trade deals with non-EU counties on 1st November.

  31. Andy
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:43 am | Permalink

    Extra police officers.

    More for education.

    Social care for all.

    A fancy railway line.

    Boris Johnson has found the magic money tree.

    Your taxes are clearly going up.

    • jerry
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:02 pm | Permalink

      @Andy; “Boris Johnson has found the magic money tree.”

      But he is still promising less spending than Labour, or even the LibDems, and those two parties still want to hand over £b’s to the EU at the same time.

      If Boris has found a money tree then both Labour and the LibDems have found an entire money tree forest!…

      • Andy
        Posted July 27, 2019 at 5:55 pm | Permalink

        I don’t object to paying higher taxes to fund better public services.

        I object to politicians who lie that they can tax you less and still spend more.

        They can do this only by passing on the bill to the next generation.

        • jerry
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:34 pm | Permalink

          @Andy; “I object to politicians who lie that they can tax you less and still spend more.”

          You must have hated Mr both Mr Blair and Mr Brown then!

          “They can do this only by passing on the bill to the next generation.”

          So who is going to fund your state pension Andy?…

        • Original Richard
          Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:02 pm | Permalink

          “They can do this only by passing on the bill to the next generation.”

          “Yes”, this is why I have never understood why young people are apparently still more likely to vote for high spending parties such as Labour when it will be themselves, and not the oldies who will be paying for all the debt created.

    • Edward2
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:28 pm | Permalink

      But isn’t all these things what you have regularly been calling for andy ?

    • NickC
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:32 pm | Permalink

      Andy, That’s because we’re leaving the EU. You do know that the EU regards us as not merely a “colony” of theirs, but also “treasure island”? That’s what your EU empire thinks of us. And if they think of people like you at all, it will be as useful idiots.

  32. forthurst
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:44 am | Permalink

    The EU is an example of an organisation which has become toxic because of institutional capture. Instead of seeking to promote the interests of European people, the EU seeks to destroy them by incorporating the whole Mediterranean basin, thereby legitimising the invasions from North Africa.

    Another example of an organisation subject to institutional capture is the UN; originally set up after WWII to enable future disputes between nations to be solved by peaceful means, it has signally failed in its original purpose but has become instead a vehicle for creating toxic international law, hence the industry destroying Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change based on fake science and the Global Compact for Safe, Orderly and Regular Migration which seeks to give more rights to invaders than to the nations and peoples of the West.

    Yet another example of institutional capture is NATO; set up originally in opposition to the Bolshevik empire which won WWII and engulfed Eastern Europe, it has now become the tool of warmongers who have perverted US foreign policy and so that of NATO to promote the interests of their own favourite nation involving us in endless wars in the ME and attempts to destabilise any nation which refuses to bend to the US yoke.

    Not only do we need to free ourselves from the EU, but also of the UN and NATO; only then can we start to become a free and independent nation once again whose foreign and domestic policies are decided based solely on the interests of the British people.

  33. BR
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 12:20 pm | Permalink

    We can certainly regain our ‘mojo’ but do we need decent armed forces in order to be more than an economic force?

    The Straits of Hormuz incidents have shown us that soft power is fine, but someone will refuse to accept it with military power at some point, so you need to be able to back it up / enforce it.

    Keeping London as the world’s financial centre must be a major objective – much of our GDP comes from there, so getting tax levels right is also paramount.

  34. Raveheart
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 12:42 pm | Permalink

    Ask Boris if the Bribe worked! Will they and their jobs-for-the -boys men consent to vote through Brexit or not? If not, offer to reincorporate Humberside into Yorkshire and join Cheshire by border/county-change into Lancashire. That should do it!! 🙂
    Take it all back off them post Brexit ASAP. Abandon the idea of Mayors. Rule Britannia!

  35. HarveyG
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 1:26 pm | Permalink

    We don’t need a foreign policy except to say we should learn to mind our own business and stay at home. We will have enough to do without sticking our nose into other peoples troubles

    • Dennis
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

      Costa Rica has done this. They are expert in not making enemies so have no need of army , navy or airforce. Do they fel any downsided for this policy I wonder?

  36. Davies
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 2:56 pm | Permalink

    Sir John

    To what extent has the uk signed up to csdp and other agreements linking eu defence and foreign policy driven by f c o under the previous pm?

    If as veterans for Britain states then the uk is bound to eu defence and foreign policy even if the WA is scrapped. Or smni reading this wrong?

  37. The Prangwizard
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 3:09 pm | Permalink

    Our foreign policy will look a lot better and carry more respect if we had a decent sized Navy which could protect our shipping routes. The recent humiliation in the Gulf was a direct result of our weakness not only in our Navy but in our leaders who for decades have in their imaginary world supposed we can get by without the need for one that the world is full of nice people.

    • Blinkered
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:49 pm | Permalink

      We don’t need a navy, all we need to do is to tell the Swedes and others to put their own flags on their own ships- why should we allow the British flag to fly on foreign owned ships and then feel obliged to have to protect them?

    • Antoinetta III
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:40 pm | Permalink

      The recent humiliation in the Gulf was a direct result of our weakness in that we happily enforce sanctions that originate with the USA. There, fixed that for you.

      It also needs to be realized that Putin’s Russia is NOT the old Soviet Union. The latter had an expressed policy of spreading Communism worldwide, Putin is concerned with his borders and “near abroad”, but is not trying to export ideology and “values.”

      It should be realized that most of the EU states are themselves poodles and lapdogs of the US when it comes to foreign policy. I am unaware of any set of US sanctions against anybody that the EU doesn’t eagerly adopt. This also applies to various “regime change” efforts which are invariably launched/promoted by the US. The destruction of Hussein in Iraq, Khaddafy in Libya, and the attempted overthrow of Assad in Syria left several million dead and created a wave of refugees into Europe, for whom, insanely, Merkel threw out a welcome carpet for.

      Western regime change activities are simply an attempt to “spread democracy”, which will ultimately fail, as did the old Soviet Union’s attempts to spread Communism.

      NATO was an alliance against a feared Soviet invasion of Western Europe. With the demise of the Soviet Union and the dissolution of the Warsaw Pact, NATO became irrelevant, and should have been disbanded at this time.

      Antoinetta III

      • Mitchel
        Posted July 29, 2019 at 9:45 am | Permalink

        The Soviet Union changed tack in the aftermath of WWII,from the promotion of Marxism-Leninism(the worldwide revolution was clearly not going to happen!) to the promotion of anti-colonialism which played havoc with the European powers attempts to re-assemble their empires-and so,even then,was more geopolitically than ideologically driven.Which is also why contemporary Russia tends to enjoy very good relations with many former European colonies in Africa ,Asia and Latin America-influence which it is now leveraging again.

  38. Raveheart
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:17 pm | Permalink

    There are laws in force governing the use of machines in factories, mines, tunnels, on bridges. Driver less unattended machines are in violation of those laws. Would legislation of these uncontrolled unattended machines need legislation wiping out those laws and historical commonsense and experience across the planet?

    • Raveheart
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:29 pm | Permalink

      Of course Mr Driverless will immediately re-position his car if only one yard on the direct instruction from a police officer, firefighter or Health worker for safety reasons to a spot indicated? Also provide the use of his onboard fire extinguisher prior to official assistance.
      Could these driverless cars be road-tested first in Iran?

  39. Lindsay McDougall
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 4:56 pm | Permalink

    An independent UK foreign policy should be pursued in our interests, not those of Europe or America. Take Iran, for example. Since we approve of the original nuclear treaty that Obama negotiated, we should offer to remove all sanctions on Iran in exchange for the release of ALL UK citizens (including dual citizens) held as political prisoners. And we wouldn’t impound Iranian oil tankers in order to comply with EU sanctions on Syria.

    More broadly, we should recognise that European Union is not in our interests and should miss no opportunities to destroy. Support Hungary’s opposition to an EU immigration policy, offer to assist Italy and Greece in helping to reinstate the lira and the drachma etc.

  40. bitterend
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 6:28 pm | Permalink

    can’t understand why you would put up Foreign Policy as a serious topic for discussion given the turmoil the country is in right now- nobody has a clue, even now, nobody has a clue where we are going to be at on 30th September- never mind 31st Oct?

  41. Dominic
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 7:43 pm | Permalink

    I saw Johnson today in Manchester and noted his comments regarding Brexit

    I have now no doubt he intends to betray the result of the EU referendum and avoid a WTO exit

    The man’s a fraud which Farage will expose ruthlessly

    • mancunius
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 8:49 pm | Permalink

      Dominic, if you were indeed present at Johnson’s speech in the Manchester Museum of Science and Industry, you would know that his theme was the future regeneration of the North. There was not a single word in his enthusiasm for the national and regional opportunities of Brexit that could remotely be interpreted as ‘intending to betray the result of the referendum and avoid a WTO exit.’
      He promised free ports in the regions, special tax advantages, and local powers, saying: “Over the last three years, we have tended to treat Brexit like some impending adverse weather event. I campaigned to leave the EU because I believed it was a chance to change the direction of the UK and make us the best country in the world to live. Leaving the EU is a massive economic opportunity – to do the things we’ve not been allowed to do for decades, to rid ourselves of bureaucratic red tape, create jobs, untangle the creativity and innovation for which Britain is famous. And we do not need to wait to start preparing to seize the benefits of that project. So we will begin right away to create the free ports that will generate thousands of high-skilled jobs – and revitalise some of the poorest parts of our country.”

      We all have a moral duty to report accurately – even the partisan propagandists who linger among us.

      • BillM
        Posted July 28, 2019 at 12:01 pm | Permalink

        Good catch!

  42. John Struan Robertson
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 9:30 pm | Permalink

    One thing I would like the UK to do once we leave the EU is change our environmental policy.

    In the EU we have to export our iron recycling, waste etc to unregulated China and India where children work in horrible conditions and or the waste fumes are not regulated.

    Lets build smelting plants here in the UK to recycle these things in a regulated environment and save the 100s miles travelled by diesel tankers across the oceans.

  43. steve
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 10:47 pm | Permalink

    Dominic

    Have to disagree, sorry.

    This really is the last chance saloon for the conservatives. Hypothetically if Boris did betray as you suggest, it wouldn’t be just a case of him getting removed from office, the whole lot of them would literally have to run for their lives.

    The risks to themselves of not getting us out on Oct 31st are simply too horrific. Things would turn very nasty for them. Moreover, they’d probably take Labour and the Liberals down with them, so you’d be looking at something akin to civil war.

  44. Sigh
    Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:49 pm | Permalink

    0040 Hours 28 07 2019. It is raining in Cambridge Botanical Gardens just now. Ring them up!!! Ask them to go snail hunting. If they find one that is less than 100 yards away from their thermometer and it is alive, suspend all operatives pending mass sackings. Unless there is a well in that 100 yards. Or their thermometers are made in North Korea, or they have discovered a snail that is not born and bred in the UK
    My TV has now finished all transmissions into my home. There is propaganda and then there is outright idiocy. Snails just beneath the surface cannot tolerate 38.7C for more two minutes. My snails never even bothered to burrow, They just hid under a leaf. African snails? No, just not born in Nineteen Eighty-Four

    • Sigh
      Posted July 27, 2019 at 11:57 pm | Permalink

      My snails were up and about at 5pm of the “Extreme” heat wave, eating merrily. They wished to catch the last three hours of “extreme” sunshine so they could boast of their tan to slimy wet friends, (99% composed of water)and relations who had flown to Spain for a holiday. Suckers!

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    John Redwood won a free place at Kent College, Canterbury, He graduated from Magdalen College Oxford, has a DPhil and is a fellow of All Souls College. A businessman by background, he has been a director of NM Rothschild merchant bank and chairman of a quoted industrial PLC.

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